INDIA- HELICOPTER Competitions::News and Discussions

[GORKHALI]

but i still wonder why KAMOV 52 aligator dint entered the race ,anyone have any news about it

 

[sancho]

@sancho :
Do you think that CH-53 is better than CH-46?

For the heavy lift role, yes but would like to see a modern Mi 26 even more.

It is a shame that our aerospace industry is not matured enough to take care of the spares of helicopters..There would be no better option than to have a fleet of Mi-26 with spares being produced in the house..Hope this time Russia provides us enough tech to make us self-sufficient in spares front..This is the least they can do to sweeten the deal..

There was talk about China joining the development of the new Mi 26, I wonder if Russia offers that for us too? Would be great if HAL can take over the maintenance, or maybe even the upgrade with modern avionics and cockpit parts.

What do you think about that possibility Capt.Popeye? Could we counter the serviceability issues like that?

 

[sancho]

but i still wonder why KAMOV 52 aligator dint entered the race ,anyone have any news about it

Possibly the side by side seat config, while the Mi 28 / Apache has tandem seat configs. I also heared it is more expensive than the Mi 28 and needs more maintenance too.

 

[kashith]

APACHE AH -64 D BLOCK 3 VS MI 28NE HAVOC

MI-28 NE HAVOC

Specifications

Crew 2 - With Pilot seated above and behind Gunner
Engines 2× Klimov TV3-117VMA 1,950 horsepower
Dimensions L - 17.01 m
W (rotor span) - 17.20 m
H - 3.82 m
Weights 5,910 kg (empty)
11500 kg (max takeoff)
Max Speed 324 kph
Range 460 km
Armament 30 mm NPPU-28 (300 rounds)
80mm/130mm unguided rockets
up to 16 AT-6 anti-tank missiles
various cannon/machine gun pods
AA-11/ SA-16 air-to-air missiles
Avionics FLIR
Microwave Radar
Narrow-field Video
Laser Designator
Infra-red jammers
Radar warning receivers
Laser warning receivers


APACHE AH-64D BLOCK 3

Specifications

Accommodation: Crew 2

Guns: Main Gun Caliber 30 mm

Dimensions: Height 5.0 m, Length 17.7 m, Main Rotor Diameter 14.6 m, Width 5.2 m

Weights: Max Weight 7,530 kg (16,601 lb)

Performance: Endurance 3 hours, Max Range 483 km (261 nm), Top Speed 74 mps (265 kph)

Power: Power 3,780 shp

Other: Main Rotor Blades 4, Number of Engines 2

ARMAMENT
Guided Missiles:
AGM-114A Hellfire (16)
AGM-114B Hellfire (16)
AGM-114C Hellfire (16)
AGM-114F Hellfire (16)
AGM-114K Hellfire II (16)
AGM-114L Longbow Hellfire (16)
AGM-114R Hellfire II (16)

SAM & ABM Missiles:
FIM-92 Stinger (4)
FIM-92 Stinger-RMP (4)

Power plant:
T700-GE-701D (2)

Sensors & Communications:
AN/APG-78
AN/APR-48A RFI
Arrowhead

Guns & Missile Launchers:
M230 Chain Gun
M299 (4)

Protection Systems:
AN/ALQ-136
AN/ALQ-211 SIRFC
DASS

I am not sure why everyone favors Apache.. Havoc flies longer, faster and has more armament as well as armor..


May be people have seen too many discovery channel documentaries

 

[jha]

I am not sure why everyone favors Apache.. Havoc flies longer, faster and has more armament as well as armor..


May be people have seen too many discovery channel documentaries

Its the whole package for which APACHE is preferred..Attack helicopter is much more than armament..and anyhow this is mainly for showpiece..Our workhorse will be LCH..

 

[kashith]

Its the whole package for which APACHE is preferred..Attack helicopter is much more than armament..and anyhow this is mainly for showpiece..Our workhorse will be LCH..

I dont trust the yanks somehow, they will stop special protection suits saying sign CISMOA and other acronym shyt.

And if you want to bring rain from hell i would suggest that havoc eats apache for breakfast.

 

[jha]

I dont trust the yanks somehow, they will stop special protection suits saying sign CISMOA and other acronym shyt.

And if you want to bring rain from hell i would suggest that havoc eats apache for breakfast.

In that case we should go for Super-Hind..

 

[kashith]

In that case we should go for Super-Hind..

Ah the beast.. i dont think many helis or ground forces stand a chance against this beast...

 

[LEO99]

Ah the beast.. i dont think many helis or ground forces stand a chance against this beast...

whats super about it, the exhaust are still exposed (no IR reduction ) .
apache's IR system that fits on its exhaust is still a patent.
russians too came up with there systems but not that effective .
but problem is Americans may not provide you there best system

 

[Kinetic]

Ah the beast.. i dont think many helis or ground forces stand a chance against this beast...

Hind or super Hind are quite old. They had good old times, but their time is almost over. Apache Block 3 is modern and have much more sophisticated sensor suite and self defense systems.

 

[jha]

Hind or super Hind are quite old. They had good old times, but their time is almost over. Apache Block 3 is modern and have much more sophisticated sensor suite and self defense systems.

Yes...Thats why i support AH-64D- Apache Longbow . Only Brutal force is not the ideal solution today.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

For the heavy lift role, yes but would like to see a modern Mi 26 even more.




There was talk about China joining the development of the new Mi 26, I wonder if Russia offers that for us too? Would be great if HAL can take over the maintenance, or maybe even the upgrade with modern avionics and cockpit parts.

What do you think about that possibility Capt.Popeye? Could we counter the serviceability issues like that?

Sancho; i assume that you directed the question to me.
First point about the Sino-Russian bit; Has Russia offered a role to India there or you have assumed that India is interested in joining that as a "third" partner. There is no evidence of that. And with very good reason.
About HAL getting involved in maintenence (actual word is overhaul), you have presupposed that the Russians are willing to let HAL do that-- did they let HAL do that with the earlier Mi-26s?
About HAL getting involved in manufacture (i.e. import substitution/upgrade etc)-- Does it make any sense to set up another facility to provide some/or all parts for a fleet of 12-15 helicopters (One HU worth) ? Try to calculate the per unit component cost for a super-small production run.
If you have some knowledge/ exposure to industry/engineering/manufacturing you will get my drift. Do you think that Bugatti will set up a manufacturing facility for 20 something Veyron cars to be sold in India!

Most of all everything presupposes that the Mi-26 is the best helicopter of choice. You seem to love that helicopter very much; question is--does the IAF share that sentiment?

On a lighter note, not everybody wants to love a sumo wrestler. After all one has to feed and look after one if he keeps one at home.

 

[GORKHALI]

Sikorsky CH-53E Super Stallion

Specifications (CH-53E)

The CH-53E rotor and exhaust assembly in detail
A MH-53E towing the MK105 mine sweeping
General characteristics
Crew: 5: 2 pilots, 1 crew chief/right gunner, 1 left gunner, 1 tail gunner (combat crew)
Capacity: 37 troops (55 with centerline seats installed)
Payload: internal: 30,000 lb or 13,600 kg (external: 32,000 lb or 14,500 kg)
Length: 99 ft 1/2 in (30.2 m)
Rotor diameter: 79 ft (24 m)
Height: 27 ft 9 in (8.46 m)
Disc area: 4,900 ft² (460 m&#178
Empty weight: 33,226 lb (15,071 kg)
Max takeoff weight: 73,500 lb (33,300 kg)
Powerplant: 3× General Electric T64-GE-416/416A turboshaft, 4,380 shp (3,270 kW) each
Rotor systems: 7 blades on main rotor, 4 blades on anti-torque tail rotor
Performance
Maximum speed: 170 knots (196 mph, 315 km/h)
Cruise speed: 150 kt (173 mph, 278 km/h)
Range: 540 nmi (621 mi, 1,000 km)
Ferry range: 990 nmi (1,139 mi, 1,833 km)
Service ceiling: 18,500 ft (5,640 m)
Rate of climb: 2,500 ft/min (13 m/s)
Armament
Guns:
2× .50 BMG (12.7 x 99 mm) window-mounted XM218 machine guns
1× .50 BMG (12.7 x 99 mm) ramp mounted weapons system, GAU-21 (M3M mounted machine gun)
Other: Chaff and flare dispensers


why we not considering this monster in heavy lift competition folks,am really impressed by payload.

 

[kingdurgaking]

Any news about LCH?... It is been quite long we heard any news about it

 

[GORKHALI]

OMG!!kinetic is banned for what ???