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Link According to this article, both Yasin AT and Yak-130 will be contemporary ATs in IRIAF.

Yasin AT (Ideally powered by Salyut Al-222) => F-14A/AM, Kowsar-I, F-4 E/D Dowran
Yak-130 AT => SU-35S, MIG-29SMT, SU-24MK

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It makes perfect sense as well. Kowsar-I, F-4E/D Dowran already carry SAIRAN avionics suite, in future may be F-14A/AM will undergo same. If there is a KowsarII/SaegheIII/Azaraksh-III in pipeline it will also be carrying SARIAN avionics package. Yasin AT already has the same package so it can look after the training for American/Iranian origin jets. If F-7N (I hope not) undergoes Project Erfanian or Mirage F1 undergoes lobbyism project Habibi upgradation it will also carry same avionics. suite. The weapons will be same as well. WVR Azarakash/Fattar, AIM-7 Arash BVR, Fakour-90/Masghoud LR-BVR.

Meanwhile it will be Yak-130's duty to carry out training for Russian origin fighters namely SU-35S and if MIG-29SMT, SU-24MKII upgradations happen. The weapons will be same as well, R-73E/M, R-27R, R-77E.


The current Russia-Ukraine conflict is a good example that modern large scale military actions will be ‘come as you are’ affairs. This is not a timeline measured in months or over a few years even but, taking into consideration from the time an requirement is acted upon- to- FOC, can take anywhere up to 5 years.

Unfortunately, there is always a but in there. Such as upgrading existing Iranian combat a/c such as the Mirage F1 (Project Habibi – thx that one got past me) & F-7N, and others, principally F-5 through Kowsar. While this will likely cause people to gnash their teeth, this is unfortunately also the most expeditious way of putting rubber on the tarmac .

That is, apart from an expedited and large-scale influx of say SU-35’s, MiG-29SMT, & Yak-130’s from Russia. Which in lieu of the first para, itself requires airframes – especially if this conflict stalls in a ‘meatgrinder’ situation something such as North Korea vs the US, South Korea & others, in 1953.

With a wide range of possibility suitable engines such as:-

  • Rostekh SM-100 (29kN/6 600lbf – 49kN/11 000lbf).
  • Klimov RD-33 et al -
  • And, Saturn AL-31(F)
a range of combat a/c could emerge.



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at the moment the Russian turbofan project SM-100 has no afterburner, 30% more power when compared with Al-222-25 is only derived from the modernization and adaptation of components.
Then as indicated, from the SM-100 they should extrapolate versions suitable for other aircraft, including commercial aircraft. Therefore, if necessary, surely Salyut will have no problem making both an afterburner version and a version for commercial aircraft. But at present the version is without afterburner
 
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I do not care for any author's political rants on Twitter. In the literary world of technical writing, the published articles with specialized evidence count, political clownery on Twitter does not. Focus on the author's authored and published articles on technical details of IRIAF instead of Twitter rants against IRI. He hates IRI and loves Shahi-Iran so he will do that just like other dissidents of Iran. But in his technical articles, he is roughly 8-9/10 times right in his predictions.

Whatever an author utters in public will affect their credibility at any rate. If they engage in clownery as you put it, then this will directly impact their professional standing.

The notion that Taghvai has been right 80-90% of the time in his predictions cannot really be substantiated by hard evidence, it remains largely speculative.

He is a regular author in Key-aero on IRIAF. Find me a single article published by him where any information he has ever provided on IRIAF turns out to be wrong. This is his profile on key-aero. He has written technical details on F-14AM, Fakour-90, Kowsar, Yasin, MIG-29, F-4 Dowran, Su-24MK overhauls, SU-22M3-4 IRGC upgrades etc. So find a single sentence in his articles where he is proven wrong. As a matter of fact, he was the first author on IRIAF who talked about Yak-130 procurement along with Saljut AL-222-25F Turbofan TOT or LP by MODAFL before anyone Link. Just like he was the first reporter/author to have openly claimed of IRIAF requesting for SU-35S in late 2021 when Bagheri was in Moscow. He predicted Kowsar production delay due to budget cuts in 2020. 4 years later we got 4 Kowsars while some 18-24 are sitting on a dead assembly line.

Issue being that OSINT data is partial and incomplete by its very essence. So is the military-related information Iranian authorities choose make public. In other terms, regular readers most of the time are deprived of the necessary tools to verify claims made by Taghvai or similar authors who base themselves on purported inside sources.

Please provide proof that Tom C said that "Bavar-373 is actually made in China"

Please provide proof that Tom C said that "Iran's modern AD systems are in fact custom designed by the Chinese for Iran"

You just appeared to misquote my statement. What I wrote is that Tom Cooper suggested as much, not that he published those particular sentences verbatim. A suggestion can be an indirect insinuation, and this is exactly what Cooper proceeded with. Although some of the terms he used, as we'll see in a second, come pretty close to a direct contention. At any rate they are expressive enough as is.

Nothing is easier to prove. Suffice to focus on the content of the article in question, namely its passages excerpted below. Source of the article: https://warisboring.com/47047-2/

First the author writes:

The Iranian media leaves no doubt. All the new SAM systems, all the associated radars, missiles and other equipment — everything was designed by Iranians and is manufactured in Iran, mostly by the Iran Electronic Industries in Shiraz and the Aerospace Industries Organization in Tehran.

Manufacturer plates are said to confirm this beyond any doubt.

In all rationality, ensuing paragraphs are thus to be understood as a rebuke to the above. In particular:

Combined with the persistent, age-old problems of the Iranian economy, the rule of the exclusivist cliques and endemic corruption, a lack of investment and industrial management skills, this results in a situation where development and production of modern SAM systems are outright impossible.

Black on white proof right here. Tom Cooper is making the claim that Iran cannot produce "modern SAM systems" (sic) - no nitpicking could possibly achieve to spin the explicit meaning of this quote.

Since Bavar-373 and other recently unveiled Iranian AD weapons are genuinely modern in the fullest sense of the term, it necessarily follows that Tom Cooper is of the opinion these could neither have been developed nor produced by Islamic Iran. Quod erat demonstrandum.

My statement was therefore 100% accurate. I could content myself solely with this, but let's go on.

In fact, new Iranian SAM systems are anything but indigenous.

Another explicit claim, furnishing totally undisputable proof as to the validity of my statement. Please do not tell me you're endorsing this type of brazen nonsense.

“I saw a photograph of very advanced radar of ‘Iranian’ design,” said Ma’arif, a career military officer from a country that’s cooperating with China on air defenses. “Recognizing its origins, I asked a representative of the Chinese Electronic Technologies Company — why is China not producing such designs for my country?

Now claiming to cite a Chinese defence industry official, to suggest that the PRC did effectively produce such designs for Iran:

“He told me that their degree of cooperation with Iran is almost reaching the degree of their cooperation with Pakistan. Furthermore, he said, this cooperation is possible with us, and should it go further, then they will do their best to boost our military industry, too.”

Putting the adjective Iranian into quotation marks and referencing China right afterwards, Cooper is evidently insinuating that the "very advanced radar" was not designed by Iranians but by the Chinese. Again Aristotelian Λόγος leaves no room for ifs and buts, nor for pedantic terminological hair splitting.

Sino-Iranian cooperation on air defenses is nothing new. It began in the late 1980s, when the Iranians began purchasing products such as the HQ-2 missile — based on the Soviet S-75/SA-2 Guideline — and the HQ-7 based on the French Crotale.

By way of an illustration to his argument, the author is citing the HQ-2 and the HQ-7 SAM's - systems Iran bought and imported from China as is and in full, further underscoring what he means. Not that this is really indispensable to mention though, since the two initial quotations onto themselves prove my point beyond the least shadow of a doubt.

Although often disappointed by poor manufacturing quality, and sometimes accusing their Chinese partners for outright espionage, the Iranians have continued this cooperation. Unsurprisingly, several of the “new” Iranian radars that have appeared in the late 2000s were quickly recognized as derivatives of Chinese-made systems.

Renewed use of quotation marks as a means of denying the indigeneous nature of radar designs presented by Iran as of late and dismissing declarations of Iranian officials and media in this regard.

Considering the flexibility and business-oriented practices of the involved Chinese companies, this might not appear unusual. However, there are strong indications that the appearance of radars in question was anything else but accidental, Ma’arif explained.

“Their companies are not wasting time searching for opportunities to present their products. They are constantly studying the market and know exactly the domain they need to fill in order to obtain lucrative orders. At least three different cases from the last few years are known, where Chinese companies did not attempt to attract local customers with general offers for their products, but placed very precise offers – and won all the contests.”

What this implies is that Iran did not merely benefit from cooperation and/or technology transfer, but purchased customized radar systems from Chinese companies.

The Chinese are meanwhile capable … of providing their export customers with much more sophisticated, yet far cheaper systems than either the USA, Russia or anybody else is ready to sell. Nowhere is this as valid as in regards of Chinese-made, ground-based, early-warning radars and electronic countermeasures.”

Talks of ground-based, early-warning radars and electronic countermeasures provided by Chinese manufacturers to their export customers i.e. of concrete, ready-made systems and not of technical cooperation.

Even then, the development — by China exclusively for Iran — of at least two entirely new, top-notch weapons systems is an affair of entirely new quality. So far, Beijing is known to have entered similar kind of cooperation with one country only — Pakistan.

Clear-cut confirmation of my reminder that Tom Cooper has claimed several of Iran's latest weapons systems had been custom-designed from the outset in China, and are thus not the work of Iranian engineers and production facilities.

Reality: Tom C barely told of a collaboration between SAIRAN-IRAN and CATIC-China just like there used to be a collaboration between IAIO and CATIC-China that resulted in Azarakhsh fighter/Saegheh/Kowsar fighter designs or some minimal level of tech transfer resulted into a family of AShCM in 2000s. Tons of examples of Iran collaborating with Russia, and China exist.

Sorry to contradict you here brother, but reality is what I shared previously, including demonstrations that Tom Cooper's claims went significantly beyond what you describe. In particular, he very clearly shed doubt on the capability of Iranian domestic research teams and defence industries to design and manufacture the systems in question.

This entire statement by you makes no sense at all.

Kindly ditch the unnecessary confrontational tone. Seeing how I did not address you in such a manner, it would be most welcome if you'd reciprocate.

Could it be that you have sort of a soft spot for the author going by the alias Tom Cooper, which would be fine, however you'd be hard pressed to argue his commentary on the Iranian defence industry as well as on the state of scientific research in Iran is actually in line with your own analyses, because this quite ostensibly is not the case. To be clear and to remove possible misunderstandings, I am in agreement with yours but am calling out the author's. That a massive gap separates the two should be obvious.

SJR-listed STEM journals with IF will never even publish a single sentence that's plagiarised. The editorial board will never ever compromise on the reputation of the journal. They check these articles through atleast 2-3 different plagiarism-catching tools then relevant referees check them subjectively for quality so copying a paper and publishing it in some journal that gives you H-Index is NONSENSE.

I highlighted how Tom Cooper's publication tends to create a diametrically opposite impression.

Case in point:

Some have strong doubts about this mass of Iranian scientific publications being a measure of innovation, or even a measure of development. Namely, most of the publications in question advance unsubstantiated theories, while others are little but copies of existing Western papers.

Meanwhile, there’s no doubt that many were published expressly for the purposes of advancing somebody’s career – often to improve chances of securing a better future in the West.

True, SJR isn't mentioned but that wasn't my point. Fact is that while you opened threads in this forum sharing SJR listings with the rightful purpose of driving home how Iran has been excelling in STEM research, the above quoted elucubrations by Tom Cooper are conveying the exact contrary. So once again, nowhere are your respective views aligning and I don't know why you would want to tell yourself otherwise, my friend.
 
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Another avro arrow cf-105 in making

In other words you admit to not possessing the ethical integrity of acknowledging the blatant falsehood of the bogus prediction you've literally been plastering this thread with countless times, with respect to Russian delivery of military jet aircraft to Iran.

And instead, come up with a strawman to change the subject. Exactly as predicted. This is because facts do not concern you, Russophobic propaganda does owing to your pro-western, empire-submissive ideology.

You were wrong, made claims which turned out to to be incorrect and therefore your credibility has completely gone down the drain.

Even a NATO-supporting forum member such as Deino recognized how a mea culpa on your part is due, seeing that they reacted to my corresponding response with a 'like'. You're attempting to be more Catholic than the Pope in your obsessive defence of western regime interests, which is pitiful.
 
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What an author states in public will affect their credibility at any rate. If they engage in 'clownery' as you put it, then this will directly impact their standing.

The notion that Taghvai has been "right 8-9/10 times in his predictions" cannot be substantiated by evidence, it remains largely speculative in nature.



Issue being that OSINT information is partial and incomplete by its very essence. So is what Iranian authorities choose to withhold (versus what they decide to make public). In other terms, regular readers most of the time are deprived of the necessary tools to verify claims by Taghvai or similar authors who base themselves on purported inside sources.



You just misquoted my statement. I wrote said Tom Cooper suggested as much, not that he published those particular sentences verbatim. A suggestion can be an indirect insinuation, and that is exactly what Cooper proceeded with.

Nothing is easier to prove. Suffice to pay attention to the content of the article in question, namely its passages excerpted below. Source of the article: https://warisboring.com/47047-2/

First the author writes:



In all rationality, ensuing paragraphs are thus to be understood as a rebuke to the above. In particular:



Black on white proof right here. Tom Cooper is making the claim that Iran cannot produce "modern SAM systems" (sic) - no nitpicking could possibly achieve to spin the explicit meaning of this quote.

Since Bavar-373 and other recently unveiled Iranian AD weapons are genuinely modern in the fullest sense of the term, it necessarily follows that Tom Cooper is of the opinion these could neither have been developed nor produced by Islamic Iran. Quod erat demonstrandum.

My statement was therefore 100% accurate.



Another explicit claim, furnishing totally undisputable proof as to the validity of my statement. Don't tell me you endorse this nonsense.




Putting the adjective Iranian into quotation marks and referencing China right afterwards, Cooper is evidently suggesting that the "very advanced radar" was not designed by Iranians but by the Chinese. Again Aristotelian Λόγος leaves no room for ifs and buts, nor for pedantic terminological hair splitting.



By way of an illustration to his argument, the author is citing the HQ-2 and the HQ-7 SAM's - systems Iran bought and imported from China as is and in full, further underscoring what he means. Not that this is really indispensable to mention though, since the two initial quotations onto themselves prove my point beyond the least shadow of a doubt.



Renewed use of quotation marks as a means of denying the indigeneous nature of radar designs presented by Iran and dismissing declarations of Iranian officials and media in this regard.



What this implies is that Iran did not merely benefit from cooperation and/or technology transfer, but purchased customized radar systems from Chinese companies.



Talks of ground-based, early-warning radars and electronic countermeasures provided by Chinese manufacturers to their export customers i.e. of concrete, ready-made systems and not of technical cooperation.



Clear-cut confirmation of my reminder that Tom Cooper has claimed several of Iran's latest weapons systems had been custom-designed from the outset in China, and are thus not the work of Iranian engineers and production facilities.



No, as perfectly demonstrated above his claims went significantly farther than that. In particular, he very clearly shed doubt on the capability of Iranian domestic research teams and defence industries to design and manufacture the systems in question.



Kindly ditch the confrontational tone. Seeing how I did not address you in such a manner, it would be most welcome if you'd reciprocate.

It's alright if you have a soft spot for the author going by the pseudonym Tom Cooper, this said you'd be hard pressed to suggest his commentary on the Iranian defence industry as well as on the state of scientific research in Iran is actually in line with yours, because this quite ostensibly is not the case. To be clear and in case you didn't notice, I am in agreement with yours but am calling out the author's. That a massive gap separates the two is absolutely obvious.



I highlighted how Tom Cooper's publication tends to create a diametrically opposite impression.

Case in point:



True, SJR isn't mentioned here but that wasn't my point. Fact is that while you opened threads in this forum sharing SJR listings with the rightful purpose of driving home how Iran is excelling in STEM research, the above quoted elucubrations by Tom Cooper are suggesting the exact contrary. So once again, your respective views are not aligning.
The massive usage of scare quotes is revealing, what they don't want to say, they use mental confusion methods such as scare quotes on "Iranian" "Indingenous" etc, but not on "Chinese", scare quotes are used massively in western think tanks/articles about Iran, this is made to confuse the reader and forcing into their what the author is implying without saying it directly
 
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at the moment the Russian turbofan project SM-100 has no afterburner, 30% more power when compared with Al-222-25 is only derived from the modernization and adaptation of components.
Then as indicated, from the SM-100 they should extrapolate versions suitable for other aircraft, including commercial aircraft. Therefore, if necessary, surely Salyut will have no problem making both an afterburner version and a version for commercial aircraft. But at present the version is without afterburner
That is 32 kilo newton force of dry thrust.
Same as two J85-GE-21/Owj turbojet engines.
If afterburner implemented it will outperform.
 
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The massive usage of scare quotes is revealing, what they don't want to say, they use mental confusion methods such as scare quotes on "Iranian" "Indingenous" etc, but not on "Chinese", scare quotes are used massively in western think tanks/articles about Iran, this is made to confuse the reader and forcing into their what the author is implying without saying it directly

You're right. In this specific example though, it's very important to note that the author not only resorted to the indirect method, he also expressed his thoughts plainly and in no unmistakable terms.

Claims such as:

"this results in a situation where development and production of modern SAM systems are outright impossible."

"In fact, modern Iranian SAM systems are anything but indigenous."

are most explicit and clear as day, proving my point about this paper to the fullest. One would need to be excessively pride-driven to try and deny or spin away what's written there black on white.
 
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That is 32 kilo newton force of dry thrust.
Same as two J85-GE-21/Owj turbojet engines.
If afterburner implemented it will outperform.


if, if, if ... Russia neded years to find a substitute for the AI-222-25, so far NO substitute for the -25F variant with afterburner since it does not need one simply since the Yak-130 cannot use such an engine and some here are already dreaming as if Iran could get them for free, they could power whatever type ranging from jet-trainers, fighters to civil airliners ... wait, wait if something will happen, WHEN it will and if then it would fit!
 
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if, if, if ... Russia neded years to find a substitute for the AI-222-25, so far NO substitute for the -25F variant with afterburner since it does not need one simply since the Yak-130 cannot use such an engine and some here are already dreaming as if Iran could get them for free, they could power whatever type ranging from jet-trainers, fighters to civil airliners ... wait, wait if something will happen, WHEN it will and if then it would fit!

To be honest Yak-130 doesn’t even need an afterburner. I have no idea why people are so fixated on afterburner for a trainer jet. Who cares if it doesn’t have one.

The pilot can then simply move to a Kowsar to learn afterburner controls.

Su-35 saga is ongoing. Man my nerves can't take much more of this.

The question is how many. 24-36 is not enough to replace most of Iran’s aging fighters. That might be good for a country like UAE, Qatar, or Egypt, but not for a country the size of Iran.

Ideally at least 72 fighters. That would allow the F-14 to be grounded and preserved for war. Would allow some of Iran’s older fighters to be retired or put into storage.

Any ToT of engine tech would be a game changer. But that is a wish at this point.
 
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To be honest Yak-130 doesn’t even need an afterburner. I have no idea why people are so fixated on afterburner for a trainer jet. Who cares if it doesn’t have one.

The pilot can then simply move to a Kowsar to learn afterburner controls.

...


I totally agree with you and my second reply concerning that engine was only related to a claim, that two AI-222-25 fit to whatever fighter would result in a fighter comparable or in the same class like the Pakistani JF-17 Thunder, which IMO it surely cannot be.
But for a jet-trainer it is totally sufficient.
 
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The question is how many. 24-36 is not enough to replace most of Iran’s aging fighters. That might be good for a country like UAE, Qatar, or Egypt, but not for a country the size of Iran.

Two or three squadrons would cover the needs in terms of complementing Iran's extensive IADS in the airborne interception department. Which would square with PeeD's assessment.

Ideally at least 72 fighters. That would allow the F-14 to be grounded and preserved for war. Would allow some of Iran’s older fighters to be retired or put into storage.

Any ToT of engine tech would be a game changer. But that is a wish at this point.

Well, transfer of technology or not, fact remains that Iran ordered fighter jets from Russia and Russia made good on its duty to supply them. This already invalidates countless posts in this thread claiming otherwise. Perhaps time has come for everyone to come to terms with and acknowledge this simple reality.

The new era in Iranian-Russian relations is here, and it is of a strategic quality.



Taking over Syria is the most important mission of global Zionists. With Syria in Iranian camp, they can't stop weapons flow into the hands of Palestinians and Lebanese. Syria is the focal and nodal point of resistance axis. Keep that in mind @SalarHaqq ,

Most definitely brother, most definitely.

Which is why when Hashemi Rafsanjani lashed out at President Bashar al-Assad, including but not limited to accusing him of employing WMD "against his own people", thus echoing NATO propaganda and fabrications, and encouraged his protégé Rohani to try and undermine Iran's strategic alliance with Syria, he clearly played into the enemy's agenda which consists in seeking to disrupt the Axis of Resistance as a sinister prelude to coming for Iran herself.

Characterize this standpoint as you may, but it certainly has nothing much patriotic to it seeing how it is decidedly in variance with Iran's core national interest and security. Which brings me to the question of those Iranians, including a couple users on this forum, who support and advertise the reformist / moderate bloc. You may consider yourself patriotic even while lacking sympathy for the Islamic nature of the Iranian government, true, but you cannot logically do so while whitewashing in-house liberal factions i.e. obfuscating their agenda's submissiveness to the zio-American empire, as well as the threat this represents for Iran's stability. Those who are having issues with Iran's religious democracy but think of themselves as patriots or nationalists, should therefore seriously think twice before backing political parties deprived of any patriotic credentials, whose program serves but the enemy's goals.



We must think twice (I mean autocritics exercise);

IRIAF has more budget than supossed.

It stands to reason that these acquisitions were not financed through the yearly budget granted to the IRIAF, but through other sources. A point I raised some time ago in response to a certain nagger who cited the IRIAF budget as supposed "proof" that Iran has "not" placed any fighter jet order with the Russian Federation.
 
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Two or three squadrons would cover the needs in terms of complementing Iran's extensive IADS in the airborne interception role. Which would square with PeeD's assessment.

Two-Three squadrons can be wiped out relatively quickly. Go see how many fighter jets Russia lost in the air and on the ground in Ukraine and that is while avoiding major enemy air defenses near frontline operations.

If your opponent is Israel or USA, then assuming you can keep 24-36 safe for 12+ months is beyond optimistic it’s borderline foolish.

Iran ordered 80 F-14’s in 1970’s for comparison.

Transfer of technology or not, Iran ordered fighter jets from Russia and Russia made good on its duty to supply them.

So far we got 2 Yak-130’s. I’d wait till the S-35 land in Iran before declaring Russia a changed person.
 
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