Indian scheme to control Bangladesh business and trade

[blackbriar]

I see a lot of bangladeshis saying that bangladesh is a sovereign nation and it will do things only in its interest and so india should not feel bad and have big brother attitude.i completely take this point.
but it works both ways, so india is a soverign nation and it will do things in its national interest.if anything around it does not meet its national interest it will use all resources available to india to stop it.now u call a soverign nation following its national interest big brother attitude.
and personally i feel very good abt fiddling with the bangladeshis, its such a small country...and the ego these guys have...

 

[TopCat]

I see a lot of bangladeshis saying that bangladesh is a sovereign nation and it will do things only in its interest and so india should not feel bad and have big brother attitude.i completely take this point.
but it works both ways, so india is a soverign nation and it will do things in its national interest.if anything around it does not meet its national interest it will use all resources available to india to stop it.now u call a soverign nation following its national interest big brother attitude.
and personally i feel very good abt fiddling with the bangladeshis, its such a small country...and the ego these guys have...

Bangladesh will do things on its own interest thats true but it will not do anything which will go against the interest of other nation either. India doing both.

 

[TheBraveHeart]

Ramu

Thanks for your comments, look we are a poor country and like most countries in our stage of development we have many problems of our own. I have no problem doing business with India if it’s in our benefit, but if anything is detrimental to our interests I will say so. India is a larger country then us with a bigger more mature market, however it is also one of the more restrictive (have a look at the negative list targeted specific to Bangladesh), so on one hand we are expected to open our markets to Indian goods and services but at the same time India restricts what we can sell. Now on the trust thing you asked with regards India, Indian occupation of one our islands on our west coast, border enclaves issues etc are just a few things but its generally the big brother attitude and expectation that Bangladesh is part India’s sphere of influence (generally we don't like being told what we should and shouldn't do).

After reading this post I for once felt there are atleast a few who can argue with valid points rather than usual my di*k is bigger than urs attitude.

Now heres what would I like to say,
1.Ur accepting the fact that BD is poor country is well appreciated and neither would I run away from the fact that almost 30% of Indian population is under poverty line although our economy as a whole is OK...Its important to note that we should be accepting the reality since there is no harm in it and accordingly make sure that we learn and improve over it in shortest possible time..

2.If I were a businessman I would never mind whom I do business with as long as I profit and that too in a legitimate manner..History and other political reasons are secondary or negligible, cause we live in present and work towards future...So in a way what I want to say is BD would decide for itself it has profit or not...the way I see it, I would say a market of more than a billion provides tremendous scope...talk of the bickering and different set of rules at times, then I would like u to compare the situation between India-US and realize its no different than India-BD...being a defense forum u must hv come across such attitude from US/Russia by now towards India or the most recent climate issue...So its a common practice, but the important point is the extent to which such bickering is acceptable which has to be decided by the gov. which we all vote for and its negotiation skills...Blaming India/US is not an answer to our problems,these are just deviations..the answer lies with the home govt.

Look when Indians talk about India / Bangladesh friendship, it seems most of the time in the context of, how India helped in our independence and we therefore have to be forever grateful to them or how they are giving us this line of credit and its made to sound like aid to Bangladesh, when it’s just standard business practice (we get same when buying goods and service from other countries/world bank).

Nothing wrong in what u say but the point to note is India is willing improve business relations(credit is just a small part of it)....If I were u I would check does it help us in some way or the other and if the answer is yes u should not be concerned how much India profits...
The most u can do come to terms on sharing a part of it but again its down to negotiations(govt)..

Just an example of what I mean, I live here in the UK and work for a company where they have a large Indian work force (they are on contract from an Indian company, supporting us), they mostly talk to each other in Hindi, and so I also spoke to them in Hindi (note a lot of Bangladeshis are fluent in Hindi, blame Bollywood for that). Anyway they never asked me where I was from; eventually the topic of Bangladesh came up at lunch, and you would not believe the stuff they were saying (I won’t repeat it here), it was verging on the racist. You should have seen their faces when I told them where I was from, funny how quickly they change their tune!

I won't deny/argue on the incident above but would like to give my own example...when I first came on this forum I had presumed that Indian-BDians would be up in ams together countering Pak members since we have fought and won a war with mutual support but what I find is seriously insipid stuff...to quote one of the post, one member from BD went to extent that WB should be overtaken by force and all Hindus annihilated....to top it he got a few thanks from other members...now tell me, am not I in the same situation as urs ???

Hope you understand what I am getting at, I’m not anti Indian, just pro Bangladeshi, if you want to win our trust, talk to us on an equal basis and don't try to sound like you’re preaching, just remember we are an INDEPENDENT sovereign country, with our own national interest which may often not coincide with yours.

That applies to ur countrymen too..."we can't clap with one hand we need two"....No one should preach neither should any1 cry foul and drag the other unnecessarily in its own woes or internal decisions...(last I read India was held responsible for MYNR-BD standoff or the BDR-Govt standoff in an article) cause it leads to provocation.
to cite an example just read the thread name!! Isnt it provocative for members on both sides??And even if its true, who's is the culprit?? Isn't it the govt. that tackles such issues?? why blame others for ones own impotency?
PS. I am not in support if wats said is true, only trying to look at it with another angle..

 

[damiendehorn]

Hi thebraveheart, one thing my parents taught me is never make claim that you can’t backup, and let others underestimate you. So I say things I know (or at least to the best of my knowledge), and if there is anything I don’t know I learn first or I keep quite (unlike a few people in this forum on both sides).

I am not sure what to make from your post, whether you agree with my statements (if so just skip points 1-4)or there are some points that you think are wrong/weak, if so please let me know.

1. You state that you appreciate me accepting that BD is a poor country, and then you continue to say almost 30% of Indians are under poverty and your economy as a whole is OK. Are you implying that there are fewer poor people proportionally in India and that BD economy is not doing well (both of which may or may not be true), IMHO this look suspiciously like “my di*k is bigger than urs attitude”.

2. You highlighted sections of my comment (selective highlighting is never a good idea as it removes them from the full context they were written unless it is your intent to rebut them or concur with their conclusions). So which is it?

3. I have always said, I will trade with any country, (except Israel as we do not diplomatically recognize them) including India, china, Pakistan etc, provided it is in our interest, you need to read all my posts just to check.

4. I have stated many times, we do not know yet the FULL details of the credit terms (different figures are being bandied about), so until we do it should be viewed as any commercial credit offer (if viable and competitive to credit term offered elsewhere accept it if not reject it SIMPLE).

5. As for the bit about WB overtaken and Hindus annihilated, that just sounds like pot smoking moron similar to what we constantly hear from some extremist RSS/Shiv Sena doing the same to BD. They talk a lot, but when you confront them, they just turn out to be cowards. My girl and I (she’s Punjabi Hindu by the way) had a great laugh at their stupidity thanks.

6. Finally “I had presumed that Indian-BDians would be up in ams together countering Pak” ah this where you made an assumption, that we would automatically side with India because of what happened 4 decades ago. Remember you said ”cause we live in present and work towards future” this also applies to Pakistan, it is not for us to side with one against the other but to look after “OUR OWN INTERESTS”.

Now for those people who keep referring to BD disappearing underwater, please provide data to confirm, as much as I know even in a worst case scenario where both caps and the glaciers were to melt, the sea level would raise approx 1.78 meters leaving 22% of Bangladesh in danger (not the whole of BD). Nature does not respect political boundaries either, meaning low land areas of India would also be in danger including large parts of WB (here is a link to more info for those geeks interested Current sea level rise - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). Before you mention flooding, remember this is not the result of ocean rise, but rather due silting of the river beds (that’s what happens when you cut down the mangroves on the water's edge/banks and don’t dredge rivers).

 

[TheBraveHeart]

Hi thebraveheart, one thing my parents taught me is never make claim that you can’t backup, and let others underestimate you. So I say things I know (or at least to the best of my knowledge), and if there is anything I don’t know I learn first or I keep quite (unlike a few people in this forum on both sides).

Hey, although I do get ur point and believe in it too,I don't find its relevance to my post cause I haven't made any claims.(do read again if in doubt)

I am not sure what to make from your post, whether you agree with my statements (if so just skip points 1-4)or there are some points that you think are wrong/weak, if so please let me know.

As I mentioned earlier, I found some good arguments on your side and I do agree with most of them but not in entirety or with a difference(strong/ weak doesn't matter, cause I am more interested in an healthy discussion rather than proving them wrong/correct)

1. You state that you appreciate me accepting that BD is a poor country, and then you continue to say almost 30% of Indians are under poverty and your economy as a whole is OK. Are you implying that there are fewer poor people proportionally in India and that BD economy is not doing well (both of which may or may not be true), IMHO this look suspiciously like “my di*k is bigger than urs attitude”.

Please do read again my post; I have never written about proportionality and said BD economy is not doing well neither did I say India's economy is doing well. What I simply said was that both our countries in a way or other are poor and we need accept it, work on it & move forward.

2. You highlighted sections of my comment (selective highlighting is never a good idea as it removes them from the full context they were written unless it is your intent to rebut them or concur with their conclusions). So which is it?

Friend, arguments need not always be concurred/rebuked with ;sometimes u agree with them but not the reasoning behind it.
My only intention was to say that its your gov. which has the rights to take decisions and it doesn't matter what Indian gov. intentions are as long as ur gov. works for the benefit of BD people....So in my opinion if there is any one to blame in the first place, its ur own gov.

3. I have always said, I will trade with any country, (except Israel as we do not diplomatically recognize them) including India, china, Pakistan etc, provided it is in our interest, you need to read all my posts just to check.

4. I have stated many times, we do not know yet the FULL details of the credit terms (different figures are being bandied about), so until we do it should be viewed as any commercial credit offer (if viable and competitive to credit term offered elsewhere accept it if not reject it SIMPLE).

Agree with u completely on this..(I had replied only to the quoted post...)

5. As for the bit about WB overtaken and Hindus annihilated, that just sounds like pot smoking moron similar to what we constantly hear from some extremist RSS/Shiv Sena doing the same to BD. They talk a lot, but when you confront them, they just turn out to be cowards. My girl and I (she’s Punjabi Hindu by the way) had a great laugh at their stupidity thanks.

So I believe, u do agree that there is hawkish attitude on both sides and Indians aren't the only ones responsible for bilateral misunderstandings as your earlier post seemed to imply .

6. Finally “I had presumed that Indian-BDians would be up in ams together countering Pak” ah this where you made an assumption, that we would automatically side with India because of what happened 4 decades ago. Remember you said ”cause we live in present and work towards future” this also applies to Pakistan, it is not for us to side with one against the other but to look after “OUR OWN INTERESTS”.

what else did I mean? I accepted that my presumption was wrong!!

Now for those people who keep referring to BD disappearing underwater, please provide data to confirm, as much as I know even in a worst case scenario where both caps and the glaciers were to melt, the sea level would raise approx 1.78 meters leaving 22% of Bangladesh in danger (not the whole of BD). Nature does not respect political boundaries either, meaning low land areas of India would also be in danger including large parts of WB (here is a link to more info for those geeks interested Current sea level rise - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). Before you mention flooding, remember this is not the result of ocean rise, but rather due silting of the river beds (that’s what happens when you cut down the mangroves on the water's edge/banks and don’t dredge rivers).

Please let me know the relevance if any of the quoted part to my post...

 

[eastwatch]

Skyscrapers that were built by the chinese and foreign MNC's for you? Is that what you are talkin about? The only thing u see when you type dhaka in google is a bunch of ancient concrete buildings surrounded by the most pathetic slums one can imagine. And roads , please dont rant about them. The roads in the most underdeveloped parts in india are better than roads in your Dhaka , which is modern by your standards.
I will definetely visit dhaka. Not now. But in around 10-15 years , yeah. It will look way better when it's under water than it looks now.

Do not become so jealous of our country. We will go above India someday, remember that.

 

[eastwatch]

Didn't we help Bangladeshi's to gain their independence?

Aren't they sneaking across our border to steal our resource?

@inferiority of B'Deshis
No, they're not inferiour to us. But they set a stage to show off our slowly picked up military strength

Try to see the other side. In the 1971 war we have fought the Pakistani army and sacrificed lakhs of lives, then you came to quicken the fall of Pak army. In that process 1300 of your troops lost lives.

But, in that process we gave you the only win, do not forget that. You people are so miserable that you have stolen the machines of many of our jute mills after the warand now you guys are stealing our land, water and even our fish from us. Machli Chor, isn't it you are?

Note that we do not regard ourselves as inferior to any nation. We do not even count India in that respect. But, do not steal our assets.

 

[su-47]

Skyscrapers that were built by the chinese and foreign MNC's for you? Is that what you are talkin about? The only thing u see when you type dhaka in google is a bunch of ancient concrete buildings surrounded by the most pathetic slums one can imagine. And roads , please dont rant about them. The roads in the most underdeveloped parts in india are better than roads in your Dhaka , which is modern by your standards.
I will definetely visit dhaka. Not now. But in around 10-15 years , yeah. It will look way better when it's under water than it looks now.

The thread was just starting to go in the right direction and now this Then people wonder why some Bangladeshis hate Indians!

Seriously dude, if u don't have anything constructive to post, just shut up. If you want to prove a point do so by posting facts and counter-arguments, not flamebait. Don't ruin the thread for others.

 

[eastwatch]

Skyscrapers that were built by the chinese and foreign MNC's for you? Is that what you are talkin about? The only thing u see when you type dhaka in google is a bunch of ancient concrete buildings surrounded by the most pathetic slums one can imagine. And roads , please dont rant about them. The roads in the most underdeveloped parts in india are better than roads in your Dhaka , which is modern by your standards.
I will definetely visit dhaka. Not now. But in around 10-15 years , yeah. It will look way better when it's under water than it looks now.

Where do you find Chinese in BD? And where did you get this top secret news that the Chinese are building our skyscrappers? Whatever it may be, come see and appreciate the beauties of our high rises. You may need these same Chinese to build a few beautiful buildings to hide your slums in Bombay and Delhi.

 

[rubyjackass]

Why not help yourself???? Why you are so worried about Bengali trolls.. You pathetic.

Please do not take trolls seriously. No rants here can change the relation between India and BD. But the bitterness people like you unnecessarily get into can. Just keep in mind that they do not represent any official Indian view, not even the majority's view.

“In time we hate that which we often fear.” -Shakespeare

Just don't be overly afraaid of Indian influence. Yes its there but not to the extent of inspiring alarm. After all it was credit. Despite the depth of Indian pockets it cannot convince its people of free grant to BD, they too are limited by their weakness.

The more Indian government is trying to make BDs feel secure, the more the conspiracy's depth gets. And the cycle continues.

 

[damiendehorn]

Ramu, su47, thebraveheart thank you for an interesting debate (if I missed anyone out I apologise), it’s good when intelligent people can have a civil discussion. I will try to summarise the points we agree on and those we differ on when I get a little bit of time.

Thebraveheart the last paragraph, if you read the beginning was not directed at you but rather, to the person in this thread trying to derail it.

Eastwatch, let’s not allow anyone to provoke us into an unnecessary slanging match about which country is better, I have many friends in Bombay and Delhi, both are beautiful cities in their own right and like any major cities they have their problems (just as Dhaka has). Let’s take the high road, have pride in who we are and where we are from. We do not need to explain anything to anyone.

Well we are off for a few days, hope to catch-up with you all latter, take care and debate away.

 

[sarthak]

Do not become so jealous of our country. We will go above India someday, remember that.

Well, since you say you , i'm inclined to trust you.
However sir, scientific studies indicate that bangladesh is going down around 0.5-1cm every year due to sea level rise

 

[asq]

I have spent 1 hour reading all the posts and have concluded that some Indians think that all Bangldeshis should be thanking them by bowing to their knees for the freedom.

India did not go in East Pakistan to help Bangledeshis and create bangladesh, they went in to break Pakistan and to try and lesson its power, they know that they did it for their interests, Now these Indians are trying to claim that they helped Bangladesh. Far from it, they helped themselves.

A disinformation of milaniun, claiming it as help is not true, it was fight to beak Pakistan's half.

Somehow breakup gave Pakistan Nucleaar weapons, rockets, jets and tank building abilities, before we were dependant on foriegner to help us with all of these things.

So it has worked wonders for Pakistan and what is next, only Allah knows better, but I am sure it will continue to be good for those who have higher moral grounds and ethics.

 

[Honor]

Why is India so mistrusted?

 

[leonblack08]

Well, since you say you , i'm inclined to trust you.
However sir, scientific studies indicate that bangladesh is going down around 0.5-1cm every year due to sea level rise

Millions will be displaced,and you can't stop laughing...That shows your pathetic and sick mentality.

And For your information,if Bangladesh goes down,so will many parts of India.Now laugh about that.

To educate you further,remember that Holland is still surviving,despite being under sea level.Bangladesh is also gaining land every year through formation of silt.

That's enough information for your "over-fertilized" brain.