JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 4]

[Dr. Strangelove]

double post

 

[Tempest II]

Their is nothing 'full and final'...its an evolving program,

Thank you very much for that note. I had refrained from commenting on the “final Thunder” description. We know Typhoons and Rafales were in production and inducted without the full range of functions that they were meant to have. This is to allow pilots and ground crew to train and also develop tactics for whatever functionalities that are available at that time. This also allows more extensive testing. So when Block comes, you have feedback from two squadrons instead of two test pilots and ten times the flying hours. Every piece of data becomes more representative the more testing/experience you have. Your components have a change to breakdown, so you know what is not realiable enough and needs replacing. You know what is not user friendly to replace or operate with feedback from the quadrons, etc.

For example, when Microsoft releases a software, even after testing before, they know once it is released, new issues are going to surface. So sometimes in a development project, when you know you are 80% or 90% there, you release while you know fully well there more work to be done, and haven’t even stopped the development. By the time you release Mk 1 or Block A or Series 1 you already have a list of 10 things you know you need to change asap. However, because you know even if these 10 are addressed now, 10 more will crop up after release. You therefore make the choice to release now, get feedback from the marker, and make the 20 changes in one go.

Now you have finally achieved what you wanted on paper originally. However, this is not to say PAF is not going to ask for upgrades after 5 years. So yes, the Block II Thunder IS NOT THE FINAL THUNDER in a true sense.

 

[fatman17]

The JFT is a tremendous achievement and we should all be proud of it and learn from it -- the kinds of things we want to see, more powerful, more efficient engines, longer legs, greater armament payload - these may have to be integrated in a new airframe.

However, there is so much work left in the JFT itself, it's integration with the ZDK or Erieye and the development of tactics and procedures integrated at all levels - there's just a lot of work left.

we as a country/people are a impatient lot - we want, want, want!

 

[Arsalan]

The Changchun airshow has kicked off in the capital of Jilin province in northeast China. Performing teams from China's air force have given audiences an exciting show with some of its most advanced aircraft.

China's air force sent three of its top air performing teams including the famous BAYI team to the air show. Together with serval other teams from the US and Russia, Bayi is one of the few air performing teams in the world that uses jet aircraft.

The aircraft used by the Bayi team include the third generation fighter, the "J-10". This model was adopted by China's air force in 2006 and has received wide compliments for its versatility.

Tianzhiyi aerobatic team performs during the first Changchun aviation open day in Changchun, capital of northeast China's Jilin Province, Sept. 1, 2011. The internationally renowned Bayi aerobatic team and newly established Hongying (red eagle) aerobatic team and Tianzhiyi (wing of the sky) aerobatic team, together with Lanying (blue eagle) paratroopers' team, presented the spectators with different kinds of performances. (Xinhua/Wang Haofei)

Tianzhiyi aerobatic team performs during the first Changchun aviation open day in Changchun, capital of northeast China's Jilin Province, Sept. 1, 2011. The internationally renowned Bayi aerobatic team and newly established Hongying (red eagle) aerobatic team and Tianzhiyi (wing of the sky) aerobatic team, together with Lanying (blue eagle) paratroopers' team, presented the spectators with different kinds of performances. (Xinhua/Wang Haofei)

Tianzhiyi aerobatic team performs during the first Changchun aviation open day in Changchun, capital of northeast China's Jilin Province, Sept. 1, 2011. The internationally renowned Bayi aerobatic team and newly established Hongying (red eagle) aerobatic team and Tianzhiyi (wing of the sky) aerobatic team, together with Lanying (blue eagle) paratroopers' team, presented the spectators with different kinds of performances. (Xinhua/Wang Haofei)

Hongying aerobatic team performs during the first Changchun aviation open day in Changchun, capital of northeast China's Jilin Province, Sept. 1, 2011. The internationally renowned Bayi aerobatic team and newly established Hongying (red eagle) aerobatic team and Tianzhiyi (wing of the sky) aerobatic team, together with Lanying (blue eagle) paratroopers' team, presented the spectators with different kinds of performances. (Xinhua/Wang Haofei)

http://www.defence.pk/forums/china-defence/127752-changchun-air-show-kicks-off.html#post2078629

it would have been great if we could have seen PAF in this show as well.
i dont kow why are we not participating at all.

 

[Arsalan]

Their is nothing 'full and final'...its an evolving program, lots of more things will be added as per the requirements of PAF. Block-II will be a refined previous version not a completely new aircraft, after the induction of block-II we will see ALCM/JSOW somewhere in 2-3 years.

According to some resources no new hard point will be added to the current design, there is hardly any major air frame change expected in Block-II. Position of probe & IRST(less likely to be a part of block-II) will be as depicted in above posted illustration. Integrating an equipment is not a problem at all, test & evaluating it in different conditions and scenarios is...if PAF decides to get IRST added then we have to wait for 10-12 months more for them. Needless to mention flight trails of aerial refueling is itself a chapter left.

Once we get Block-II, previous block will get upgraded too, or its possible that PAF decides to build an OCU and allot them to it.

hmm, that will be great. the JFT was initially designed with the idea of continous evolution in miond. it could be the best succedor of F-16 is this regard. with an open fram design, it will be open to most of modren developments and can be kept updated and flying for decades. hpwever, i was worried by the various sources claiming the Blk-II to be the final thunder!

thanks and best regards!

 

[Jango]

The bugle on the right side is an impression of IRST

I know that, but the picture is an animation, not the real thing, and as Najam Khan said, no IRST on blk II.

 

[monitor]

 

[Last Hope]

 

[Arsalan]

 

[Donatello]

I know that, but the picture is an animation, not the real thing, and as Najam Khan said, no IRST on blk II.

I do not understand why we are not integrating IRST on all models. I mean, it is a must for day-night capability and carrying a pod takes up a hard point.......any reasons??

 

[araz]

I do not understand why we are not integrating IRST on all models. I mean, it is a must for day-night capability and carrying a pod takes up a hard point.......any reasons??

I suspect there is a set programme of when what capability would be integrated depending on PAFs priority. Each new system requires test and evaluation. Plus space consideration is also an aspect.You also need to evaluate how capable is the new tech you want to integrate, as it has often happened that PAF has nto been happy with a product and has asked for changes for it to comply with its demands. Lastly cost consideration is paramount in PAFs mind.So all in all you need to consider a lot of things before you integrate new tech. This is why it takes time.
PAF has its hands full on all the fronts.
Araz

 

[Kompromat]

Enjoy.

 

[Jango]

I do not understand why we are not integrating IRST on all models. I mean, it is a must for day-night capability and carrying a pod takes up a hard point.......any reasons??

Most probably the reason is that there is a set program schedule, and IRST induction date has not yet come, so it will come, in due time.

 

[Beast]

Enjoy.

This prototype is the testing with WS-13,right? The engine petal is in dark black rather the metallic bluish color of the RD-93 engine.. It seems to be some different. That's my suspect.

 

[TaimiKhan]

This prototype is the testing with WS-13,right? The engine petal is in dark black rather the metallic bluish color of the RD-93 engine.. It seems to be some different. That's my suspect.

I have seen atleast 40 landings of JF-17 up close at its first sqd home base, as close as 20 meters, and the sound the RD-93 makes at the time of landing is exactly 100% as we hear in this video. RD-93s have a distinct sound which they make at the time of landing. My guess is the FC-1 in the video is still using RD-93s, but who knows the WS-13 is exact copy of RD-93 thus it has the same sound characteristics too.