India Accepts Pakistan Air Force is a Leading Force

[SQ8]

F-16s, 30+ Years old of Mirages III/V, 20+ Years old F-7P, 10 Years old F-7PG
Let not discuss JFT they are under going extensive training and continuous upgrades..

I do not think so PAF is a challenge or poses a challenge but it is good for many small states around it.
22 Years is a long time the only thing we came up in this time is couple of awacs, couple of air refullers and initiated and complete JFT project as JFT has still to prove itself in the next 5/7 Years, I am seriously doubting where the money is channeled in the past 22 Years that we had to come up with these only? Amazing, I remember just before OBL Operation, Air Force Chief 2 days or so earlier said our Air Space is secured mahfooz like his predecessors and yeah bad luck struck him 2/3 days later.

I have to ask this question we are in the state of war both our Easter and Western Borders are engaged how in the Hell were radars inactive and then run away with such statement and then explains that we will initiate an investigations what investigations when PAF Chief Orders to keep radars inactive, does he plan to oust poor young men and get away with it safe his .

Perhaps they were.
Perhaps they were not...
Whats the going rate for a Sq Ldr?? or a Major?? 5?? ten million dollars?
not to report a hit on the scope??
Ignore it?

Then again... low flying choppers, mountainous terrain.. its easy for choppers to evade detection using NOE flight profiles.. The first strikes at Iraq's ADA network were carried out by Apache's escorted by MH-53's flying low. And that was flat terrain..
Now if the Chief was to reveal that our network was bypassed till it was too late.. and that when they did realize what was going on and went in to assess the situation.. the US Def Attache gave a simple ..lay off or we send in a strike package of SH's escorted by growlers and lay waste to whatever is in our path..???
Language such as "Bomb you back to the stone age" has a strong effect on our brave military leaders...
The Truth of the event will probably never surface.. what is surfacing is "ankh churana" of PAF personnel when asked questions similar to yours..
Will time tell.. ??
or like Ojhri, like Kargil, like tens of "nazuk mor's" in Pakistan's history, this will be brushed over and forgotten as well.


As far as the money channeled in the last couple of years goes to??
Well.. the JF project ate a lot of cash.. so did the F-16's.. the actual cost of which is more than disclosed.. the SAAB purchase was heavy on the pockets.. as were refuellers.. upgrades to the C4I system, K-8P payments, FT-5 LOTEX, FOB upgrades, MOB upgrades, "Housing" upgrades, Staff essentials upgrades.. and few other trinkets here and there..
Not to mention the brand spanking new staff cars roaming around E-9 these days.

 

[Storm Force]

Its all relative

Is PAF a strong air power. YES. compared too many it is very large and capable prehaps top 20.

IS ONE THE best = NO not in Top 10

Why Not = Very limited budget compared the TOP 10 air powers.

and too few 4 generation fighters. big difiencies in radar technology and SAM protection.

Before some body beats me up the TOP 10 in my book are

USA, Russia, China, Israel , Japan , UK, France, Turkey , Saudi, & India

You could ARGUE Germany Sweden South Korea Eygpt could potentially replace India as well in top 10

 

[Frankenstein]

Well I sadly agree than PAF is presently more advanced than IAF...they have 900 aircraft majority being 3rd generation Mirages f-7...only 93 fall in 4 gen category and most of them like J17 and early F-16 are far less capable than contemporary 4 gens. While India has 280 4 gen aircraft of which atlest 180 are 4++.

India have 480 Combat aircraft while Pakistan have 413

India have 189 Trainers (In which HAL deepak was grounded once ) while Pakistan have 276 trainers

In future we will be getting 300 JFT and how much LCA are you procuring ?? 45

and 126 MMRCA WHILE WE WILL GET 150 J10B

and some time after 2018 India will have PAKFA while we will have J20

so .... ..

 

[Mo12]

India have 480 Combat aircraft while Pakistan have 413

India have 189 Trainers (In which HAL deepak was grounded once ) while Pakistan have 276 trainers

In future we will be getting 300 JFT and how much LCA are you procuring ?? 45

and 126 MMRCA WHILE WE WILL GET 150 J10B

and some time after 2018 India will have PAKFA while we will have J20

so .... ..

You can see, India economy is 8 times bigger then Pakistan, but yet numbers are similar, do you think Pakistan is punching above their weight?

Or Pakistan is lacking funding else where for say hospital and education for military.

 

[PakistaniPacifist]

Pakistani's please don't buy into Indian flattery, they can fool the world but don't let them fool you! When you get compliments from an Indian then check yourself for surely their is something wrong!

 

[desioptimist]

The thread title suggests it is some official acceptance.
How one article written by an Indian becomes "India accepts...", nobody knows.

 

[majesticpankaj]

India have 480 Combat aircraft while Pakistan have 413

India have 189 Trainers (In which HAL deepak was grounded once ) while Pakistan have 276 trainers

In future we will be getting 300 JFT and how much LCA are you procuring ?? 45

and 126 MMRCA WHILE WE WILL GET 150 J10B

and some time after 2018 India will have PAKFA while we will have J20

so .... ..

sir..i haven't heard so far that chinese are selling J20 to pakistan... can u confirm ??

 

[Ammyy]

India have 480 Combat aircraft while Pakistan have 413

Get your facts right

India have 189 Trainers (In which HAL deepak was grounded once ) while Pakistan have 276 trainers

In which 150 is MFI-17 Mushshak a 1975 model

In future we will be getting 300 JFT and how much LCA are you procuring ?? 45

For current version of JF17 we dnt need any thing

and 126 MMRCA WHILE WE WILL GET 150 J10B

Why not 500 j10b but paisa kaha se aayega ?????

and some time after 2018 India will have PAKFA while we will have J20

so .... ..

again money problem dude

 

[The HBS Guy]

India have 480 Combat aircraft while Pakistan have 413

India have 189 Trainers (In which HAL deepak was grounded once ) while Pakistan have 276 trainers

In future we will be getting 300 JFT and how much LCA are you procuring ?? 45

and 126 MMRCA WHILE WE WILL GET 150 J10B

and some time after 2018 India will have PAKFA while we will have J20

so .... ..

It sends shivers down my spine to see the might of the mighty PAF!

 

[Peshwa]

I think you are raising a good point but guess the answer to this is pretty much clear if we look at the numbers. Lets take a hypothetical situation of India carrying out some surgical strikes in Pakistan. India may loose half of its strike package with Pakistan loosing only a few of its jet. However the raid maybe successful in neutralizing some of the scum of this earth.

In my opinion....Surgical strikes in S.Asia should be considered nothing more than precursor to a full blown war....

So I personally wont like to comment on surgical strikes as they are a very blatant sign of aggression....Nevetheless...I am for going against terrorists (India centric) using special forces...
So lets leave this out of the discussion

The thing to ponder about is what can PAF do... not a lot I would presume. They don't have good quantities of strike aircrafts and I guess F-16 do face lack of parts as far as maintenance and repair are concerned. All in all the only credible threat that I see from Pakistan maybe in the form of some cruise missiles ( which maybe shot down by some of our airplanes) .

To be very honest...the more this OBL fiasco unfolds, the more Im inclined to think that the PAF F-16s will become a non player for Pak in future war scenario (if at all).....
I think the JFT is something to be looked at with a keen eye since that can easily change the numbers game when coupled with the AWACs + refuellers

In case of a full blown war...PAF will be tasked with defending its borders....Its offensive capability is marred by the fact that they lack a solid air defence and that the numbers arent in their favor...currently

Not sure if another 26/11 can trigger such strikes but whether or not we do it is more a question of will. We can spend some million dollars if we can get rid of some terrorist machinery. (Also if I only talk about economy , then the loss from surgical air strikes maybe less then the loss incurred after Mumbai. However, the stocks will definitely go down temporarily .Who knows , maybe its a risk that we may have to take)

As mentioned....Surgical strikes are not as easy as many here make them out to be....
Apart from the military implications, the country needs to have
a) solid proof ie. Dont bomb a village full of civilians thinking they are terrorists...even if they are terrorists...the ability to change the story lies with the victim and can really hurt the attacker from a political standpoint....NOTE: India is no USA
b) Political will....
c) A strategic goal.....What next? What does one do once these terrorists camps are bombed...Is India going for Kashmir?....teach Pak a lesson?....where does it stop
d) Is the country ready to face war....ie. Be ready to defend Mumbai which will be target #1 for Pak

So frankly...NO
India will not opt for surgical strikes...
But this does not mean we lose....This means that the Pak "deep state" that has sheltered these fringe elements will be weakened through economic sanctions, losing allies and clout....India just needs to have calm nerves and wait it out....
Unlike most hyperactive members looking for any excuse to nuke....India should be cold and calculated....we know the numbers, tech, economy and political clout is in our favor....and the enemy knows it even better....Their main goal will be to make us blink first.....

PAF attacking India would be a suicide mission....at least at this stage of the decade

As a conclusion , I would say that PAF is a very weak offensive force when compared to IAF ( its primary enemy) and that surgical strikes are always a viable option. ( Another thing we should keep in mind is the suicidal nature of Pakistan , where people will say that they have lost everything anyways , so why not try and take India down with them. I also dread a day when a General comes to power and launches a few missiles towards India in anger, Guess that would be the end of Indian subcontinent.)

I think you're attributing the comments of Pakistanis on this forum to the state of Pak....

Trust me....kids high on hormones are not to be used as a benchmark for Pakistani reaction....Just as India has its excited electrons....so does Pak....
Any move by Pak will be equally calculated....and trust me....No country is suicidal....one would call their actions suicidal only post outcome of their actions...

 

[Tshering22]

How and why does it matter to Pakistan whether we accept you or reject you as a top class air force or not? Aren't Pakistanis confident enough about their fighting forces that they need acknowledgement of our experts and officials to feel assured? I certainly don't see us waiting for PLAAF or USAF to wait and praise our prowess.

What is the point of this thread honestly, guys?

 

[HAIDER]

Guys forum is discussing spot, no essay written by some analyst is final word. Your civil and knowledge based discussion bring more knowledge then above piece. For example, i think India has top of the line fighters, the only thing which beat India is PAF maintenance and training at this moment.

 

[Peshwa]

Guys forum is discussing spot, no essay written by some analyst is final word. Your civil and knowledge based discussion bring more knowledge then above piece. For example, i think India has top of the line fighters, the only thing which beat India is PAF maintenance and training at this moment.

I suppose you could argue with regards to maintainence....

But I really would like to hear how PAF has an edge over the IAF in training? I hear this quite a lot on the forum but have yet to seek a reply....

Could you please indulge me?

 

[Mo12]

India jets are better then PAF.

But what annoys me, is the price per jet Pakistan is getting for JF 17, like the price of 1 Eurofighter, you can get like 5 JF-17 jet.

And I know what I would like out of the 2.

 

[Frankenstein]

Get your facts right

my facts are straight, you can open your eyes now

In which 150 is MFI-17 Mushshak a 1975 model

You are so funny

First its a basic trainer (I hope you know what it means), not a combat aircraft

Second, it has been upgraded to super Mushak

and third how many trainer have Indians got?? 70, which are deepak, which was obviously a huge flop, and was grounded , i can see why mig21 crashes all the time, cuz you don't have a perfect trainer

fourth there are more then 5 countries who operate Mushak, while deepak is operated by one and only "India"

For current version of JF17 we dnt need any thing

duh!, you dont have anything, LCA is a joke

Why not 500 j10b but paisa kaha se aayega ?????

soft loans

again money problem dude

and again soft loans dude