Iraqi PM visits Iraqi Hezbollah and wears their uniform

[Saddam Hussein]

US has far more influence in Iraq than Iran which people keep forgetting. Military aside, Iraq's financial deposits are in New York.

US ruined the country through decades of wars and sanctions, as if 1991 and 2003 weren't enough they launched several cruise missile campaigns in 1998.

Now we have Isis rats to deal with, trash we never had to deal with before 2003 to start with. The west is spreading cancer all over just because they can.

 

[500]

Germany and Italy are christian nations, Korea and Japan have incomplete sovereignity, both are occupied by US bases and neither are part of a bigger collective entity, their Ideology is not in direct conflict with western ones.

Iraq is part of the collective Islam as well as the Arab world, its occupation came with entirely different objectives than the nations mentioned above, the US destroyed the state and all of its infrastructure, they didnt simply remove Sadam.

Iraq is not under an Iranian occupation but a US one, Iran has influence in Iraq, one that grew because of the destruction of the state and the power vacuum that was created.

The terrible democratic system that was imposed within the constitution is the defacto reason behind all the turmoil, I will not go through all the details.

The amount of destruction in Germany, Korea, Japan was hundreds times worse. Plus u had huge oil incomes.

But u decided to invite Iranian occupiers which created dozens of sectarian gangs. So u just reap what u sow.

 

[T-123456]

Thanks in part to NATO.

Not NATO,US and some allies.
My country was not involved.

 

[Saddam Hussein]

Not NATO,US and some allies.
My country was not involved.

Incirlik was used by the US to airdrop troops and weaponry in Northern Iraq.

This as far as my brain knows, equals involvement.

 

[Naram_Sin]

The amount of destruction in Germany, Korea, Japan was hundreds times worse. Plus u had huge oil incomes.

But u decided to invite Iranian occupiers which created dozens of sectarian gangs. So u just reap what u sow.

Your reply is disconnected from my argument, it is irrelevant how much germany or japan was destroyed, The US did not come to Iraq with the intention of building a nation but rather to control and if that failed, to deny control through conflict management.

A destroyed state cannot 'invite' anyone, it doesnt exist, so there are no more borders, there was a vacuum and all regional and global actors entered, Iran included.

 

[T-123456]

Incirlik was used by the US to airdrop troops and weaponry in Northern Iraq.

This as far as my brain knows, equals involvement.

BS,in 2003, Ankara refused to allow American ground and air forces to invade Iraq from Turkish territory.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/mar/20/iraq.helenasmith
''The Turkish prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, confirmed last night that he will ask parliament to allow the US overflight rights for a war on Iraq but to deny the Americans use of their bases in Turkey.

In a move scuppering plans for a heavily armoured "northern front" against Saddam Hussein, it is expected that the vote, due today, would not even allow US planes to refuel on Turkish soil.''

 

[Saddam Hussein]

BS,in 2003, Ankara refused to allow American ground and air forces to invade Iraq from Turkish territory.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/mar/20/iraq.helenasmith
''The Turkish prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, confirmed last night that he will ask parliament to allow the US overflight rights for a war on Iraq but to deny the Americans use of their bases in Turkey.

In a move scuppering plans for a heavily armoured "northern front" against Saddam Hussein, it is expected that the vote, due today, would not even allow US planes to refuel on Turkish soil.''

Turkey rejected the American initial request that would see up to 80.000 US troops deployed in Turkey. However, they did provide a smaller level of support, which in the end is still involvement.

Although the 1 March licence was rejected, Turkey took steps backward in order to support the US in the operation it started in Iraq. After a short while following the rejection of the licence on 20 March, the US requested the necessary permits in order to use Turkish Air Corridor. One day after, on 21 March 2003, the licence which opened Turkish Airspace to the use of the US by favour of the Assembly and which regarded “sending Turkish Armed Forces to the Northern Iraq and permitting utilization of Turkish Airspace by air components belonging to foreign armed forces for six months,” was accepted.2 On the same day, the US and British aircrafts started bombing Iraq. Turkey, which provided support all by opening its airspace to the US in the Iraq operation, provided support for the US in many aspects during the war. Aircrafts carrying injured people used İncirlik Air Base during the operation. Additionally, a permit was provided for the aircrafts that the US withdrew from Turkey following the rejection of the licence in order for them to land to İncirlik Base in case of emergency.

https://guvenlikcalismalari.pa.edu....dosya07d7b43f-090a-426b-bcc3-b3926fd23cf8.pdf

Although let us leave 2003 aside, the entire northern no-fly zone of 1991-2003 was enabled through Incirlik airspace. This is what led to the growth of the PKK and KRG, before that we took care of them.

The entire region has been hijacked by America for decades.

 

[925boy]

US has far more influence in Iraq than Iran which people keep forgetting.

THis is debatable. If i were to bet money today, you will lose your money if you bet against Iran in Iraq. US is probably in control of the "cosmetic" parts of Iraq and the Iraqi govt. Us military is going to fully exit within 2 years per what we heard last about that, so US influence in Iraq will either be in business sector, but Iran will always keep influence in the deep political sphere. If US has influence in Iraq then why couldnt it block Iraq from kicking it out of Iraq? c'mon bro!!

Military aside, Iraq's financial deposits are in New York.

so? Iran is probably controlling/influencing them from Baghdad.

The west is spreading cancer all over just because they can.

agreed

Not NATO,US and some allies.
My country was not involved.

BUt TUrkey ALSO invaded IRaq and setup some bases illegally in northern IRaq no? I know you will tell me that was to help Iraq, but legally, its illegal and not accepted as following international law.

 

[T-123456]

BUt TUrkey ALSO invaded IRaq and setup some bases illegally in northern IRaq no? I know you will tell me that was to help Iraq, but legally, its illegal and not accepted as following international law.

If Iraq cant make sure the terrorists on its territory are not a threat to my country,we do it ourselves.
We make it legal,capish?

 

[Falcon29]

Another revolution is around the corner. Iran and Iraqi militias/govt had to kill thousands of Iraqis during the revolution that held up until killing of Iranian general. They also assassinated Iraqi activists on a daily basis.

Because it's Ramadan and the world is dealing with Coronavirus the protests have died down. Give it a month or two and they will resume full force. I will document it here on the forum when that time comes.

 

[Saddam Hussein]

Another revolution is around the corner. Iran and Iraqi militias/govt had to kill thousands of Iraqis during the revolution that held up until killing of Iranian general. They also assassinated Iraqi activists on a daily basis.

Because it's Ramadan and the world is dealing with Coronavirus the protests have died down. Give it a month or two and they will resume full force. I will document it here on the forum when that time comes.

Hopefully no demonstrations, ineffective and not worth it dying for. It won't remove Iranian groups as they couldn't give two shits about killing people.

THis is debatable. If i were to bet money today, you will lose your money if you bet against Iran in Iraq. US is probably in control of the "cosmetic" parts of Iraq and the Iraqi govt. Us military is going to fully exit within 2 years per what we heard last about that, so US influence in Iraq will either be in business sector, but Iran will always keep influence in the deep political sphere. If US has influence in Iraq then why couldnt it block Iraq from kicking it out of Iraq? c'mon bro!!


so? Iran is probably controlling/influencing them from Baghdad.


agreed


BUt TUrkey ALSO invaded IRaq and setup some bases illegally in northern IRaq no? I know you will tell me that was to help Iraq, but legally, its illegal and not accepted as following international law.

It's not exactly a good thing, Iran is disliked by locals. All they did is make use of the power vacuum to export their trash to us, their influence has turned the country into a shithole beyond American physical destruction.

Whenever this is stated someone comes with "but ISIS". So I already wrote it to save other people's effort.

 

[mangekyo]

Hopefully no demonstrations, ineffective and not worth it dying for. It won't remove Iranian groups as they couldn't give two shits about killing people.



It's not exactly a good thing, Iran is disliked by locals. All they did is make use of the power vacuum to export their trash to us, their influence has turned the country into a shithole beyond American physical destruction.

Whenever this is stated someone comes with "but ISIS". So I already wrote it to save other people's effort.

your problem is that firstly, you blame everyone for your mistakes, and second and most importantly. You are not a historical country. You were created by the British. Your only solution is to either split Iraq into 3 or 4 smaller nations. Or hunt down and kill every single Kurd and every single Iran and US, sympathizers in the most brutal civil war in the history of mankind and just hope it works.

US invaded in 2003. You have had 17 years since then to rebuild. Look how fast we rebuilt after the revolution. And yes it is comparable because all our competent people fled to the west, those who decided to stay got executed, then we fought an 8 year long bloody war against the west, while being embargoed and sanctioned which we still are.

 

[Naram_Sin]

your problem is that firstly, you blame everyone for your mistakes, and second and most importantly. You are not a historical country. You were created by the British. Your only solution is to either split Iraq into 3 or 4 smaller nations. Or hunt down and kill every single Kurd and every single Iran and US, sympathizers in the most brutal civil war in the history of mankind and just hope it works.

US invaded in 2003. You have had 17 years since then to rebuild. Look how fast we rebuilt after the revolution. And yes it is comparable because all our competent people fled to the west, those who decided to stay got executed, then we fought an 8 year long bloody war against the west, while being embargoed and sanctioned which we still are.

Quit being naive, no current individual Arab nation is historical since we were all one, most nations in the middle east did not draw their borders, our history is that of the Arab nation formed since prophet Muhammed.

The US is not a historical country, it has tens of ethnicities, should we divide the US ?

The premise we should divide because of kurds is silly, Kurds are a problem everywhere, they are a problem in Turkey, should we divide Turkey ? They'l also want Iranian kurdistan... lets also divide Iran then.

The conflict in Iraq is the result of the current democratic system and the constitution behind it, if this system was injected into Iran it would disintegrate into its ethnic composition faster than Sun melts the Ice.

 

[mangekyo]

Quit being naive, no current individual Arab nation is historical since we were all one, most nations in the middle east did not draw their borders, our history is that of the Arab nation formed since prophet Muhammed.

The US is not a historical country, it has tens of ethnicities, should we divide the US ?

The premise we should divide because of kurds is silly, Kurds are a problem everywhere, they are a problem in Turkey, should we divide Turkey ? They'l also want Iranian kurdistan... lets also divide Iran then.

The conflict in Iraq is the result of the current democratic system and the constitution behind it, if this system was injected into Iran it would disintegrate into its ethnic composition faster than Sun melts the Ice.

US has national unity. Nationalism and patriotism is strong in US. The same for Iran. Iraq however has no national unity and if you ask 5 Iraqis, what Iraqi nationalism is. You will get 5 different answers.

 

[Naram_Sin]

US has national unity. Nationalism and patriotism is strong in US. The same for Iran. Iraq however has no national unity and if you ask 5 Iraqis, what Iraqi nationalism is. You will get 5 different answers.

Aside from Iraqi Kurds, they'l give you one answer, the internal conflict takes the shape of identity politics because the installed democratic system rewards identity politics, its a tool to the seat of rule, it doesnt help that all regional actors entered into the vacuum and picked sides.

The US installed a system that amplifies and strives on differences and conflicts, it maintained a military and political presence through management of these conflicts and through this presence ensures that the system continue to work as intended... plain old divide and conqure.

There is no sovereignity, rest assured if the US ever manages to acheive regime change in Iran, you will suffer a similar fate.

The US patriotism is manufactured and not based on any inherited identity or common heritage, it is strong as long as the machine applying the glue is strong, absent that they would be killing each other like they did in their early days.