Indian Navy to induct a nuclear submarine by 2009

[ejaz007]

I think time has come to change the role of Pakistan Navy. It needs to have a capability to go beyond Pakistan’s border to protect its interests. Things have changed a lot during the previous 5 to 7 years and navy needs to adapt to these changed global environment.

Also Pakistan’s economy is growing and with it its trade through sea is growing. Affording a nuclear submarine now is not a problem. Pakistan’s GDP has grown from 45 billion USD to around 140 billion USD. Foreign currency reserves have gone up from 300 million USD in 1999 to around 16.3 billion USD today. Adequate funds shall be available once a decision is made to have a nuclear submarine.

I have a feeling we shall soon be hearing about this from PN.

 

[courageneverdies]

Indeed, we have to be a big economy before inducting such kind of expensive weapons in our forces. Not 10th but not below 20th as well. We have to be in first 20 most strong economies before we become the indestructable.

Over n out Sire.

 

[bhangra12345]

You need to be the 10th biggest economy in order to have or support nuclear powered submarine? Another big joke.

I assume you are talking of nuclear propelled.
AFWW :: Examples of War Expenses

One U.S. Nuclear Submarine - $ 1.6 billion. The U.S., in 2004, has fifty of these submarines.

That is the cost of acquisition. Now setting up and maintaining them will be additional 20% (my rough guess), i.e. around .3 billion$.
For maintaining constantly atleast one on the sea, three will be required. So 4.5billion$ for acquisition and around 1 billion dollars for maintanence.
Imagine acquisition over 4 years.


So remember it is a huge expense. A normal country will have around 3-4% of gdp for defence. In that especially for Pakistan, army and airforce take precedence, which leaves around 0.5% of gdp (a higher estimate). If we take 40% (which actually means you have sacrificed even a token amount of surface and aireal resistance) of that amount which PN can spend on these

0.2% = 1 billion
100% = 1 * 100 * 5= 500 billion

So yes, Pakistan is in a stage where it can just afford ONE nuclear submarine constantly at the expense of its sacrifice of surface and everything else(orions and all). In my personal opinion, the downside is higher and at its present state of economy should not buy one.

 

[IceCold]

I assume you are talking of nuclear propelled.
AFWW :: Examples of War Expenses


That is the cost of acquisition. Now setting up and maintaining them will be additional 20% (my rough guess), i.e. around .3 billion$.
For maintaining constantly atleast one on the sea, three will be required. So 4.5billion$ for acquisition and around 1 billion dollars for maintanence.
Imagine acquisition over 4 years.


So remember it is a huge expense. A normal country will have around 3-4% of gdp for defence. In that especially for Pakistan, army and airforce take precedence, which leaves around 0.5% of gdp (a higher estimate). If we take 40% (which actually means you have sacrificed even a token amount of surface and aireal resistance) of that amount which PN can spend on these

0.2% = 1 billion
100% = 1 * 100 * 5= 500 billion

So yes, Pakistan is in a stage where it can just afford ONE nuclear submarine constantly at the expense of its sacrifice of surface and everything else(orions and all). In my personal opinion, the downside is higher and at its present state of economy should not buy one.

Quite a analysis you presumed but you see thats not the case. Whenever pakistan wants to acquire something for her armforces, additional funds are provided for that purpose. For instance PAF wanted to induct new jets in her inventory and so more funds were provided, same is the case with navy. If navy wants to induct something for instance a nuclear sub, additional funds other then what is already allocated for the defence budjet will be provided. And obiviously when something is acquired, it means its maintainence is also kept in mind.

 

[Flintlock]

india is 10th biggest economy in world but pak is not so india can afford any such kind of system

Can you elaborate?

 

[EagleEyes]

I assume you are talking of nuclear propelled.
AFWW :: Examples of War Expenses


That is the cost of acquisition. Now setting up and maintaining them will be additional 20% (my rough guess), i.e. around .3 billion$.
For maintaining constantly atleast one on the sea, three will be required. So 4.5billion$ for acquisition and around 1 billion dollars for maintanence.
Imagine acquisition over 4 years.


So remember it is a huge expense. A normal country will have around 3-4% of gdp for defence. In that especially for Pakistan, army and airforce take precedence, which leaves around 0.5% of gdp (a higher estimate). If we take 40% (which actually means you have sacrificed even a token amount of surface and aireal resistance) of that amount which PN can spend on these

0.2% = 1 billion
100% = 1 * 100 * 5= 500 billion

So yes, Pakistan is in a stage where it can just afford ONE nuclear submarine constantly at the expense of its sacrifice of surface and everything else(orions and all). In my personal opinion, the downside is higher and at its present state of economy should not buy one.

Do you know how much it costs for the Chinese?

 

[ejaz007]

At the moment Pakistan Navy is being given precedence over the army and the air force. The reason is that the other two arms of the forces have been buying equipment for quite some time. Army is in good shape and air forces beginning from 2008 shall be inducting new aircrafts for which funds have already been allocated. Therefore, it leaves navy as the only arm needing funds. Beginning 2006 navy has been looking at different weapon systems namely Chinese Frigates, French/German submarines and some other sources for patrol boats etc. I have not mentioned US equipment since it is coming courtesy US grants/aid. I believe its navy’s turn to begin modernization.

Extra funds shall be made available. It is also not necessary that nuclear submarine be inducted right away. It might be inducted in a couple of year time from now but at-least process should begin.

 

[lv2zam]

You don't need a nuc submarine to be a blue water navy. The USA, Germany and Japan Navies were Blue water navy's in WWII on diesel boats.

 

[ahussains]

Well Pakistan is not intrested in the Nuclear powerd submarines i think as webby say the job will be easily done by U214 or Agusta easily by firing Babar cruse missile or any other equalent type ?

 

[firefight]

With the Indian Missile shield we need a submarine more than ever.
How can we strike back if our land capability is paralyzed, we have to
strike by water,even striking by Air is not reliable with their air defences
we MUST get a submarine no matter what it costs!!!!!! Chinese maybe
the only ones who maybe helpful in this matter but we have to get on
this fast it means a lot of training,maintenace and cost but we are
starting to fall dangerously behind.

 

[KENT]

With the Indian Missile shield we need a submarine more than ever.
How can we strike back if our land capability is paralyzed, we have to
strike by water,even striking by Air is not reliable with their air defences
we MUST get a submarine no matter what it costs!!!!!! Chinese maybe
the only ones who maybe helpful in this matter but we have to get on
this fast it means a lot of training,maintenace and cost but we are
starting to fall dangerously behind.

Man, according to your reasoning if Indian missile shield is applicable to missile launch from Land and Air launch platform, then how does same can't be applicable to submarine launch missile?

 

[Proud to be Pakistani]

With the Indian Missile shield we need a submarine more than ever.
How can we strike back if our land capability is paralyzed, we have to
strike by water,even striking by Air is not reliable with their air defences
we MUST get a submarine no matter what it costs!!!!!! Chinese maybe
the only ones who maybe helpful in this matter but we have to get on
this fast it means a lot of training,maintenace and cost but we are
starting to fall dangerously behind.

Nuclear Submarine is required for long endurances and motives, as for Pakistan Agosta 90B has an endurance of 68 days which is not less by any means. With Babur on it you need not to worry for a Nuclear Sub. Only edge of Nuclear Subs is endurance and nothing else. Agosta class with MESMA AIP are one of the quitest submarines around.

As for defence shield, It is a shield with holes........... Donot burden your mind with thoughts that India is defended completely with this hoka poka...


When the time comes we shall see...

 

[KENT]

Nuclear Submarine is required for long endurances and motives, as for Pakistan Agosta 90B has an endurance of 68 days which is not less by any means. With Babur on it you need not to worry for a Nuclear Sub. Only edge of Nuclear Subs is endurance and nothing else. Agosta class with MESMA AIP are one of the quitest submarines around.

As for defence shield, It is a shield with holes........... Donot burden your mind with thoughts that India is defended completely with this hoka poka...


When the time comes we shall see...

Nucler submarines are much more then just endurance, reduction in noise and let the babur get properly configured on Agosta.

regarding defence shield, seems to have shaken with few initial test, definetly it is hoka poka, let it get evolve in few more years, then it will be mayhem for ballastic missile.

 

[Proud to be Pakistani]

Nucler submarines are much more then just endurance, reduction in noise and let the babur get properly configured on Agosta.

regarding defence shield, seems to have shaken with few initial test, definetly it is hoka poka, let it get evolve in few more years, then it will be mayhem for ballastic missile.

US doesn't say this with PAC, AGEIS and THAAD but India oooooooooh ..

Rest assured my friend that Agosta is quiter than the Nuclear sub you know of.

 

[Vinod2070]

The nuclear submarine is not Pakistan specific, I would guess.