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ICHR member calls Indian Leftists Jihad-friendly

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@Joe Shearer

Leftists in India are presently fighting for their own political survival
So leftist historians have become fossilized and irrelevant

Anyway there is a BIG India outside Bengal which cares for the truth
not the distilled version of leftist historians


Why people inside bengal aren't interested ?:undecided:

@Mike_Brando kya ye sach he ? :(
 
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Unfortunate remark from some one sitting not only in a prestigious but responsible chair, especially when the alternate way of learning Indian history that extensively relies on religious faith rather scientific approach has never seemed to be a convincing one.
 
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LOL.

Your adventures with the CBSE curriculum are unfortunate. However, a study of Indian history sometimes starts (in my opinion, incorrectly) with the Indus Valley Civilisation.

Generally, in traditional divisions of history, three separate sections considered include ancient history, from the oldest records to generally some time around the beginning of the thirteenth century, 1206 being a frequently used date.

There are those who argue that the next period 1206 to 1707 being considered as mediaeval history is inaccurate, and that this represents only the late, the developed, matured period of mediaeval history, there being an earlier, equally important period of transition. These historians take points of time such as the seventh century as a start, the thirteenth century as the mid-point, the division between 'early' mediaeval and 'late' mediaeval, and the seventeenth century as the end.

There is no dearth of history for the earlier years; why the peculiarities foisted on a generation by some bizarre choice of subjects should be taken as the standard, canonical version of Indian history is beyond comprehension.

The Internet is the least reliable of sources. It consists of a series of prejudices repeated by a series of biased and untrained commentators. There is ultimately no substitute for peer review.

Now for some specifics:



Your syntax is as idiosyncratic as your views on education. Is it your case that @Joe Shearer was told that the emphasis was on mediaeval India, etc., etc., or is it your case that @Joe Shearer was doing the telling? Neither is correct. I was neither told such a silly thing, nor have I told anyone so.



That is a question for the people who decided the curriculum for the CBSE, not for us. As far as I was concerned, I have had a full introduction to Maratha history, right back at undergraduate level, beginning with Sircar, and ending with the annals of the wars against the British. So, too, about the Sikhs.



This is a criticism that can be made even of a full-scale undergraduate or a post-graduate programme. The emphasis tends to be on north India, and on Delhi, in all major histories; many of the provincial histories are dealt with in a skimpy manner, either due to lack of materials, or due to an emphasis on what is deemed to be the mainstream. There are few general histories which deal in a satisfactory manner with the Ahoms, their origins, their entry into India, their conquests, their organisation, and their cultural legacy. There are even fewer that deal with Orissa or with south India in a satisfactory manner.

The reference to 1500 is misleading. 1526 marked Babur's incursion; the earlier period of the Sultanate saw as great a penetration of the peninsula or of the north-east, or as little, considering that it was only with Aurangzeb that the Mughals pressed on into the Deccan, and considering that both the Khiljis and the Tughlaqs had penetrated deep into the Deccan. Incidentally, those historians who believe that the period before 1206 saw 'early' mediaeval India would be baffled at your efforts to drag in Hindu kings and dynasties into the 'mediaeval' period: it is a given.



Ever heard of the straw horse argument? Where one sets up a phony argument for the pleasure of demolishing it?

Who argued that our history starts from the Islamic conquests of our land? I should like to know. I would be surprised if it is someone responsible on PDF. If it is an external argument, fought elsewhere and brought in kicking and screaming here, it can only be described as playing to the gallery.

It is a pity that your education in history did not continue after school.



Well, yes, precisely. Your point being?

You seem to have lost track of the fact that the question of famines was brought in to illustrate that dips in demographic growth occurred as much in British times as they did earlier.



Oh, I wouldn't worry about that.

My audience on Internet, on PDF, for instance, will remain long after an Internet Hindu here and there has vanished. I had the regulars' attention before, I have it now, and I will continue to have it as long as I am able to bring a logical, rational point of view to discussions.

On the other hand, will some of you exist in three months?

As for the audience in my classes, my ratings continue to be the highest in the department, although there are higher ratings in the university. I'm all right, Jack.



Apart from a little amusement, what one gets from these self-important little struts about a public platform is that most Indians are brought up bereft of more than elementary education in the social sciences, especially in history. I have no idea what school text-books say about Indian history; my school subjects were science. As an historian who teaches history (some of the time), l am keenly aware, on the other hand, of the huge number of historians who are not Marxian in their historiography, ranging right down from Sircar to recent times. One's own guru-parampara vividly illustrates the point:

Kuruvilla Zachariah (not Marxian)

Susobhan Sarkar (Marxist)

Ashin DasGupta (not Marxian)

Look at the plethora of Indian history writing, led by Sugato Bose, filled out by Mridu Rai and Chitralekha Zutshi, who are not Marxian. What is the Parivar groaning about?

I suspect it is a lack of its own historians.
See. I have heard this from seculars many times. Bad Sanghi, Bad Hindus. Etc. No secular have the guts to say anything against followers of religion of peace. The Parivar is groaning about the the Indian Secular Logic. Only statements.

@Joe Shearer

Leftists in India are presently fighting for their own political survival
So leftist historians have become fossilized and irrelevant

Anyway there is a BIG India outside Bengal which cares for the truth
not the distilled version of leftist historians
See the titles of those Historians. Sugato "Bose ", Then "Dasgupta". He he he. That is why Bengal is the one of the best Indian Secular state.
 
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lolz.. headline should be..'pro sanghi man appointed as ICHR member calls leftists jihad friendly'. Why hide the clown behind 'ICHR member' facade.

Anyone opposing leftists (the same organizations that has used its guise to blame our troops in our country falsely) is sanghi?
 
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Well, yes, precisely. Your point being?

You seem to have lost track of the fact that the question of famines was brought in to illustrate that dips in demographic growth occurred as much in British times as they did earlier.

My point is rather simple. That the blame for the population dip is put on the door steps of those who invaded and then destroyed India.

You seem to cloud and obfuscate the fact that the dip in demographics occurred DURING British Time and for which they are held accountable.

The Dip before that is due to Islamic invasion and its aftermath and blame is assigned accordingly.

Finally NOT all dip in demographics was due to Famine, a Large Chunk of it was due to Large scale killing, Wars and related Deaths.

I would ask the the RSS fan boys to give it a a rest. You are literally engaging a person with a history major, with a knack for history !!

And that is his biggest weakness. A history major educated in the Macaulay tradition and who made a career out of agreeing with "secular" coloured history of India do not command much respect.
 
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My point is rather simple. That the blame for the population dip is put on the door steps of those who invaded and then destroyed India.

You seem to cloud and obfuscate the fact that the dip in demographics occurred DURING British Time and for which they are held accountable.

The Dip before that is due to Islamic invasion and its aftermath and blame is assigned accordingly.

Finally NOT all dip in demographics was due to Famine, a Large Chunk of it was due to Large scale killing, Wars and related Deaths.



And that is his biggest weakness. A history major educated in the Macaulay tradition and who made a career out of agreeing with "secular" coloured history of India do not command much respect.

India was conquered because they were militarily weak. When muslim rulers were weak they were defeated by the Mongols in Arabia and by a few hundreds Brits in India. This is how the world was, and to some extent remain so these days.

Stop whining about some events that happened because your ancestors were not strong enough to defend themselves.
 
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India was conquered because they were militarily weak. When muslim rulers were weak they were defeated by the Mongols in Arabia and by a few hundreds Brits in India. This is how the world was, and to some extent remain so these days.

Stop whining about some events that happened because your ancestors were not strong enough to defend themselves.

:lol: ..... MY Ancestors held strong, it was YOUR ancestors who were NOT STRONG ENOUGH to defend themselves and their beliefs. LOL.

India was conquered because we lived in civilized times till the barbarians from a different era and geography invaded and shocked us with their brutality and savagery. We remained strong since most of the soldiers in the Mughal army were HINDUS. Same being true for the sepoys in the British Army.

Only the Ruler/Head changed and when the Hindu's realized that the new heads did not believe in the Hindu value system they revolted and took back our culture, our lives and our destiny. From Shivaji to 1857 to Gandhi.

You are the one Whining when the HIndus are taking back what is ours ............. now like your ancestors, better join the winning team. :P
 
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@Joe Shearer

Leftists in India are presently fighting for their own political survival
So leftist historians have become fossilized and irrelevant

Anyway there is a BIG India outside Bengal which cares for the truth
not the distilled version of leftist historians


I propose @joe shearar for ASHISH NANDY AWARDS 2015.

He's the closest we've got to ashish nandy here on PDF, in fact he may well even be the real Ashish nandy in disguise who knows :o:
 
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I propose @joe shearar for ASHISH NANDY AWARDS 2015.

He's the closest we've got to ashish nandy here on PDF, in fact he may well even be the real Ashish nandy in disguise who knows :o:

You may like to Correct his name in your post

You have not tagged him correctly ; so he will not get the message
 
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Why people inside bengal aren't interested ?:undecided:

@Mike_Brando kya ye sach he ? :(
Well,the truth is the average "intellectual" Bengali man is still a die-hard commie in his heart.It's only that the TMC is in the power now and hence the "Intellectual" Bengali class has no other option than to support the ruling party for their very own survival.The roots of communism has already spread too deep inside the middle class "Intellectual" Bengali society to be wiped out at any time soon.These "Bhadrolok"(gentlemen) Bengalis are still living inside their wet dreams where they are still able to implement the ideas of communism among the entire society(something which even the USSR failed to do despite being an official communist country).Bengali "Bhadroloks" are still dreaming of a spectacular comeback by the CP(I)M led Left Front coalition in the upcoming assembly election.
 
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Anyone opposing leftists (the same organizations that has used its guise to blame our troops in our country falsely) is sanghi?
oh the irony .. tagging everybody as leftist, terrorist sympathizer, adarshliberal... :p:
 
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:lol: ..... MY Ancestors held strong, it was YOUR ancestors who were NOT STRONG ENOUGH to defend themselves and their beliefs. LOL.

India was conquered because we lived in civilized times till the barbarians from a different era and geography invaded and shocked us with their brutality and savagery. We remained strong since most of the soldiers in the Mughal army were HINDUS. Same being true for the sepoys in the British Army.

Only the Ruler/Head changed and when the Hindu's realized that the new heads did not believe in the Hindu value system they revolted and took back our culture, our lives and our destiny. From Shivaji to 1857 to Gandhi.

You are the one Whining when the HIndus are taking back what is ours ............. now like your ancestors, better join the winning team. :P

If India in this present time doesn't have any muslim problem ( as your kind claims) or christian missionary issues, the civilized Hindus ( just for the sheer fact that they are human beings) will go back to the days of fighting among themselves probably using caste-ism. When you have no one else to fight against, you fight among yourselves. The upper caste will find a way to rule the lower causing a fracture in the fragile unity.

The mongols destroyed Arabiya when Muslim civilization was probably at its zenith. The Mongols were barbarians or not is irrelevant, they were out there to conquer nations. They did just that.
 
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