JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 4]

[Farooqi1]

I know this not the place for J10 but some body uploaded a J10 (as FC-20) photo in Pakistan colors in Wiki. The date of upload is April 28th, 2012. The narrative says FC-20 in Air Show in Pakistan. Can some body confirm. Did we already get it? Or this is some old picture just uploaded in Wiki?

 

[gambit]

...stealth is a specific word used for aircraft that truly possess this capability for e.g, f22, 35, 117, J-20.

What 'stealth' really mean is that the low radar observability methods are applied in CONJUNCTION with aerodynamics exploitation at the INITIAL design stage. All aircrafts are aerodynamically exploitative, meaning they know how manipulate the principles that Bernoulli formalized to make flight possible. But EM radiation analyses from these complex bodies have been a recent practice starting with Ufimtsev during the Cold War, and one that the Soviets (tragically) ignored and dismissed as mere scientific curiosity.

So the most we can do for the current 'non-stealth' designs are opportunistic RCS reduction methods in areas of the aircraft that would not produce adverse aerodynamic forces. Those opportunistic RCS reduction methods are absorbers at leading edges, a conductive or 'non-EM permissible' canopy, external store enclosures, and/or reduction of communication, navigation, and identification (CNI) antennas that so much festoons these famous aircrafts.

I will say this without trespassing the 'classified' info line: Based upon what we found in isolated EM anechoic chamber testings, and the US have plenty of airframes to test, those four opportunistic RCS reduction methods works for most '4th gen' fighters out there at reducing effective detection distance by about 1/4 of whatever each '4th gen' fighter was before these modeling/predicting testing.

The engineering degree of difficulty in rising level is:

- Absorber
- Canopy
- CNI antenna reduction
- External store enclosures

A lot of people think that CNI antenna reduction is easy but it actually is not. The location of CNI antennas are not arbitrary based upon their utility because the aircraft's body itself can block these antenna's radiation pattern, making communication and navigation difficult. GPS receiver antennas should be topside, correct? Conformal antennas have different radiation pattern than blade antennas, which is usually omnidirectional, so in order to have effective CNI capability in moving to conformal arrays, there must be an increase in antenna quantity to capture as much of the aspect angles as possible.

Here is an example...

The F-22 have been described as an 'antenna farm' but one would not know it just by visual alone. The CNI antennas' cumulative EM radiation effects not when they are in use but when the aircraft is under radar bombardment is just another contributorship towards the final RCS value. Removing a couple blades and installing four or more conformals would require you to strip the aircraft down to the frame, study the most optimum locations that would not interfere with fuel storage, hydraulics components, structural supports, and so on, and you can only hope to find a location for your new conformal antenna. Then comes wiring.

Now convince the Ministry of Defence to: 'Show me the money....!!!'

 

[Dazzler]

many indigenous weapons were already integrated including chinese sd-10 back in 2010, also, ecm pods like ALQ-131 and Atlis were also done before this video, he also praised the performance of WMD-7 and KG-300G. Listen carefully folks...again

jf17.flv part 2 - YouTube

 

[Edevelop]

FC-1 Xiaolong / JF-17 Thunder Fighter Jet Spotted with Electro Optical Pod

with big brother

If this is JF-17 Block 2 then how come i don't see composite use?
We should work on thrust to weight ratio...

 

[Dazzler]

this is prototype 6, not the block 2, many new technologies/ weapons/ subsystems have been tested in this aircraft. Blk 2 is yet to be revealed. There are a few external changes on antennae array and some other external differences from blk1. More composites are added replacing metallic parts but we cant identify them by merely looking from a good distance.

 

[razgriz19]

Correct. Its not national day or flight display. carry smoke winder for what?

It shall be some kind of data pod.

Pt-06 might be the block II PAF going to receive. External wise, not much different but the added with all A2G capabilities and datalink. Making it true multi-role. Most importantly BVR capable with SD-10.

Yes thats what i am hoping too!
hopefully PT-06 will be BLK-2 so we would atleast have a BVR missile other than AMRAAM.

 

[Pak47]

I know this not the place for J10 but some body uploaded a J10 (as FC-20) photo in Pakistan colors in Wiki. The date of upload is April 28th, 2012. The narrative says FC-20 in Air Show in Pakistan. Can some body confirm. Did we already get it? Or this is some old picture just uploaded in Wiki?

If your speaking of this image here, i don't think its real. This is the only image of Fc-20 on wiki.

 

[Dazzler]

Yes thats what i am hoping too!
hopefully PT-06 will be BLK-2 so we would atleast have a BVR missile other than AMRAAM.

SD-10 already integrated in blk 1 and in active service with PAF, you already have a BVR missile and a capable indigenous fighter.

BLK 2 is an improvement over some subsystems and EW, reduced RCS to some extent, IFR surely and possible IRST, more composites but nothing drastic...

 

[Beast]

SD-10 already integrated in blk 1 and in active service with PAF, you already have a BVR missile and a capable indigenous fighter.

BLK 2 is an improvement over some subsystems and EW, reduced RCS to some extent, IFR surely and possible IRST, more composites but nothing drastic...

Not sure about that, heard from some Pakistanis source claiming blk 1 still do not carry SD-10 and the fact we never really see one JF-17 carry it. But there is indeed picture of pt06 carry SD-10 flying around. Therefore , most likely pt06 maybe forming the basic of blk 2.

 

[farhan_9909]

JF-17 IS BVR capable as the PAF official Khlid mahmood is saying.
We have our own Pt-04 and PAC is very big bt very much protected.I mean the walls are as high as that Osama house in Abbottabad..so it is very hard to capture pictures

 

[Dazzler]

i know this through my contact, sd-10 is already with PAF, also confirmed from the video i posted above. Besides, what is the point of inducting the first batch without inducting the primary weapon that it is meant to carry? It is in active service since 2010-11 after the radar interface glitch was resolved.

Here is the video of JFT carrying camera strange pod behind j-20....

J20: flight test with JF-17 chase - 2012.04.28 (HD1080) - YouTube

 

[ziaulislam]

officially and unofficially it seems that thunder has been ALREADY integrated with SD-10 but no matter what happens i dont think so we would reach this agreement ever. even if a videos is released(which is unlikly to be released ever at all). Infact PAF has not released any anount of significant thunder phots at all.
as Oscar pointed out pt-6, JF-17 thunder and pt-4 carries same radar and avionics and thus weapon integration on one is essentially integrated on the second.

anyway i am pretty sure that we wouldnt see an offical picture with thunder carrying/testing a sd-10 even in block 2 or block 3..that would mean they will also not be capable of carrying BVRs..?

by the way anyone ever saw a PAF ROSE mirage carrying a BVR or any other fighter other than f-16?

 

[fatman17]

officially and unofficially it seems that thunder has been ALREADY integrated with SD-10 but no matter what happens i dont think so we would reach this agreement ever. even if a videos is released(which is unlikly to be released ever at all). Infact PAF has not released any anount of significant thunder phots at all.
as Oscar pointed out pt-6, JF-17 thunder and pt-4 carries same radar and avionics and thus weapon integration on one is essentially integrated on the second.

anyway i am pretty sure that we wouldnt see an offical picture with thunder carrying/testing a sd-10 even in block 2 or block 3..that would mean they will also not be capable of carrying BVRs..?

by the way anyone ever saw a PAF ROSE mirage carrying a BVR or any other fighter other than f-16?

JF-17 is going to be the 'work-horse' of the PAF. why would they 'detail' every aspect of the Thunders capacity and capability. BTW already 175 rounds of the SD-10A have been delivered to the PAF. if the Thunder wasnt able to fire this missile, then who?

 

[LiberalAtheist]

just wondering could anyone clarify on what kind of airframe the block 2 version of the JF-17 will use? and does it offer any improvements over the current one?

 

[Crypto]

Not sure about that, heard from some Pakistanis source claiming blk 1 still do not carry SD-10 and the fact we never really see one JF-17 carry it. But there is indeed picture of pt06 carry SD-10 flying around. Therefore , most likely pt06 maybe forming the basic of blk 2.

SD10 has been integrated and is currently in service, if i am not wrong Pak got delivery of 200 SD-10 missiles.