Indian Army tender procurement of more than 40,000 carbines

[Abhishek_]

4. Baretta CX4 Storm Carbine

i've shot the cx 4 semi. nice weapon

 

[Jaadugar]

why look anywhere else simply go for Zitaara

 

[God of Death]

Look mate,no offenses..but would you carry a INSAS and go to a battle when you know it is a terrible rifle?

The Indian Army took the first step and armed all of its troops with INSAS and the result is in front of everyone who has used an INSAS or knows anyone who has used it.The thing is that it hasnt still being improved and the INSAS LMG is just a piece of crap.Whoever made that LMG i am 1000% sure doesnt know the need of an LMG in a battle.

INSAS not only gets jammed but believe me on this that i have heard soldiers saying that they shot at a terrorist with their INSAS and the terrorist got up and fired back at them...what would you call it now?I think its the most useless weapon in the Indian army..the SLR was a much better weapon than this and AK is incomparable inspite of being decadeds old.

If cheap is the thing then i would say AKs are the best.But we are missing a point here..its easy to sit in our AC bedrooms and talk about indigenisation but we are loosing good men in the battlefield who give their all to serve the nation.They deserve better and i am not asking for cool uniforms and gear..just 3 things...a good rifle,a good helmet and a good bulletproof..thatsit.

Those of them designing the product sitting in big cities if cant do their work properly should not blame the Army for not choosing their product..its like the student blaming the teacher for failing in an exam where it was his fault.

Suggest people here to interact with the army guys and know the truth..i am sure they are friendly and would share their experiences with those who think it is a very good weapon.

I have asked this to a Major of Indian Army he was saying that its for the army not for para military forces against terrorists.

His argument was that a INSAS wounds a enemy troop but not kill him instantly and then 1-2 of his fellow troops (enemy troops) will get busy in taking care of him.

By using INSAS we can tie up their 2-3 troops.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

I have asked this to a Major of Indian Army he was saying that its for the army not for para military forces against terrorists.

His argument was that a INSAS wounds a enemy troop but not kill him instantly and then 1-2 of his fellow troops (enemy troops) will get busy in taking care of him.

By using INSAS we can tie up their 2-3 troops.

Yaa sure man...hit one enemy soldier..make him wounded and wait for him to fire at you back with his AK and get your body drilled out...but you know what..congrats we made the enemy busy!

 

[Tshering22]

You don't do flamebaiting from what I've seen.

About why it doesn't support its indigenous... Idk..

And it's not like they weren't doing anything either.

With the experience of INSAS, they branched out.

Submachine gun - Carbine

Submachine gun

INSAS Carbine

The only solution to indigenization in Army is that Indian Army should be banned from buying anything foreign for next 15 years. Only then it is possible.

 

[deckingraj]

Yes i have heard about this logic but i dont agree with it because whoever thinks like that is clearly thinking of the enemy as cowards who wont fight back after getting hit which is not the case.We got brave people all around the world and this logic clearly puts our soldiers in risk coz we may injure them...but they will surely kill us!

Well the argument can go both ways..I am not necessarily in favor of the argument but for sure it has nothing to do with enemy being coward...Look there is a big difference b/w terrorits and a soldier...A soldier life is very important and all attempts are made to save it...In short if a fellow soldier has been hit by a bullet then it is more likely that he will be send back to the camp for medical attention...

Anyhow i am not supporting INSAS..I have my objections to foreign equipments...US official defense budget is $600 Billion and our's is just $35-40 billion.....However if you look at the economic activity due to nature of the spending US is far better placed then us...reason being most of the money spent stays in their system...However we are loosing a lot of reserves just because we tend to buy everything...I mean even a freaking rifle and bullets!!!

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Well the argument can go both ways..I am not necessarily in favor of the argument but for sure it has nothing to do with enemy being coward...Look there is a big difference b/w terrorits and a soldier...A soldier life is very important and all attempts are made to save it...In short if a fellow soldier has been hit by a bullet then it is more likely that he will be send back to the camp for medical attention...

Anyhow i am not supporting INSAS..I have my objections to foreign equipments...US official defense budget is $600 Billion and our's is just $35-40 billion.....However if you look at the economic activity due to nature of the spending US is far better placed then us...reason being most of the money spent stays in their system...However we are loosing a lot of reserves just because we tend to buy everything...I mean even a freaking rifle and bullets!!!

I agree with you and to be honest i also would love to see more "made in India" products in the Army but i believe the manufacturers are at fault here and we cant really blame the Army here.

13-14 years after designing the product what have they done to rectify the problem?

 

[deckingraj]

I agree with you and to be honest i also would love to see more "made in India" products in the Army but i believe the manufacturers are at fault here and we cant really blame the Army here.

13-14 years after designing the product what have they done to rectify the problem?

Look we all know Arjun saga...I am not justifying the freaking attitude of DRDO and likes but it seems that our Army has serious allergy to desi products...This is not going to help and we will never be able to become self-sufficient...One has to understand that it will take time before our industry matures...and we all know that one learn by experience...We need to give our industry a fair chance...

 

[Omega007]

In my openion,the IA should stick to the INSAS AR with recommending 4 modifications-
1.Adapt the 30 round mags of INSAS LMG for the AR as standard.
2.Fit the UBGL to every single piece.
3.Paint them all black.
4.Fit them with the OFB manufactured holographic red-dot sight.
That way,INSAS AR can be brought on per with the likes of Tavor TAR 21,FN SCAR,M 16A4 etc.Practically,there is no argent need to discard the INSAS ARs from Army service.WRT accuracy and range,INSAS is 2nd to no assault rifle chambered for 5.56X45mm NATO ammo.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Look we all know Arjun saga...I am not justifying the freaking attitude of DRDO and likes but it seems that our Army has serious allergy to desi products...This is not going to help and we will never be able to become self-sufficient...One has to understand that it will take time before our industry matures...and we all know that one learn by experience...We need to give our industry a fair chance...

I fully support the induction of more Arjuns in the Army and i personally believe it has to do with corruption at some stage(thats my personal opinion).

And because of that i dont want the soldiers to suffer because Indian Army is fighting a war everyday in Kashmir and North-East.What i dont like about the DRDO is that they could have atleast corrected the problems..what hurts is that the problems still exist.When they can make world class products like LCH,ALH then why cant they make a decent rifle?...the answer is no one cares about the soldiers.

 

[deckingraj]

I fully support the induction of more Arjuns in the Army and i personally believe it has to do with corruption at some stage(thats my personal opinion).

And because of that i dont want the soldiers to suffer because Indian Army is fighting a war everyday in Kashmir and North-East.What i dont like about the DRDO is that they could have atleast corrected the problems..what hurts is that the problems still exist.When they can make world class products like LCH,ALH then why cant they make a decent rifle?...the answer is no one cares about the soldiers.

Look as already clarified that INSAS were not meant for counter-insurgency operations. We have already rectified the problem and IA is using AK-47 there....As far as soldier life is concerned then we as a nation sucks in that department...I used to think that it must be today's generation but after watching the flick "Paan Singh Tomar" i got to know that the problem is deep down and is there from quiet sometime...so i am with you on that...No one cares about the foot soldier as such...

 

[Omega007]

Well,AK is good in close and medium ranges (upto 300 meter) but not good at longer distances.Traelling at a mussel vellocity of 920-930 meter/sec when fired from a 18.6 inches barreled INSAS AR,an enhanced performance SS 109 5.56X45mm NATO round can punch through 4mm of standard NATO mild steel plate at upto 650 meter and can shrade level 3+ BPJs at 300-350 meter-quite a performance huh??Same can't be told about AK variants.

 

[Omega007]

Home steers clear of AK-47 row

Can you even read you idiot. . . . . . . . .I seriously doubt that you can!!In my post I had clearly mentioned 5.56 NATO chambered AR-from which day,AK 47 became chambered for that??

 

[Omega007]

There was no need for INSAS in the first place. We could have easily produced the AK series in India considering our close relationship with USSR/ Russia. Its frustrating that even now AK is not made in India but we have to import from former Soviet republics.

Oh we have another 'EXPERT' here!!I'll not comment on your 'Well Researched and EXPERT' openion but would like to tell you some thing.

It's that,atleast get your facts right before giving out your openion.Who told you that we do not produce any AK variant here in India??Had you checked the OFB website for once before start blabbering,you could've got know about the 'A 7' rifle-the Indian AKM clone.

Besides,there is another one- TAR (Trichi Assault Rifle).

 

[harpoon]

Oh we have another 'EXPERT' here!!I'll not comment on your 'Well Researched and EXPERT' openion but would like to tell you some thing.

It's that,atleast get your facts right before giving out your openion.Who told you that we do not produce any AK variant here in India??Had you checked the OFB website for once before start blabbering,you could've got know about the 'A 7' rifle-the Indian AKM clone.

Besides,there is another one- TAR (Trichi Assault Rifle).

Then why we are still importing AKs from former Soviet republics.