Israel & GCC discussing War with Iran in Warsa

[VEVAK]

https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2019/02/13/588508/Israel-Benjamin-Netanyau-Iran-Warsaw-Arabs

I wonder if idiot politicians in Iran will still refuse to increase our Defense budget to an appropriate level!

Iran needs to start increases it's missile & UCAV production capabilities. ​

We've had repeated attacks in Iran against Iranian military personal and now this!

Israel has practically declared war on Iran and it's time Iran starts taking precautionary defensive measures and go to Iran's version of Defcon 2 and be ready for our own retaliatory blitz attack.

 

[Crystal-Clear]

https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2019/02/13/588508/Israel-Benjamin-Netanyau-Iran-Warsaw-Arabs

I wonder if idiot politicians in Iran will still refuse to increase our Defense budget to an appropriate level!

Iran needs to start increases it's missile & UCAV production capabilities. ​

We've had repeated attacks in Iran against Iranian military personal and now this!

Israel has practically declared war on Iran and it's time Iran starts taking precautionary defensive measures and go to Iran's version of Defcon 2 and be ready for our own retaliatory blitz attack.

iran is busy in blame game .

 

[Philip the Arab]

https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2019/02/13/588508/Israel-Benjamin-Netanyau-Iran-Warsaw-Arabs

I wonder if idiot politicians in Iran will still refuse to increase our Defense budget to an appropriate level!

Iran needs to start increases it's missile & UCAV production capabilities. ​

We've had repeated attacks in Iran against Iranian military personal and now this!

Israel has practically declared war on Iran and it's time Iran starts taking precautionary defensive measures and go to Iran's version of Defcon 2 and be ready for our own retaliatory blitz attack.

Are you dumb or are you dumb? Blitz is from WW2 and in no way could Iran even attack Israel without major repercussions. Simple to say, Israel has nukes and Iran does not. Even if Iran has nukes at first they will be low in kilotons of tnt while I'm sure Israel has megaton yields by now, some 50 or so years after first developing nukes.

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

 

[Persian Gulf 1906]

 

[VEVAK]

Are you dumb or are you dumb? Blitz is from WW2 and in no way could Iran even attack Israel without major repercussions. Simple to say, Israel has nukes and Iran does not. Even if Iran has nukes at first they will be low in kilotons of tnt while I'm sure Israel has megaton yields by now, some 50 or so years after first developing nukes.

Only a delusional person would think that just because Israel has nukes Iran will reframe from responding a Israeli attack!

Iran will most certainly respond to an Israeli attack and if they use WMD's Iran will respond in kind and the Israeli's know that and given that they have less than a handful of major cities Iran responding in kind isn't going to be good for a tiny country like Israel.

And Iran's version of a Blitz attack isn't going to involve Tanks like WW2 moron Iran's version will be firing 1000's of Ballistic Missiles, cruise missiles, rockets & UCAV's coordinated to arrive at Israel at about the same time. UAE military, vital infrastructure, Ports & command will most certainly be taken out (Hell Iran's Fatteh class alone can do that) same with every Saud target within 1000km of Iran.

 

[Philip the Arab]

Only a delusional person would think that just because Israel has nukes Iran will reframe from responding a Israeli attack!

Iran will most certainly respond to an Israeli attack and if they use WMD's Iran will respond in kind and the Israeli's know that and given that they have less than a handful of major cities Iran responding in kind isn't going to be good for a tiny country like Israel.

And Iran's version of a Blitz attack isn't going to involve Tanks like WW2 moron Iran's version will be firing 1000's of Ballistic Missiles, cruise missiles, rockets & UCAV's coordinated to arrive at Israel at about the same time. UAE military, vital infrastructure, Ports & command will most certainly be taken out (Hell Iran's Fatteh class along can do that) same with every Saud target within 1000km of Iran.

Those are all conventional weapons, unless of course you use NBC without the N but Israel has an abundant supply of countermeasures for civilians. As I said before Tehran and any other major cities will be completely obliterated off the face of the earth so Iran is taking a huge gamble at attacking Israel. I was not aware of Iran having any WMDs except chemical and biological weapons so if Iran has some magic weapon then you know something I don't and Iran is some mighty nation. In the words of Netanyahu "Strike Israel and it will be the last anniversary you celebrate" Besides, your missiles will probably hit Lebanon if you launched them towards Israel.

 

[Stryker1982]

I was not aware of Iran having any WMDs except chemical and biological weapons so if Iran has some magic weapon then you know something I don't and Iran is some mighty nation.

Chemical and Biological missiles are more than enough to deter Israel from using nuclear weapons. The point is, that if their is ever a hotwar between Iran and Israel. Israel should be deterred from using nuclear missiles.

We don't know if Iran holds are large chemical stockpile or not but they should in my opinion since their principle enemy is stocked with 100's of nuclear weapons.

 

[Philip the Arab]

Chemical and Biological missiles are more than enough to deter Israel from using nuclear weapons. The point is, that if their is ever a hotwar between Iran and Israel. Israel should be deterred from using nuclear missiles.

You and I both know they won't. During the Yom Kippur war Israel was going to use nukes without reason and what's to say they won't today, the Samson Option means they will do whatever they can to insure the survival of the Zionist state. Israel can intercept Iranian missiles individually most likely and Iran does not have enough TEL's to launch them all simultaneously in which case they will be launched in waves and intercepted or the TEL's hit with cruise missiles. Overall its hard to hit Israel and the damage will be less than what Israel will do to Iran so its a Win-Win for Israel, their enemy is gone and they suffered less casualties than the Iranians even if their population is smaller they shalt recover with their government intact. I can't say the same about the Iranian regime.

 

[Stryker1982]

You and I both know they won't. During the Yom Kippur war Israel was going to use nukes without reason and what's to say they won't today, the Samson Option means they will do whatever they can to insure the survival of the Zionist state. Israel can intercept Iranian missiles individually most likely and Iran does not have enough TEL's to launch them all simultaneously in which case they will be launched in waves and intercepted or the TEL's hit with cruise missiles. Overall its hard to hit Israel and the damage will be less than what Israel will do to Iran so its a Win-Win for Israel, their enemy is gone and they suffered less casualties than the Iranians even if their population is smaller they shalt recover with their government intact. I can't say the same about the Iranian regime.

I completely disagree .

I believe Israel are so barbaric they are willing to use nuclear weapons without reason. On the other hand, Gassing Israeli cities causes alot of damage in the sense of mild to large casualties but more importantly mass exodus from Israel. The point is that if Israel believes nuclear weapons is an option, they need to feel that Israel would be at stake should they make that choice



Regarding military stand point:
1) You don't know how many TEL's Iran has so I have no idea where you can possibly assume how many TEL's Iran has.
2) Suggesting that TEL's can be hit with cruise missiles is so implausible. Do you know how long it takes for a cruise missile to reach....say central Iran from the border of the Persian gulf? It could take up to an hour assuming you can even find it in a land space the size of western Europe.
3) I don't understand how you can suggest "Win-win" for Israel when their cities are attacked by chemical gas.
4) Using any form of WMD's doesn't magically eradicate governments.

The point is that Iran needs to have a credible WMD threat for Israel, enough to suggest Israel's existence would be at stake should WMD's be used.

 

[Blue In Green]

You and I both know they won't. During the Yom Kippur war Israel was going to use nukes without reason and what's to say they won't today, the Samson Option means they will do whatever they can to insure the survival of the Zionist state. Israel can intercept Iranian missiles individually most likely and Iran does not have enough TEL's to launch them all simultaneously in which case they will be launched in waves and intercepted or the TEL's hit with cruise missiles. Overall its hard to hit Israel and the damage will be less than what Israel will do to Iran so its a Win-Win for Israel, their enemy is gone and they suffered less casualties than the Iranians even if their population is smaller they shalt recover with their government intact. I can't say the same about the Iranian regime.

How did you come to the conclusion that Iran doesn't have enough TEL's (unless you have actual numbers, this point is completely mute). Logically one would think that since BM's are a literal cornerstone of Irans deterrence, they would indeed have a sizable amount of TEL's. I would surmise that Iran is currently building TELs, BM's, missiles of all kinds and makes more so now than ever due to the very tumultuous geo-political climate. I mean we've seen on more than one occasion Iran firing its missiles from TEL's, silos etc...So respectively I just don't see how they wouldn't have the means to launch an efficient saturation attack against Israel.

Also it should be noted that Iran will be using a mixture of CMs, BMs, Quasi-BMs, Long-range drones and proxies in any war-scenario with Israel. Proxies/Allies (depending on your perspective) like Hezbollah are still quite lethal against Israel, more so now than ever. It wouldn't be a one-sided war but Iran (I believe) has the means to hit high value targets in Israel.

I completely disagree .

I believe Israel are so barbaric they are willing to use nuclear weapons without reason. On the other hand, Gassing Israeli cities causes alot of damage in the sense of mild to large casualties but more importantly mass exodus from Israel. The point is that if Israel believes nuclear weapons is an option, they need to feel that Israel would be at stake should they make that choice



Regarding military stand point:
1) You don't know how many TEL's Iran has so I have no idea where you can possibly assume how many TEL's Iran has.
2) Suggesting that TEL's can be hit with cruise missiles is so implausible. Do you know how long it takes for a cruise missile to reach....say central Iran from the border of the Persian gulf? It could take up to an hour assuming you can even find it in a land space the size of western Europe.
3) I don't understand how you can suggest "Win-win" for Israel when their cities are attacked by chemical gas.
4) Using any form of WMD's doesn't magically eradicate governments.

The point is that Iran needs to have a credible WMD threat for Israel, enough to suggest Israel's existence would be at stake should WMD's be used.

Your second point is such an important concept that many people just tend to not understand. Iran is HUGE, even in the best of operational conditions, finding and adequately quelling Irans offensive abilities is a monumental task given all the Air defense you'd have to get through, bunkers, mountain bases, silos, mobile TELs which you will have to find, etc. It isn't some video-game where the objectives cleanly marked on a map and you can press a button then BAM! it's gone. I'd like to believe war has much more finesse to it...

 

[Beny Karachun]

You overestimate the power of conventional ballistic missiles and underestimate the power of merely owning nuclear weapons. In World War Two, Germany suffered more explosive power than what ever Iran has, and they were no where close to extinction, and that was when the Allies had shared borders and air superiority over Germany, you think you are going to wipe out cities with maybe at most a few kilotons worth of conventional weapons, and that's not even considering their kilometers long CEPs, the fact that the majority of them won't even reach Israel, and that most of the ones that will reach Israel will be intercepted?

And Iran's version of a Blitz attack isn't going to involve Tanks like WW2 moron Iran's version will be firing 1000's of Ballistic Missiles, cruise missiles, rockets & UCAV's coordinated to arrive at Israel at about the same time. UAE military, vital infrastructure, Ports & command will most certainly be taken out (Hell Iran's Fatteh class alone can do that) same with every Saud target within 1000km of Iran.

Didn't you say Iran need to up its budget? You were so worried, you said "it's time Iran starts taking precautionary defensive measured", as if it's gonna loose otherwise, but later on you claim everything is fine and Iran has all in its hands, and that Iran's current arsenal is enough for an easy victory.

1) You don't know how many TEL's Iran has so I have no idea where you can possibly assume how many TEL's Iran has.

Not enough to get Israel anywhere near destruction

2) Suggesting that TEL's can be hit with cruise missiles is so implausible. Do you know how long it takes for a cruise missile to reach....say central Iran from the border of the Persian gulf? It could take up to an hour assuming you can even find it in a land space the size of western Europe.

Most of your missiles will be located in Western Iran, because in order to reach Israel they need to be as close to it as possible, they simply wouldn't reach Israel otherwise.At this point I wouldn't be surprised if we were to use your neighbors airfields for our jets, the enemy of our enemy is our friend, even if we have our past experiences.

Remember when a Shahab 3 missile base suddenly blew up in 2011, along with Gen. Hassan Tehrani Moghaddam, the head of Irans missile program, and dozens of more Iranians? I wonder what caused it. Must have been the wind.

Now imagine this happening again, and again, and again. Because that's exactly what's going to happen.
And that's just the Mossad, what are you going to do when Sayeret Matkal and Shaldag units will sabotage your army? You wouldn't even know they were there until the damage is already done.

3) I don't understand how you can suggest "Win-win" for Israel when their cities are attacked by chemical gas.

Chemical weapons or not, you launch ballistic missiles at us, chances are you're going to be microwaved.

4) Using any form of WMD's doesn't magically eradicate governments.

How well your government will manage when Teheran along with all of your major cities are suddenly inhospitable to anything but lizards and cockroaches?

The point is that Iran needs to have a credible WMD threat for Israel, enough to suggest Israel's existence would be at stake should WMD's be used.

Chemical and Biological weapons aren't enough to destroy a nation.

Besides, every citizen in Israel has access to a bunker most of them are fortified in a way that unless a Scud will literally land on it, everyone inside will be intact and well.

 

[Blue In Green]

You overestimate the power of conventional ballistic missiles and underestimate the power of merely owning nuclear weapons. In World War Two, Germany suffered more explosive power than what ever Iran has, and they were no where close to extinction, and that was when the Allies had shared borders and air superiority over Germany, you think you are going to wipe out cities with maybe at most a few kilotons worth of conventional weapons, and that's not even considering their kilometers long CEPs, the fact that the majority of them won't even reach Israel, and that most of the ones that will reach Israel will be intercepted?

Didn't you say Iran need to up its budget? You were so worried, you said "it's time Iran starts taking precautionary defensive measured", as if it's gonna loose otherwise, but later on you claim everything is fine and Iran has all in its hands, and that Iran's current arsenal is enough for an easy victory.


Not enough to get Israel anywhere near destruction


Most of your missiles will be located in Western Iran, because in order to reach Israel they need to be as close to it as possible, they simply wouldn't reach Israel otherwise.At this point I wouldn't be surprised if we were to use your neighbors airfields for our jets, the enemy of our enemy is our friend, even if we have our past experiences.

Remember when a Shahab 3 missile base suddenly blew up in 2011, along with Gen. Hassan Tehrani Moghaddam, the head of Irans missile program, and dozens of more Iranians? I wonder what caused it. Must have been the wind.

Now imagine this happening again, and again, and again. Because that's exactly what's going to happen.
And that's just the Mossad, what are you going to do when Sayeret Matkal and Shaldag units will sabotage your army? You wouldn't even know they were there until the damage is already done.

Chemical weapons or not, you launch ballistic missiles at us, chances are you're going to be microwaved.


How well your government will manage when Teheran along with all of your major cities are suddenly inhospitable to anything but lizards and cockroaches?


Chemical and Biological weapons aren't enough to destroy a nation.

Besides, every citizen in Israel has access to a bunker most of them are fortified in a way that unless a Scud will literally land on it, everyone inside will be intact and well.

Given what you're saying then Iran should go for a diverse nuclear arsenal asap since any sort of aggression against Israel will be met with nuclear retaliation. Sounds like a self-fulfilling prophecy to me...

Regardless, I think "Mossad's" operations in Iran have been hampered ever since the 2011, hell even that supposed Nuclear files stealing was questionable at best since most if not all of the information "stolen" by super duper Israeli ultra spies was already known during the Nuclear talks, it came off as more of a Netanyahu PR stunt (amongst many others). Further more, the Base accident/explosion (to think Israel has some sort UNLIMITED operational capacity in Iran is just wishful thinking, you are drastically underestimating you enemy) wont stop the Iranians. Iran still has Hezbollah and multiple above ground and underground missile production bases with numerous TELs, silos and god knows what else, fielding ever more accurate and destructive missiles (I mean according to your post Israel has literally unlimited abilities to operate in Iran). Wouldn't it be logical for Israel to continue in destroying Irans ability to produce these increasingly advanced missiles? Relying on "Mossad" to win the conflict by subversion/espionage is well kinda stupid really. Why hasn't there been any more base explosions since 2011? I mean Iran has DRASTICALLY increased its missile production and technology since 2011. One would think that Israel would continue targeting Iranian missile bases since the 2011 was so effective. Consistency, Beny, consistency...

I personally don't think Iran can "destroy" Israel or wipe it "off" the map (Israel is the stronger nation conventionally) but to say that any damage Iran can possibly do is negligible or insignificant (given just how big and advanced Irans offensive capabilities are getting) is just really void of reason. War is war, and missiles raining down on strategic Israeli assets, like sea ports, air ports, industrial centers, energy production, cities where commerce is conducted etc, will have a tangible effect. Even if Israel uses nukes against Iran off the bat (horrible decision). Iran will RACE towards building its own nuclear arsenal (they wont keel over and let millions of their own just die without retaliation). And to boot, Iran is 80 million people, Israel is 9 million about. Iran can recover since it's big, diverse and naturally resilient (all those years of sanctions have made the people pretty hardened to hardships, remember Saddam's chemical attacks?), Israel is much smaller with its population centers in Tel Aviv, Haifa, Ashdod, Rishon LeZion, Netanya, etc. Unless you Israelis also think you can kill 80 million people and "wipe" out the Persians/Iranians for good too lmao. Wishful thinking again. Nukes are not the end of a civilization or the world, more useless "end of the world" destruction **** for idiots...

All in all I'm glad to see Israeli hubris matches our own American hubris. Don't take what I say as personal though, I'm just sharing my own point of view.

Separate question for you. Do you think Israel could win a conflict against the US? like one-on-one?

 

[Philip the Arab]

I completely disagree .

I believe Israel are so barbaric they are willing to use nuclear weapons without reason. On the other hand, Gassing Israeli cities causes alot of damage in the sense of mild to large casualties but more importantly mass exodus from Israel. The point is that if Israel believes nuclear weapons is an option, they need to feel that Israel would be at stake should they make that choice



Regarding military stand point:
1) You don't know how many TEL's Iran has so I have no idea where you can possibly assume how many TEL's Iran has.
2) Suggesting that TEL's can be hit with cruise missiles is so implausible. Do you know how long it takes for a cruise missile to reach....say central Iran from the border of the Persian gulf? It could take up to an hour assuming you can even find it in a land space the size of western Europe.
3) I don't understand how you can suggest "Win-win" for Israel when their cities are attacked by chemical gas.
4) Using any form of WMD's doesn't magically eradicate governments.

The point is that Iran needs to have a credible WMD threat for Israel, enough to suggest Israel's existence would be at stake should WMD's be used.

What I mean by Win-Win is that Israel has capabilities against chemical weapons such as shelters, gas masks, etc and that their citizens losses will be miniscule when compared to Iran's. Mountains are the worst place for a nuclear strike since the radiation can't leave and means a more lethal radius for longer hence what happened during WW2 with either Hiroshima or Nagasaki. My point is that citizens are protected against many things since Gaza has been launching rockets into Israel for the last decade or so and can be out of danger in a moments notice. You are right I don't know the number of TELs but loading, and launching would be detected by Israel fairly easily and I'm pretty sure the Arrow series is pretty good at intercepting missiles if deployed is significant numbers. You and I both know many BMs would miss and hit useless parts of Israel or hit other nations which would be very bad for Iran because of more enemies.

 

[Beny Karachun]

Given what you're saying then Iran should go for a diverse nuclear arsenal asap since any sort of aggression against Israel will be met with nuclear retaliation. Sounds like a self-fulfilling prophecy to me...

That's exactly what they're trying to achieve, but we won't let Iran get it.

Regardless, I think "Mossad's" operations in Iran have been hampered ever since the 2011, hell even that supposed Nuclear files stealing was questionable at best since most if not all of the information "stolen" by super duper Israeli ultra spies was already known during the Nuclear talks, it came off as more of a Netanyahu PR stunt (amongst many others). Further more, the Base accident/explosion (to think Israel has some sort UNLIMITED operational capacity in Iran is just wishful thinking, you are drastically underestimating you enemy) wont stop the Iranians. Iran still has Hezbollah and multiple above ground and underground missile production bases with numerous TELs, silos and god knows what else, fielding ever more accurate and destructive missiles (I mean according to your post Israel has literally unlimited abilities to operate in Iran). Wouldn't it be logical for Israel to continue in destroying Irans ability to produce these increasingly advanced missiles? Relying on "Mossad" to win the conflict by subversion/espionage is well kinda stupid really. Why hasn't there been any more base explosions since 2011? I mean Iran has DRASTICALLY increased its missile production and technology since 2011. One would think that Israel would continue targeting Iranian missile bases since the 2011 was so effective. Consistency, Beny, consistency...

Was already known my ***, we shipped a whole container worth of information that only a select few Iranians, and the whole Israeli intelligence service knew where it is, and Israel managed to ship it from Iran without anyone noticing. Mossad is all over your country, your scientists randomly dying, bases blowing up, centrifuges failing, it's all Mossad.
Mossad won't win the war, but it's definitly an asset, Israel is capable of sending special forces that will meet up with the Mossad, easily multiplying the amount of damage Israel is able to cause from within Iran. They wouldn't win the war either, our plans would be much bigger than that. All we need is a green light and a major part of your chain-of-command will be assassinated. The purpose of destroying that missile base wasn't for the sole intention of destroying one, you had some valuable personel that died there.

I personally don't think Iran can "destroy" Israel or wipe it "off" the map (Israel is the stronger nation conventionally) but to say that any damage Iran can possibly do is negligible or insignificant (given just how big and advanced Irans offensive capabilities are getting) is just really void of reason. War is war, and missiles raining down on strategic Israeli assets, like sea ports, air ports, industrial centers, energy production, cities where commerce is conducted etc, will have a tangible effect. Even if Israel uses nukes against Iran off the bat (horrible decision). Iran will RACE towards building its own nuclear arsenal (they wont keel over and let millions of their own just die without retaliation). And to boot, Iran is 80 million people, Israel is 9 million about. Iran can recover since it's big, diverse and naturally resilient (all those years of sanctions have made the people pretty hardened to hardships, remember Saddam's chemical attacks?), Israel is much smaller with its population centers in Tel Aviv, Haifa, Ashdod, Rishon LeZion, Netanya, etc. Unless you Israelis also think you can kill 80 million people and "wipe" out the Persians/Iranians for good too lmao. Wishful thinking again. Nukes are not the end of a civilization or the world, more useless "end of the world" destruction **** for idiots...

I said Iran's ballistic missiles are not an existential threat against us, Iranian missiles aren't that big, aren't that strong and aren't that accurate. As you can see Irans missiles wouldn't target solely Israel, but they would be split against other nations. Now you have the fact that a part of the ones that will target Israel will not reach Israel, perhaps they would blow up in Iran like that Shahab 3 missile base, or maybe they will just crash in their way to Israel, then there are the missiles that would be intercepted by Israel, given Israels expertise in that field, there would be quite a few of them. The ones that will not be intercpted, have a CEP ranging from 300 to 3000 meters, which is quite large, they can't reliably target infastructure, only use those missiles as weapons of terror.
Netanyahu already said that if you would try to destroy Haifaand Tel Aviv you will fail, but we would quite literally end you in return.

Separate question for you. Do you think Israel could win a conflict against the US? like one-on-one?

We would make up a fight, probably a much bigger fight than anything America has seen in the last 70 years, however if America changes into a war economy and get all its aircraft carriers within range of Israel, then it's only a question of time.