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India admits Kashmir a disputed territory.

Do you really think that western civilisation will put crippling economic sanctions on India through UN ?

The sole purpose is to smash this long established Indian narrative of cross border terrorism and let everyone be clear on what this dispute is about. Indian shenanigans linking Kashmir freedom struggle with terrorism, those needs to be put to bed once for all.

After that Pakistan will do what needs to be done.
Do you think you succeeded in doing that in UN ? The narrative will not change because it is no myth that cross border terrorism occurs. The whole world accepts it. When JEM claimed Pulwama attack, the world saw it. For it to change credible action needs to be done and FATF sanction avoidance should be the priority. Its a time taking process that needs to be started and its not going to happen in UN.
 
Do you think you succeeded in doing that in UN ? The narrative will not change because it is no myth that cross border terrorism occurs. The whole world accepts it. When JEM claimed Pulwama attack, the world saw it. For it to change credible action needs to be done and FATF sanction avoidance should be the priority. Its a time taking process that needs to be started and its not going to happen in UN.

Cross border whatever, there is no border to begin with and infact it's gone further down the status as ceasefire line since Indian unilateral move. we are back to 1947-48 situation. The term never exsisted in any legal or logical debate.

Faft can be stepped aside, it's not on menu atm for state of Pakistan. By exposing India internationally, which btw international media and publications are doing quite brilliantly on their own, this whole narrative is falling apart to be even discussed in FATF.

But there are much bigger national interests at stake here and state sees this once in a lifetime opportunity presented to Pakistan by this strategic blunder committed by Indian establishment. It's time to put foot on the gas. The squealing you heard from Indian defense minister today is result of this.
 
Looks like the Indian top diplomat, himself a Muslim, is in a state of denial!!! For he knows too well what’s in store for the Muslims inside India - Kashmir or no Kashmir doesn’t matter!! They’re going for the Nazi style Final Solution vis-a-vis the Muslim folks!!! The only question is whether the Muslims are gonna die fighting or die without resisting...
 
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That the two countries are resolved to settle their differences by peaceful means through bilateral negotiations or by any other peaceful means mutually agreed upon between them. Pending the final settlement of any of the problems between the two countries, neither side shall unilaterally alter the situation and both shall prevent the organization, assistance or encouragement of any acts detrimental to the maintenance of peaceful and harmonious relations;
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7. Both Governments agree that their respective Heads will meet again at a mutually convenient time in the future and that, in the meanwhile, the representatives of the two sides will meet to discuss further the modalities and arrangements for the establishment of durable peace and normalization of relations, including the questions of repatriation of prisoners of war and civilian internees, a final settlement of Jammu and Kashmir and the resumption of diplomatic relations.

You see this is the problem. The language has been kept deliberately vague. J & K has not been referred to as a dispute and what is exactly the "settlement" that is required is also not defined. Now both sides can interpret the vague term "settlement" whichever way they like. Pakistan can say that a settlement is required only on the Indian side of Kashmir while, India can say a settlement is required only on the Pakistani side of Kashmir. This vagueness is exactly what India is playing around now. They will claim that there is no violation of the Shimla Agreement in removing Article 370 and they "technically" won't be wrong.

Looks like the Indian top diplomat, himself a Muslim, is in a state of denial!!! For he knows too well what’s in store for the Muslims inside India - Kashmir or no Kashmir doesn’t matter!! They’re going for the Nazi style Final Solution vis-a-vis the Muslim folks!!! The only question is whether the Muslims are gonna die fighting or die without resisting...

I see you love pumping up the Muslims of South Asia to take on the Hindus here sitting comfortably wherever you are. Since you are so concerned, when are you coming and joining them here in the fight on the LoC. I am sure they will appreciate an extra hand.
 
You see this is the problem. The language has been kept deliberately vague. J & K has not been referred to as a dispute and what is exactly the "settlement" that is required is also not defined. Now both sides can interpret the vague term "settlement" whichever way they like. Pakistan can say that a settlement is required only on the Indian side of Kashmir while, India can say a settlement is required only on the Pakistani side of Kashmir. This vagueness is exactly what India is playing around now. They will claim that there is no violation of the Shimla Agreement in removing Article 370 and they "technically" won't be wrong.

It's absolutely clear on what it says:

It says Pending the final settlement of any problem no side shall seek to alter the situation unilaterally ..... And it categorically mentions the final settlement of Kashmir ...

Moreover, it also mentions that In Jammu and Kashmir, the line of control resulting from the cease-fire of December 17, 1971 shall be respected by both sides without prejudice to the recognized position of either side. Neither side shall seek to alter it unilaterally, irrespective of mutual differences and legal interpretations. Both sides further undertake to refrain from the threat or the use of force in violation of this Line

You need to try harder ...
 
It's absolutely clear on what it says:

It says Pending the final settlement of any problem no side shall seek to alter the situation unilaterally ..... And it categorically mentions the final settlement of Kashmir ...

Moreover, it also mentions that In Jammu and Kashmir, the line of control resulting from the cease-fire of December 17, 1971 shall be respected by both sides without prejudice to the recognized position of either side. Neither side shall seek to alter it unilaterally, irrespective of mutual differences and legal interpretations. Both sides further undertake to refrain from the threat or the use of force in violation of this Line

You need to try harder ...

I am not debating this with you. I am only giving my opinion. So you need not get mad at me and write things like "try harder" and all. First, learn to look at things dispassionately.

I already told you, the Agreement does not define clearly what problem or settlement means. These terms can be interpreted by either side whichever way they like. It is a vague document and perhaps deliberately so.

As for not changing something unilaterally, it specifically refers to the LoC. This recent action of India does not violate the LoC in any manner. In fact that is what Pakistan tried to do in 1999 and that was indeed a violation of the Shimla Agreement.

Look, I am not arguing. I am also against the way in which Article 370 has been revoked. I am just putting my understanding forth.
 
India admits Kashmir a disputed territory
By Imran Kazmi
Published: August 17, 2019
TWEET EMAIL
2035642-indianunenvoyscreen-1565988276-611-640x480.jpg

Delhi’s UN ambassador reiterates commitment to Simla Accord. SCREENGRAB

KARACHI: Hours after the United Nations Security Council (UNSC) held a first-ever meeting over Kashmir issue in almost 50 years in a diplomatic triumph to Pakistan, India’s envoy to the United Nations Syed Akbaruddin on Friday admitted that Indian-Occupied Jammu and Kashmir was a disputed territory and New Delhi was conditionally ready to engage with Islamabad over the matter.
India has regularly blocked discussion on Occupied Kashmir at the UN because it considers the matter an ‘internal affair’.

Facing a barrage of questions in a press briefing following the historic meeting at the UN headquarters in New York, Akbaruddin said that India is committed to the Simla accord inked with Pakistan in 1972, which explicitly declared the Kashmir as dispute between the two countries.
“So let me begin by coming across to you and shaking your hand… as we’ve already extended our hand of friendship by saying we are committed to Simla agreement. Let us wait on that from the Pakistani side,” said the Indian ambassador while awkwardly reaching out to Pakistani journalists and shaking hands with them.

UNSC meeting nullifies India’s claims IOK is its ‘internal matter’: Lodhi

Responding to a question, he said: “In closed consultations at the UNSC, anyone, especially parties to the dispute, can try and throw in anything at the members of the Security Council. That’s the nature of the beast.”

He added: “We are ready to address these issues in a matter in which states who have normal approaches to international ties address them… and in our case, we are committed to Simla agreement. It’s now for Pakistan to make that commitment to ‘stop terror and start talks’.”

New Delhi has been harping on its terror mantra despite Islamabad’s repeated attempts at resolving all outstanding issues between the two countries, including that of Kashmir, through dialogue.

After coming into power last year, Prime Minister Imran Khan has extended an olive branch to his Indian counterpart Narendra Modi on multiple occasions, however, India never responded positively.

The Simla accord highlighted that ‘no settlement’ had been reached on the Kashmir issue, but it mentioned ‘a final solution of Jammu and Kashmir’ as one of the outstanding questions for settlement. The accord also stated that: “The Line of Control resulting from the ceasefire of December 17, 1971 shall be respected by both sides without prejudice to the recognised position of either side. Neither side shall seek to alter it unilaterally, irrespective of mutual differences and legal interpretations.”

The 17-point agreement reaffirmed the principles and purposes of the Charter of United Nations to “govern the relations between the two countries”.

Trump urges India-Pakistan talks on Kashmir in call with PM Imran

Visibly frustrated over the Kashmir issue being discussed at the highest diplomatic forum of the world, Akbaruddin lashed out at the ‘international interference’ in his government’s very ‘internal matter’. “We don’t need international busybodies to try to tell us how to run our lives. We are a billion plus people,” he told reporters.

On August 5, New Delhi scrapped Article 370 in the Indian constitution that had granted Kashmir special autonomy. It split the state of Jammu and Kashmir in two and downgraded their status to union territories, sparking a row with Pakistan.

PM Modi’s government also restricted freedom of movement in the region and cut the internet and phone lines. Akbaruddin said the restrictions were “reasonable” and are being eased.

“Public order is integral to ensuring that democracy prospers,” he added, denying reports that India was committing human rights violations in the former Himalayan region.
Bhai sahab,
He clearly said dispute will be settle by talks, not that Indian/pakistan claim is disputed
 
I am not debating this with you. I am only giving my opinion. So you need not get mad at me and write things like "try harder" and all. First, learn to look at things dispassionately.

I already told you, the Agreement does not define clearly what problem or settlement means. These terms can be interpreted by either side whichever way they like. It is a vague document and perhaps deliberately so.

As for not changing something unilaterally, it specifically refers to the LoC. This recent action of India does not violate the LoC in any manner. In fact that is what Pakistan tried to do in 1999 and that was indeed a violation of the Shimla Agreement. Shimla agreement, UN resolution all are facing a slow natural death now.

Look, I am not arguing. I am also against the way in which Article 370 has been revoked. I am just putting my understanding forth.
At the end of the day, 370 is gone forever and BJP got what India was trying for long i.e making LoC the de facto border between the two. Indians won't mind Pakistan claiming a moral/psychological victory today I guess. 70 years have gone and only a naive would hope that Kashmir could have another solution.
 
They trying to calm Pakistan. More like calming Pakistanis and Kashmiris.

Elements of Pak govt are complicit with world elite and people who sacrifice children in basements.

I can't help but shake the feeling we are being tricked into another '71.

We could afford to lose Bangladesh. But if we lose Kashmir mainland Pakistan is next. That's the main threat.
 
why they were not ready before when imran khan asked modi to talk on table and solve issues?
any Indian friend on here would be feeling so embarrassed that what modi has done to Indian image lol.
Modi thinks the modren world is sleeping and no one caught him lyeing.
Hubris.
Att khuda da vair.
 
Phati hui hai bharway ki

India admits Kashmir a disputed territory
By Imran Kazmi
Published: August 17, 2019
TWEET EMAIL
2035642-indianunenvoyscreen-1565988276-611-640x480.jpg

Delhi’s UN ambassador reiterates commitment to Simla Accord. SCREENGRAB

KARACHI: Hours after the United Nations Security Council (UNSC) held a first-ever meeting over Kashmir issue in almost 50 years in a diplomatic triumph to Pakistan, India’s envoy to the United Nations Syed Akbaruddin on Friday admitted that Indian-Occupied Jammu and Kashmir was a disputed territory and New Delhi was conditionally ready to engage with Islamabad over the matter.
India has regularly blocked discussion on Occupied Kashmir at the UN because it considers the matter an ‘internal affair’.

Facing a barrage of questions in a press briefing following the historic meeting at the UN headquarters in New York, Akbaruddin said that India is committed to the Simla accord inked with Pakistan in 1972, which explicitly declared the Kashmir as dispute between the two countries.
“So let me begin by coming across to you and shaking your hand… as we’ve already extended our hand of friendship by saying we are committed to Simla agreement. Let us wait on that from the Pakistani side,” said the Indian ambassador while awkwardly reaching out to Pakistani journalists and shaking hands with them.

UNSC meeting nullifies India’s claims IOK is its ‘internal matter’: Lodhi

Responding to a question, he said: “In closed consultations at the UNSC, anyone, especially parties to the dispute, can try and throw in anything at the members of the Security Council. That’s the nature of the beast.”

He added: “We are ready to address these issues in a matter in which states who have normal approaches to international ties address them… and in our case, we are committed to Simla agreement. It’s now for Pakistan to make that commitment to ‘stop terror and start talks’.”

New Delhi has been harping on its terror mantra despite Islamabad’s repeated attempts at resolving all outstanding issues between the two countries, including that of Kashmir, through dialogue.

After coming into power last year, Prime Minister Imran Khan has extended an olive branch to his Indian counterpart Narendra Modi on multiple occasions, however, India never responded positively.

The Simla accord highlighted that ‘no settlement’ had been reached on the Kashmir issue, but it mentioned ‘a final solution of Jammu and Kashmir’ as one of the outstanding questions for settlement. The accord also stated that: “The Line of Control resulting from the ceasefire of December 17, 1971 shall be respected by both sides without prejudice to the recognised position of either side. Neither side shall seek to alter it unilaterally, irrespective of mutual differences and legal interpretations.”

The 17-point agreement reaffirmed the principles and purposes of the Charter of United Nations to “govern the relations between the two countries”.

Trump urges India-Pakistan talks on Kashmir in call with PM Imran

Visibly frustrated over the Kashmir issue being discussed at the highest diplomatic forum of the world, Akbaruddin lashed out at the ‘international interference’ in his government’s very ‘internal matter’. “We don’t need international busybodies to try to tell us how to run our lives. We are a billion plus people,” he told reporters.

On August 5, New Delhi scrapped Article 370 in the Indian constitution that had granted Kashmir special autonomy. It split the state of Jammu and Kashmir in two and downgraded their status to union territories, sparking a row with Pakistan.

PM Modi’s government also restricted freedom of movement in the region and cut the internet and phone lines. Akbaruddin said the restrictions were “reasonable” and are being eased.

“Public order is integral to ensuring that democracy prospers,” he added, denying reports that India was committing human rights violations in the former Himalayan region.
 
No, literally we will fight our battle to the end no matter what the consequences are.

And we know very well that UN can't do anything, it's just about strategic narrative building and Modi is really helping us in that.
It's also about positioning ourselves for when the Kashmiri resistance starts after the curfew is lifted.

Guys, i think the time to talk about that is long gone ! 370 is gone, its not going to be brought back. People have moved on. UN sympathy has been used up. India isnt going to suddenly decide to change the status because someone interpreted things differently.
You're partly right.
370 is gone but people haven't moved on. Nobody wants you to change it back because by doing what you have done, you have unified the separatist cause, countered your own narrative, and internationalised the issue in one fell swoop.
Well done.
 
I hate these smart *** bearucrates dont reply in detail this brain dead took question and nothing admitted and nothing replies which matters keep repeating you know all.
Shi/ is happening everywhere and india is preventing. I will answer i will answer and didnt answer what a skunk he is.
India is ceating to their people and everyone india is state who sponsor terrorism we caught kilboshan aka monkey. I am sure if someone ask him about this monkey he will not accept.
India is cheater killer and liar.
 
Looks like the Indian top diplomat, himself a Muslim, is in a state of denial!!! For he knows too well what’s in store for the Muslims inside India - Kashmir or no Kashmir doesn’t matter!! They’re going for the Nazi style Final Solution vis-a-vis the Muslim folks!!! The only question is whether the Muslims are gonna die fighting or die without resisting...
If you don't fight you deserve what you get.
We have been fighting since 1947 to maintain our freedom and territory.
God helps those who help themselves.
 

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