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Iran player refuse to sing national anthem

Please be honest here, do they want to get rid of political Islam

I am being honest and you may ask other Iranian users. Oppositionists to the current political system and especially the rioters we've seen in recent weeks as well as their supporters, are heavily tending towards secularism and liberalism. And some adhere to Iranian ultra-nationalism, focusing on the pre-Islamic Iranian civilization, and oftentimes viewing Islam as an "Arab" religion not well suited for Iran.

How is not a sign of all out anti-clericalism when campaigns are launched to harass ulema by knocking off their turbans?

How is it that some mosques were attacked, while one in the city of Rasht was actually burnt down?

https://www.redd.tube/video/bf224f1cb4c22a954ba30ae6469c7910488a27a3

How is it that the mother of a child martyred by terrorists, in a gathering of individuals chanting slogans against the Islamic Republic and its Leadership, requests the Quran not to be recited at her son's funeral because he allegedly disliked Quran recitations?

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(Note: the reddit post says "shot dead by Iranian security forces" but this appears to be fake news. For one, Iran arrested three terrorists said to be responsible for the killing. Secondly the child's mother initially claimed that police indeliberately shot at their car, but she happens to be a staunch opponent of the Islamic Republic, who was following the Persian-language propaganda account of the zionist regime on Instagram, so her credibility stands to debate.)

These may be salient examples, but I am not exaggerating when I state that the riots are marked by very strong secularist and anti-clerical traits at a minimum, with more radical elements going farther yet in their opposition to Islamic religiosity. So while all of them may not be Islamophobic (some definitely are), they are secularist in their overwhelming majority, and averse to the slightest notion of Islamic governance.

Either way, they are not the majority. The majority rejects those who riot and provoke disturbances.

or get rid of your current governance system with put Mullah as the supreme leader that cannot be changed before he died or step down voluntarily ?

This is not so. The Supreme Leader is chosen by the Assembly of Experts, which itself is elected by the people. And, the Assembly can remove the Leader and replace him with somebody else if deemed necessary. However, there are numerous advantages to having some sort of an authority with a longer term mandate to balance out the elected institutions, control over which changes hands at shorter intervals. A steadier institution like the Leadership enables more efficient long term planning, thanks to the existence of an authority unaffected by party political bickering and dubious voter chasing tactics.

Don't forget that the Supreme Leader is not micro-managing policy nor really in charge of the executive power per se. What he does, is to set general guidelines, broad directions for the elected President and his cabinet, as well as for other institutions to try and follow.

And believe me, there are many examples of Presidents and other officials not listening to the Leader and ignoring his guidelines with impunity. Former President Rohani in a speech even used indirect invectives against the Leader and got away with it.

Also, there's a peculiar characteristic to Iran's political landscape which is quite unique in the world: one of two governing parties, the liberal camp (made of reformist and moderate parties) does not truly believe in the founding principles of the Constitution nor in the ideology of the Revolution, but seeks to operate so-called "regime change" from within like Gorbachev did in the Soviet Union. Furthermore this political camp is in effect advancing the interests of Iran's geostrategic enemies, namely the western regimes.

This makes the Iranian system more much pluralistic than liberal secular "democracies" of the west, where the difference between rival forces competing at elections is minimal in comparison.

In Islam there is no support on dualism in power like your current system with Mullah as supreme leader and other person as current President, it doesnt mean Islam forbid your current system, as long as it can work and supported by the majority it will not be a problem as it is not Haram (forbidden) either, but please dont call the system as Islamic system as we also dont see this system run by Prophet Muhammad and first 4 Caliph where on that system there is no dualism in leadership like Iranian current system.

The Shia Islamic tradition has specificities of its own. In particular the concept of Wilayat ul Faqih or authority of the Jurisprudent, a highly qualified alim who is to act as the vice regent to Imam Mahdi (a.j.) until the latter's return (for Shia Moslems believe in Imamate as the legitimate form of government, rather than a califate).

Now there are different interpretations amongst Shia scholars as to what exact form Wilayat ul Faqih should take, with several schools of thought (some believe that the Wali should directly govern, others that he should only deal with religious matters, etc).

But Iran's system allows for a combination of theocratic and electoral elements. Wilayat ul Faqih is implemented, as well as the republican form of government along with elections.

No one will feel suppressed with the implementation of Shariah Law where the punishment on Quran is only limited to criminals (killer, stealer) and Adultery (Zinah) actors.

They just dont want government to be moral police enforcing Hijab, banning women to watch sport etc

As man I am also suprised as how our women are so keen to watch sports like basketball, footballs and others, dont limit them too much. We of course can have anti **** law like Indonesia does to prevent immoral behavior to happen, but dont ban something that is not even banned in Quran and Hadiths, your Mullah system is more conservative than even Quran and Hadith. It is more like cultural than a reflection of Islam rule as like previously in Saudi women cannot even drive the car.

Don't underestimate the impact of the soft war Iran has been subjected to at the hands of hostile western and zionist powers. Like I said, Persian language BBC for instance posts eight times more content than Chinese or Russian services of the same BBC. No nation has been subjected to such an intensive propaganda and social engineering campaign by foreign powers, encouraging among other things irreligious lifestyles.

Also, the Iranian context is different from the Indonesian one. In Iranian modern history we have had strongly secularist and even Islamophobic currents, unlike most other Islamic countries. These currents and their legacy have perpetuated themselves to this day. Under Reza Khan, the first ruler of the Pahlavi dynasty in the first half of the 20th century, hejab was outright banned in public, clerics were persecuted. Certain thinkers who were supporting Reza Shah's regime, like Taqizade, were openly advocating cultural westernization, and considered Islamic piety as an obstacle to progress.

To this, a scholar like shahid Motahari would later respond by formulating the thesis that Islam and modernity are compatible. Anyway, I don't want to get into details nor into religious discussions, but context matters and the Iranian context is different from Indonesia's.

Now as for Islamic legislation in Iran: just know that the Islamic Republic's Leadership never sought to confine women nor to prevent them from participating in social, political and economic life. Some make an unhealthy fixation on the dress code and on the football stadium topic, but you'll notice that the same people will deliberately obfuscate far more decisive matters such as:

- The fact that over 60% of Iranian university students are women. Is this what's commonly considered as Taleban-style rule? What's more, this percentage is much higher than it used to be under the secular regime of the last shah, when hejab was not mandatory in the public sphere.

- The fact that Iranian women vote at every election. Again, Taleban-style? Definitely not.

- The fact that we have female members of Majlese Shoraye Eslami (parliament), and other political institutions and administrative offices.

- Females working in countless branches of the economy.

- Females never having been prevented from driving cars, traveling, and so on.

For the rest, the Islamic Republic has sought to combine this with an Islamic public sphere, where decency will be guaranteed by law. People can do a lot of things in the privacy of their homes and nobody is going to bother them, but the public realm is not to be opened up to un-Islamic behaviour.

This does not mean that women would be forced to wear burqas or chadors: they're free to choose their preferred type of hejab, and in practice tolerance levels haven't ceased increasing since 1979, so that nowadays the laxest forms of hejab authorized feature loose headscarves with half the hair protruding, heavy make-up and what not.

When it comes to attendance of sports games, women aren't barred from matches of male teams in other modern sports. Football has been kind of an exception because of the particular atmosphere at football stadiums, which is conducive to rudeness, hooliganism etc. But even here, authorities did show gradual flexibility since they experimented with female attendance of male football games some months ago, when women were allowed into the stadium. To me however, this is a secondary issue, there are more important topics in the life of a woman.

So anyone claiming that something like this justifies riots, lethal assault against law enforcement and the ensuing escalation of violence, needs to have their head checked I'd say.
 
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Seems like Kurds are major opponents of government during this protest?

Kurds in Northern Iraq need to realise their position is weak, especially with Turkey being a NATO member.
 
Seems like Kurds are major opponents of government during this protest?

Kurds in Northern Iraq need to realise their position is weak, especially with Turkey being a NATO member.

Kurds are the stupidest nation I've seen, and their females need to stop breeding with their retarded men and go elsewhere. You have issues with Turkey, Iraq, and Iran. At some point, these desert nigger needs to realize they're not going to get what they want and are better off co-mingling with the locals and adopting that country. What will you do if you end up having a landlocked nation and its neighbors hate you?
 
Kurds are the stupidest nation I've seen, and their females need to stop breeding with their retarded men and go elsewhere. You have issues with Turkey, Iraq, and Iran. At some point, these desert nigger needs to realize you're not going to get what they want and are better off co-mingling with the locals and adopting that country. Even if you get into a landlocked country, what will you do?
Kurds are Middle Eastern version of Afghans. lol
 
Kurds are the stupidest nation I've seen, and their females need to stop breeding with their retarded men and go elsewhere. You have issues with Turkey, Iraq, and Iran. At some point, these desert nigger needs to realize they're not going to get what they want and are better off co-mingling with the locals and adopting that country. What will you do if you end up having a landlocked nation and its neighbors hate you?
come on the land they live in is more than 90% mountain , very little desert in Syria but majority is mountainous area
 
Kurds are the stupidest nation I've seen, and their females need to stop breeding with their retarded men and go elsewhere. You have issues with Turkey, Iraq, and Iran. At some point, these desert nigger needs to realize they're not going to get what they want and are better off co-mingling with the locals and adopting that country. What will you do if you end up having a landlocked nation and its neighbors hate you?

You can make a point without using demeaning language "sand nigger'.

Separately, a balanced Iranian can explain who is leading protests. Remember just like Saddam and Gaddafi rule millions benefited from system. Same with Iran, many millions benefit from status quo.
 

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Fears grow Iran players may face reprisals for not singing national anthem


Politician says no one will be allowed to ‘insult our anthem and flag’ as loyalist media vent fury over protests during England game





'It's not enough': Iranian fans torn on team refusal to sing national anthem at World Cup – video



Iran’s footballers could face reprisals if they fail to sing the national anthem in their remaining World Cup group games, after a politician said the country “will never allow anyone to insult our anthem”.

The football team stayed silent while the anthem was played before their 6-2 defeat to England on Monday, in a symbolic show of support for the protest movement that has roiled Iran since the death of 22-year-old Mahsa Amini in police custody in September.


Team Melli, as the national team is known, had previously drawn criticism from protesters for even competing in Qatar, and footage of them bowing in front of President Ebrahim Raisi at a send-off meeting drew more anger.


On Tuesday, Mehdi Chamran, the chairman of Tehran city council, said: “We will never allow anyone to insult our anthem and flag. Iranian civilisation has a history of several thousand years, this civilisation is as old as the total of European and American civilisations.”

A conservative MP in Kurdistan, meanwhile, called for the national team to be replaced by faithful and revolutionary youth willing to sing their national anthem.

Iran’s heavily censored media made very little mention of the team not singing the national anthem.

Kayhan, probably the newspaper closest to supreme leader Ali Khamenei, vented its fury at the way in which protesters had cheered an English victory, saying “for weeks foreign media had conducted ruthless and unprecedented psychological-media war against this team”.

“This campaign did not spare any effort to create a gap between the people of Iran and the members of the Iranian national football team, as well as producing false dichotomies,” it said, adding that “this political-media movement, mainly Londoners, with the support and coordination of local patriots, from movie and sports celebrities to chain media and Telegram channels, and even reformist political figures, have joined hands to attack the players”.

It said the Portuguese-born head coach, Carlos Queiroz, had accused critics at the post-match press conference of trying to destroy the team’s morale. “I have to tell those who do not want to support the national team that it is better to stay at home, no one needs them,” it reported him as saying.

The revolt against the national team was demonstrated with videos showing crowds on the streets hailing the England victory and chanting “Death to the dictator” during the match. A restaurant in Tehran that had backed England on its Instagram page was shut and sealed by the authorities on Tuesday.

In an interview with the reformist newspaper Etemaad, Ali Latifi, a former Iranian national team striker, said the team had fallen between two stools, neither saying they only wanted to discuss football nor wholeheartedly supporting the protests, and as a result had satisfied no one. “When some spectators boo, the team suffers,” he said. “Even though it was not broadcast on the radio, the players hear it and it affects their mood.” He also blamed negative coaching tactics that he said had instilled fear in the players.

In late September, the team opted to wear black jackets to cover the country’s colours in their friendly against Senegal.


 

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Fears grow Iran players may face reprisals for not singing national anthem


Politician says no one will be allowed to ‘insult our anthem and flag’ as loyalist media vent fury over protests during England game




'It's not enough': Iranian fans torn on team refusal to sing national anthem at World Cup – video



Iran’s footballers could face reprisals if they fail to sing the national anthem in their remaining World Cup group games, after a politician said the country “will never allow anyone to insult our anthem”.

The football team stayed silent while the anthem was played before their 6-2 defeat to England on Monday, in a symbolic show of support for the protest movement that has roiled Iran since the death of 22-year-old Mahsa Amini in police custody in September.


Team Melli, as the national team is known, had previously drawn criticism from protesters for even competing in Qatar, and footage of them bowing in front of President Ebrahim Raisi at a send-off meeting drew more anger.


On Tuesday, Mehdi Chamran, the chairman of Tehran city council, said: “We will never allow anyone to insult our anthem and flag. Iranian civilisation has a history of several thousand years, this civilisation is as old as the total of European and American civilisations.”

A conservative MP in Kurdistan, meanwhile, called for the national team to be replaced by faithful and revolutionary youth willing to sing their national anthem.

Iran’s heavily censored media made very little mention of the team not singing the national anthem.

Kayhan, probably the newspaper closest to supreme leader Ali Khamenei, vented its fury at the way in which protesters had cheered an English victory, saying “for weeks foreign media had conducted ruthless and unprecedented psychological-media war against this team”.

“This campaign did not spare any effort to create a gap between the people of Iran and the members of the Iranian national football team, as well as producing false dichotomies,” it said, adding that “this political-media movement, mainly Londoners, with the support and coordination of local patriots, from movie and sports celebrities to chain media and Telegram channels, and even reformist political figures, have joined hands to attack the players”.

It said the Portuguese-born head coach, Carlos Queiroz, had accused critics at the post-match press conference of trying to destroy the team’s morale. “I have to tell those who do not want to support the national team that it is better to stay at home, no one needs them,” it reported him as saying.

The revolt against the national team was demonstrated with videos showing crowds on the streets hailing the England victory and chanting “Death to the dictator” during the match. A restaurant in Tehran that had backed England on its Instagram page was shut and sealed by the authorities on Tuesday.

In an interview with the reformist newspaper Etemaad, Ali Latifi, a former Iranian national team striker, said the team had fallen between two stools, neither saying they only wanted to discuss football nor wholeheartedly supporting the protests, and as a result had satisfied no one. “When some spectators boo, the team suffers,” he said. “Even though it was not broadcast on the radio, the players hear it and it affects their mood.” He also blamed negative coaching tactics that he said had instilled fear in the players.

In late September, the team opted to wear black jackets to cover the country’s colours in their friendly against Senegal.


Much Ado About Nothing
 
Much Ado About Nothing


I will be interested to see if they do it again tomorrow. They are playing Wales at noon 12-00 .

I for one will be cheering for Iran team.

common Wales ? , how boring. How many people here know anything about Wales ?

Iran actually has a chance this time to make it to the next round if it passes Wales and the US , which is very possible. I imagine there is a lot of pressure on those young players from all directions and they earned my respect.


Population 3m ,This is Wales lol , . . .

Snowdonia.jpg



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I dont know any Andalusian separatist.

:lol:

But Catalonian people are free to shout "Catalonia is not Spain" in footballs meetings and nobody will make troubles to them due to that.

I hope Iranian people could say the same.

What happened to the referendum? we supposed to forget the beatdowns and the destruction of ballot boxes? Freedom for Catalonia. Hypocritical Madridistas.
 
I will be interested to see if they do it again tomorrow. They are playing Wales at noon 12-00 .

I for one will be cheering for Iran team.

common Wales ? , how boring. How many people here know anything about Wales ?

Iran actually has a chance this time to make it to the next round if it passes Wales and the US , which is very possible. I imagine there is a lot of pressure on those young players from all directions and they earned my respect.


Population 3m ,This is Wales lol , . . .

Snowdonia.jpg



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i knew Tolkien described Shire based on wales and i also watched The Englishman who Went up a Hill but Came down a Mountain.
but that aside after they sacked the coach who take team to World cup with 25 point out of the possible 30 point (and the team before him was on the brink of elimination) instead of throwing out the players who had problem i decided not to follow the games
 
I will be interested to see if they do it again tomorrow. They are playing Wales at noon 12-00 .

I for one will be cheering for Iran team.

common Wales ? , how boring. How many people here know anything about Wales ?

Iran actually has a chance this time to make it to the next round if it passes Wales and the US , which is very possible. I imagine there is a lot of pressure on those young players from all directions and they earned my respect.


Population 3m ,This is Wales lol , . . .

Snowdonia.jpg



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Wales are a decent side.
 
Tell you what, YOU first

Get rid of communist party

Free and fair democratic elections in China

Freedom of religion and allow people's and groups a referendum on whether they want to be part of China

The worst communist countries like Laos is still thousand times better than "democracies" like The Phillipines, India or even Mexico and Brazil in some aspects (comparing countries with similar level of development, not GDP per capita only). (Orderly society, crime rate, equality, etc.)

China is now the best governed country in the world and you think people want to trade it for the like of Boris Johnson, Truss, and Scholz or even worse, the like of Biden, Modi and Zelinsky or the Finnish woman PM Perhaps people in UK and the US should revolt to install a Chinese style goverment (not necessarily communist). It would be much more logical.
 
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I’m not sure with why everybody is so obsessed with the internal politics of other nations. As a person that loves freedom and has issues with authority, I don’t like people telling me what to do, think, or what’s right.

Regarding Iran, I believe Iran should be ruled how the Iranian people want it to be ruled. That’s that.
 

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