India & Pakistan Ceasefire Violations

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Since we only have the GoI, IA statement so far, thank no one as of yet. Some of the previous 'firing' incidents blatantly exposed the IA through their contradicting statements.

Could be a stunt by the IA to deflect from the tensions in Kashmir.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Why is this happening? It is an instance of 'calibrated mischief' by the Pakistani army brass to 'reassert its power', say military intelligence officials.

"The Pakistani army wants to dispel any impression that its authority has been weakened after the restoration of democracy," said a senior army officer.

Yeah right - you guys need to get some 'intelligence analysts" who don't spew such infantile 'theories'.

But then again, maybe they know exactly what they are doing, gotta come up with some sort of justification for vilifying Pakistan, no matter how weak it is.

Anything really 'sophisticated' about these LoC firings?

 

[Flintlock]

Yeah right - you guys need to get some 'intelligence analysts" who don't spew such infantile 'theories'.

But then again, maybe they know exactly what they are doing, gotta come up with some sort of justification for vilifying Pakistan, no matter how weak it is.

Anything really 'sophisticated' about these LoC firings?

Well, I can understand that its rather hard to accept.

But The Pakistani Army is acting of its own accord, as usual, just like the ISI. You guys need to get your act together, frankly.

 

[jaison]

next time this happens i think ia has to take photographs of bullets raining in to present a 'sophisticated' evidence to pakistanbecause if ia shows bullet marks on our side pak says its all fabricated and pa crosses fingers behind them and indicates

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Well, I can understand that its rather hard to accept.

But The Pakistani Army is acting of its own accord, as usual, just like the ISI. You guys need to get your act together, frankly.

It is together - you guys need to get off the 'vilify Pakistan' boat. Its starting to seem like India just has this negative and hateful mindset towards Pakistan that it cannot get around - terrorism in India, blame the ISI. Asinine policies that lead to unrest in Kashmir, lets see how we can figure out an angle to blame Pakistan for this somehow.

Its really quite pathetic.

Again, nothing so amply illustrated the lies over the ceasefire incidents than the conflicting statements issued by the IA, and now this junk to somehow involve Pakistan in the unrest. The audiences in India must be fed their propaganda and daily dose of hatred towards Pakistan.

 

[GHATAK]

Well, I can understand that its rather hard to accept.

But The Pakistani Army is acting of its own accord, as usual, just like the ISI. You guys need to get your act together, frankly.

Exactly!!!!!!!!!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

next time this happens i think ia has to take photographs of bullets raining in to present a 'sophisticated' evidence to pakistanbecause if ia shows bullet marks on our side pak says its all fabricated and pa crosses fingers behind them and indicates

Ahh but you left your guns behind after firing in fear at your own side of the border. The ISPR indicated that it would be bringing that evidence up during the flag meet.

 

[GHATAK]

It is together - you guys need to get off the 'vilify Pakistan' boat. Its starting to seem like India just has this negative and hateful mindset towards Pakistan that it cannot get around - terrorism in India, blame the ISI. Asinine policies that lead to unrest in Kashmir, lets see how we can figure out an angle to blame Pakistan for this somehow.

Its really quite pathetic really.

Again, nothing so amply illustrated the lies over the ceasefire incidents than the conflicting statements issued by the IA, and now this junk to somehow involve Pakistan in the unrest. The audiences in India must be fed their propaganda and daily dose of hatred towards Pakistan.

What is togather ??

Who is the real power of Pakistan ? Nawaz ? Zardari ? or PM ? or Mushraf ?

The fact is - most pakistani's are not sure who is in charge!!!!

And about Kabul, your own Prime Minister has agreed to conduct a probe. So lets wait for the result. Or Did you conduct any other probe ?

One month after the bombing, your PM is not sure and agreed to conduct a probe. What does that mean ?

 

[Flintlock]

It is together - you guys need to get off the 'vilify Pakistan' boat. Its starting to seem like India just has this negative and hateful mindset towards Pakistan that it cannot get around - terrorism in India, blame the ISI. Asinine policies that lead to unrest in Kashmir, lets see how we can figure out an angle to blame Pakistan for this somehow.

Oh please.....its quite clear....Pakistani Army violated ceasefire. You'd obviously want to deny it, but I am not going to argue over it.

The report is correct. And that's that.

Now ask yourselves why your army is firing on our Independence Day.

Its really quite pathetic really.

What's pathetic is the cheap way in which your army is lobbing 'calibrated' mortars across the border to attract attention.

Again, nothing so amply illustrated the lies over the ceasefire incidents than the conflicting statements issued by the IA, and now this junk to somehow involve Pakistan in the unrest. The audiences in India must be fed their propaganda and daily dose of hatred towards Pakistan.

We all know how credible the Pakistani press is (hint: next to zero credibility), so lets just stop comparing.

I'll repeat myself: You guys need to sort out your problems and start following a coherent policy. Its very dangerous if every instrument of state policy follows its own agenda.
Enough articles have been written in the media about this total lack of cooperation in Pakistan, and you've been conveniently dismissing them as "American Propaganda."
When The Kabul blasts happened, you trumpeted the statements from the Americans as proof that ISI was not involved. When the Americans blamed Pakistan, you turned around and claimed that its all a conspiracy to defame the ISI. When does this all end? You cannot keep blaming everything on grand conspiracies. The facts are before you. So is the simplest explanation. Ignore it at your own peril.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

What is togather ??

Who is the real power of Pakistan ? Nawaz ? Zardari ? or PM ? or Mushraf ?

The fact is - most pakistani's are not sure who is in charge!!!!

And about Kabul, your own Prime Minister has agreed to conduct a probe. So lets wait for the result. Or Did you conduct any other probe ?

One month after the bombing, your PM is not sure and agreed to conduct a probe. What does that mean ?

The same argument Malay raised on the other thread, and the same answer. A probe into finding out possible rogues does not automatically signify that the entire institution is compromised.

As to who is in charge, it is pretty obvious it is Zardari, most Pakistanis are not confused about that. Musharraf's powers could only come through the military, and the military under Kiyani has refused to get involved in politics or policy formulation - something recognized by most Pakistani analysts and commentators.

The only point at which the military has acted has been when a flawed decision related to the functioning of a defense institution was made.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Oh please.....its quite clear....Pakistani Army violated ceasefire. You'd obviously want to deny it, but I am not going to argue over it.

The report is correct. And that's that.

The refusal and denial to recognize the absurdity of the IA statements issued after some of those ceasefires is yours - check the LoC violations thread.

Now ask yourselves why your army is firing on our Independence Day.

So says your army, as unrest in Kashmiri increases and the GoI needs to deflect blame onto Pakistan to continue to feed propaganda to the masses.


What's pathetic is the cheap way in which your army is lobbing 'calibrated' mortars across the border to attract attention.

We all know how credible the Pakistani press is (hint: next to zero credibility), so lets just stop comparing.

Pot calling the kettle black.
Most of those statements in the thread were nto from Pakistani sources if I remember correctly.

I'll repeat myself: You guys need to sort out your problems and start following a coherent policy. Its very dangerous if every instrument of state policy follows its own agenda.
Enough articles have been written in the media about this total lack of cooperation in Pakistan, and you've been conveniently dismissing them as "American Propaganda."
When The Kabul blasts happened, you trumpeted the statements from the Americans as proof that ISI was not involved. When the Americans blamed Pakistan, you turned around and claimed that its all a conspiracy to defame the ISI. When does this all end? You cannot keep blaming everything on grand conspiracies. The facts are before you. So is the simplest explanation. Ignore it at your own peril.

And I will repeat myself, India needs to get over its tantrums and continued vilification of Pakistan. It is extremely dangerous for the region that it continues to follow policies of destabilization in Balochistan.

I am not dismissing lack of cooperation (which has a lot of dynamics behind it), I am dismissing institutional support for the taliban - there is a difference between the two.

I said the Americans were trustworthy as long as their own interest were not involved one way or the other - since then it is apparent that the Pakistani and US defense establishments have diverged, and the conveniently leaked sources were a pressure ploy on Gillani. And lets not forget that despite the Pakistani Ambassadors open demand for evidence, if the US had any, no such thing.

And you are one to talk about conspiracies, when the basis behind this thread you started is a 'conspiracy' by Pakistan to take advantage of the unrest caused by the GoI in Kashmir.

 

[Flintlock]

And you are one to talk about conspiracies, when the basis behind this thread you started is a 'conspiracy' by Pakistan to take advantage of the unrest caused by the GoI in Kashmir.

That's not a conspiracy. A conspiracy implies a complex plot which is hatched between a number of improbable partners.

This is just opportunism.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

That's not a conspiracy. A conspiracy implies a complex plot which is hatched between a number of improbable partners.

This is just opportunism.

The arguments against the US, Indian and Afghan governments implies no conspiracy between the three. The US has its own agenda, Karzai has never liked Pakistan, and the less said about India's repeated touretts outbursts the better.

To cross post my response from the Kashmri thread:

As Pakistan has pointed out to Afghanistan, India and the US - if you have evidence, share it - you wouldn't want the perpetrators in the ISI getting away now would you?

And what has been the response?

Nothing. There is no evidence, if there is, why are the people responsible being protected?

 

[jaison]

'This is just opportunism'
exactly.pak politicians are using this to distort indias image on world stage....and i say this is just to deviate pak peoples mind from inflation and other economic problems and also to show pak people that gov is not weak....i say many mangoes in one stone

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

'This is just opportunism'
exactly.pak politicians are using this to distort indias image on world stage....and i say this is just to deviate pak peoples mind from inflation and other economic problems and also to show pak people that gov is not weak....i say many mangoes in one stone

Indeed, similarly the Pakistani ceasefire violations are similarly being trumped up to somehow link Pakistan to the Kashmir instability.

But read the posts in the Kashmir Moving to Pakistan thread for 'civil analysis'. This thread is just jingoism from both sides.