Israel and Non Arab Muslim countries

[Hyperion]

Actually, I wouldn't be so polite.

You do not get it do you I do not care what you say. OP was not addressed to you. I am being polite to you.



Well it shows if we can openly start discussing it then there has been some change in some Pakistanis view. maybe in the future more people will discuss and talk about it in an accommodating way.

 

[lem34]

You're missing the point. No one has yet negated anything here That is a win in disguise

Some years ago no Pakistani would have dreamed of even discussing it. It would have been taboo. So there is a change

 

[Hyperion]

I agree, lets not forget the fact that Kashmiris & Pashthuns for example are distant genetic cousins. Even the ancient languages spoken on those lands such as Sanskrit & Avestan are sister languages.

To tell you the truth, Pathans AKA Pashtuns are more related to the Jews than to anyone else. But yes, we love Pakistan and every inhabitant in it. We're one people.

The Israeli Source of the Pathan Tribes
The Taliban Have Jewish Roots? - ABC News

Some years ago no Pakistani would have dreamed of even discussing it. It would have been taboo. So there is a change

Well I had the same mindset I have right now. I grew up in a multi-cultured environment I guess, maybe I could spot the bullshit even as a baby

 

[lem34]

Mate, the reason I don't support the Syrian intervention isn't because the Rebels are killing civilians and vice versa ! I don't support it simply because I've come across a plethora of sources, analysts, journalists, well placed individuals, reports and articles supporting either stance and so I don't support it because I don't know whats going on in there and I find it hard to believe anyone who can categorically say 'Mr A is the Bad Guy' and 'Mr B is the Good Guy' because the facts are as fudged as they can get ! Even in Iraq weren't so many narratives and counter-narratives provided as there are now....so 'I really haven't a clue as to whats going on in Syria on the ground' and I'm stunned if someone supports one side of the other or accuses one side over the other as if the dynamics of Syria exist in a perfect dichotomy !

How do you then feel that so many Saudis and one Jordanian come here and say they are 100% sure when there clearly is no certainty. You know hat I mean butty lol . I suggest neutrality go and check thread and I am condemned as an Iranian supporter etc

 

[Armstrong]

I'm not justifying any wrong, i'm just pointing out the one-sided support. There is no awareness about the Kashmir cause within the Arab public, while in Pakistan even the common man, be he a rikshaw driver, a tea seller, a fruit seller, butcher has something against israel due to the suffering of the Palestinians. We're not even Arabs and we're being more Arab than the Arabs themselves.

I'm not supporting israel, i just prefer that we take a neutral stance in all middle eastern affairs. Do our business and mind our business.

First off if the Kashmir issue hasn't taken root as well as it should have we're to blame a lot for it too ! The Chinese aren't Arabs but they haven't really come out and paralleled our actions or rather our cries over Kashmir ? Reminds me of how true it is that we make a very..very crappy sales pitch ! The other part of it involves the Arab Leaders themselves not lending as much support to it as it deserves and I do blame them for it but not the People !

Secondly saying that 'Israel is engaged in an apartheid against the Palestinians' isn't being more Arab than the Arabs themselves for if that were true then all supporters of Palestine would be doing that and yet many have an open disdain for Saudi Arabia because of what is perceived as their bad human rights records, their lack of women empowerment and a representative system of governance ! I've had the good fortune of interacting with many such American and British individuals, some of whom were Jews, themselves ! So...its not an Arab thing..its a human rights thing ! So is Kashmir and so is it their shame for not recognizing it as it should be and our incompetence for not selling it effectively enough...for godsake we didn't even have a contingency in case of Fai !

P.S Of course I'm for a balanced approach as well ! Do you think I'm asking us to send our armies the next time an Arab-Israeli war breaks out ? No...support the Arabs - our allies - in the UN and give them whatever material aid that we can ! They're more than capable of fighting their own wars....over the past few years they really have gotten their acts together !

 

[p(-)0ENiX]

To tell you the truth, Pathans AKA Pashtuns are more related to the Jews than to anyone else. But yes, we love Pakistan and every inhabitant in it. We're one people.

The Israeli Source of the Pathan Tribes
The Taliban Have Jewish Roots? - ABC News

Lol, I have read a lot about the lost tribes of Israel. However I have never seen any reliable genetic study confirming any relation between the ancient Hebrews & modern day Pasthuns. In fact the most common genetic studies that I have read link both the Pashtuns & Kashmiris to ancient Indo-Europeans.

Speaking of the lost tribes of Israel, there are even theories stating that the Kashmiris are descendants of them as well. However none of them have been proven true as far as I know.

The Ten Lost Tribes: Kashmir

 

[fd24]

Mate, the reason I don't support the Syrian intervention isn't because the Rebels are killing civilians and vice versa ! I don't support it simply because I've come across a plethora of sources, analysts, journalists, well placed individuals, reports and articles supporting either stance and so I don't support it because I don't know whats going on in there and I find it hard to believe anyone who can categorically say 'Mr A is the Bad Guy' and 'Mr B is the Good Guy' because the facts are as fudged as they can get ! Even in Iraq weren't so many narratives and counter-narratives provided as there are now....so 'I really haven't a clue as to whats going on in Syria on the ground' and I'm stunned if someone supports one side of the other or accuses one side over the other as if the dynamics of Syria exist in a perfect dichotomy !

You are a smart bloke and your knowledge is good - yet you attempt to be selective.Ok put the Syrian issue to one side and lets say "we are not sure". What about their behaviour regarding the Palestinian issue? What about their open support of terrorist groups in Pakistan? What about their assistance in the creation of frankenstein (Al Queda)? Do you think you the facts are still fudged? Why are you being selective in what you can and cant remember - i feel patronized when asking me innocently why i think the way i do when you are aware of Saudi behaviour in recent years. I am NOT a Saudi hater in any way what so ever - i am simply frustrated at their "laissez faire" attitude which has harmed so many unnecessarily...

 

[Edevelop]

I agree, lets not forget the fact that Kashmiris & Pashthuns for example are distant genetic cousins. Even the ancient languages spoken on those lands such as Sanskrit & Avestan are sister languages.

Did you just make that up or what?

 

[p(-)0ENiX]

Did you just make that up or what?

Nope, it's true, I don't have the sources regarding the genetic studies at the moment, but they are distinct yet related groups.

 

[Edevelop]

Nope, it's true, I don't have the sources regarding the genetic studies at the moment, but they are distinct yet related groups.

I'm Kashmiri. I don't think i have any links to pashtuns. If you're right, then oh well i need to go back to my family tree and genetic studies...

 

[Armstrong]

How do you then feel that so many Saudis and one Jordanian come here and say they are 100% sure when there clearly is no certainty. You know hat I mean butty lol . I suggest neutrality go and check thread and I am condemned as an Iranian supporter etc

You're as neutral as Italy was during the Second World War !

And BlackEagle - says that hes met a lot of Syrian refugees in Jordan or people who've had loved ones in Syria - its right next door...you know ! Hes my friend and I don't see any reason as to why he'd be lying but do you see me still supporting an intervention ? Buttty, don't be smart with me young man !

P.S Why don't you ask the Turks the same thing ? They're, or so it appears, even more keen on the Syrian Intervention then their Arab counterparts ? Why aren't they Zionist-Imperial boy-toys and the Arabs are ?

 

[Mosamania]

I have no wish to be derailed by you and your thoughts on this if you want to talk about Arab rationality start another thread

As I said it is YOUR internal matter wither to recognize Israel or not. However you keep claiming that "Saudis and Israelis are lovers" yet you never ever bring proof. Our stance since the beginning of the Arab-Israeli conflict have been "At war" with Israel and until today this stance has not changed.

Our soldiers train to fight what they call "The double threat" of both Israel and Iran. It has nothing to do with sectrainism at all up until the Iraniaj revolution in 1979 KSA have had one enemy to the northwest and until today the northwestern military command in KSA is tue most trained and well equipped of all the other regions.

Right now sure we are not as vcocal in our Anti-Israel stance as we used to. Because in 2002 we offered them peace full recognition and even economic collaboration and put our terms in the table and it is up to them to choose peace or war.

If you spoken to our Pilots you will see that who they train against is Israel not Iran we arm up for Israel not Iran. Iran is a pain in the a$$ true but the only thing Iran has managed to do was to depolarize the middle east and effectively made Israel less worried about a united stance.

Iran never fired a bullet against Israel Saudi Arabia have lost hundreds of soldiers in the war. Saudi soldiers fought in the Egyptian and Syrian front. A Saudi armor column have scored one of the few battle victories against Israel in Tel-Murei. Now we are offering peace because we realized in our state we can not win against Israel and we need to build our country's economies and develop ourselves and only then will we be able to fight. In 1948 Israel had massive support from Chickaslovakia and USSR and in 1967 they practically had a western logistical supply bridge same with 1973.

When you fight Israel you do not fight it alone but you fight against those who back it fully. In 1973 the US even used the BlackBird for recon for Israeli forces. So we decided to postpone the conflict until we are ready amd fight them under our terms Hebert the current Iranian situation is going against that.

You love conspiracy theories so let me bring some for you. You say KSA leaders are fully supportive of western stance however historical evidence show that KSA fought against the British not with in the unification, you wanna know something that is historically accurate?? Khomeni came from France.
Another one: in the Iran-Iraq war Iran had massive support from Israel because it was righting Arabs their common enemy you can still see many Uzis and such innthe hand of Iranian soldiers however "Fact" KSA until today is the country with the most effective Israeli goods embargo in the world. So you connect the dots.

 

[lem34]

Lol, I have read a lot about the lost tribes of Israel. However I have never seen any reliable genetic study confirming any relation between the ancient Hebrews & modern day Pasthuns. In fact the most common genetic studies that I have read link both the Pashtuns & Kashmiris to ancient Indo-Europeans.

Speaking of the lost tribes of Israel, there are even theories stating that the Kashmiris are descendants of them as well. However none of them have been proven true as far as I know.

The Ten Lost Tribes: Kashmir

Yep Butty & I can confirm it. Its the big noses lol. I also heard that there was some relation between Kashmir and Pashtuns

 

[p(-)0ENiX]

I'm Kashmiri. I don't think i have any links to pashtuns. If you're right, then oh well i need to go back to my family tree.

I am Kashmiri too. Like I said before, I don't have any sources available with me at the moment. You are free to do your own research & come up with a conclusion on your own.

 

[Hyperion]

Lol, I have read a lot about the lost tribes of Israel. However I have never seen any reliable genetic study confirming any relation between the ancient Hebrews & modern day Pasthuns. In fact the most common genetic studies that I have read link both the Pashtuns & Kashmiris to ancient Indo-Europeans.

Speaking of the lost tribes of Israel, there are even theories stating that the Kashmiris are descendants of them as well. However none of them have been proven true as far as I know.

The Ten Lost Tribes: Kashmir

Read it. Calmly... We are related to anyone and everyone... But not Arabs for sure... Have a go at it. Our Physical features, our customs do not match anything local. They are completely unique and some dialects and words match exact hebrew.

Theory of Pashtun descent from Israelites - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Pashtun people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia