Iraq's war against IS terrorism | Updates and Discussions

[al-Hasani]

@1000

That's because they don't follow the teachings. You are probably not going to tell me that you believe that extremist/retards be it Daesh or those 50-100 demonstrating in European capitals every year are representatives of the sect that they claim to follow?

The teachings of the Salaf were/are Islamic. After all those people are the best generation of Muslims and lived among the Prophet Muhammad (saws). Most of our knowledge about the Sunnah derive from them. Goes for all sects of Islam today.
They were not perfect but nobody is and especially not back then. Still they did nothing of what those retards are doing.

So, yes I disagree with them being connected to Islam or any sect in Islam. One thing is what they claim and another thing is what they do.

It's not a secret that all known clerics regardless of sect have condemned them and similar terrorist groups a long time ago.

 

[1000]

That Saudi Arabian was a 16 year old kid. Of course they treated him fine on camera. Do you know what has happened with him since then? No. The number of Saudi Arabian prisoners in Iraq is lower than 30. Many were truck drivers going to Turkey accused of being "terrorists". There are in fact more Iraqis in prisons in KSA. Just so you know. Many sentenced to death too. So of course states will try to release their prisoners or transfer prisoners. That's something most states do outside of North Korea and maybe a few others.

Idiotic logic. Daesh bad equals oppressive mass-murdering dictators being great. No wonder that the ME is struggling with that logic.

18 year old I heard, 1996. But yes I don't agree with killing him, looks like a confused kid anyway did you hear him during the interview, he was studying Sharia law and got brainwashed by trash like Wesal TV addicts, maybe it was @Rakan.SA himself. As for true (hardcore) terrorists they shouldn't be released neither imprisoned.

Ye but the Iraqis in Saudi prisons are there for little things, not paying a fine or something like that. Not terrorism.

All those problems are bound in social, political and economic reasons. Unemployment and marginalization breeding more terrorists/criminals than anything else regardless of sect.

No not all, you forget the ideology they follow is the problem itself. Unemployment, marginalization and other stuff can push others to take a violent path but you forget how many people living in the safe free west are drawn to the ideology. The overused excuse of 'they were being oppressed' to justify groups like ISIL won't pass.

 

[al-Hasani]

18 year old I heard, 1996. But yes I don't agree with killing him, looks like a confused kid anyway did you hear him during the interview, he was studying Sharia law and got brainwashed by trash like Wesal TV addicts, maybe it was @Rakan.SA himself. As for true (hardcore) terrorists they shouldn't be released neither imprisoned.

Ye but the Iraqis in Saudi prisons are there for little things, not paying a fine or something like that. Not terrorism.


No not all, you forget the ideology they follow is the problem itself. Unemployment, marginalization and other stuff can push others to take a violent path but you forget how many people living in the safe free west are drawn to the ideology. The overused excuse of 'they were being oppressed' to justify groups like ISIL won't pass.

I don't recall how old he was. It was clear that it was a kid that just arrived after being brainwashed on the internet. I doubt that he could even fight let alone killed anyone. There are probably many of such cases. Especially from the thousands of people from Europe who are likely never to have received any military training and obviously not killed anyone before.

@Rakan.SA does not support Daesh nor is he against the regular Shia. He is against the teachings of leading Shia clerics who are doing their brainwashing too and who have similar channels.

As seen here below;

Well, I don't think that murder, drug trafficking etc. are "little things". Fact of the matter is that transferring prisoners is normal. Besides all Daesh members caught are likely executed on the spot nowadays. I don't care about them anyway. Of course it's sad when we are dealing with such young people who get brainwashed but on the other hand I also believe that you must use your brain.

Yes, a murderous ideology is part of the problem. Still the main problems are found due to social, political and economic hardships. Ideology alone cannot explain it. If so you would have 2 million terrorists (as many as there are Salafis) in Europe or more waiting to blow themselves up but somehow this does not happen. Since 9/11 there have been how many terrorist attacks blamed on "Muslims"? Less than 10 and there are 40 million Muslims in Europe. You make the conclusions after reading this.

There is no justification. Besides I was talking about terrorism overall and there are dozens of terrorist groups in the ME and even whole regimes that could be called this depending on who you ask. Crime too.

 

[1000]

Well, I don't think that murder, drug trafficking etc. are "little things". Fact of the matter is that transferring prisoners is normal. Besides all Daesh members caught are likely executed on the spot nowadays. I don't care about them anyway. Of course it's sad when we are dealing with such young people who get brainwashed but on the other hand I also believe that you must use your brain.

Don't know what they're in jail for, various things but can't be equal to terrorist crimes. Murder and large amount of drug transfer are most likely the worst crimes but they exist in all countries. You can kill criminals who deserve it, that's not my problem.

Yes, a murderous ideology is part of the problem. Still the main problems are found due to social, political and economic hardships. Ideology alone cannot explain it. If so you would have 2 million terrorists (as many as there are Salafis) in Europe or more waiting to blow themselves up but somehow this does not happen. Since 9/11 there have been how many terrorist attacks blamed on "Muslims"? Less than 10 and there are 40 million Muslims in Europe. You make the conclusions after reading this.

There is no justification. Besides I was talking about terrorism overall and there are dozens of terrorist groups in the ME and even whole regimes that could be called this depending on who you ask. Crime too.

Of course, if some Salafis had a better life why would they bring themselves in the path of being killed except for a tiny brainwashed minority. But there are many poor people on earth, not all start terrorizing randomly so the ideology remains a major problem. But we got someone here telling us Salafis don't commit crimes on Sunnis, should educate him about the recent history of their terrorism on Sunnis. Start in Algeria and work your way to the East all the way to Pakistan.

 

[al-Hasani]

Don't know what they're in jail for, various things but can't be equal to terrorist crimes. Murder and large amount of drug transfer are most likely the worst crimes but they exist in all countries. You can kill criminals who deserve it, that's not my problem.



Of course, if some Salafis had a better life why would they bring themselves in the path of being killed except for a tiny brainwashed minority. But there are many poor people on earth, not all start terrorizing randomly so the ideology remains a major problem. But we got someone here telling us Salafis don't commit crimes on Sunnis, should educate him about the recent history of their terrorism on Sunnis. Start in Algeria and work your way to the East all the way to Pakistan.

I was just saying that exchanging prisoners is normal state procedure. Especially among neighbors. I also believe that execution is the only solution for hardcore terrorists and criminals. Especially if they have been proven to have killed people. After that Allah (swt) will deal with them and he is after all the most gracious and most merciful as we Muslims believe.

Actually it's also a myth that the most hardcore terrorists are unemployed social retards. In fact most seem to be well off. For instance almost every single 9/11 attacker was educated and many were successful in their jobs apparently.

My only problem with your logic is that you equal an ideology/sect and paint it over with red paint just because a tiny minority of it's SUPPOSED adherents do bad stuff. Mostly actions that have nothing to do with their religion or sect.

In general I have a problem with that. Especially when it is so obvious for every sane and non-biased person that those terrorists have little to do with Islam.

Anyway I don't have to defend any sect or ideology. I am just a regular Sunni Muslim of the Shafi'i fiqh although I take inspiration from all sects if I find something that I agree with or find spiritually enhancing.

 

[1000]

Some Jordanian officials visit Iraq minister of defense. recently they mobilized a few thousand soldiers to the border maybe it has to do with that.

 

[TankMan]

You can say ISIS have no religion but they deeply believe in Salafis and the influential figures of this ideology. Moreover Salafis that use violence to enforce their ideology on others are terrorist trash, they kill Sunnis day and night unlike what @Dr.Thrax claimed.

Anyhow Salafis are not 1 united group that believe the same, many have disagreements and are enemies. We even saw this in Syria between Nusra & ISIS.

Now I gave many examples and those can be proven, if you'd remove all Salafis from the middle east there would be far less terrorism.

Dude, you don't even know what the word 'Salafi' means, so stop embarrassing yourself. A Salafi is the label given to anyone who does not follow all the modern sectarianism, mullahs, politically-influenced sectarian mullahs and all that bull and instead prefer to directly follow the Quran, Hadiths and the Prophet's companions and their teachings.

Those can be and are twisted around by some people, Salafis and non-Salafis alike. The only difference is that Salafism allows for open debate a lot more since we don't have to do any taqleed, i.e we don't strictly obey any Imam's interpretation.

Salafism ideology when defined with the meaning of Salafism no one sees anything wrong with it, if you look at the modern day Salafis and groups affiliated with this ideology all you find is trash.

I don't even like or use the label of 'Salafi' and refuse to identify with any sect, but guess what that makes me? A ghair-muqallid, or, in layman's terms, a Salafi. And no, not all 'modern-day' Salafis are involved in ''trash''.

Grabbing one whole sect or group and blaming it is bigoted and plain wrong. One of the biggest terrorist groups, the Taliban, are Hanafi sunnis - practically the opposite of Salafi. I can name a couple of dozen more non-Salafi terrorist groups. Does that mean anything? No, it does not and should not. Terrorists are terrorists, regardless of what ideology they claim to follow.

This label you keep using only helps Mullahs achieve their political goals, consequently dividing Muslims. If I were to disagree with a Molvi on anything, the first thing he'll do is label me a Salafi or ''Wahabi'' and then avoid the argument entirely - I'm speaking from experience and I'm sure many others would have had similar experiences.

If you'd remove all the humans from Earth there would be far less terrorism too - start with yourself if you're that keen to do it.

''And hold firmly to the rope of Allah all together and do not become divided'' [Quran 3:103]

''Surely they who divided their religion into parts and became sects, you have no concern with them; their affair is only with Allah, then He will inform them of what they did.'' [Quran 6:159]

All those problems are bound in social, political and economic reasons. Unemployment and marginalization breeding more terrorists/criminals than anything else regardless of sect.

Perfectly true and summed up. As for those who are well off yet fall into such traps, terrorist groups tend to attract psychopaths from everywhere - and some of those can be well off. But ultimately, the truth is that the majority of the actual fighters are uneducated fools recruited from poverty and brainwashed into terrorism, like this guy:

 

[Alshawi1234]

Salafism is a sect and sometimes an influential ideology just as all the other Islamic sects are. Some people claim to follow the "Alsalaf alsalih" while refusing to be named salafi, while others are just Sunnis from other sects ideologically influenced by the scholars of Salafism. For me, I see Salafism as nothing more than a neo-ummayid ideology renewed by Ibn Tamiya and Mohammed ibn Abdul-Wahab.
Saying that Salafist follow the original Sunna is ludicrous since all the other madhab a claim the same. But they take the Sunna from different scholars (hanafi, shaafii, Maliki,Hanbali, Imami(Shia))

Since the Salafist was a reformist ideology spread by Mohamed ibn Abdul Wahab, it wouldn't be politically wrong to call them Wahabi...
If you read their books you can clearly see their corrupt ideology calling for killing, hate and takfir of other Muslims including even some Sunni madhabs. The hate for the prophets family and their Shia is especially evident. That's other than the corrupt religious thoughts such as tajsim (giving Allah physical attributes) and other ideas such as calling to follow the government whether he is just or not.. Besides many other corrupt ideas. The result of terrorism is because of such ideologies which started growing since the Umayids dynasty and are not exactly new. Ibn tamiya was just a nasibi who tried to renew the ummayid creed, as for Mohammed ibn Abdul Wahab, he was a jahil and brought nothing new from himself, he just read the works of ibn tamiyah and kept renewing it and adding to them.

For the record, Mohamed ibn Abdul Wahab didn't come from an extremist family, even his brother and father were against his work. The fact that his father died while he was angry with him should be enough.

The majority of mainstream Sunnis who aren't influenced by Salafism in fact have major issues with Mohamed ibn Abdul Wahab and ibn Tamiya. We can clearly witness that with the anti-MB Sunnis in the Middle East who shun These two scholars openly.

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As for IS not belonged to any religion. I may agree that it had quite a bit of political influence. But the fact that their supporters are ALL Sunnis, the members are Sunnis, they claim to get their justifications from what they do from Sunnism, they claim to fight for Sunnis and so on.... If it looks like a duck and sound like a duck, it may be a handicap duck but it still is a duck.

Even when you go on Aljazeera, you can clearly tell that over 75% of the viewers sympathize with IS. The majority of comments and likes/dislikes justify the killing of civilians in Iraq, they try to jusitify the killing of Egyption, Libyan soldiers. They even justified the burning of Kasasbeh. We all know that Aljazeera is seen as the voice of Sunnis/MB in the Arab world.

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UPDATES on the situation.

IS sources claimed a large operation against Iraqi army positions near Tikrit, they claimed that there are 50 dead and wounded from the Iraqi security forces as well as burning at least 8 Iraqi army vehicles as a result of the operations. As usually they don't publish their casualties. 4 suicide bombers were involved.

Iraqi army takes over the route connecting Hawijia to Baiji and Nineveh province, drawing the way for a possible assault on both areas from south Baiji and east Hawija.

Coalition airstrikes are said to have killed dozens of terrorists in Hawija and daqouq in Kirkuk.

 

[ResurgentIran]

Salafism is a sect and sometimes an influential ideology just as all the other Islamic sects are. Some people claim to follow the "Alsalaf alsalih" while refusing to be named salafi, while others are just Sunnis from other sects indeologically influenced by the scholars of Salafism. For me, I see Salafism as nothing more than a neo-ummayid ideology renewed by ibn tamiya and Mohammed ibn Abdul-Wahab.
Saying that Salafist follow the original Sunna is ludicrous since all the other madhab a claim the same. But they take the Sunna from different scholar (hanafi, shaafii, Maliki,Hanbali, imamia(Shia).

Since the Salafist was a reformist ideology spread by Mohamed ibn Abdul Wahab, it would be politically wrong to call them Wahabi...
If you read their books you can clearly see their corrupt ideology calling for killing, hate and takfir of other Muslims including even some Sunni madhabs. The hate for the prophets family and their Shia is especially evident. That's other than the corrupt religious thoughts such as tajsim (giving Allah physical attributes) and other ideas such as calling to follow the government whether he is just or not.. Besides many other corrupt ideas. The result of terrorism is because of such ideologies which started growing since the Umayids dynasty and are not exactly new. Ibn tamiya was just a nasibi who tried to renew the ummayid creed, as for Mohammed ibn Abdul Wahab, he was a jahil and brought nothing new from himself, he just read the works of ibn tamiyah and kept renewing it and adding to them.

For the record, Mohamed ibn Abdul Wahab didn't come from an extremist family, even his brother and father were against his work. The fact that his father died while he was angry with him should be enough.

The majority of mainstream Sunnis who aren't influenced by Salafism in fact have major issues with Mohamed ibn Abdul Wahab and ibn Tamiya. We can clearly witness that with the anti-MB Sunnis in the Middle East who shun These two scholars openly.

--------
As for IS not belonged to any religion. I may agree that it had quite a bit of political influence. But the fact that their supporters are ALL Sunnis, the members are Sunnis, they claim to get their justifications from what they do from Sunnism, they claim to fight for Sunnis and so on.... If it looks like a duck and sound like a duck, it may be a handicap duck but it still is a duck.

Even when you go on Aljazeera, you can clearly tell that over 75% of the viewers sympathize with IS. The majority of comments and likes/dislikes justify the killing of civilians in Iraq, they try to jusitify the killing of Egyption, Libyan soldiers. They even justified the burning of Kasasbeh. We all know that Aljazeera is seen as the voice of Sunnis/MB in the Arab world.

------------------------------




UPDATES on the situation.

IS sources claimed a large operation against Iraqi army positions near Tikrit, they claimed that there are 50 dead and wounded from the Iraqi security forces as well as burning at least 8 Iraqi army vehicles as a result of the operations. As usually they don't publish their casualties. 4 suicide bombers were involved.

Iraqi army takes over the route connecting Hawijia to Baiji and Nineveh province, drawing the way for a possible assault on both areas from south Baiji and east Hawija.

Coalition airstrikes are said to have killed dozens of terrorists in Hawija and daqouq in Kirkuk.

Very in-depth and thoughtful post.

 

[1000]

@Mussana Can you explain to me why your cousins blow themselves up in every war, everywhere I read that suicide is not allowed in Islam yet they are professionals when it comes to suicide.

 

[Alshawi1234]

Aljazeera report on PMF. As usual biased crap.

 

[1000]

Iraq says Jordan offers all military means in IS fight - Yahoo News UK

Jordan is ready to offer all military means at its disposal to help Iraq fight the Islamic State group, Iraq's defence minister said Wednesday after meeting Amman's army chief.

"The king of Jordan has requested that all means of the Jordanian armed forces be made available to the Iraqi army," said Khaled al-Obaidi.

"This was confirmed by the joint chief of staff" of Jordan's armed forces, the minister said of General Mohammed al-Zaben Meshaal, who was at his side during a news conference in the Iraqi capital.

General Zaben, who also advises King Abdullah II, said he was in Baghdad to bring a message from the king that "we are in the same boat as our Iraqi brothers".

"We will do everything to defeat this group," he added.

Their statements came a week after the Islamic State group released a video in which the jihadists burned alive a Jordanian pilot captured in December when his fighter jet went down in Syria.

Jordan, a member of the US-led coalition waging air strikes against IS, promised a harsh response and has expanded its role in the campaign to include Iraq as well as Syria since the murder of pilot Maaz al-Kassasbeh.

 

[TankMan]

Saying that Salafist follow the original Sunna is ludicrous since all the other madhab a claim the same. But they take the Sunna from different scholars (hanafi, shaafii, Maliki,Hanbali, Imami(Shia))

No one is claiming that - the only claim is that they try to follow it directly while everyone else goes through an Imam, like Imam Abu Hanifa or Shafii' or Malik

If you read their books you can clearly see their corrupt ideology calling for killing, hate and takfir of other Muslims including even some Sunni madhabs. The hate for the prophets family and their Shia is especially evident. That's other than the corrupt religious thoughts such as tajsim (giving Allah physical attributes) and other ideas such as calling to follow the government whether he is just or not.. Besides many other corrupt ideas. The result of terrorism is because of such ideologies which started growing since the Umayids dynasty and are not exactly new. Ibn tamiya was just a nasibi who tried to renew the ummayid creed, as for Mohammed ibn Abdul Wahab, he was a jahil and brought nothing new from himself, he just read the works of ibn tamiyah and kept renewing it and adding to them.

Depends on whose books you read. You are completely and totally mistaken if you think that 'Salafist' is some ideology with a hive-mind. All it does is give flexibility because there's no taqleed - that's it. A sick person would use that flexibility to justify takfir and terrorism, a decent person would use it to spread tolerance and goodness - an ultra-liberal would use it to abandon restrictive Islamic principles while a mullah-mindset follower would use it to create laws and present them as Islamic.

Circumstantial flexibility is supposed to be a key aspect in Islam anyways, so that isn't a bad thing - it's about how you use it.

You don't need to follow Abdul Wahab's works if you don't like them, I don't - yet the label is still 'Salafi'. Muslims are obsessed with labels, that's the main issue. Everyone just has to be some Salafi, Wahabi, Barelvi, Deobandi, Shia, Sunni - then these sects have to be divided into fifty dozen jamaats and sub-sects. And those who don't want a label are just lumped into one anyways. After one label comes another and another, until it eventually reaches 'Kafir'.

As if humans have stamps on their backsides to indicate which sect they're from.

 

[Dr.Thrax]

Opression and sectarianism, you will keep crying about this whatever they do. 'Maliki army killing civillians', now some say Abadi army like idiots. Maliki army captured a foreign Saudi ISIS member and they treated him in a civilized way, gave him water interviewed him. They'll probably release him like they release all foreigners they capture for fu*** reconciliation bullshit so people like you stop accusing them of sectarianism, that's what keeps terror alive.


We saw that in Libya, 'opressor' Gaddafi got taken out now you have terrorism. Algeria had to massacre terrorists to get rid of them, how will you clean ISIL from Syria ? I guess if you stop the cycle of oppressing ISIS they'll quit their terror right ?




Saddam is a Sunni indeed, who are you to call him a kaffir saying he's burning in hell ? You should have told him in his face to experience some true education

Maliki Army does kill civilians. Ever heard of Fallujah?
Oh yes, a country is going to become perfect right after a dictator leaves. Perfect idiot logic.
Saddam isn't a Sunni, he is a secularist, if you walked around his palaces while he was still in power you'd see women dressed like whores, and wineries. That's not Islamic.

 

[Abii]

Maliki Army does kill civilians. Ever heard of Fallujah?
Oh yes, a country is going to become perfect right after a dictator leaves. Perfect idiot logic.
Saddam isn't a Sunni, he is a secularist, if you walked around his palaces while he was still in power you'd see women dressed like whores, and wineries. That's not Islamic.

Classic Arab sunni.

Why do you guys all have to be so radical? Why do you even live? Just go and kill yourself if life is so miserable to you.