Indian Special Forces

[Umair Nawaz]

72hours?? if you are mentioning is 26/11 then it is 59 hours. 5 things you must understood
1. mumbai is the largest city with ill equipped and poorly trained police forces.
2. the attack was conducted by highly trained militants from pakistan, mumbai police with WW2 weapon cannot mach them.
3. marcos reach there without any intelligence of what is happening there, they faced these militants as a local gangsters.
4. to save people from these hotels were gusts are locked themself inside the hotel is time consuming.
5. the attack was not on a single place, it was simultaneous attack on multiple places, withe bomb attacks. make security forces total confusing and they have no idea what is happening there.

these are the main reason why security forces take 59H in that operation.

The operation took 72 hrs to clear them out in case u dont know.

1) When the World is facing Global terrorism and u were attacked before too in yr country by them, but still the police were instructed to hold them.

U want me believe that u dont have a SF presence in yr largest city?
LOL u may tell that excuse to indians but nobody is gonna buy that.

2)LOL pure rubbish These r Militants not regular people. They r at their best designated as poorly trained partisan style highly motivated civilians. Their gear is even not close to the worse SF forces around the globe.

Again nobody is gonna buy that either.

3)Yes! now u r talking, my sources also conform this that op was done by MARCOS not NSG people.

Still my point is that, after all that tall glory claims in wars and still took them 72 hrs to clear them out where as our Zarar Company of SSG (who r responsible for CT ops) it took them 44 minutes to do the job even inside the AB like Kamra who is our main AB.

So the claim of MARCOS being best or even better then SSG dont fit in this either.

4) and the casualties were more then 160 people and of loss in property as well.... The damage was done, there was no reason for them still to be so late. Look at Kamra and Mehran Attack where there was also loss of property/assets and lives, still it took them few hrs and 44 minutes respectively.

The point is that the damage which was bound to have happened has been done already, there is not point in holding back now.

If still it takes a SF soo much time then clearly they have lot of problems either in training/moral or attitudes.


5) And so were the attacks in Kamra and Mehran. In Kamra we have PAC there which itself is a complex of many companies/manufacturing plants.

And the people who raided Kamra and Mehran were More then just 9.

Even if we take yr argument seriously, then the logical analysis can be that just 9 people in different buildings means each building should have few lets say 1 to 3 men there meaning minimum resistance and u have all the options of SFs in yr table with no shortage of Supply both in ammo and men and the others who were just 9 and brought ammo with them have no such leverages. Still it takes them so much time and in that time span they keep on doing more damage.

Clearly this would have been a very big concern for me if i were an indian.

The final word is that these r just excuses to put things under carpet so that national moral stays up then making armed forces held accountable for showing lack of will/courage in what it takes to fight big time.

Accept it or not its yr business. But we r satisfied and happy because these fighting capabilities show us that our enemy is not that good as it claims for itself.

We have seen the wonders Madrasas have made on your country. Keep it up. Madrasas have done something what an enemy army can not do.

And yes we have seen the performance of your commandos in the fight against the terrorist. We also see your ISI, your military and your police performance . All we show in last one week.

Yup and still these wonder men have besieged yr entire Armed Forces and yr financial capital for good 72 hrs.

Yes, that's about right. Take pride in your ignorance.

Rather its u who is talking pride in ignorance.

U havnt provided an authentic proof still.

Haan beta G..we believe what we have a link of.

And that attitude shows too

 

[Umair Nawaz]

correct information will only get through a neutral source.

Sure and the sources must be authentic and should be accepted as neutral worldwide too!!!!!

Things is that there is no such thing as neutral in this sad Age we r living in.

 

[special]

The operation took 72 hrs to clear them out in case u dont know.

1) When the World is facing Global terrorism and u were attacked before but still the police were instructed to hold them.

So u want me believe that u dont have a SF presence in yr largest city?
LOL u may tell that excuse to indians but nobody is gonna buy that.

2)LOL pure rubbish These r Militants not regular people. They r designated at best as poorly trained partisan style highly motivated civilians. Their gear is even not close to the worse SF forces around the globe.

Again nobody is gonna buy that either.

3)Yes now u r talking, my sources also conform this that op was done by MARCOS not NSG people.

Still my point is after all that tall glory claims in wars and still took them 72 hrs to clear them out where was our Zarar Company of SSG who r responsible for CT ops it took them 44 minutes to do the job even inside the AB like Kamra who is our main AB.

So the claim of MARCOS being best or even better then SSG dont fit in this either.

4) and the casualties were more then 160 people and a lot of loss in property.... The damage was done there was no reason for them still to be so late. Look at Kamra and Mehran Attack where there was also loss of property/assets and lives out still it took them few hrs and 44 minutes respectively.

The point is the damage which was bound to have happened have already done, there is not point in holding back now.
If still it takes a SF soo much time then clearly they have look of problems either in training/moral or attitudes.


5) Either do the attacks were in Kamra and Mehran. In Kamra we have PAC there which itself is a complex of many companies/manufacturing plants.

And the people who raided Kamra and Mehran were More then just 9.

Even if we take yr argument seriously, then the logical thing is that just 9 people r in different buildings means each building should have few lets say 1 to 3 men there and u have all the options of SFs in yr table with no shortage of Supply both in ammo and men and the others who were just 9 and brought ammo with them have no such leverages.

If still it takes them this much time then clearly this is a very big concern for me if i were an indian.

The final word is that these r just excuses or armed forces lacks what it takes to fight big time.

Accept it or not its yr business. But we r satisfied and happy because these fighting capabilities show us that our enemy is not that good as it claims for itself.



Yup and still these wonder men have besieged yr entire Armed Forces and yr financial capital for good 72 hrs.



Rather its u who is talking pride in ignorance.

U havnt provided an authentic proof still.



And that attitude shows too

mumbai attack is of 59 hours. it start at 9: 30 pm of 26 nov and ends at 29 nov 8:00 am
=> 2.5+24+24+8 = 58:30 hours.

1. no, attack like that is first in mumbai. police were told to stop and they tried, but they are partially succeeded in it. that is how kasab was captured vvvv

if i tell you that there was no special forces presence(other than marcos) in mumbai then you have to beleve that because it is true.

2. these militants are not ordinary militants they are highly trained in different places in pakistan.
2008 Mumbai attacks - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia check "Training" section in it

rest of the video is also in internet

3. the ssg was clearing a military base not large hotels. ask somebody who knows about hostage rescue. military personals know how to face terrorism unlike foreign and domestic tourists who lock himself inside the hotel. SF has to blast each door to check whether there is any terrorists, as they have plenty of places to hide even in bath tub. the attack was occured in different parts of city and it will create chaos. marcos enter into the hotel without any knowledge of hottel, number of terrorists, what weapon are they using etc unlike marcos, ssg knows all these during their operation in that military base. (initially 25 marcos personals of QRF for the protection of Oil rig in case of a attack on it, are arrived at the scene which was not sufficient for that operation)

4. in mumbai attack terrorist's primary target was people who don't know how to react in a terrorist attack unlike mumbai attack pakistan military base has only active duty military personal and the terrorists primary target was the fighter planes and other aircrafts. when marcos arrived in the mumbai they were told that there are more than 20 terrorists in taj. and marcos was concentrating on the safe rescue of 1000s of people in that hotel. in Kamra and Mehran there are few 100 military personals.

5. Kamra and Mehran is a military base that are surrounded by long walls and ssg need only to concentrate on that particular compound not entair city unlike Kamra and Mehran mumbai attack was occurred simultaneous attack on different method(shooting, bomb explosions, granide attacks). yes there are different buildings were in Kamra and Mehran. but not in the size or type in mumbai.

p.s-
1. don't compare a military base with a large hotel.
2. don't compare a military compound with a metropolitan city.
3. don't compare military personals with civilians and their behaviour during terrorist attack.
4. don't compare a highly protected military base to a defenceless city.
5. pakistan's primary urbain counter terrorism force is SSG, india's NSG not marcos. if 36-100 us navy seals are asked to rescue the peoples from different places during mumbai style attack in an american city without any intelligence on terrorists and the area, they cannot do that job with an excellency of a SWAT team doing it. it doesn't mean that seals are less trained than SWAT.

Yes, special forces made many mistakes in mumbai attack, they failed to understand the gravity of situation, they initially deal this as they are dealing some gangsters, they didn't bring enough equipments for this kind of operations (this is about marcos), they lack the mobility needed for this operation, and coordination between security personals, commandos, intelligence agencies are very poor.

 

[special]

training videos of indian special forces:

MARCOS:

para commandos:

garuds:

Garud Commandos Of Indian Air Force - YouTube

 

[special]

further reference:
NDTV » Search » rajeev ranjan

 

[Umair Nawaz]

mumbai attack is of 59 hours. it start at 9: 30 pm of 26 nov and ends at 29 nov 8:00 am
=> 2.5+24+24+8 = 58:30 hours.

1. no, attack like that is first in mumbai. police were told to stop and they tried, but they are partially succeeded in it. that is how kasab was captured vvvv

if i tell you that there was no special forces presence(other than marcos) in mumbai then you have to beleve that because it is true.

2. these militants are not ordinary militants they are highly trained in different places in pakistan.
2008 Mumbai attacks - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia check "Training" section in it

rest of the video is also in internet

3. the ssg was clearing a military base not large hotels. ask somebody who knows about hostage rescue. military personals know how to face terrorism unlike foreign and domestic tourists who lock himself inside the hotel. SF has to blast each door to check whether there is any terrorists, as they have plenty of places to hide even in bath tub. the attack was occured in different parts of city and it will create chaos. marcos enter into the hotel without any knowledge of hottel, number of terrorists, what weapon are they using etc unlike marcos, ssg knows all these during their operation in that military base. (initially 25 marcos personals of QRF for the protection of Oil rig in case of a attack on it, are arrived at the scene which was not sufficient for that operation)

4. in mumbai attack terrorist's primary target was people who don't know how to react in a terrorist attack unlike mumbai attack pakistan military base has only active duty military personal and the terrorists primary target was the fighter planes and other aircrafts. when marcos arrived in the mumbai they were told that there are more than 20 terrorists in taj. and marcos was concentrating on the safe rescue of 1000s of people in that hotel. in Kamra and Mehran there are few 100 military personals.

5. Kamra and Mehran is a military base that are surrounded by long walls and ssg need only to concentrate on that particular compound not entair city unlike Kamra and Mehran mumbai attack was occurred simultaneous attack on different method(shooting, bomb explosions, granide attacks). yes there are different buildings were in Kamra and Mehran. but not in the size or type in mumbai.

p.s-
1. don't compare a military base with a large hotel.
2. don't compare a military compound with a metropolitan city.
3. don't compare military personals with civilians and their behaviour during terrorist attack.
4. don't compare a highly protected military base to a defenceless city.
5. pakistan's primary urbain counter terrorism force is SSG, india's NSG not marcos. if 36-100 us navy seals are asked to rescue the peoples from different places during mumbai style attack in an american city without any intelligence on terrorists and the area, they cannot do that job with an excellency of a SWAT team doing it. it doesn't mean that seals are less trained than SWAT.

Yes, special forces made many mistakes in mumbai attack, they failed to understand the gravity of situation, they initially deal this as they are dealing some gangsters, they didn't bring enough equipments for this kind of operations (this is about marcos), they lack the mobility needed for this operation, and coordination between security personals, commandos, intelligence agencies are very poor.

Even if we agree in 59 hrs still thats a lot of time it means 2 days and 11 hrs.

1) Very hard to believe that.Anyways....


Kasab was capture in the dying moments of the attack. Or if not he was not capture before 48 hrs into operation.

Yr largest city has SF presence..... Yr MARCOS r part of SF forces or arnt they?

2)Wikipedia is not taken as a source. The training title has some american individual analysts and indian media sources. Again not neutral towards pakistan. So they will always give more fire if its any negative abt pakistan. There was a report in 2010 by American gov saying it as the biggest security lapse of the century Which is pure rubbish as they were trying to hide their weaknesses that we saw in 9/11.

So u see they will only say somethings that works for them. Following truth is not their priority.

Anyways yr gov claims they were trained in muridke and the title claims to be trained in Mangla etc etc places....

So there are contradictions here.

The argument stays...They r at their best designated as poorly trained partisan style highly motivated civilians. Their gear is even not close to the worse SF forces around the globe.



3)Exactly is my point they r just hotels not Military bases where sensitive assets r kept.

If it takes them door to door hunt for terrorists or rescue hostages then thats why more then one team of SFs work on it. Still That much time is not understandable.

Again will not buy this excuse.

MARCOS being best in the World or better then SSG. I dont see that happening.

4) Sure people were their target and also was to besiege yr main city. In that also they were successful, also let me remind u that people were evacuated from hostile areas within hrs of attack so still it took them according to u 59 hrs is still unbelievable to me.

Still my point is same the damage which was bound to have happen has happen. Same way like Kamra and Mehran which were more sensitive then raiding hotels to clear militants out.

Thats the difference b/w Indian forces and Pakistani Forces.

Its the attitude that makes difference in the end.

5) First answer me have u ever been to a Military base of strategic value or a Military Complex like DRDO or HAL??

If u were there specially in DRDO or HAL which is complex standard facility u will know how vast they will be and how many Plants and Companies will be inside that Complex. Every company has its critical output in making a Military Unity.

In the case of Kamra we have PAC in side, Officers Colony, Workers Colony etc etc. Now PAC who was targeted has many group of companies, R&D facilities and Manufacturing plants there and also there r air field and hangers where a/c like F16s JF17s r parked. Now Abt A/C even a single bullet hit them then they may not be able to fly again without repairs. That is how much protective and how much sensitive the environment is inside these military bases and in a situation where some crazy gruop of men raid an area like this and the SFs r to clear them out then they r specially instructed to be extra careful and shoot when u r sure abt the target and bullet. Let me remind u that they have just not AKs but r armed with explosives where a single bullet hints them they blow themselves now imagine if they r close to a sensitive asset? The impact of blast is enough to destroy an A/c or even a Machine in a Manufacturing plant.


The Kamra and Mehran attacks were more sensitive / important then fighting in an urban hostile situation to save hostages.

So if in Mumbai the attackers held more targets then so did they in Mehran and specially Kamra.


With these odds against them it still took them just 44 minutes in kamra and took yr armed forces 59 hrs (again by u) in a more easy environment to raid hotels clear militants and rescue hostages tells different story abt fighting capabilities abt yr armed forces.


Mehran Base has no tall walls the a/c parked inside can be seem from the outside too and people who raided Kamra and Mehran were More then just 9

Still argument stays....



Even if we take yr argument seriously, then the logical analysis can be that just 9 people in different buildings means each building should have few lets say 1 to 3 men there meaning minimum resistance and u have all the options of SFs in yr table with no shortage of Supply both in ammo and men and the others who were just 9 and brought ammo with them have no such leverages. Still it takes them so much time and in that time span they keep on doing more damage.


Regarding Rest of yr points....

Again nobody is gonna buy them and i have explained them why.

According to same wikipedia Yr intelligence knew abt these attacks even a simple wikipedia read will let u know. Read that in RAW's page but i will not share it as i dont believe in wikipedia info But as u shared it so im also telling u from what i read there.

Also even if we believe that!!! then let me tell u we also didnt had intel our attacks too. and our SSG is also not responsible for any type of urban hostile situations only SSG's zarar Company does that.

But that shows who is better prepared to face any hostile situation in any time of need. Regardless of being in Alert.

Regarding yr last words....

If yr armed forces lack co-operation then our armed forces r no better either. They have rivalry b/w the Services here.

These r just excuses to put things under carpet so that national/forces moral stays up then making armed forces held accountable for showing lack of will/courage.... These r old tactics by Indian Armed forces.... See this...

Disclosing Kargil casualties would affect morale of troops: CIC

They r known to be doing that.


In the end it still comes to this who is better prepared to face any hostile environment in a moments notice. This is what make Special Forces special.

Accept it or not its up to u.

 

[klub]

Even if we agree in 59 hrs still thats a lot of time it means 2 days and 11 hrs.

1) Very hard to believe that.Anyways....


Kasab was capture in the dying moments of the attack. Or if not he was not capture before 48 hrs into operation.

Yr largest city has SF presence..... Yr MARCOS r part of SF forces or arnt they?

2)Wikipedia is not taken as a source. The training title has some american individual analysts and indian media sources. Again not neutral towards pakistan. So they will always give more fire if its any negative abt pakistan. There was a report in 2010 by American gov saying it as the biggest security lapse of the century Which is pure rubbish as they were trying to hide their weaknesses that we saw in 9/11.

So u see they will only say somethings that works for them. Following truth is not their priority.

Anyways yr gov claims they were trained in muridke and the title claims to be trained in Mangla etc etc places....

So there are contradictions here.

The argument stays...They r at their best designated as poorly trained partisan style highly motivated civilians. Their gear is even not close to the worse SF forces around the globe.



3)Exactly is my point they r just hotels not Military bases where sensitive assets r kept.

If it takes them door to door hunt for terrorists or rescue hostages then thats why more then one team of SFs work on it. Still That much time is not understandable.

Again will not buy this excuse.

MARCOS being best in the World or better then SSG. I dont see that happening.

4) Sure people were their target and also was to besiege yr main city. In that also they were successful, also let me remind u that people were evacuated from hostile areas within hrs of attack so still it took them according to u 59 hrs is still unbelievable to me.

Still my point is same the damage which was bound to have happen has happen. Same way like Kamra and Mehran which were more sensitive then raiding hotels to clear militants out.

Thats the difference b/w Indian forces and Pakistani Forces.

Its the attitude that makes difference in the end.

5) First answer me have u ever been to a Military base of strategic value or a Military Complex like DRDO or HAL??

If u were there specially in DRDO or HAL which is complex standard facility u will know how vast they will be and how many Plants and Companies will be inside that Complex. Every company has its critical output in making a Military Unity.

In the case of Kamra we have PAC in side, Officers Colony, Workers Colony etc etc. Now PAC who was targeted has many group of companies, R&D facilities and Manufacturing plants there and also there r air field and hangers where a/c like F16s JF17s r parked. Now Abt A/C even a single bullet hit them then they may not be able to fly again without repairs. That is how much protective and how much sensitive the environment is inside these military bases and in a situation where some crazy gruop of men raid an area like this and the SFs r to clear them out then they r specially instructed to be extra careful and shoot when u r sure abt the target and bullet. Let me remind u that they have just not AKs but r armed with explosives where a single bullet hints them they blow themselves now imagine if they r close to a sensitive asset? The impact of blast is enough to destroy an A/c or even a Machine in a Manufacturing plant.


The Kamra and Mehran attacks were more sensitive / important then fighting in an urban hostile situation to save hostages.

So if in Mumbai the attackers held more targets then so did they in Mehran and specially Kamra.


With these odds against them it still took them just 44 minutes in kamra and took yr armed forces 59 hrs (again by u) in a more easy environment to raid hotels clear militants and rescue hostages tells different story abt fighting capabilities abt yr armed forces.


Mehran Base has no tall walls the a/c parked inside can be seem from the outside too and people who raided Kamra and Mehran were More then just 9

Still argument stays....



Even if we take yr argument seriously, then the logical analysis can be that just 9 people in different buildings means each building should have few lets say 1 to 3 men there meaning minimum resistance and u have all the options of SFs in yr table with no shortage of Supply both in ammo and men and the others who were just 9 and brought ammo with them have no such leverages. Still it takes them so much time and in that time span they keep on doing more damage.


Regarding Rest of yr points....

Again nobody is gonna buy them and i have explained them why.

According to same wikipedia Yr intelligence knew abt these attacks even a simple wikipedia read will let u know. Read that in RAW's page but i will not share it as i dont believe in wikipedia info But as u shared it so im also telling u from what i read there.

Also even if we believe that!!! then let me tell u we also didnt had intel our attacks too. and our SSG is also not responsible for any type of urban hostile situations only SSG's zarar Company does that.

But that shows who is better prepared to face any hostile situation in any time of need. Regardless of being in Alert.

Regarding yr last words....

If yr armed forces lack co-operation then our armed forces r no better either. They have rivalry b/w the Services here.

These r just excuses to put things under carpet so that national/forces moral stays up then making armed forces held accountable for showing lack of will/courage.... These r old tactics by Indian Armed forces.... See this...

Disclosing Kargil casualties would affect morale of troops: CIC

They r known to be doing that.


In the end it still comes to this who is better prepared to face any hostile environment in a moments notice. This is what make Special Forces special.

Accept it or not its up to u.

Funny your SF regulary get "targeted" and you call it better. Were they sleeping when Osama was sunbathing topless in Abottabad?

BTW in 1987, ordinary Indian Grenadiers beat up you Mard e Momins.

After 1984, Pakistan launched several attempts to displace the Indian forces, but with little success. The most well known was in 1987, when an attempt was made by Pakistan to dislodge India from the area. The attack was masterminded by Pervez Musharraf (later President of Pakistan) heading a newly raised elite SSG commando unit raised with United States Special Operations Forces help in the area. A special garrison with eight thousand troops was built at Khapalu. The immediate aim was to capture Bilafond La but after bitter fighting that included hand to hand combat, the Pakistani attack was repulsed and the positions remained the same.

Marcos are possibly the best in South Asia due to their intensive experience of arranging meetings b/w terrorists and the male virgin brigade in Hell. Hell their dropout rate is 90%.

New Response Time :

Indian marine comm*andos need 60 minutes to target | Deccan Chronicle

 

[Mike_Brando]

Sure atleast its still better then a Mandir with Indian Special Forces of Swamis and Pundits

aren't you the guy who claimed that the first human being on earth was a man named Adammaybe Adam was a SSG commando after all

 

[special]

Even if we agree in 59 hrs still thats a lot of time it means 2 days and 11 hrs.

1) Very hard to believe that.Anyways....


Kasab was capture in the dying moments of the attack. Or if not he was not capture before 48 hrs into operation.

Yr largest city has SF presence..... Yr MARCOS r part of SF forces or arnt they?

2)Wikipedia is not taken as a source. The training title has some american individual analysts and indian media sources. Again not neutral towards pakistan. So they will always give more fire if its any negative abt pakistan. There was a report in 2010 by American gov saying it as the biggest security lapse of the century Which is pure rubbish as they were trying to hide their weaknesses that we saw in 9/11.

So u see they will only say somethings that works for them. Following truth is not their priority.

Anyways yr gov claims they were trained in muridke and the title claims to be trained in Mangla etc etc places....

So there are contradictions here.

The argument stays...They r at their best designated as poorly trained partisan style highly motivated civilians. Their gear is even not close to the worse SF forces around the globe.



3)Exactly is my point they r just hotels not Military bases where sensitive assets r kept.

If it takes them door to door hunt for terrorists or rescue hostages then thats why more then one team of SFs work on it. Still That much time is not understandable.

Again will not buy this excuse.

MARCOS being best in the World or better then SSG. I dont see that happening.

4) Sure people were their target and also was to besiege yr main city. In that also they were successful, also let me remind u that people were evacuated from hostile areas within hrs of attack so still it took them according to u 59 hrs is still unbelievable to me.

Still my point is same the damage which was bound to have happen has happen. Same way like Kamra and Mehran which were more sensitive then raiding hotels to clear militants out.

Thats the difference b/w Indian forces and Pakistani Forces.

Its the attitude that makes difference in the end.

5) First answer me have u ever been to a Military base of strategic value or a Military Complex like DRDO or HAL??

If u were there specially in DRDO or HAL which is complex standard facility u will know how vast they will be and how many Plants and Companies will be inside that Complex. Every company has its critical output in making a Military Unity.

In the case of Kamra we have PAC in side, Officers Colony, Workers Colony etc etc. Now PAC who was targeted has many group of companies, R&D facilities and Manufacturing plants there and also there r air field and hangers where a/c like F16s JF17s r parked. Now Abt A/C even a single bullet hit them then they may not be able to fly again without repairs. That is how much protective and how much sensitive the environment is inside these military bases and in a situation where some crazy gruop of men raid an area like this and the SFs r to clear them out then they r specially instructed to be extra careful and shoot when u r sure abt the target and bullet. Let me remind u that they have just not AKs but r armed with explosives where a single bullet hints them they blow themselves now imagine if they r close to a sensitive asset? The impact of blast is enough to destroy an A/c or even a Machine in a Manufacturing plant.


The Kamra and Mehran attacks were more sensitive / important then fighting in an urban hostile situation to save hostages.

So if in Mumbai the attackers held more targets then so did they in Mehran and specially Kamra.


With these odds against them it still took them just 44 minutes in kamra and took yr armed forces 59 hrs (again by u) in a more easy environment to raid hotels clear militants and rescue hostages tells different story abt fighting capabilities abt yr armed forces.


Mehran Base has no tall walls the a/c parked inside can be seem from the outside too and people who raided Kamra and Mehran were More then just 9

Still argument stays....



Even if we take yr argument seriously, then the logical analysis can be that just 9 people in different buildings means each building should have few lets say 1 to 3 men there meaning minimum resistance and u have all the options of SFs in yr table with no shortage of Supply both in ammo and men and the others who were just 9 and brought ammo with them have no such leverages. Still it takes them so much time and in that time span they keep on doing more damage.


Regarding Rest of yr points....

Again nobody is gonna buy them and i have explained them why.

According to same wikipedia Yr intelligence knew abt these attacks even a simple wikipedia read will let u know. Read that in RAW's page but i will not share it as i dont believe in wikipedia info But as u shared it so im also telling u from what i read there.

Also even if we believe that!!! then let me tell u we also didnt had intel our attacks too. and our SSG is also not responsible for any type of urban hostile situations only SSG's zarar Company does that.

But that shows who is better prepared to face any hostile situation in any time of need. Regardless of being in Alert.

Regarding yr last words....

If yr armed forces lack co-operation then our armed forces r no better either. They have rivalry b/w the Services here.

These r just excuses to put things under carpet so that national/forces moral stays up then making armed forces held accountable for showing lack of will/courage.... These r old tactics by Indian Armed forces.... See this...

Disclosing Kargil casualties would affect morale of troops: CIC

They r known to be doing that.


In the end it still comes to this who is better prepared to face any hostile environment in a moments notice. This is what make Special Forces special.

Accept it or not its up to u.

1. nobody say we are impressed by SF's response time. NSG take 10 hours to reach taj. and marcos take 4 hours. Kasab was captured by a brave police officer Tukaram Omble, search in google how he capture kasab. i said there were no special forces except for marcos, i don't say that marcos was not a special force, but it is not an urbain counter terrorism unit.

2. only india and US were investigating the 26/11. so only they can provide this information, for neutral source there is BBC reports in internet. it was the biggest security breach in the history of mumbai, by accepting that fact GoI is not hiding anything. it create a turning point on the country's approach on the special forces. NSG had best equipment for this kind of operation, mumbai police get its dedicated counter terrorism force. india is upgrading all of its security force from police constable to military special forces. Now mumbai police is equipped with M4, mp5,and ak103 from a WW2 era .303 enfield.

3. during the attack on pakistan military bases terrorists destroy an AEW&CS, 3 navy anti-submarine planes and a fighter jet. the attack on the military base on pakistan is much large military intelligence and military force's failure than mumbai attack. in every country military bases are protected by highly trained unit. in pakistan these units failed to protect their asset, because of their lack of training and quality of men on the duty. mumbai was not protected by any kind of units except for coast guard and navy.
to avoid the capturing by navy and, CG they hijack a fishing vessel and kill all the men inside in it. so the reach mumbai unchallenged. in the case of pakistan at that time pakistan was fighting terrorism in FATA and waziristan and also they are fighting some terrorists in karachi too, so the security in karachi was much better than in mumbai, karachi police and military was on high alert, despite the high alert they failed to prevent the attack on karachi. in case of mumbai the security forces are not on high alert and the insurgency in kashmir is 1000s of km away from mumbai to being alert. unlike densely populated area in mumbai a military complex buildings in pakistan are constructed a considerable distance away and there is not much people in that compound for being taken as hostages. and there is not many rooms to be cleared and ssg is fighting from a considerable distance away from terrorists as the manufacturing areas which are larger than the entire ground floor of taj so clearing the room in a hotel is time consumig.
marcos are trained, equipped, deployed to conduct covert operations, unconventional warfare and counter terrorism(not in cities), not to conduct a SWAT team's work. marcos are best in what they are created for.

4. the last hostages are released on 29 nov. and the time taken for is to rescue the hostages in the hotel, you can search in google about mumbai attack.

in Kamra and Mehran there is no nuclear or conventional weapons to be so sensitive during firing (at least in the area were the terrorists attacked) a fighter jet and other military planes are constructed to withstan a direct hight from AK 47 so the terrorists use RPG, ssg does not need to be so sensitive during firing, in mumbai attack SF has to make sure that the are shooting at terrorists not civilians during night without any light and the terrorists are wearing simple dress like tourists. in pakistani military base the personals are wearing uniform and terrorists are wearing triditional dress of pakistani tribal area, so ssg can identify them easly.

5. yes i had visited DRDO with my parants and visited HAL with my uncle and i know how it is. and what is the differnce between a 6 floor hotel and a single floor assambling unit building.
there is a large distance between the entrance, the runway and buildings in an air force base or manufacturing unit. a hanger is in the one side of runway and the controll tower is in an another side. during attack in military base in pakistan the terrorists have to travel a large distance to get to the targets without any place to cover is like a sitting ducks for ssg , unlike in pakistan the mumbai hotel give lot of protection to terrorists from special forces enterining the hotel as it has more than 800 rooms in taj hotel to hide. in pakistan military can use helecoptor for fire support and a large space for maneuvering of helecoptors. they have enough space and have a clear line of sight on the terrorist from a long distance. yes NSG take 49:30 hours to clear the hotel and to save the hostages. the same NSG have a record of saving a hijacked plane in 12 minits after the ariwal of NSG in the spot, which no unit in pakistan can mach this time limit(Indian Airlines Flight 427 in 1993).

and that is the difference b/w indian forces and pakistani forces


during the attack nobody knows how many terrorists are in taj and other places in mumbai and also there are multiple blast in different places of mumbai the reports are comming in and secutity force are in a caos situation to understand what is happining there as it is a war like situation. special forces are there with a primary objective of saving hostages in the hotel as they all are highprofile people. the terrorists in mumbai attack have enough ammunition, granides, bombs, and other drugs for incresing stamina. so they are well prepared for this and they know the hotel than the special forces. they are trained for this perticular attack. in pakistan terrorists 1st open fire on the security at the gate and they moved in foot to the target so security forces has enough time to aleart the specal forces and the entrance and the targets are seperated by a large distance, in mumbai the terrorist get only open fire only get close to their targets
ssg is the primar forces for counterterrorism in urban warfare in pakistan, SSG's zarar company was the first one to came there - for your knowloge.
i had already told you, there are inteligence about an attack, but police and government ignore the wanning. but the intelligence tells about an atack on mumbai from the sea ways and the police and securtiy forces failed to understand the intencity of the attack.

answer to your last sentence

your current PM who was also the PM in 1999 had already said that the casuality in kargil war on pakistan army is more than 4000, and your former military ruler musharaf said it is less than 200, isi said it is more than 3000. many dead bodys are bured in indian soil as pakistan denied that it is their soldiers. are these things pump up your soldier's morale. in 1971 after the death of only 8000 soldier your army surrendred is because of your high morale.... i salute your carage and morale. indian army kill 200 soldier of total 2000 came, destroyed 34 tanks and 500 vehicles supported by tanks and ICFs with only 120 indian soldier without any tanks and with only loss of two soldier in th battle of Battle of Longewala is only because of high curage of your soldiers... i admire your by knowing all these actions in different war with india.
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-n...Jan-2013/putting-our-children-in-line-of-fire

better prepared???? oh i am hearing about it for last 1 month in different parts in pakistan especially during the attack on the central prison break which is terrorists favorite target for couple of years.

p.s- don't over estimate your military and special forces and don't compare a military base to a civilian hotel. and don't quistion the curage of indian soldiers who beleve death is better than surrender.

 

[Amaa'n]

@Aeronaut @nuclearpak @Oscar , sir the topic is about Indian SF, and their pics and videos than why are they doscussing Pakistani SF here?

 

[Jango]

Where the heck has SSG, Kamra and Mehran come in here from?

Any more off topic posts and you will be dealt with harshly.

Keep posts restricted to Indian SF.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

T
Regarding RPG..i was talking about the loader smart guy..who loads the weapon and not the one who carries it.

Dnt edit ur post ... also u dnt need a loader for RPG "smart guy" ... its fired like this :

while CG RR:

 

[special]

Dnt edit ur post ... also u dnt need a loader for RPG "smart guy" ... its fired like this :

while CG RR:

both of it can carried by a single man. if there is to man then the loading is faster. during reloading RPG has to take out the aiming but CG does not have to do that as it is loaded from backside and the other man can load it faster and the firing person can keep the aiming on the target. reloading become much easy for CG that is why indian special forces uses it as india has both rpg and CG

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

botth of it can carried by a single man. if there is to man then the loading is faster. during reloading RPG has to take out the aiming but CG does not have to do that as it is loaded from backside and the other man can load it faster and the firing person can keep the aiming on the target. reloading become much easy for CG

Lol... no kid.. CG RRs ammo is heavy as fk .. same goes for the launcher.. and u cant aim and load the thing at the same time... unlike rpg where a soldier can just take out a rocket from his backpack load n fire... also these weapons arent used as "sniper rifles" .. they are used coz of their "fire power" ... against bigger areas,bunkers,hideouts etc....

 

[special]

Lol... no kid.. CG RRs ammo is heavy as fk .. same goes for the launcher.. and u cant aim and load the thing at the same time... unlike rpg where a soldier can just take out a rocket from his backpack load n fire... also these weapons arent used as "sniper rifles" .. they are used coz of their "fire power" ... against bigger areas,bunkers,hideouts etc....

cg use optical sight with zooming capability

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Gustav_recoilless_rifle read this.

cg uses Open (iron) sights, optical 3×, laser rangefinder, image intensification system which will increase accuracy. RPG uses only iron sight