Iranian Space program

[Hack-Hook]

First off Google Earth shows Israel. So let’s not act like getting satellite images of countries is hard work these days. Even a recent commercial satellite company revealed sensitive Turkish/NATO military sites and what did the company do at turkeys request? They blurred the buildings lol, as if that would do anything.

good luck finding image newer than 6month to one year old on google earth

 

[Persian Gulf 1906]

good luck finding image newer than 6month to one year old on google earth

yep, and good luck finding anything relating to israeli military:

" in 1997, Congress passed the National Defense Authorization Act, one section of which is titled, “Prohibition on collection and release of detailed satellite imagery relating to Israel.” The amendment, known as the Kyl-Bingaman Amendment, calls for a federal agency, the NOAA’s Commercial Remote Sensing Regulatory Affairs, to regulate the dissemination of zoomed-in images of Israel."

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2011/06/google-israel-us/

 

[TheImmortal]

^

good luck finding any military sites in israel on open access recon sources

good luck getting recent and frequent satellite imagery of anything actually useful from Russia, even if you sign a contract with Russia for that maybe in 10 years if you sue them enough they'll send a few images from 10 years ago

spy satellites have never been attacked you're talking speculative nonsense as usual

Honestly you really need to stop talking when you have no idea what you are talking about (like not knowing solid slvs are highly inefficient vs liquid slvs).

US Military officials have warned of their own spy/military satellite-vulnerability in periods of war.

Recently both Iran and Russia have done aggressive tactics against spy satellites. Iran blinded a passing spy satellite with a laser. The US was shocked Iran knew the spy satellite even existed. Russia moved an orbiter near a French military communications satellite for close episonage. And this only things that have “leaked”.

This was during peace time. If you for one second think that during war, an Iranian satellite is going to be off limits by the enemy then quite frankly you are the one spouting nonsense.

Lastly if Iran wants Military sat photos it can get it hands on them. Lol at you thinking a “contract” with a russia or open source is what they will use. Yes, that is exactly how military intelligence services work.

good luck finding image newer than 6month to one year old on google earth

It was a figure of speech in an overall counter rebuttal. The fact this is all you could find to nit pick about rather than defend your main point (Iran’s “need” for spy satellites) shows you have no basis for a counter arguement.

Even if Google Earth HAD 6 month military base photos that is all Iran needs, because we all know how “mobile” military bases are. One minute they are there and the next minute they are an empty parking lot. /sarcasm

If Iran’s public sector is capable of producing 5m-10m resolution then Iran’s military sector is capable of <1 meter resolution. The military sector of state is typically decades ahead of the public sector in Sensitive technologies. Just go look at decommissioned US spy sats from the 80’s and their capability versus public commercial reconnaissance sats launched today. It will suprise you.

Even Hezbollah gathered actionable intelligence and warned Israel to move a commercial ammonia storage facility in Haifa as it is an easy target that could cause countless casualties. Israel quickly emptied it.

For the targets that Iran’s military establishment cares about a spy satellite is not a necessity. IRGC could have sent up small spy sats in last 10 years if it desired. Like I said plenty of ways for even paramilitary sources to get their hands on actionable intelligence on targets without spy satellites. Iranian officials have said this in the past as well.

I mean right in this forum in the navy section there are pictures of Iran’s shipbuilding yards this was unheard of decades ago. Just look at Syrian and Ukraine civil war conflict and what twitter users were able to get through open sources. In public space ordinary public sector researchers get their hands on pictures of highly sensitive iranian military sites like Sharud. So just imagine what a military intelligence gathering agency in Iran can do.

 

[Persian Gulf 1906]

Honestly you really need to stop talking when you have no idea what you are talking about (like not knowing solid slvs are highly inefficient vs liquid slvs).

i don't need to do anything for your lies, you can take your US flags and stick them in your kos with your speculative BS

 

[Sineva]

using israel as comparison, its ofek spy satellites weigh around 300kg with resolution approx 0.5m and are sent into LEO with a life span of 5 years. simorgh has payload capacity of 350kg and we have satellite with 1m resolution (B&W) already, so once we fix third 'stage' problems with simorgh we should be able to do this immediately if i'm not mistaken

comms sats appear to be significantly heavier and will need far more powerful SLVs

Yes,however the israelis have access to the very best western technology virtually for free,so I think it is a little unrealistic to expect to match them right off the starting line.However a satellite,or more preferably a constellation of small imaging sats with a resolution in the single digits of meters with a lifespan measured in months would be good enough to start with.
The same approach of a small constellation of leo satellites can also be used for military comsats as well.

 

[Galactic Penguin SST]

Mastering the Saman-1 insertion stage is certainly not easy. That should be the task of that launch.
The Simorgh lqunch last year may not have had the Saman-1 and was just aiming to get the heavy Tolue sat into a eliptical orbit. Last year the second stage my have malfunctioned while this year the Saman-1 got either instabile or its solid fuel engine somehow didn't reach the required extra v-delta.
A solid motor creates vibrations which only get stronger the longer it burns. I have the feeling the Saman-1 flight control could not compensate a vibration or instability via its cold gas steering system (caused by the solid motor).
Vibration and resonance issues with solid motors can be really nasty and hard to predict without testings...

Some trolls here are so entertaining! But below the true reasons for the recent launch failure:

Iran's Satellite Fails to Reach Orbit, Crashes Into Indian Ocean

2019/01/17 [12:01]

The remains of Iran’s Payam satellite plummeted into the Indian Ocean, Ahmad Motamedi, the chancellor of Amirkabir University, which designed and developed the satellite, told the local Mehr news agency.

"According to GPS data active until the last minute,
...
Payam was sending out signals for about six minutes before the connection with it was lost.

Motamedi mentioned the failure of the launcher to calculate the initial speed of the satellite and fuel-related problems among the reasons that led to the satellite’s failure to reach the orbit.

"Given the order by Minister of Information and Communications Technology Mohammad Javad Azari Jahromi to design and build the next satellite, named 'Payam 2', our team of scientists will prepare it for launch in less than a year, thanks to the technical knowledge we have now acquired," Motamedi pointed out.

http://jajusibo.com/sub_read.html?uid=43661&section=sc29&section2=
​

 

[Sineva]

Hi,
Actually I'm an aerospace engineer myself. I just love these things. I am a huge fan of India's space research efforts. I always compare our efforts with that of China. Its nice to know that Iran is also in the race. After coming to this thread, I gotta know that Iran is actually working on something serious - ghaem. Unfortunately it exists only in forums. If you guys can shed some light, it'll be really helpful. Thanks in advance

Sadly with ascension of rouhani to power both the nuclear and space programs were seen as politically expendable.Effectively both of these have been in the deep freeze,which is why this launch is so ironic.

 

[amardeep mishra]

Sadly with ascension of rouhani to power both the nuclear and space programs were seen as politically expendable.Effectively both of these have been in the deep freeze,which is why this launch is so ironic.

Oh I see, I am all for the peaceful applications of space. Iran also has the right to pursue the same. However as far as ICBMs go, I will not comment. It has a lot of political dimensions that I do not wish to get into. I am certainly no fan of religious theocracy that Iran is at the moment.
As for the research is concerned, Iran has produced some brilliant folks-- all of whom migrated west-- that clearly shows a lot of things!

 

[TheImmortal]

Yes,however the israelis have access to the very best western technology virtually for free,so I think it is a little unrealistic to expect to match them right off the starting line.However a satellite,or more preferably a constellation of small imaging sats with a resolution in the single digits of meters with a lifespan measured in months would be good enough to start with.
The same approach of a small constellation of leo satellites can also be used for military comsats as well.

Satellites with <1 meter resolution are well within Iran’s capability right now.....in the military sector. What you are looking at today is Iran’s achievements using basically university students with a small budget and a rather amateur governmental space agency (ISA). Even in the case of NASA, it’s current tech is completely outclassed by what DARPA and military industrial complex is pumping out.

IRGC has the deep funds, the access to highly advanced tech and materials, and the resources to build satellites the public space in Iran can’t do for probably another 10-15 years maybe more (unless it’s gets foreign assistance).

The issue is satellites are a luxury and IRGC looks at everything in a power expanding lens. If IRGC still hasn’t come around on overhauling the Air Force, chances are spy satellites aren’t a huge priority.

 

[Sineva]

^

good luck finding any military sites in israel on open access recon sources

good luck getting recent and frequent satellite imagery of anything actually useful from Russia, even if you sign a contract with Russia for that maybe in 10 years if you sue them enough they'll send a few images from 10 years ago

spy satellites have never been attacked you're talking speculative nonsense as usual

Agreed relying on the russians for anything is idiotic in the extreme,they are neither friends nor allies of iran....and likely never will be either.
As for attacking enemy spy sats,altho this has never to the best of public knowledge actually been done,the capability to attack satellites was developed and does currently exist.The russians developed the polyot series of killer sats back in the 60s and successfully tested these against target sats,the first energia heavy booster launch carried an 80 ton[!!] megawatt class laser,tho a malfunction prevented this from deploying successfully,that was intended as an antisat weapon.
The us also developed and tested these weapons,including a successful intercept using an f15 launched asat back in 1985 and more recently to destroy a malfunctioning us spy sat with a rim161 standard 3 back in 2008.
So the capability certainly exists today,and if I was iran I`d certainly consider developing my own version of it.

Oh I see, I am all for the peaceful applications of space. Iran also has the right to pursue the same. However as far as ICBMs go, I will not comment. It has a lot of political dimensions that I do not wish to get into. I am certainly no fan of religious theocracy that Iran is at the moment.
As for the research is concerned, Iran has produced some brilliant folks-- all of whom migrated west-- that clearly shows a lot of things!

So nukes and icbms are ok for india,tho?
Iran certainly isnt going to be making any icbms out of the simorgh,anymore than the dprk was able to turn the unha into an icbm,despite what a lot of western "experts" tried to claim,rather embarrassingly for them as it turned out[lol!].

 

[amardeep mishra]

Agreed relying on the russians for anything is idiotic in the extreme,they are neither friends nor allies of iran....and likely never will be either.
As for attacking enemy spy sats,altho this has never to the best of public knowledge actually been done,the capability to attack satellites was developed and does currently exist.The russians developed the polyot series of killer sats back in the 60s and successfully tested these against target sats,the first energia heavy booster launch carried an 80 ton[!!] megawatt class laser,tho a malfunction prevented this from deploying successfully,that was intended as an antisat weapon.
The us also developed and tested these weapons,including a successful intercept using an f15 launched asat back in 1985 and more recently to destroy a malfunctioning us spy sat with a rim161 standard 3 back in 2008.
So the capability certainly exists today,and if I was iran I`d certainly consider developing my own version of it.


So nukes and icbms are ok for india,then?

Yes! It is ok, because-
(i) India has a stated "no first use" policy.
(ii) India is a democracy in true sense. Of course there are certain bigots, however the constitution is steadfastly secular and doesnt grant any special rights to any groups.
(iii) India is not against the existence of any country -- regardless of what Pakistani members think here.

PS- I did not wish to get into the political dimensions of this debate, yet you dragged me nonetheless. I will comment no further on this issue. If however you wish to discuss the technical aspects, then you are more than welcome. Thanks!

 

[Sineva]

Yes! It is ok, because-
(i) India has a stated "no first use" policy.
(ii) India is a democracy in true sense. Of course there are certain bigots, however the constitution is steadfastly secular and doesnt grant any special rights to any groups.
(iii) India is not against the existence of any country -- regardless of what Pakistani members think here.

PS- I did not wish to get into the political dimensions of this debate, yet you dragged me nonetheless. I will comment no further on this issue. If however you wish to discuss the technical aspects, then you are more than welcome. Thanks!

You know whats really sad m8?,reading your last 2 posts,you come off as being just as ignorant,just as bigoted,just as biased and sadly just as arrogant as the very same superpowers that india aspires to [eventually perhaps...if shes very lucky] become one of.
Right up to those last 2 posts you were actually doing pretty well,I was liking what I was reading...,its a pity really,oh well.
Have a nice day.

 

[amardeep mishra]

You know whats really sad m8?,reading your last 2 posts,you come off as being just as ignorant,just as bigoted,just as biased and sadly just as arrogant as the very same superpowers that india aspires to [eventually perhaps...if shes very lucky] become one of.
Right up to those last 2 posts you were actually doing pretty well,I was liking what I was reading...,its a pity really,oh well.
Have a nice day.

Same to you my dear friend, same to you! Lets agree to disagree and keep it purely technical without digressing into politics. Having varied political opinion is what makes a democracy. You have as much right to express your views as much as I do. Have a nice day to you too.
PS- Just because I happen to have a different view, doesnt necessarily mean I am against Iran or that I oppose their space program, on the contrary, I like Iran and their ancient cultural heritage. I also feel there should be deeper space cooperation between India and Iran in space research.
@Sineva

 

[Persian Gulf 1906]

Same to you my dear friend, same to you! Lets agree to disagree and keep it purely technical without digressing into politics. Having varied political opinion is what makes a democracy. You have as much right to express your views as much as I do. Have a nice day to you too.
PS- Just because I happen to have a different view, doesnt necessarily mean I am against Iran or that I oppose their space program, on the contrary, I like Iran and their ancient cultural heritage. I also feel there should be deeper space cooperation between India and Iran in space research.
@Sineva

it's kind of expected if you come to an iranian thread and say india should be allowed ICBM and nukes but Iran cannot be trusted with them... i dislike the govt as much as anyone but they're rational enough that they wouldn't use nuclear weapons (e.g. against Israel) so that's irrelevant.

but apart from that different standard that is based on fearmongering most of what you've said is reasonable and i also would welcome greater space co-operation between iran and india, but i think space is something we will have to do alone because of sanctions

 

[TylerDurden07]

Yes! It is ok, because-
(i) India has a stated "no first use" policy.
(ii) India is a democracy in true sense. Of course there are certain bigots, however the constitution is steadfastly secular and doesnt grant any special rights to any groups.
(iii) India is not against the existence of any country -- regardless of what Pakistani members think here.

PS- I did not wish to get into the political dimensions of this debate, yet you dragged me nonetheless. I will comment no further on this issue. If however you wish to discuss the technical aspects, then you are more than welcome. Thanks!

Indian constitution gives special cultural/educational rights to religious and linguistic minorities. Better focus on technical side of debate.