JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 4]

[Beast]

delete-

double post

 

[Last Hope]

when will we integrate the SD-10 with our JF-17s!! it has been many years and we still haven't done so .

It is already integrated. JF-17 at 26th and 16th Squadron have the SD-10A and SD-10B was recently delivered to Pakistan.
The 32nd Wing ADA uses the SD-10A equipped JF-17s. That is the Peshawar Air Base.

 

[Beast]

It is already integrated. JF-17 at 26th and 16th Squadron have the SD-10A and SD-10B was recently delivered to Pakistan.
The 32nd Wing ADA uses the SD-10A equipped JF-17s. That is the Peshawar Air Base.

We need a picture....

 

[JunaidP]

Hi..


Hi,

First of all welcome to the forum----if you want to say something---say it like a man that you are--say it with confidence and say it with conviction. You have wasted many years of your time sitting quietly on this forum--the days of the quiet man standing in the corner disappeared some 30 plus years ago---now----if you don't say your piece in time----then better old your breath.

But then I don't see anything interesting in your post---except for protectionism----well I don't blame you or that.


The terms like 'my two cents' and 'arm chair generals' take the conviction away from your post---.

Next--don't take the indian operators and planners as idiots---don't take their strategists and game players as any less than highly efficient---.

The su30 operator has 10 plus years of experience in their frontline aircraft---o sell them short will be deceiving.

After all these wars in the last 22 years----every nation that has some kind of awakening has learnt that the game of warfare has changed----.

Air dominance---air superiority---control of the skies starting from 00 hours + is the name of the game---if you have numeric superiority---better strike capability---you will use majority of those assets available in that arena at the first go--specially facing a smaller--numerically lesser and technically inferior air force---on the very first day---the first 8 to 12 hours in our case would be extremely crucial----.

IAF knows that if it can make a break through on the first 12 hours---the game is over----that is the what the iaf has learnt from u s air force strikes in iraq.

Sir Mastan,

i was really not trying to convince anybody here.. just trying to clear away some misconceptions regarding the JF17s mission profile.. as has already been seconded by Oscar and other members here..

it was really not my intention to take them as idiots.. but neither should you take the PAF as same.. in all this time they have not been eating peanuts but devising counter strategies to the Su30.. and no this is not protectionism.. they wouldnt be there if they werent doing their job right.. and you see this in the 2008 incident when the JF17 and Blk52s were not even operational..

wouldnt you consider the mig27 flight over islamabad an awakening?? how about 99 then?? IMO that was the lowest PAF got with regards to its capabilities..

Currently, numeric superiority-yes, technically inferior-BIG NO, this is where PAF has caught up with the IAF.. the IAF will try to make a breakthrough in the first 12 hours.. and if God forbid the game is over, you will have MAD come knocking at your doorstep.. and if the IAF believes it can mimic the US then they are just being arrogant.. they do not have any B1s or B2s or F-117s or F111s for that matter to knock down enemy air defenses.. neither is the PAF, IQAF..

now coming back to the topic, according to this post here by antibody in the "Arguments of choosing JF17 thunder over gripen" (sorry cant post links as yet) the basic range of the JF17 is 1800Kms.. and the amount of internal fuel it can carry is 2300kg.. now with jet fuel being lesser dense than water (1kg of water = 1L at room temp) ill say that the JF17 carries round about 2500L of onboard fuel.. so with a 800L under belly tank, the additional combat range would be (1800/2500)*800=576km

so the range extends to about 2376kms and combat radius to about 1188kms. ideal for CAP duties for a country with so small an airspace..

Oscar, would you be needing a hi lo hi mission profile for CAP duties?? for CAS yes but isnt CAP carried out at relatively higher altitudes to preserve more fuel..

Also, would the IAF really abandon its FOBs?? what would happen to the IAF moral if they choose to do so.. and that would definately be a tactical victory for the PAF..

 

[ziaulislam]

We need a picture....

well you may never get it.....

 

[Beast]

well you may never get it.....

Why we can have the PAF F-16 blk 52 carrying AIM-120 while we can't get PAF JF-17 with SD-10?

 

[SQ8]

Why we can have the PAF F-16 blk 52 carrying AIM-120 while we can't get PAF JF-17 with SD-10?

depends on both security and opportunity.
Foreign journalists were allowed to look at the Block-52's fully operational while not too much has been revealed about the JF-17's operational use.

 

[regular]

jf-17 needs modern avionics , like AESA radar , i would like to see AESA upgrade in upcoming blocks.....
i believe 150 advance fighters are better than 250 comparatively less advance fighters .

Yes we shold go for quality instead of quantity....cuz we can't fight a war with pistals if the opponents got the Ak's or more.Surely we need equivalent or more powerful weapons quality wise means the best quality fighters...

 

[Last Hope]

depends on both security and opportunity.
Foreign journalists were allowed to look at the Block-52's fully operational while not too much has been revealed about the JF-17's operational use.

The secrecy led to minimized opportunity. We started to get the pictures of Aim-120 after ages. And that is when the journalists and everyone else were allowed to see the ADA.

We need a picture....

All the people I know who have visited the Peshawar Air Base (Foreign, not belonging to base or retired AF officials) had taken pictures with the JF-17 especially the 07-101 and 09-111 units. They were only allowed to visit the hangars where the A/Cs were stored, not the ADA section.

PAF has stricken their policy regarding JF-17 with public. The officials at PAC Kamra were ordered not to take any pictures inside the perimeter, near the production line of any JF-17 unit. The officers/engineers/air-men are all stripped of their phone and camera or similar gadgets at the enterence.

Only time will give us pictures, probably flying over the skies.

 

[graphican]

Don't worry, JF-17 Block 2 will emerge with a new platform in avionics and a better, stronger radar.

As far as Radar is concerned, Nabeel has enlightened that it is going to be AESA but other resources mention it is still KLJ-7. So both are inside news and you cannot weight one more above the other. My wish and thought inclination is towards AESA for block II as thunder has very high burden upon its shoulders. We are not procuring more F-16s (as of now) and there is no confirmed news of J-10B. So I have a reason to think that PAF would want Thunder to be as potent and as capable as possible. But Allah knows that best.

 

[ice_man]

depends on both security and opportunity.
Foreign journalists were allowed to look at the Block-52's fully operational while not too much has been revealed about the JF-17's operational use.

sorry bro but i can't keep eating this BULL over & over again. FIRSTLY if we wished for it to be such a "secretive" thing we wouldn't be running around with it to every airshow & trying to export it!

Secondly we wouldn't have been looking for a better avionics suite & weapons system for it around the whole continent of europe!

I am sorry but JF-17 like Mastan sir has been saying for the last 3 years on this forum that it is having all sort of "teething problems"! i personally believe that by choosing JF-17 pakistan has kept an elephant as a pet & doesn't have proper doors to fit it through!

 

[Bratva]

Why we can have the PAF F-16 blk 52 carrying AIM-120 while we can't get PAF JF-17 with SD-10?

Stupid and Weak marketing policies of PAF. They don't know how to advertise a thing and will not show you anything.

As far as Radar is concerned, Nabeel has enlightened that it is going to be AESA but other resources mention it is still KLJ-7. So both are inside news and you cannot weight one more above the other. My wish and thought inclination is towards AESA for block II as thunder has very high burden upon its shoulders. We are not procuring more F-16s (as of now) and there is no confirmed news of J-10B. So I have a reason to think that PAF would want Thunder to be as potent and as capable as possible. But Allah knows that best.

I don;t know when People will come out of this Aesa phobia. The upgrades of Block-2 don't allow PAF to add an AESA because of the under power RD-93. Upgraded ECM, Fix IFR and other upgrades will put a strain on RD-93 and if we add AESA, both radar and maneuverability of plan will be degraded and Director of JF-17 program has already said Aesa is not needed, Block-2 will only feature Upgraded KLJ-7. So Whose got more credibility? Director of JF-17 program or what Nabeel says? Which by the way most of the things turn out wrong.

 

[Last Hope]

As far as Radar is concerned, Nabeel has enlightened that it is going to be AESA but other resources mention it is still KLJ-7. So both are inside news and you cannot weight one more above the other. My wish and thought inclination is towards AESA for block II as thunder has very high burden upon its shoulders. We are not procuring more F-16s (as of now) and there is no confirmed news of J-10B. So I have a reason to think that PAF would want Thunder to be as potent and as capable as possible. But Allah knows that best.

The first reports came in 2009 for an AESA radar, which were latter turned down.
The KLJ-7 was being upgraded and this new KLJ-7X was going to be used on Block II but now AESA rumors are back again, and the source Nabil quoted was a strong one.

Whatever it is, is going to be a stronger radar.

@Ice Man. Sir, you believe what you have to. JF-17 is intended to be a huge surprise on the battle-field hence is kept secretive.

 

[SQ8]

sorry bro but i can't keep eating this BULL over & over again. FIRSTLY if we wished for it to be such a "secretive" thing we wouldn't be running around with it to every airshow & trying to export it!

Secondly we wouldn't have been looking for a better avionics suite & weapons system for it around the whole continent of europe!

I am sorry but JF-17 like Mastan sir has been saying for the last 3 years on this forum that it is having all sort of "teething problems"! i personally believe that by choosing JF-17 pakistan has kept an elephant as a pet & doesn't have proper doors to fit it through!

there is nothing secretive.. why see BULL when there is none..
its just that nobody went ahead and took a picture.
Considering the amount of stuff seen within the likes of Alan Warnes and others.. I see no secrecy there.
What I do see is bad PR.. and that comes from an archaic mindset.. not an elephant.

 

[Bratva]

depends on both security and opportunity.

Foreign journalists were allowed to look at the Block-52's fully operational while not too much has been revealed about the JF-17's operational use.

PAF attitude gives a strong expression that JF-17 is a still a half baked cookie that's why they are not willing to show it to general public.