JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 4]

[VCheng]

the writer shouldve followed some paf forums to upgrade his rusty info plus some systems are taken from j10 which is already in service

the intersesting thing is , structuraaly , jf17 is qiute comparable to grippen , ufcourse grippen has lesser empty weight and higher max takeoff wt , which might be due to composites and matallurgy

Considering the article is posted on a site better known to 16 year olds with raging libido's and a liking for outlandish souped up family cars and bad rap.. Its a miracle it got a few facts correct.
While its best left not to comment on the construction and design process or the gadgetry used for the Jf lest I invite cynicism from ever increasing members from across the border..I suppose its best to let people believe what they should..
let the critics satisfy their ego's.. and the fanboys theirs..

Would you like to discuss the article?

 

[siegecrossbow]

Would you like to discuss the article?

Is this the reason that you joined the forum ? Oh boy this one is going to be interesting.

 

[Manticore]

Would you like to discuss the article?

http://www.defence.pk/forums/jf-17-thunder/71435-jf-17-thunder-information-pool.html

we will try to complete the good posts in thread 3 onwards here-- for qiuck info

 

[VCheng]

Is this the reason that you joined the forum ? Oh boy this one is going to be interesting.

I am glad that you find my posts amusing.

No, this is not the reason. I am perfectly willing to keep quiet and listen rather than say anything at all.

 

[VCheng]

http://www.defence.pk/forums/jf-17-thunder/71435-jf-17-thunder-information-pool.html

we will try to complete the good posts in thread 3 onwards here-- for qiuck info

Oh that's quite alright. I have my own resources.

As I just mentioned, I'd rather keep quiet.

 

[S.U.R.B.]

Don't know if it's already been shared.

Here's a nice animation.

2020 is near guys.

 

[siegecrossbow]

I am glad that you find my posts amusing.

No, this is not the reason. I am perfectly willing to keep quiet and listen rather than say anything at all.

No sir I just find the situation high ironic, that's all. Reminds me a lot of the joke posts that you see on youtube when two guys are bad mouthing about a third guy when the third guy suddenly shows up.

I'm glad that you are taking the non-confrontational approach . Your inputs are welcomed.

 

[VCheng]

No sir I just find the situation high ironic, that's all. Reminds me a lot of the joke posts that you see on youtube when two guys are bad mouthing about a third guy when the third guy suddenly shows up.

I'm glad that you are taking the non-confrontational approach . Your inputs are welcomed.

Well, I had to show up sometime!

Thank you for the welcome. It will be a pleasure to participate here.

 

[TaimiKhan]

Would you like to discuss the article?

You said: " The basic design of the airframe is a further development from the remains of the joint Sabre 2 project between Chengdu Aircraft Industries of China and Grumman Aerospace Corporation "


Here is about the Sabre II project: " Under Project Sabre II, considered a replacement of the abandoned Super-7 project by the Chinese, the F-7 airframe was redesigned with angled air intakes on the sides of the fuselage replacing the nose intake. The nose intake was replaced by a solid nose radome to house the avionics from the F-20 Tigershark. The Chinese WP-7 turbojet engine was planned to be replaced with a modern turbofan engine, either the GE F404 or PW1120, to improve performance. The resulting aircraft, designated F-7M Sabre-II, would have looked much like the Guizhou JL-9 (or FTC-2000) jet trainer / fighter aircraft.

Now, had the Sabre II project gone on, this below pic can give you an idea what it would have been looked like:



and now compare it to the JL-9 / FTC 2000:

and here is the JF-17:

So, now plz enlighten us, which part of JF-17 seems to be a modification or further designed part of the Sabre II project, which part of JF-17 has anything in similar with Sabre II project or the F-7 ?? Wings ? Tail & rudder ? Stabilizers ? nose ? LERX ? Intakes ? even the front and rear landing gear of JF-17 have nothing in common with the landing gear of F-7s. So now which part of JF-17 suggests it is made on a modified design of F-7 or Sabre II project. Plz point out just one single similarity between both the designs. Just one single design which is there in both planes.

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You said: "The powerplant currently is a Chinese version of the Soviet Klimov RD-33/93 turbofan engine. "

Chinese version of the Soviet turbo fan engine ?? What the hell are you writing about ?? How it can be a Chinese version when it is being built and imported from Russia, while only installation is being done in China, Chinese did not built this engine nor they have been provided the technology to make it locally under licence. For God sake, do this correction.

-----------------------------------------

You said: "The Kamra Avionics and Radar Factory (KARF) portion of the PAC has used its previous experience with integrating western avionics into Chinese aircraft to attempt to integrate the Italian Grifo-7 radar into the PAF JF-17s using equipment provided by the US company APS Novastar for production and assembly of circuit boards."

Grifo-7 lost the competition when it was brought in comparison with KLJ-7 radar, that is why we are using the KLJ-7 not because we have not been able to do the integration.

And the APS Novastar equipment would be used to make circuit boards and stuff for whatever avionics they can be used for, not just Grifo-7 radar. Plus, the Grifo-7 radar tech is Italian, thus had we gone for Grifo radars for JF-17s, we would have gotten the tech from the Italians to manufacture radars locally, just like the earlier version of Grifo radars being assembled and made locally at Kamra.

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JF-17 has small percentage of composites in its airframe currently, which will increase with the passage of time, so its not just one tin can as you suggested.

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You said: " It is not a state-of-the art airplane by any means "

Care to elaborate, what do you suggest state of the are airplane with respect to the current fighters in our inventory, plus compared to other state of the art fighters deployed.

What is your criteria of state of the art airplane.

What is in JF-17, which makes it having nothing state of the art.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Plus, don't come up with this I have inside source thingy, as the above blunders in your article clearly suggest, you have no idea about the JF-17 and you just copy pasted the stuff, some which you understood, some which you have no idea about.

We have more real insider sources on this forum, who have provided quiet credible, authentic information regarding the JF-17 and its capabilities.

So waiting for the explanation of your above blunders, with sources, facts and figures.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

And by the way, what is the hype about JF-17 ?? What has been so much hyped about it ?? Care to tell, as your copy pasted article had nothing to tell anything hyped about JF-17, its just a normal fighter project, but compared to the fighters we have, its generations ahead of them, minus the Blk 52s. So what is so hyped about it ?? Did anyone said its a 6th generation fighter which can't be seen to naked eyes ??

 

[Patriot]

The article is written by this dude!
http://www.urmc.rochester.edu/people/?u=23020825

Best Graduate, Pakistan Air Force Air Base Intermediate College, Sargodha, Pakistan 1980
Chief of Air Staff Gold Medal 1980

None the less it does not mean article is credible as he did not join PAF and left for US.In other words no inside info just plain bs but much better your say your typical strategy type articles written by Indian Journos.

 

[VCheng]

My my, aren't we a bit sensitive over here. Everybody, please calm down!

My request would be to discuss the topic, not personalities. I do not wish to get into a confrontation with anybody here.

For now, I will keep myself quiet.

Let me just say this for now:

The Sabre II, the JL-9 and the JF-17 are ALL delta wing designs with conventional tailplanes, just like the original MiG-21.

 

[Crypto]

My my, aren't we a bit sensitive over here. Everybody, please calm down!

My request would be to discuss the topic, not personalities. I do not wish to get into a confrontation with anybody here.

For now, I will keep myself quiet.

Let me just say this for now:

The Sabre II, the JL-9 and the JF-17 are ALL delta wing designs with conventional tailplanes, just like the original MiG-21.

JF - 17 is not Delta wing FYI, its cropped-delta planform. mirages aredelta wing, ; JF17's wing design is more like f-16;a cropped delta.

i would advise you to start reading from JF-17 Thread 1 to get upto date info.

 

[VCheng]

JF - 17 is not Delta wing FYI, its cropped-delta planform. mirages aredelta wing, ; JF17's wing design is more like f-16;a cropped delta.

i would advise you to start reading from JF-17 Thread 1 to get upto date info.

Cropped or not, it is still a delta wing design with a conventional tailplane, just like its ancestors.

 

[TaimiKhan]

My my, aren't we a bit sensitive over here. Everybody, please calm down!

My request would be to discuss the topic, not personalities. I do not wish to get into a confrontation with anybody here.

For now, I will keep myself quiet.

Let me just say this for now:

The Sabre II, the JL-9 and the JF-17 are ALL delta wing designs with conventional tailplanes, just like the original MiG-21.

Plz elaborate with facts and figures.

JF-17s wings are more similar to F-16 wings design compared to Mig-21s.

Sabre II and JL-9 are modified, evolved versions of the basic Mig-21 design, but JF-17 wing design has no influence from the Mig-21s.

Delta wing design is a general terminology, numerous aircraft use delta wing design.

By the way, JF-17 has cropped-delta planform wing design with missiles mounted on the wing tips.

Do read about Delta wing design and the variants, before giving vague statements that JF-17 has same delta wing design as Mig-21s, which it hasn't.

We are here discussing the JF-17 wings and Mig-21 / F-7 wings, so plz provide figure and then try to convince us, just statements won't work.

Here, see this picture to get things in perspective and let the people decide, which design has more influence on the JF-17 wings, Mig-21 or the F-16s. I am giving things with facts and figure, you are just making statements.



So now after this post of mine and the earlier one, its your turn to give facts and figures, and convince us that you are right.

 

[VCheng]

Plz elaborate with facts and figures.

JF-17s wings are more similar to F-16 wings design compared to Mig-21s.

Sabre II and JL-9 are modified, evolved versions of the basic Mig-21 design, but JF-17 wing design has no influence from the Mig-21s.

Delta wing design is a general terminology, numerous aircraft use delta wing design.

We are here discussing the JF-17 wings and Mig-21 / F-7 wings, so plz provide figure and then try to convince us, just statements won't work.

Here, see this picture to get things in perspective and let the people decide, which design has more influence on the JF-17 wings, Mig-21 or the F-16s. I am giving things with facts and figure, you are just making statements.



So now after this post of mine and the earlier one, its your turn to give facts and figures, and convince us that you are right.

Of course, it is an evolution, so it does represent advancement. I agree with you here.

I am also very happy to hear that Pakistan will make 58% of the final Block 1 aircraft by June 2012.