India could strike Pakistan with nuclear weapons first to pre-empt attack

[Taimoor Khan]

TSIMOOR...you are really scared of our new policy. As you don't have 2nd strike capability...we don't have. Can someone in this forum enlighten him.

The U.S., UK, France, Russia and most recently China now have nuclear-armed submarines in operation. The 110-meter long Arihant would be harder to detect than India’s nuclear weapons on land and air, giving it a "second-strike" capability to retaliate powerfully against an enemy who managed to destroy the rest of the arsenal.

LOL, you are a perfect specimen of the "gullible Indian" I mentioned in my previous post.

If you are having comprehension issues, let me remind you again. As we speak, you DO NOT have a second strike capability. Having sub is one thing but to mate a nuclear capable missile with it is another thing which till date you haven't demonstrated. While in Pakistan we have already demonstrated our underwater nuke lunch capability from our sub.

THE POINT IS, your policy makers in recent past and till date, have been making a chutiya out of you common Indians about "no first strike" doctrine.

You were never in position to absorb Pakistani first strike and retaliate later.

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

Maybe. It may even be an existential suicide but then what about Israel's Samson Option? As far as I know not a single Western country targets Israel with nuclear weapons yet Israel has every major western capital as a target for its nuclear weapons. To what end? What military advantage does the Samson option give to Israel. It is assured suicide for millions of Jews, yet the option not only exists but has the Israelis assure the world that they will use it if need be even though they understand the consequences of their actions. If you think the Samson option is a myth then there is nothing I can do about that, but if you think it is real, then where does your nuclear theory go then?

Israel policy is to neither confirm or deny its nuclear capability.
Since it has not confirmed it nuclear capability, it has also not stated its first strike policy.

Samson Option is named after the biblical character which kills his enemy by destroying
the temple with the enemies as well as himself. The theory states that Israel will only use
it if millions of jews is about to be killed, so it gives an incentive to avoid such situations.

The Samson option is therefore a theory which can only be verified with difficulty.
The primary target for the Samson option would be the enemies of Israel,
and those are not to be found in the West.

 

[Paranoid Android]

Having sub is one thing but to mate a nuclear capable missile with it is another thing which till date you haven't demonstrated.

What demonstration?Should we call BBC FOX?
We don't invite any media house during any trial..Our army don't need to advertise to mass..This is how India maintains it's soft image as a respectable nuclear power...

we have already demonstrated our underwater nuke lunch capability from our sub.

Underwater launch platform & nuclear missile launch capable subs both are different things..

 

[kabooter_maila]

Kid...That is a problem you need to find a solution for. What you say now is what we see when we look west. May be we are looking to the same direction but you are blaming us. Do you think we need desperate diplomatic move? Do we need to wait outside the white house for a week and come back ? No....Never...
Every country has a place in the world order. Stay there...then people respect you..
You need to enlighten yourself.

Yeah, that's the only thing I would agree with you. Stay at your real worth. Modi learned that during BRICS meeting held recently in India albeit after disgracing himself and turning to be a bad host.

"Do you think we need desperate diplomatic move?" Yes, I think so. That's based on your history as cry babies. Who ran to kiss shiekh's feet? Who keeps complaining and requesting Chinese? In fact, Indians have always complained to every single country in world where we had some kind of agreement for weapons. Cry babies, haan? Stay at your real worth. We have faced and kept our nine times bigger enemy on knees. That's our real worth.

 

[Lotus_stalk]

India just needs to build more consulates in Afghanistan, offense is the best defense ...

 

[salarsikander]

what the hell does he mean 'increasing evidence'?

fear mongering, More shot on Tv channels, More airtime, more paid up sponsorships, More bucks/. Whereas naive population will play on the dancing tunes of shithead politicians who are using deep religious sentiments to stir up some support. All the while becoming largest EXPORTER of beef

 

[Reichsmarschall]

Minions..?.we are not talking about Pakistan here...We are talking about Powerful INDIA.

OK



Don't Ban me for finding the truth.

North’s missiles tied to Musharraf blunder
KYODO
JAN 28, 2013
ARTICLE HISTORY
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ISLAMABAD – A retired Pakistani nuclear scientist has claimed that former Pakistani leader Gen. Pervez Musharraf’s 1999 military adventurism in the Kargil region of divided Kashmir failed in part because the North Korea-aided, nuclear-capable Ghauri missiles he wanted to deploy then had a faulty guidance system.

Speaking on condition of anonymity, the scientist said that during the Kargil crisis of May-July 1999, Musharraf, who was then army chief, “wanted to deploy Ghauri missiles, but air went out of his balloon when the top general in charge of the missile program told him the missile had a faulty guidance system.”

Over a year earlier, on April 6, 1998, Pakistan had carried out what it described as a successful first test of the intermediate-range ballistic missile, developed by Khan Research Laboratory with North Korean assistance.

BS
by the way here is the great vedic missile see how powerful they are

 

[koolio]

This is how most Pakistanis think & want to believe India can never defeat them. So it is time to show them reality. So far you have attacked India, & when nearing defeat you would run to America & West to mediate for cease fire. Still we managed to break Pakistan. This time India will attack first & nobody will hear your cries for cease fire. They will only say fire till Pakistan cease. It's not going to be a long wait. I have given the time also, when. I will be around then.[/QUOTE]

Listen, I am not going to fall for your Bollywood fantasy saffron crap, What does a nuclear bomb do, total destruction, and I doubt you will be alive too, if such a scenario were to happen, now go back to bharat rakshak forum and enjoy your fairy-tales there.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

[

fear mongering, More shot on Tv channels, More airtime, more paid up sponsorships, More bucks/. Whereas naive population will play on the dancing tunes of shithead politicians who are using deep religious sentiments to stir up some support. All the while becoming largest EXPORTER of beef

No I'm sure nuclear policy will be kept away from common emotion. Right now they've estimated that in case of war approaching nuclear threshold, Pak will set off an atom bomb in chagi to indicate things are approaching serious levels. This might force a cease and negotiation position. I think it makes sense.

 

[maximuswarrior]

LOL our nukes have put these Indians in some quandary and predicament. What a dilemma. So utterly confused. So many conflicting thoughts.

This is excellent news. This is an admission that the Indians clearly don't have a concise doctrine in place. They are struggling with the idea to strike first. This is the result of Pakistan gaining nuclear parity.

 

[waz]

Iran will never ever take Pakistan's side, as it relates Pakistan to a Chameleon. It very well knows, as soon as Saudis throw money & play the Sunni card, you will just dance to their music as puppets. Iran is already bleeding from the proxy war of the Arabs in Iraq/ Syria crisis. It's even worse with low oil prices & US sanctions. Though the world has problems with Muslims, The Iranians & Shiaites are the poor people, who are the real victims of all these dirty power games of the West & conspiracies of the Saudis, when it should have been the other way.

Iran has a peaceful history & are beautiful people, an exception in Islam. It has deep historic & peaceful relations with India & the world. My only disapproval of Iranians is, freedom of women & their rights. If not for Islam Iran India relations would be like America Canada relation. May be the Iranians & Afghans should seriously think of renouncing the present faith to go back to their old ones or any other. It will do a world of good to Iran, Afghan & the region. It's really unfortunate the Americans & Israelis are not on the Iranian side. If only that happens the whole of Middle East crisis would end immediately. One day probably India will convince the Americans & west to side the Iranians. You never know, that will change the dynamics of the Middle East. Iran will become the regional power of the Middle East. It has also made strides in science unlike other Islamic countries.

Same goes with Turkey. They have been trying to get into the EU for more almost two decades now. They have seen what fall of Saddam & Gaddafi has done to Iraq & Libya. So they want to portray themselves as Europeans than Arabs, as they know they will one day fall prey to Middle Eastern conspiracies. Turkey already has diplomatic crisis with Netherlands, Germany & EU Nations. Even its American relation is jeopardy after Trump has taken over. It has had serious confrontations with Putin/Russia over Syrian crisis. Also remember Turks hate the Pakistanis casting a blind eye on the atrocities of the Uyghur Muslims. The beating of Chinese drum by Pakistanis makes the Turks blood boil, since they know what real Chinese are, how trust worthy they are.





If Pakistan knew & really understood the tragedy & disaster of such an adventure, it wouldn't time & again give nuclear threats to India & world. True Millions will die & Billions may suffer, but these threats show the mindset which prevails in a country which is irresponsible. So why should we be always the tolerant & humane one, who abstain from such verbal threats unlike our hostile neighbor. Pakistanis has taken for granted our defensive policy as cowardly & go about with the rhetoric, Indians have no guts to start a war nor give threats to Pakistan. If they wanted peace, they would not do this or teach their children, Hindus are barbarians in their textbook. The tides are changing slowly. Reason Gandhian or Non-Violence policies will only make the Pakistan make merry & mock at our approach as cowardly. It's of no use. It needs to change like Israel's image in the middle east.

It's India's turn now to do the same what Pakistan has been doing for 70 years. It is time for Pakistan to experience the same fear, threat & horror. Defensive stand with Pakistan has no meaning & has not worked & will never ever. Time for giving the same medicine to the enemy has long past. Pakistan is slowly experiencing the heat with the failure of SAARC, the changing dynamics of Balochistan internationally, Afghan enmity getting fiercer The Pakistan's announcement, it is planning to make GB it's 5th province is signs of weakness & surrender. Pakistan could have done it 50-60 years back & we could have lived in peace. Things may probably change even now, if Pak gives up Kashmir & makes peace with India. Will it or Can it happen. NO WAY. So India has to only work, towards getting back GB, Kashmir & all of Pak. China will never take Pakistan's side if we went to war. On the other had China will use Pakistan to try & stop India's growth by using it as a pawn, so it doesn't need to fight a war with India.



Israel is allowed by the west to exist, so countries around it have fear. If they are defeated or eliminated, it would give the Arab countries to become over confident. The west has the fear & feels the Arabs will be barbaric for the rest of the world, If they unite, even though it may not happen. As long as Arab Iran tensions prevail, the conspiracies is not going to end. Israel is only a check, to make sure these wars don't spill over to the west.

Same is going to happen in the sub-continent. Like the west supporting Israel, every body will come together to support India to bring down Pakistan & China. India is the most important ally, which can give the west the confidence to take on China. Modi's rising power, his fearlessness, tough leadership qualities & actions has given the west the confirmation, time has come to take on China. If you closely join all the dots & watch the developments you will see the bigger picture what's coming.

According to me, the strategy would be to take out the smaller pawns in the game, rather take on China first. If you take on China, the smaller players will be at merry under the umbrella of China. So don't be surprised if North Korea is attacked & eliminated first, since it is been supported by China. China equips N Korea with arms & uses it only to keep the U.S & Japan at bay. The real intention of China is for North Korea to collapse economically & it gets torn into a civil war like Libya, Iraq, so it gets an excuse to invade N Korea & annex it as part of China.

But N Korea will be taken out before this dream of China. Expect 2018/19 Japan, S Korea & America to attack N Korea, If I am not wrong. The preparation & positioning is already happening. This will also give an understanding of the war & capabilities of N Korea, since they have mostly Chinese missiles & technology. It will be a practice session for Japan, S Korea & probably Taiwan too for taking on China. For America its very vital as it's not her region, it gets to test it's Naval strengths & weaknesses for planning & preparation.

Next would be Pakistan possibly around 2020/21 after Modi's re-election. Till then China will be choked with its exports & trade, to weaken its economic front. The reason I say by 2021 Pakistan would be taken out is, because India will have enough Rafales, Brahmos with extended range, Baraqs, S400's, M777 Howitzers, Submarines & our additional carrier would be in operation, apart from our KALI weapon. Even the smaller arms like (INSAS) Rifle manufactured here is being replaced with deadlier assault rifles of higher caliber (7.62x51). The best rifles of the world will replace the Indian INSAS by 2019. And another reason after 2022 Pak will start getting its submarines, Missile Defence systems, drones & even J20's which is in test stage now.



This is how most Pakistanis think & want to believe India can never defeat them. So it is time to show them reality. So far you have attacked India, & when nearing defeat you would run to America & West to mediate for cease fire. Still we managed to break Pakistan. This time India will attack first & nobody will hear your cries for cease fire. They will only say fire till Pakistan cease. It's not going to be a long wait. I have given the time also, when. I will be around then.

Good Lord you actually took time out to write up all your fantasies? Is this therapy of sorts?

 

[salarsikander]

Pak will set off an atom bomb in chagi to indicate things are approaching serious levels

And Attract international condemnation coupled with serious sanctions ?

 

[maximuswarrior]

[


No I'm sure nuclear policy will be kept away from common emotion. Right now they've estimated that in case of war approaching nuclear threshold, Pak will set off an atom bomb in chagi to indicate things are approaching serious levels. This might force a cease and negotiation position. I think it makes sense.

LOL keep estimating and guessing. That is our primary strength. To keep you confused. That has been the whole point after gaining parity. If our capability has managed to confuse India to such a degree than it is mission accomplished.

A leading nuclear strategist Vipin Narang said yesterday, at a conference on nuclear policy, that there is increasing evidence that India could launch a preemptive first strike against Pakistan if it feared a nuclear attack was imminent.

“There is increasing evidence that India will not allow Pakistan to go first,” Vipin Narang, a nuclear strategist from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, said at a conference on nuclear policy hosted by Carnegie, a think tank, yesterday.

He added that the first strike will not be aimed at urban centres and conventional targets of a retaliatory strike intended to punish and prevent an escalation, but against Islamabad’s nuclear arsenal, to preempt a nuclear attack altogether.

“India’s opening salvo may not be conventional strikes trying to pick off just Nasr batteries (launch vehicles for Pakistan’s tactical battlefield nuclear warheads) in the theatre, but a full ‘comprehensive counterforce strike’ that attempts to completely disarm Pakistan of its nuclear weapons so that India does not have to engage in iterative tit-for-tat exchanges and expose its own cities to nuclear destruction,” he said.

As evidence for his theory, Narang cited recent remarks and policy prescriptions from leading Indian strategists and a book by Shivshankar Menon, who oversaw nuclear targeting for India as National Security Adviser to Prime Minister Manmohan Singh. Narang also quoted Menon as telling Ajai Shukla, a defense analyst with Business Standard, that “India’s nuclear doctrine has far greater flexibility than it gets credit for”.

Narang supported his theory by citing this paragraph from Menon’s book, “Choices: Inside the Making of Indian Foreign Policy”, which was released in November : “There is a potential grey area as to when India would use nuclear weapons first against another NWS (nuclear weapon state). Circumstances are conceivable in which India might find it useful to strike first, for instance, against an NWS that had declared it would certainly use its weapons, and if India were certain that adversary’s launch was imminent.”

New Delhi declared its no-first use strike policy in 2003, undertaking to not start a nuclear war in a neighbourhood.

Times of India released a report today in which it said there are also worries in India that New Delhi might not have full information on the whereabouts of Pakistan’s nuclear weapons and tactical warheads that are much smaller and mounted on lorries to be driven around to escape detection through satellite imagery.
http://nation.com.pk/national/21-Ma...st-to-pre-empt-attack-says-nuclear-strategist

How incredibly insecure India has become when it openly promotes the use of nuclear weapons LOL This country likes to call itself a responsible nuclear power. What reckless and undiplomatic behavior on the international stage. I'm certain these remarks have others worried. Using nuclear weapons in such a casual manner against another state is a matter of grave concern. Clearly, India is in the mood of using such destructive weapons based on assumption. Such paranoia by India serves us well.

 

[Flying Man]

LOL keep estimating and guessing. That is our primary strength. To keep you confused. That has been the whole point after gaining parity. If our capability has managed to confuse India to such a degree than it is mission accomplished.



How incredibly insecure India has become when it openly promotes the use of nuclear weapons LOL This country likes to call itself a responsible nuclear power. What reckless and undiplomatic behavior on the international stage.

The whole world know who is insuecure , estimating and running around with fustration.We don't have a "No first use policy against a nuclear state" So take care.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

And Attract international condemnation coupled with serious sanctions ?

The scenario is that conventional war has already broken out and advanced to serious levels, about to cross nuclear threshold. When Pak is about to lose the conventional war, nuclear threshold is approached. An attack on India means the start of formal nuclear retaliation. Setting it off in Chagi means the international community should intervene immidetaley and India should now consider a nuclear attack might be a possibility so India should probably de-escalate. Pretty intelligent posture actually.