JF-17 Block-3 -- Updates, News & Discussion

[messiach]

No.

That hints towards three possibilities:
1. Structural changes.
2. Material (more composites?) changes.
3. Both 1 & 2.

These are SoP for any new built. Every generation should be considered a new fighter jet.

Re: Structural changes, I think they are likely to be minor and not major. Widening / modification of DSI has been hinted and possibility of the tail being more akin to B version . The later makes sense to harmonize the building processes and have a unified structure for both A&B. We have also heard of rejigging internal tubing to allow for AESA fitment. So those things will likely be structural in nature. Whether this would require stress testing agian is something @messiach can tell us. Additional chin mounted hardpoints or incorporation of DER/additional wing HP(Wishful thinking) might put increased work load on the frame so perhaps that is the reason.
More composites have been hinted and are poissibly coming so very likely.
Regards
A

SoP.

Ma'm if the airframe is pretty much the same as block 2 as claimed by @Deino then what is the point of carrying out the above mentioned tests...

1. SS IRST are module based, they can be mounted anywhere suitable on the aircraft providing 360 coverage with DSA.
2. No.
3.4. Classified.

I would appreciate if you could give us your opinion on the following for the Block 3:

1. Any chance of IRST showing up on the Block 3? I mean an air-to-air sensor like the Eurofighter's PIRATE and Su-35's OLS-35 and not a targeting pod like the Sniper.
2. Any chance of Towed IR/Radar Decoys and expendable decoys like the Raytheon AN/ALE-50 or ALE-55 and Leonardo Britecloud?
3. Any chance of a 250lb class Quad packable weapon? Something like the Raytheon GBU-39 SDB, UK Spear
4. Any chance of a CBU-97 type sensor fused weapon?

Of course, Pakistan is going to have to find a chinese or turkish system for these purposes. But what chances are there of such systems finding their way on the Block 3?
@messiach

 

[Dazzler]

No.


1. SS IRST are module based, they can be mounted anywhere suitable on the aircraft providing 360 coverage with DSA.

I hope you understand that most members on the forum are not familiar with abbreviations like SS IRST/ DSA.

 

[Shane]

I hope you understand that most members on the forum are not familiar with abbreviations like SS IRST/ DSA.

I think she is aware of that fact.

 

[araz]

I hope you understand that most members on the forum are not familiar with abbreviations like SS IRST/ DSA.

@Dazzler.
Please tell us what SS IRST and DSA mean.
OK DSA IS?
electro-optical Distributed Aperture System (DAS)

A

 

[Deino]

@Dazzler.
Please tell us what SS IRST and DSA mean.
OK DSA IS?
electro-optical Distributed Aperture System (DAS)

A

SS IRST = Solid State Infra-red search and track (device) I would say!?

 

[Arsalan]

Possible 2 new under wing plus two under intake so 4 new pylons

POssible, may be! But unlikely.
Expecting max addition of one under cockpit for mission POD and that is it as far as hard points are concerned.

 

[wulff]

Buy a EF Typhoon instead eh? Who will sell you OLS 35? Russians? What will they integrate on SU-35s then? EFTs pirate IRST? Should they sell it to you and abandon the IRST for the EFT? And Raytheon is dying to sell us CBU 97 right.

Do you guys even think before posting such gibberish?

I would have expected a better reply from you. EU/US/RUS may not sell but China and Turkey have already fielded or are developing such systems.

1. IRST: China has developed multiple domestic IRSTs. These are deployed on J-16s, J-15s, J-10B/Cs and they have also demonstrated such systems for FC-31. If they are willing to sell a J-10C, they will sell the IRST it carries. Here is a link showing various types of IR sensors developed by them:

https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/j-20-5th-gen-fighter-thread-v.t7303/page-257#post-414602

The imgur albums in that post has a bunch of such sensors, developed by just one Chinese company.

2. As Quwa said, BriteCloud is on offer from Leonardo. And although I dont have photographic proof, but China likely already has developed such systems. Turkey is developing one as well. Here is a video that was released in 2018 of Aselsan's in-development towed decoy: https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/tf-x...rcraft-projects.256669/page-153#post-10540063

China is today developing airborne solid state lasers for their J-11/16 series aircraft, which are designed to kill incoming SAMs/AAMs.

3. China has already developed sensor fused cluster weapons for their artillery and MLRS systems. They wont have much of a problem developing an air launched dispenser for those.

China also has at least one 250 lb guided weapon in the class of the SDB. It is called the CS/BBM-2. Given the variety of their drone launched miniature munitions, it is a no brainer to assume multiple such weapons exist in china. Turkey is also developing a 250 lb class SDB type weapon. It is currently being tested on a Turkish F-16. Here is a link

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/turkish-missile-programs.60968/page-347#post-11307386

Pakistan does not have to take systems off of an Eurofighter or wait for Raytheon to sell if it decided to add said capabilities to the JF-17.

I sincerely suggest thinking before you respond with gibberish

 

[Dazzler]

I would have expected a better reply from you. EU/US/RUS may not sell but China and Turkey have already fielded or are developing such systems.

1. IRST: China has developed multiple domestic IRSTs. These are deployed on J-16s, J-15s, J-10B/Cs and they have also demonstrated such systems for FC-31. If they are willing to sell a J-10C, they will sell the IRST it carries. Here is a link showing various types of IR sensors developed by them:

https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/j-20-5th-gen-fighter-thread-v.t7303/page-257#post-414602

The imgur albums in that post has a bunch of such sensors, developed by just one Chinese company.

2. As Quwa said, BriteCloud is on offer from Leonardo. And although I dont have photographic proof, but China likely already has developed such systems. Turkey is developing one as well. Here is a video that was released in 2018 of Aselsan's in-development towed decoy: https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/tf-x...rcraft-projects.256669/page-153#post-10540063

China is today developing airborne solid state lasers for their J-11/16 series aircraft, which are designed to kill incoming SAMs/AAMs.

3. China has already developed sensor fused cluster weapons for their artillery and MLRS systems. They wont have much of a problem developing an air launched dispenser for those.

China also has at least one 250 lb guided weapon in the class of the SDB. It is called the CS/BBM-2. Given the variety of their drone launched miniature munitions, it is a no brainer to assume multiple such weapons exist in china. Turkey is also developing a 250 lb class SDB type weapon. It is currently being tested on a Turkish F-16. Here is a link

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/turkish-missile-programs.60968/page-347#post-11307386

Pakistan does not have to take systems off of an Eurofighter or wait for Raytheon to sell if it decided to add said capabilities to the JF-17.

I sincerely suggest thinking before you respond with gibberish

Go through your post and read it over.

 

[wulff]

No.


These are SoP for any new built. Every generation should be considered a new fighter jet.


SoP.


1. SS IRST are module based, they can be mounted anywhere suitable on the aircraft providing 360 coverage with DSA.
2. No.
3.4. Classified.

Thank you madam. Appreciate your to-the-point reply. I'm interested in the IRST story because of the danger stand-off jamming poses in terms of degrading the JF-17's radar detection/tracking ranges. Hopefully the PAF would have had a taste of things to come during the February event.

 

[messiach]

Solid state IRST are modular distributable sensors installed anywhere on the aircraft. They are interferable and limited. DSA is digital subtractive analysis of thermographic data. These systems are not exhaustive but complimentary.

@Dazzler.
Please tell us what SS IRST and DSA mean.
OK DSA IS?
electro-optical Distributed Aperture System (DAS)

A

 

[Khafee]

Buy a EF Typhoon instead eh? Who will sell you OLS 35? Russians? What will they integrate on SU-35s then? EFTs pirate IRST? Should they sell it to you and abandon the IRST for the EFT? And Raytheon is dying to sell us CBU 97 right.

Do you guys even think before posting such gibberish?

He is just asking genuine questions, why are you being condescending?

 

[messiach]

EWS capacity is developed for this purpose.

Thank you madam. Appreciate your to-the-point reply. I'm interested in the IRST story because of the danger stand-off jamming poses in terms of degrading the JF-17's radar detection/tracking ranges. Hopefully the PAF would have had a taste of things to come during the February event.

 

[SQ8]

EWS capacity is developed for this purpose.

Multiple “pilot” trials were carried out 27th Feb.

 

[messiach]

Block3 is carrying a very similar EWS to jian10. There are some minor alterations to leading edges.

Multiple “pilot” trials were carried out 27th Feb.

 

[Chak Bamu]

There are some minor alterations to leading edges.

Something to do with RCS?