Is there any supersonic / hypersonic missile being developed by Pakistan?

[marcos98]

Subsonic, terrain-hugging cruise missiles are enormously difficult targets to intercept, and they are usually used in swarms, greatly compounding the challenge. They are also easy to engineer with a very low RCS.

Speed is less of a defense these days than ever before. High mach requires altitudes above 40,000 to 50,000 feet in general; the high mach number generates a huge doppler return, and it is well within the envelope of modern SAMS. They are also generally much more expensive. If I had a choice as a commander, I'd rather have a large number of subsonic, low-altitude missiles.

absolutely.....thus nirbhay:

Nirbhay (Sanskrit: निर्भय, Nirbhy "Dauntless/Fearless") is a long range, subsonic Stealth cruise missile[2] being developed in India. The missile will have a range of 1,000 km and will arm three services, the Indian Army, Indian Navy and the Indian Air Force.[3] The Nirbhay will be able to be launched from multiple platforms on land, sea and air. The missile is being developed by the Advanced Systems Laboratory, a division of DRDO and after finalizing the design, the technology required for the missile is being developed. The first test flight of the missile is expected in the year 2010

 

[SnIPeR Xr]

Some members here are not differentiating between Hypersonic & Supersonic
Brahmos is Supersonic missile with top speed of mach2.8.
But what is the speed of most of Interceptors???

MACH 4

Some indian members are relating the criteria of hypersonic missiles with their supersonic brahmos.
A hypersonic missile with speed of Mach 5 or above,is cannot be shot down with Mach 4 interceptors.
But this is utter nonsense that a Mach 4 interceptor cannot shotdown mach 2.8CM if the CM does not have any stealth capability i.e Terrain hugging or radar reflection & even in case of brahmos its high exhaust and enormous weight doesn't give it any of the protection from radar but even makes it more vulnerable to radar detection.

And this is the reason why US dont have any SUPERSONIC CM. but they are working on HYPERSONIC CM.

 

[Jungibaaz]

i dont think u dont know that india has ABM tech which will shield india from any upcomming nuclear missile and it has shown 100% accuracy in its tests where as even china doesnt have its own ABM tech it depends on s400 of russia

were not talking about ICBM/IRBM. Your ABM is for ballistic missiles only, not for cruise missiles, China can still strike India it has the DH-10 cruise missile with >4000 km range.

 

[v9s]

Hi,

The GPS in my 2004 Acura 3.5 RL was with 5--10 feet of accuracy all the time.

It is understood that the civilian GPS is more accurate than the millitary----why---because the civilian gps is always newer and uptodate----the millitary gps has to go through the reliability and integration process---why I say that---One of my friends girlfriend worked on the f 16 electronis---she was riding with him in his Infiniti Q 45 when she made the comment about the gps on the cars being ahead of those on the planes.

Some millitary personale can comment on it and I can stand corrected.

You're basically correct:

Is military GPS more accurate than civilian GPS?

GPS offers two services -- the Precise Positioning Service (PPS) for U.S. and Allied military users, and the Standard Positioning Service (SPS) for worldwide civilian users. PPS is a more robust form of GPS that is encrypted and jam-resistant. It employs two signals to reduce radio transmission errors caused by the atmosphere, thus improving accuracy. SPS uses only one signal, but the ongoing GPS modernization program is adding several more civilian signals over the coming years. Detailed descriptions of PPS and SPS are available here.

Eventually, the accuracy difference between military and civilian GPS services will disappear. Using local or regional augmentations, today's civilian GPS users can already achieve much higher accuracy than PPS.

http://pnt.gov/public/faq.shtml#difference

 

[prototype]

were not talking about ICBM/IRBM. Your ABM is for ballistic missiles only, not for cruise missiles, China can still strike India it has the DH-10 cruise missile with >4000 km range.

sorry but we also have some cover for that,S-300,Akash,Barack etc and many more projects still going on

 

[Sinnerman108]

Hi,

The GPS in my 2004 Acura 3.5 RL was with 5--10 feet of accuracy all the time.

It is understood that the civilian GPS is more accurate than the millitary----why---because the civilian gps is always newer and uptodate----the millitary gps has to go through the reliability and integration process---why I say that---One of my friends girlfriend worked on the f 16 electronis---she was riding with him in his Infiniti Q 45 when she made the comment about the gps on the cars being ahead of those on the planes.

Some millitary personale can comment on it and I can stand corrected.

You are confusing two different concepts;
There is a GPS device and there is GIS image.

Now how the car naviagates is completely different from how a cruise missile navigates.

A Car navigates by look up and sensing the satellite's signal and from there it determines where it is. The accuracy of this depends on how many satellites were present when the car was updating it's location and what was the signal strength at that point and it depends on the quality of the sensor etc etc.
You need 3 satellites for almost a 100% accurate result.

That position is then put on the GIS IMAGE which is basically a very high resolution of the terrain stitched for a particular region and then it is
referenced on key points with differential GPS ( DGPS).

Aircraft use this technique, other military vahicle

THIS is completely different from how Babar finds it's course.

Let me know and I will write up on how babur does it.

 

[Patriot]

Let me know and I will write up on how babur does it.

Don't do it if its insider info.This forum is browsed by many Indians.

 

[Safriz]

Let me know and I will write up on how babur does it.

Go on then...lets read the info.
And plz dont be unwelcoming towards indian members on here...A good discussion is always with two opposing sides..without it,this website will be a boring unilateral place.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

At this time, I don't think that pak needs to get into supersonic missiles---its focus is on the sub sonic missile that we have and they will keep producing it in numbers that meet the need and requirement.

Can they be looking into the supersonic version----absolutely---there is no reason not to---but pak must look into long range surface to air missile systems.

Sub sonic cruise missiles are a proven system---pak millitary is not in the habbit of abandoning proven systems right in the middle of the production run

 

[MastanKhan]

Let me know and I will write up on how babur does it.

Hi,

Are you talking about pre-programmed way point type of guidelines---anyway would like to see your input on it.

 

[Sinnerman108]

Hi,

Are you talking about pre-programmed way point type of guidelines---anyway would like to see your input on it.

hmm, some thing like that ...
Ask taimi and he will let you know

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

So---it is based on the cruise missiles that uncle sam gave us inadvertantly in the late 90's.

If that is the case---then it is very difficult to detect---you don't need gps---you just need the map of topography of where you want to go---and guess what---you can change the input to your liking and go around a place if you don't want to fly over it directly.

Is that what it is---.

 

[Bhim]

Don't do it if its insider info.This forum is browsed by many Indians.

UuuHoo..I am here

 

[Safriz]

IMO..Babur and most other modern missiles dont depend on one Navigation system,but use a hybrid multi level guidance system..Pakistan's KRL has been extensively developing Ring laser gyroscopes for use with Inertial Navigation systems.These are Pretty accurate,if calibrated well.
Most Military Navigation systems,cross reference INS with GPS,and Babur may have the capability of terrain reference also..That means the guidance system is three folds,each being compared with the other..One fails or gets jammed..Others are still operational..
I dont know about the never F-16s , but the ones given to Pakistan originally had Inertial+GPS navigation system...Each cross referencing the other.
GPS Military signal has some sort of anti jamming capability,as one American member on this forum already stated.Although the frequency on which GPS military signal is transmitted is known to all,and can be jammed as any other radio frequency...But the military receivers have a way of over riding the frequency jamming...and that's classified..May be the receiver can request satellite to change frequency to some other, if the jamming or clutter signals are induced by enemy..to block the known frequency of the M-signal.

Overall the civilian GPS is as accurate as the military..the only limitation is that civilian receiver wont work above a certain altitude,i think 18000 meters and beyond a certain speed,which i think is 550 meters per second..But since Babur dos not go beyond those limits..it can use the GPS signal...BrahMos cant,because its faster than 550m/s..unless they use Russian GLONASS,that i dont know.

 

[gambit]

In addition to all that,GPS guidance is not the last word in guidance..Pakistani missiles rely heavily on Inertial guidance systems,which if well calibrated are as good as GPS,and even better as Inertial guidance cannot be jammed,unlike GPS.

All inertial navigation systems suffer from 'drift'...

Inertial navigation system - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

All inertial navigation systems suffer from integration drift: small errors in the measurement of acceleration and angular velocity are integrated into progressively larger errors in velocity, which are compounded into still greater errors in position. Since the new position is calculated from the previous calculated position and the measured acceleration and angular velocity, these errors are cumulative and increase at a rate roughly proportional to the time since the initial position was input. Therefore the position must be periodically corrected by input from some other type of navigation system. The inaccuracy of a good-quality navigational system is normally less than 0.6 nautical miles per hour in position and on the order of tenths of a degree per hour in orientation.