IRIAF | News and Discussions

[Oldman1]

Again NOT that simple!

1. Iran can absolutely build 100km A2A missiles! The problem is targeting at that range, equipment required for targeting at that range, how big and heavy would such a missile would be...
So far we haven't even managed to put a Fakkor-90 missile on our Kowsar fighters let alone....

2. Shahed-129's fly at 150 kph and max out at 24,000 ft vs F-35's that will be cruising at 45000 ft at speed of over 1000 kph.
Sh-129 can currently be armed 1 AiM-9 or at best with future upgrades 2 AiM-9's with no more then ~10km range (6km of which would be needed to make up for the altitude) and due to the vast difference in speed even with an upgraded AiM-9 with a wide aspect ratio your target window will mere seconds.
Which means although you can potentially use them to target fighter jets just as AiM-9 armed Helo's have in the past been used to down fighters however the success ratio of such a platform would be far too low to be worth investigating in

3.In terms of costs, one of the reasons Iranian UCAV are affordable is because they don't have expensive radars. If you want a UCAV capable of targeting at 100km then you clearly have to equip it with some kind of multi million dollar radar because radars capable of targeting at such a range aren't cheap! And putting multi million dollar radars on slow, easy to shoot down platform with weak frames that also lack any kind of maneuverability makes no sense either.

Anyone who claims that investing in a domestic, heavy manned fighter is not a worth while investment clearly doesn't know what they are talking about.
Investing in a fighter isn't just about a fighter!

Building a jet fighter is more harder than building missiles or rockets. Even their mockup looks hilarious, and wouldn't fly as all even if its the real thing. And besides Iran knows their air force will be destroyed easily. The Iranian posters know that. If the RQ 170 didn't fall into Iran, they would have been decades behind in drone tech. After all the Iranians thanked us graciously for that. And you've seen most of their drones pretty much looks like it now.

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

Building a jet fighter is more harder than building missiles or rockets. Even their mockup looks hilarious, and wouldn't fly as all even if its the real thing. And besides Iran knows their air force will be destroyed easily. The Iranian posters know that. If the RQ 170 didn't fall into Iran, they would have been decades behind in drone tech. After all the Iranians thanked us graciously for that. And you've seen most of their drones pretty much looks like it now.

Is English your first language?

 

[OldTwilight]

Building a jet fighter is more harder than building missiles or rockets. Even their mockup looks hilarious, and wouldn't fly as all even if its the real thing. And besides Iran knows their air force will be destroyed easily. The Iranian posters know that. If the RQ 170 didn't fall into Iran, they would have been decades behind in drone tech. After all the Iranians thanked us graciously for that. And you've seen most of their drones pretty much looks like it now.

We simply trolled you guys ....

 

[VEVAK]

Building a jet fighter is more harder than building missiles or rockets. Even their mockup looks hilarious, and wouldn't fly as all even if its the real thing. And besides Iran knows their air force will be destroyed easily. The Iranian posters know that. If the RQ 170 didn't fall into Iran, they would have been decades behind in drone tech. After all the Iranians thanked us graciously for that. And you've seen most of their drones pretty much looks like it now.

Wrong! The downing of the RQ-170 in terms of design gave Iran quicker access to flying wing designs and that was about it's only contribution to the Saegheh UCAV's

As for the Simorgh 1-1 copy again main contribution so far have been in design & flight management also in the future when the Jahaesh-700 engine is successfully mass produced one could possibly claim that Iran's access to RQ-170 engine helped Iran overcome a few hurdles but in the end most of the work was done by Iran.

You think just because someone has access to a certain aircraft that they can just simply reverse engineer and produce it? How many different type of Jet engines does Turkey have access too? and for how many years have they been trying to come up with a domestic mini jet engine of their own? so it's not that simple!

The only time having access to a weapon helps you reproduce it(especially In such a short time period), is only when you already have access to the vast majority of the tech, tools, infrastructure, materials, human resources,.... required to produce it in the 1st place.

Unless your claiming that the US RQ-170 came down in Iran with all the blueprints of all the required infrastructure needed to produce every single component, then your statement is utter nonsense.
Which should also tell you that Iran had a detailed, active & serious projects for the development of Jet powered UCAV's long before the RQ-170 landed in Iran

As for U.S. having a stronger Airforce, no one doubts that! However, what Iran should have learned from the Iran-Iraq war is that just because one side has a stronger Airforce that does NOT automatically wipe out the vast damage the opposing Airforce can potentially do.

 

[Incog_nito]

Can Iran now buy Aircraft from Russia and China?

Russians have the whole fleet of their MiG-29s free which Iran can acquire with upgrades in a short span of time. Moreover, Iran can place orders of 100+ MiG-35s as well. Also, they can acquire Sukhoi Su-24 from current & past operators.

Similarly from China, IRAN can take license production of 100-150+ JF-17s. Maybe, China might sell F-7s too as stop-gap with upgrades.

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

Can Iran now buy Aircraft from Russia and China?

Russians have the whole fleet of their MiG-29s free which Iran can acquire with upgrades in a short span of time. Moreover, Iran can place orders of 100+ MiG-35s as well. Also, they can acquire Sukhoi Su-24 from current & past operators.

Similarly from China, IRAN can take license production of 100-150+ JF-17s. Maybe, China might sell F-7s too as stop-gap with upgrades.

Why should Iran waist its money on MiG-29/35,JF-17s or any other 4th generation fighter when our enemies have 5th generation fighters that would dominate them in the skies?

 

[Arash1991]

Engine develp

Can Iran now buy Aircraft from Russia and China?

yes

Russians have the whole fleet of their MiG-29s free which Iran can acquire with upgrades in a short span of time. Moreover, Iran can place orders of 100+ MiG-35s as well. Also, they can acquire Sukhoi Su-24 from current & past operators.

This is not in their interest (at least at this quantities). There are several reasons for that.
1.) They learned that in a war they must be able to rely on their own ressources even if systems are underperformed. This behaviour have several big advantages:
a.) more Political independence during a conflict due to lower dependencie on third parties wich results in more room for maneuver in frame of own interests

b.)Total Control of production, output and more attention to own needs.
c.)Long term effect: Creating very important experiences for future developments.
d.) big part of moneyflow cycle will stay inside the country. Strenghten of domestic industry, production and economy during wartime. Many new employees will work in the own industry.
e.) Supply Routes can be cut so easily. There is no need for Iran to import end products. Importing some basic initial products is much easier, and even if no acsess , they will be easier to produce.

Another question is: What is the main role of an Airforce?
Air supriority, reconnaissance and other missions only serve one purpose:
to incapacitate the enemy on the ground. This goal is reached on Strategic and tactical level.

Iran already fullfills this capacity with its precisition missiles and Drones with proof of work.
Fighter jets are for Iran more like a "Nice to have" tool but not a "must have"
Missiles and drones remember me little bit to aircraft carriers before the second world war.

during this time Aircraft carriers were seen as accessories to support the Battleships and as a still developing future technology. But after Pearl harbor attack, Midway and sinking of the most advanced Battleship at this time, the Yamato of the Imperial Japanese fleet by very outdated torpedo bombers from WW1 era , the strategic roles changed and Aircraft carriers became the Heart of the US Navy.

I believe that irans strategic orientation to use missiles and drones as primary weapons instead of fighter jets is maybe little bit early bu

 

[VEVAK]

Can Iran now buy Aircraft from Russia and China?

Russians have the whole fleet of their MiG-29s free which Iran can acquire with upgrades in a short span of time. Moreover, Iran can place orders of 100+ MiG-35s as well. Also, they can acquire Sukhoi Su-24 from current & past operators.

Similarly from China, IRAN can take license production of 100-150+ JF-17s. Maybe, China might sell F-7s too as stop-gap with upgrades.

Why should Iran waist its money on MiG-29/35,JF-17s or any other 4th generation fighter when our enemies have 5th generation fighters that would dominate them in the skies?

A purchased Airforce is more of a leash than a capability! And a purchased Airforce, without constant supply of parts and weapons will loose the vast majority of its capability in mere months. So regardless of the Aircrafts generation, unless you have the capability to supply, maintain and arm them domestically they are just not worth the expenditure you would have to waist on them. And if you don't have the full capability to maintain them they become more of a leash than anything else.

It's like giving a caveman king 10 armed AK-47's. Sure he may be able to use them, but take away the ammo and it's nothing more than junk metal and in the end the caveman king would have been far better off learning how to forge a sword to supply his caveman army.

Over the past 1000 years, Iranian regimes and government before the Islamic Republic have always had trouble comprehending that truth and one can even say the only reason this Iranian government was forced to face that reality was due to the combination of US sanctions on top of the Iran-Iraq war and Iranian leaders that finally woke up and were willing to do something about it.

So Iran is far better off learning how to forge it's own fighters regardless of the generation.
Iran just needs to ensure that the fighter they produce has the required speed, range, payload capacity & areal refueling capability to actually be useful

Also a fighter project isn't just about a fighter! The infrastructure you need to develop to produce a fighter will allow you to enhance & or develop a wide range of other industries so the byproducts and side effects of truly mass producing a fully domestic fighter jet go far beyond a simple fighter.
Just as the byproduct of learning to forge a sword for the caveman would be the ability to build nails, saws, hammers... the circumstances may be different and far more complex but the analogy holds true...
So the domestic production of a far less sophisticated fighter is far more valuable than the imported purchase of the most advanced fighter jet in the world.

 

[Incog_nito]

Engine develp

yes


This is not in their interest (at least at this quantities). There are several reasons for that.
1.) They learned that in a war they must be able to rely on their own ressources even if systems are underperformed. This behaviour have several big advantages:
a.) more Political independence during a conflict due to lower dependencie on third parties wich results in more room for maneuver in frame of own interests

b.)Total Control of production, output and more attention to own needs.
c.)Long term effect: Creating very important experiences for future developments.
d.) big part of moneyflow cycle will stay inside the country. Strenghten of domestic industry, production and economy during wartime. Many new employees will work in the own industry.
e.) Supply Routes can be cut so easily. There is no need for Iran to import end products. Importing some basic initial products is much easier, and even if no acsess , they will be easier to produce.

Another question is: What is the main role of an Airforce?
Air supriority, reconnaissance and other missions only serve one purpose:
to incapacitate the enemy on the ground. This goal is reached on Strategic and tactical level.

Iran already fullfills this capacity with its precisition missiles and Drones with proof of work.
Fighter jets are for Iran more like a "Nice to have" tool but not a "must have"
Missiles and drones remember me little bit to aircraft carriers before the second world war.

during this time Aircraft carriers were seen as accessories to support the Battleships and as a still developing future technology. But after Pearl harbor attack, Midway and sinking of the most advanced Battleship at this time, the Yamato of the Imperial Japanese fleet by very outdated torpedo bombers from WW1 era , the strategic roles changed and Aircraft carriers became the Heart of the US Navy.

I believe that irans strategic orientation to use missiles and drones as primary weapons instead of fighter jets is maybe little bit early bu

But still they need some aircraft now.

Why should Iran waist its money on MiG-29/35,JF-17s or any other 4th generation fighter when our enemies have 5th generation fighters that would dominate them in the skies?

These are very credible platforms.

 

[Hack-Hook]

But still they need some aircraft now.


These are very credible platforms.

not For Iran Needs , Iran air-force rejected J-10 and that airplane is a lot more with iran Airforce need than Mig-29 or Mig-35 or JF-17.

let be honest we need something more in line with an Air superiority fighter or Interceptor than a bomber or Jack of all Ace fighter

 

[OldTwilight]

not For Iran Needs , Iran air-force rejected J-10 and that airplane is a lot more with iran Airforce need than Mig-29 or Mig-35 or JF-17.

let be honest we need something more in line with an Air superiority fighter or Interceptor than a bomber or Jack of all Ace fighter

The Su-35 , PakFa , J20 , these are only real assets which has some use for us ... our main condition of purchase is join production in Iran which for sure both Russia and China won't accept it , although we don't have money ...

 

[Mr Iran Eye]

As Philosopher said, you underestimated Iran's air force by many, it is clear that Iran is hiding surprises on the subject.

 

[Philosopher]

Interview with airforce commander:

There was nothing really discussed in terms new upcoming projects. Couple of points:

Kaman-22 UAV is going to be revealed soon.
He talked about how an Iranian private company helped develop a key electro-mechanical component for fighter jets. He did not disclose exactly what it was but stated it is almost as difficult as jet engines to produce and that it took the company 6 years to do it. It has now been successfully completed.

 

[Oldman1]

Wrong! The downing of the RQ-170 in terms of design gave Iran quicker access to flying wing designs and that was about it's only contribution to the Saegheh UCAV's

Really? So the engines and sensors and materials didn't help their UAV program in the long run because...they just needed the wings?

As for the Simorgh 1-1 copy again main contribution so far have been in design & flight management also in the future when the Jahaesh-700 engine is successfully mass produced one could possibly claim that Iran's access to RQ-170 engine helped Iran overcome a few hurdles but in the end most of the work was done by Iran.

You think just because someone has access to a certain aircraft that they can just simply reverse engineer and produce it? How many different type of Jet engines does Turkey have access too? and for how many years have they been trying to come up with a domestic mini jet engine of their own? so it's not that simple!

The only time having access to a weapon helps you reproduce it(especially In such a short time period), is only when you already have access to the vast majority of the tech, tools, infrastructure, materials, human resources,.... required to produce it in the 1st place.

Unless your claiming that the US RQ-170 came down in Iran with all the blueprints of all the required infrastructure needed to produce every single component, then your statement is utter nonsense.
Which should also tell you that Iran had a detailed, active & serious projects for the development of Jet powered UCAV's long before the RQ-170 landed in Iran

As for U.S. having a stronger Airforce, no one doubts that! However, what Iran should have learned from the Iran-Iraq war is that just because one side has a stronger Airforce that does NOT automatically wipe out the vast damage the opposing Airforce can potentially do.

You look at Russia's or Soviet Union's first high altitude bomber during Cold War and it was the American B-29 which they copied it after one landed in Soviet Union and didn't take that long to copy it. Did that mean they already had a future bomber planned but just decided to copy the American version cause maybe it was better? Perhaps the Iranians did the same.

We simply trolled you guys ....

No you really thanked us because you were behind by decades. Many of the drones are American copies. And you were proud to display it when you guys produce them.

 

[yavar]

Iran Army Airforce Brigadier General Pilot Hamid Vahedi:Fighter Jet Kowsar Radar, MiG-29 and F-14 radar upgrade