Indonesia Defence Forum

[Chestnut]

I think they means 5 more SU35 for F5 replacement. Like I said real F5 replacement should be Air Superiority fighter as its role/function and operational requirements of air force.

What caught my eyes is 21 LIFT & 8 COIN? Really? More likely these 2 would be pushed back for after 2024

And as I predicted 2 tanker & 2 AEW for a start, this one is reasonable numbers. No need for more AEW if we dont have enough avaiable fighters. With airforce readyness of 60% that 2 AEW & tankers should do just fine. Perhaps after 2024 we could add few more

Fairly sure it's supposed to replace the hawks and add more Tucanos.

 

[Ruhnama]

Lebih murah ngasih uang saku akhir tiga bulan sd lima bulan gaji pokok plus beasiswa kuliah dibanding ngasih tunjangan pensiun bulanan sampai meninggal....

Selain itu bakalan ningkatin produktivitas ekonomi dan skill para lulusan SMA yg ngikutin program prajurit kontrak model US Army. Kalau ngikutin model Wamil ala Korsel dan Singapore gak cocok karena Indonesia negara besar yang jumlah penduduk diatas 260 juta.

Secara ga langsung, bikin anak SMA mau gabung tentara lebih banyak plus bisa jadi mahasiswa dibiayai. Asik kan hehehhe

Tentunya pendidikan yang lebih tinggi diharapkan meningkatkan mutu orangnya sendiri(lebih visioner dsb)

 

[Raduga]

new mindef inspecting CN-235 MPA , that one mockups/scale model had torpedo pylon , looks like based on the new n-235 testbed prototype ? .

 

[Kansel]

I have photos about AL&AD renbut (rencana kebutuhan) but it was blurry as hell i will share it here hoping someone can increas the resolution of the pics.

 

[LtMaverick]

new mindef inspecting CN-235 MPA , that one mockups/scale model had torpedo pylon , looks like based on the new n-235 testbed prototype ? .
View attachment 587927View attachment 587930
View attachment 587928

as far as i remember i think it was an Indonesian variant of ac235. with 2 stub wing pylon on each side. along with torpedo and rocket launcher on It's stub wing, and there's also 30mm cannon on the left side of the plane

 

[Raduga]

not related to any news , but aside from iver , imagine our naval fleet like this scale model

well ..... people are free to dream afterall .

sc :https://www.scalemodelsweston.com/project/damen-schelde-sigma-10514/

 

[Nike]

new mindef inspecting CN-235 MPA , that one mockups/scale model had torpedo pylon , looks like based on the new n-235 testbed prototype ? .
View attachment 587927View attachment 587930
View attachment 587928

Prabowo is much eager to look at platform and hardware system compared previous Mindef

Meanwhile....


Military chief discloses details on defense concept for new capital
1 minute ago

House of Representatives' (DPR's) Commission I held a hearing with National Defense Forces (TNI) Chief Marshal Hadi Tjahjanto at the Parliament Building in Jakarta on Wednesday (Imam B)

Jakarta (ANTARA) - National Defense Forces (TNI) Chief Marshal Hadi Tjahjanto shed light on the concept of defense system in Indonesia’s new capital city at a hearing with the House of Representatives’ (DPR’s) Commission I in Jakarta, Wednesday.

The defense system must be prepared in a matured manner since during a state of war, the capital will be targeted in the enemy attack, he remarked.

"In a state of crisis or war, the capital city of a country will become a center of gravity that will certainly be attacked by the enemy to its full strength. Hence, the development of a defense system in the capital city of a country is something of absolute importance for Indonesia," he stated.

Related news: Defense Minister to inventorize issues to strengthen national defense

In the defense field, the air defense identification zone (Adis) and restricted and prohibited area must draw attention in line with Government Regulation No. 4 of 2018 on Indonesian Air Territory Security, he remarked.

He attached significance to the show of military force capable of thwarting any form of threat and the development of a defense system capable of warding off guided missile attacks, enemy warplanes, rockets, cyber sabotage infiltration, chemical biology, and nuclear radioactivity.

In addition, it must adopt routes to mobilize military strength involving the army, naval, and air force personnel as preparations for a contingency plan and VVIP evacuation route, he explained.

In relocating TNI personnel to the new capital of the country in East Kalimantan Province, theTNI units and military base will be situated in Penajam Paser Utara along with the presidential palace, parliament building, ministries/state institutions, and embassies of friendly countries.

Related news: Prabowo vows to strengthen military weaponry defense system

Editor: Rahmad Nasution

COPYRIGHT © ANTARA 2019

https://m.antaranews.com/en/news/13...es-details-on-defense-concept-for-new-capital

Luckily Chief of Armed forces quite sane enough to said the threat assessment is may came from many spectrum in which need comprehensive array of defense arrangement not exclusively to cater the threat came from caveman with rifles like our highness and then just need Super Tucano coupled with C4ISR mode and so on @Chestnut said before. So what if you got top notch C4ISR network and hardware when you dont have meaningful firepower and latent high end platform to show off your capability?

 

[Kansel]

TNI: Ibu Kota Baru Harus Tangkal Rudal hingga Senjata Kimia
CNN Indonesia
Rabu, 06/11/2019 16:16
Bagikan :

Panglima TNI Marsekal Hadi Tjahjanto. (Foto: ANTARA FOTO/Hafidz Mubarak A)

Jakarta, CNN Indonesia -- Panglima Tentara Nasional Indonesia (TNI) Marsekal Hadi Tjahjanto mengatakan kekuatan militer dalam sistem pertahanan di ibu kota Indonesia yang baru harus mampu mengantisipasi ancaman kejahatan siber hingga serangan senjata kimia.

Penangkal serangan udara dan rudal juga mesti dibangun dalam sistem pertahanan di ibu kota baru.

Menurutnya, konsep pertahanan di ibu kota Indonesia yang baru harus dipersiapkan dengan matang. Tujuannya jelas, untuk mengantisipasi situasi darurat perang.


"Gelar kekuatan militer yang mampu menghadapi segala bentuk ancaman. Pembangunan sistem pertahanan penangkal serangan rudal, pesawat udara musuh, roket, infiltran sabotase siber, serta ancaman chemical biology dan radio aktif, dan nuklir," kata Hadi dalam Rapat Kerja dengan Komisi I DPR di Kompleks Parlemen, Senayan, Jakarta pada Rabu (6/11).

Dia menyatakan bahwa pembangunan sistem pertahanan di ibu kota negara merupakan suatu hal yang mutlak. Sejumlah hal pun harus menjadi perhatian di bidang pertahanan seperti pemberlakuan Air Defence Identification Zone (ADIS), serta restricted and prohibited area atau daerah terbatas dan terlarang sesuai Peraturan Pemerintah Nomor 4 Tahun 2018 tentang Pengamanan Wilayah Udara Republik Indonesia.

Lihat juga:
Ibu Kota Baru Perlu Tambahan Pasokan Listrik 1.555 MW
Tidak ketinggalan, ucap Hadi, ibu kota baru nantinya juga harus memiliki jalur yang dekat untuk mobilisasi kekuatan militer sebagai persiapan rencana kontijensi dan rute evakuasi orang-orang atau tamu negara penting.

"Memiliki jalur pendekatan dalam mobilisasi kekuatan militer baik aspek darat laut udara," ujarnya.

 

[Gundala]

Their industry is booming because it's not nationalized and are encouraged to compete locally and abroad for contracts.

There's a reason why PAL and PTDI has more foreign orders than Pindad. Both PAL and PTDI has to compete with local shipyards and intentional aircraft manufacturers thus forcing them to constantly innovate. Pindad does not have any sort of local competition and the government is obligated to buy from them, thus resulting in their rather stagnant development (simply copying stuff instead of actually having R&D). If you want our defense industry to grow, we need to denationalize the big 3 and allow local companies to compete on even footing.

Competition is good for business.

Agree, competition is good for business. But its not that easy building Military Industry when there is not even any "real" competition in shipyard industry per say. I personally not agree with some BUMN taking most of the APBN but if we looking at the condition of private one they simply not big enough to absorb the project in most cases. Not to mention how we manage our own bumn.... too many political strings attached And there are some decissions they made in the name of technological advancement that can sometime went too far.

When others were happy seeing PT.PAL doing nuke reactor in the name of diversification I personally questioned if they already do business study for it. Do they have enough "modal kerja" to finance it or they going to ask from APBN? When this reactor is done, are there going to be any follow up order? Why arent they just specialize in building Warship and put most of their resources in it? Where those submarine manufacturing equipment worth trillions rupiahs going to be used for in a future? There are the question that going thru my mind. Keep in mind that from what I know whats dragging PT.PAL before was anak perusahaannya yg merugi. Now they doing it again? idk...

PAL, DI, Pindad, those 3 companies if we look back 5 years ago arent even healthy financial wise afaik. So hoping them to do R&D is wishful thinking. The relatively small military budget and contract inconsistency play a negative role to the already niche military industry here. But in the last 5 years they have made good profit and generate cash flow, hopefully for the next decade they can start doing their own R&D. But becarefull about denationalize it, there is a political price you have to pay. Things like "antek asing, bumn dijual tanda tidak nasionalis, dll".

https://ekonomi.bisnis.com/read/201...hitungan-jika-pertamina-pln-melantai-di-bursa

https://www.liputan6.com/bisnis/read/2140552/harga-mati-pertamina-dilarang-go-public

So when the BUMN rugi people will blame them, when they try to generate more money they are not nasionalis. See the dilemma? Anyway I have good article for you, tho its from 2011 but it could give you better perspective on the condition of our BUMN or BUMIS and why its hard to denationalize them, enjoy.

https://kickdahlan.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/100-harapan-baru-demi-indonesia.pdf

 

[Kansel]

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Agree, competition is good for business. But its not that easy building Military Industry when there is not even any "real" competition in shipyard industry per say. I personally not agree with some BUMN taking most of the APBN but if we looking at the condition of private one they simply not big enough to absorb the project in most cases. Not to mention how we manage our own bumn.... too many political strings attached And there are some decissions they made in the name of technological advancement that can sometime went too far.

When others were happy seeing PT.PAL doing nuke reactor in the name of diversification I personally questioned if they already do business study for it. Do they have enough "modal kerja" to finance it or they going to ask from APBN? When this reactor is done, are there going to be any follow up order? Why arent they just specialize in building Warship and put most of their resources in it? Where those submarine manufacturing equipment worth trillions rupiahs going to be used for in a future? There are the question that going thru my mind. Keep in mind that from what I know whats dragging PT.PAL before was anak perusahaannya yg merugi. Now they doing it again? idk...

PAL, DI, Pindad, those 3 companies if we look back 5 years ago arent even healthy financial wise afaik. So hoping them to do R&D is wishful thinking. The relatively small military budget and contract inconsistency play a negative role to the already niche military industry here. But in the last 5 years they have made good profit and generate cash flow, hopefully for the next decade they can start doing their own R&D. But becarefull about denationalize it, there is a political price you have to pay. Things like "antek asing, bumn dijual tanda tidak nasionalis, dll".

https://ekonomi.bisnis.com/read/201...hitungan-jika-pertamina-pln-melantai-di-bursa

https://www.liputan6.com/bisnis/read/2140552/harga-mati-pertamina-dilarang-go-public

So when the BUMN rugi people will blame them, when they try to generate more money they are not nasionalis. See the dilemma? Anyway I have good article for you, tho its from 2011 but it could give you better perspective on the condition of our BUMN or BUMIS and why its hard to denationalize them, enjoy.

https://kickdahlan.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/100-harapan-baru-demi-indonesia.pdf

I never like "Badan Usaha Milik Negara" concept biasanya BUMN² itu manja dan mature nya mesti work hard try hard unlike swasta industrial.

Our goverment announced holding and superholding concept which is i don't really know how will it work but since we'll cooperate with BUMS using holding concept, so why don't give it a try?

<CMIIW>

 

[Chestnut]

Agree, competition is good for business. But its not that easy building Military Industry when there is not even any "real" competition in shipyard industry per say. I personally not agree with some BUMN taking most of the APBN but if we looking at the condition of private one they simply not big enough to absorb the project in most cases. Not to mention how we manage our own bumn.... too many political strings attached And there are some decissions they made in the name of technological advancement that can sometime went too far.

When others were happy seeing PT.PAL doing nuke reactor in the name of diversification I personally questioned if they already do business study for it. Do they have enough "modal kerja" to finance it or they going to ask from APBN? When this reactor is done, are there going to be any follow up order? Why arent they just specialize in building Warship and put most of their resources in it? Where those submarine manufacturing equipment worth trillions rupiahs going to be used for in a future? There are the question that going thru my mind. Keep in mind that from what I know whats dragging PT.PAL before was anak perusahaannya yg merugi. Now they doing it again? idk...

PAL, DI, Pindad, those 3 companies if we look back 5 years ago arent even healthy financial wise afaik. So hoping them to do R&D is wishful thinking. The relatively small military budget and contract inconsistency play a negative role to the already niche military industry here. But in the last 5 years they have made good profit and generate cash flow, hopefully for the next decade they can start doing their own R&D. But becarefull about denationalize it, there is a political price you have to pay. Things like "antek asing, bumn dijual tanda tidak nasionalis, dll".

https://ekonomi.bisnis.com/read/201...hitungan-jika-pertamina-pln-melantai-di-bursa

https://www.liputan6.com/bisnis/read/2140552/harga-mati-pertamina-dilarang-go-public

So when the BUMN rugi people will blame them, when they try to generate more money they are not nasionalis. See the dilemma? Anyway I have good article for you, tho its from 2011 but it could give you better perspective on the condition of our BUMN or BUMIS and why its hard to denationalize them, enjoy.

https://kickdahlan.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/100-harapan-baru-demi-indonesia.pdf

If we want to improve our defense industry then the first step is to allow local private individuals to enter the market and compete. People generally do not know how hard it was for Komodo Armament to set up and even today the reason they don't sell well is because Pindad has a strong role in KKIP. Arguably having local branches of international defense companies work directly with the government instead of going through Pindad, PAL, and PTDI would be a step in the right direction. It would also make things a lot cheaper as you're cutting out middlemen.

 

[trishna_amṛta]

People generally do not know how hard it was for Komodo Armament to set up and even today the reason they don't sell well is because Pindad has a strong role in KKIP. Arguably having local branches of international defense companies work directly with the government instead of going through Pindad, PAL, and PTDI would be a step in the right direction. It would also make things a lot cheaper as you're cutting out middlemen.

I'm not familiar (no first hand experience) with Komodo lineup. How good is workmanship quality overall? and also how is the metalworking of the barrel? Do they importing the barrel steel just like PINDAD or they made here in Indonesia?
Thanks beforehand

 

[Ruhnama]

I have photos about AL&AD renbut (rencana kebutuhan) but it was blurry as hell i will share it here hoping someone can increas the resolution of the pics.
View attachment 587933 View attachment 587934

Both are blur or sorry emang adanya gtu ya pengadaan AL am AD ngeblur gada yg agak jelas?

How capable our TNI when facing CBRN attack? Are every soldier in batallion level outside Nubika have CBRN training also equipped with gas mask?

I hope someday civilian trained to face CBRN, as i know chemical attack likely targeting civilian. Imho cmiww

 

[Kansel]

Both are blur or sorry emang adanya gtu ya pengadaan AL am AD ngeblur gada yg agak jelas?

How capable our TNI when facing CBRN attack? Are every soldier in batallion level outside Nubika have CBRN training also equipped with gas mask?

I hope someday civilian trained to face CBRN, as i know chemical attack likely targeting civilian. Imho cmiww

Iya, emang dari sono nya nge blur gitu

 

[trishna_amṛta]

I hope someday civilian trained to face CBRN, as i know chemical attack likely targeting civilian. Imho cmiww

You can always learn it by yourself. I can even give you some pointers here. Unfortunately Indonesian mindset has always been "accident based approach" rather than "prevention based approach" which render the whole learning into a USELESS exercise. Furthermore learning and practising are two different things. And Practising require DISCIPLINE.

And TBH I've already given up teaching Indonesian about disaster mitigation / preparedness, because every time I do so the respond I've got was always the same, that they should just pray it wont happen. So be it I said, I most likely survive major disaster but they don't (as in their dead and I'm alive)