How PAF Should Counter the SU-30 MKI

[paul106]

The JF17 is a half-half JV project by China and Pakistan, we are equal on this one. JF-17 is a product required by PAF to suit its cost effective and high-performance doctrine. If PAF is as rich as PLAAF, they will choose go for J10b or J11B as well. But the maintenance and operation fees of those duo engine fighers could kill PAF befire it give a strike to IAF, hope you understand that. PLAAF will phase out J7 and replacing it by J10A and B VERSION for your notice. Read more before you post nonsense here. The bold shows your instigation skill sucks! The best one is what suits you the most, remember it as always.
JF17 is ready to export to BD now, what you say? PAF will enjoy the luxrious profit it gains from exporting JF17, and go for whatever they like with these hard cash.

1. read my post gain i have written customer/partner. customer in the seance your half work/product.
2. agree pak is not rich as china. but as per my knowledge pak is taking JF17 on loan, not on hard cash.
3. true. that means JF17 is not suite to China. even as point defense role. so JF17 is sub-standard. J11b and J10 is par on expectation.

mate i am not here to argue. as i am neither interested in defense nor defense personal. i am instructor/tutor for business management. I visit this page forum because i want to understand the debating ability of south asian and tolerance as it will be useful in my research and teaching. generally i dont post, I just observe and do my research. but from your post i liked to play with you so i did. mate take my free advise you need to improve lot in your interpersonal skills.

on this forum i have encountered your posts are some of the most inefficients and i clearly judge your ability of debate.

best of luck for your future.

I rest my case. and thanks for being one of the candidate.

 

[帅的一匹]

So you mean to say that Pakistan cannot defend all by itself? India is a sovereign nation, It has the right to buy or sell arms to any country as per International norms. Friendship is a requirement but not an exchange to your integrity.

Similarly Large number of funds and weaponry are gifted and sold by the United States to Pakistan, does that make Pakistan less friendly to you. Why does the attitude change when Pakistan is replaced with India?

I'm not say anything fuzz about India buying weapons from USA, it's your right and choice.

 

[IndianArmy]

I'm not say anything fuzz about India buying weapons from USA, it's your right and choice.

You made it look as though we did a crime, anyways thanks for the debate.

 

[帅的一匹]

1. read my post gain i have written customer/partner. customer in the seance your half work/product.
2. agree pak is not rich as china. but as per my knowledge pak is taking JF17 on loan, not on hard cash.
3. true. that means JF17 is not suite to China. even as point defense role. so JF17 is sub-standard. J11b and J10 is par on expectation.

mate i am not here to argue. as i am neither interested in defense nor defense personal. i am instructor/tutor for business management. I visit this page forum because i want to understand the debating ability of south asian and tolerance as it will be useful in my research and teaching. generally i dont post, I just observe and do my research. but from your post i liked to play with you so i did. mate take my free advise you need to improve lot in your interpersonal skills.

on this forum i have encountered your posts are some of the most inefficients and i clearly judge your ability of debate.

best of luck for your future.

I rest my case. and thanks for being one of the candidate.

Since when China is a south Asian country? better reinforce your geo knowledge before doing any research here.
Oh, you are not convincing me before you left here. Try it agian some other time. Good luck to you as well as a tutor for business management.

You can not even spell freedom right. Its symbol of status of freedom of speech in China

My typo leads to a chance of your trolling, sorry man.

 

[bloo]

The only option for PAF is J-20, that is IF it ever is purchased.
Coz the Su-30MKI will evolve further(Super-30 program) so a short term deterrence for the MKI is literally impossible for PAF.

 

[Hobo1]

JF17 is actually the huge advantage PAF has toward IAF, i'm here to delivery my appreciation of JF17's importance to PAF. Why so many Indians member are keen to bring in LCA when they got fleet of MKI and Rafale, cause it's cheaper and sanction free.
PAF made it step ahead of IAF to bring in JF17. At the time of LCA induction, JF17 will have becomed a mature battle platform in PAF.

PAF hopes JF17 be as good as Mig29s whose much improved version India Mig35 India didn't even bothers at during MRCA. For IAF JF17 is nothing ,our current inventory of Mig29s and M2k is enough for them.
IAF is worried with JF17 because Pakistan has always indulged in militry misadventures like Kargil and war of 65 when ever the felt a bit confident.

The JF-17 is an outdated design LCA is much better and mature platform. PAF cannot afford any decent 4th gen plane thatswhy they are hang Ho about a plane which they are virtually getting for free.

 

[ice_man]

PAF hopes JF17 be as good as Mig29s whose much improved version India Mig35 India didn't even bothers at during MRCA. For IAF JF17 is nothing ,our current inventory of Mig29s and M2k is enough for them.
IAF is worried with JF17 because Pakistan has always indulged in militry misadventures like Kargil and war of 65 when ever the felt a bit confident.

The JF-17 is an outdated design LCA is much better and mature platform. PAF cannot afford any decent 4th gen plane thatswhy they are hang Ho about a plane which they are virtually getting for free.

thanks for sharing your bharat raaakshaak info with us!

JF-17 is truly a game changer in the india pak scenario! it gives PAF a true BVR paltform for air defence needs! this was not the case till the introduction of JF-17. Mirages,F7s were no match for the IAF however, with the introduction of JF-17 the game has changed considerably.

 

[Viper0011.]

As a matter of fact, the rising disparity between India and Pakistan is forcing Pakistan to agree to more and more on what India wants. Part of the coercive strategy is to keep increasing the difference in the size of the gun and the body/economy to sustain it. Working brilliantly for the last decade. Why should there be peace on equal terms between two highly unequal countries especially when both have committed the same kinds of wrongs.

If people with this mentality exist in the Indian army's top leadership. Then good luck to the South Asia. You are SADLY mistaken if you think that Pakistan is bowing down to your pressure or is accepting you as a big brother. If you talk to them being someone from the US government, the ONLY enemy they think they have...is India. So, let me assure you, try not to run with your crazy logic. I am sure you'll destroy Pakistan but be ready to go back to pre 1950's India too. I don't understand why you guys are so stupid* at times. Is this all a joke for you guys filled with fantasy Indian supremacy?? There are HUNDREDS of NUKES involved in this. There is no 'Winner' here. The whole talk about disparity between conventional arms, etc, doesn't apply here. I don't think anyone thinks there will be a next 'conventional' war. It'll just be a mother of all wars and it'll kill hundreds of millions of people. So get off the supremacy horse and look around you and your geography. Try to work things out with peace. Not with this attitude of yours reflected in your post above. That'll hurt many innocent poor people who don't deserve another war!!!

 

[Gentelman]

PAF hopes JF17 be as good as Mig29s whose much improved version India Mig35 India didn't even bothers at during MRCA. For IAF JF17 is nothing ,our current inventory of Mig29s and M2k is enough for them.
IAF is worried with JF17 because Pakistan has always indulged in militry misadventures like Kargil and war of 65 when ever the felt a bit confident.

The JF-17 is an outdated design LCA is much better and mature platform. PAF cannot afford any decent 4th gen plane thatswhy they are hang Ho about a plane which they are virtually getting for free.

hahaha bloody rasca** always try to troll...
in every PAF,PA and PN post.....
and chk out their senve...they always compare a plane under development with a plane in service....
they will tell stories to their kids...
JF-17 destroyds IAF coz LCA a mature platform was umder development...lolzzzzz..
step aside bro...
if it is soo outdated then why it was a big concern to russia fot its sale of MIG series??

 

[SQ8]

1. read my post gain i have written customer/partner. customer in the seance your half work/product.
2. agree pak is not rich as china. but as per my knowledge pak is taking JF17 on loan, not on hard cash.
3. true. that means JF17 is not suite to China. even as point defense role. so JF17 is sub-standard. J11b and J10 is par on expectation.

mate i am not here to argue. as i am neither interested in defense nor defense personal. i am instructor/tutor for business management. I visit this page forum because i want to understand the debating ability of south asian and tolerance as it will be useful in my research and teaching. generally i dont post, I just observe and do my research. but from your post i liked to play with you so i did. mate take my free advise you need to improve lot in your interpersonal skills.

on this forum i have encountered your posts are some of the most inefficients and i clearly judge your ability of debate.

best of luck for your future.

I rest my case. and thanks for being one of the candidate.

Then you are making a flawed assumption based on your own field.
Within Business management there is also something known as managerial decisions and for that you try to maximize the contribution you are able to receive within your budget.
So if Product A and B are better suited for your immediate needs would you still go for product C when you can afford product A and B and their overall contribution to your capabilities will be greater than including product C within that budget?
The J-10 serves as a better replacement for the F-7 than the JF-17 since the Chinese have the budget for it.
The same way the F-16 served as a better candidate for airforces as compared to the F-20 tigershark.
The US has not bought the block-60 variant of the F-16.. does that mean that the USAF considers it inferior or that it is hedging its bets on the F-35?
Different "organizations" ..different environments...different needs.. different budgets...different decisions.

As for your last part, if you are here for the discussion.. you arent exactly setting a good example for yourself either.
If this is the level of BM being taught in NZ.. than god help the kiwis.

The only option for PAF is J-20, that is IF it ever is purchased.
Coz the Su-30MKI will evolve further(Super-30 program) so a short term deterrence for the MKI is literally impossible for PAF.

PAF hopes JF17 be as good as Mig29s whose much improved version India Mig35 India didn't even bothers at during MRCA. For IAF JF17 is nothing ,our current inventory of Mig29s and M2k is enough for them.
IAF is worried with JF17 because Pakistan has always indulged in militry misadventures like Kargil and war of 65 when ever the felt a bit confident.

The JF-17 is an outdated design LCA is much better and mature platform. PAF cannot afford any decent 4th gen plane thatswhy they are hang Ho about a plane which they are virtually getting for free.

Posts like these dont deserve a reply. And in this case I am inclined to think that there is little more than jingoism in them.
please refrain from posting in this thread while it is being cleaned up from the likes of Jingos from both sides.

 

[batmannow]

wanglaokan dear friend!

Actually J16 will give pakistan the ability to take down MKI, with mucher lower RCS with intake shape redesign and using new composite material,EOTS,FLIR, AESA radar, with a combat radius of 1500km with fullload of 12 tons, DUO WS10A engine with 132KN each(duo WS15 with 160KN power per after 2015). Actually J-16 has surpaseed existing IAF MKI fleet, except for the TV engine. PLA will handle those MKI with Superior BVR capable J16.
Mostly importantly, J16 could be packed with China weapon suite, YJ-62,YJ83, SD10A,PL-9, PL12, PL21 and CM-400AKG. I thought its a overkill for IAF to take.
To batmannow bhaiya, J31 STEALTHY one is a better choice for PAF to go for cause it will provide PAF Asymmetric advantage toward IAF. My sugestion to PAF:
a feet consist of large number of JF17 block 2, and 5 squadrons of J10b with existing F16 block 50, and go for J31 directly. Know why India bring in Rafale so hurry, 2 reason:
1. China knows SU30mk SERIES so deep, no secret of MKI before PLA(especially the case when PLA induct SU35 super flanker)
2. PAF WILL get FC20.

thanks for the post!


so what i assume is J-16s are the most gettable option PAF has in its , closed fists technicly, J-31 s are future in case IAF, getting rafeals?

 

[Storm Force]

SO IT SEEMS WE HAVE THE ANSWERS FROM BATMANNOW & HIS FRIEND wanglaokan....

J16 a brand new Flanker with reduced RCS and superior weapons & radars will be the answer to IAF SU30MKI

LETS JUST hope that the IAF and indeed the RUSSIANS do not start some ambitious programme to upgrade their existinf fleet of 157 SU30MKI delivvered already with a AESA radar. reduced RCS programme through ram coating & new EW suites and a new rangle of RAMJET BVR missles like NOVATOR...

oh hang on " somebody just showed me this

Armed with 5G jet features, Super Sukhoi on the way... | Russia & India Report

oh my GOD the damn indians & russians have started to induct fifth gen features to those already delivered 157 su30mki

AND WE ARE STIL TALKING ABOUT J16 as been the correct answer to MKI

Sorry to be sarcastic

in warefare NOTHING STANDS STILL

su30mki is the backbone of the IAF already

THEY WILL ADD T50/FGFA technology to this jet at which point there will be little to choose between the

SUPER SUKHOI SU30MKI & SU35B OR THE F15 SILENT EAGLE & F18 SUPERHORNETS

Armed with 5G jet features, Super Sukhoi on the way... | Russia & India Report

a serious question HAVE THE PAF found the real answer to this current threat of SU30MKI & will they get the answer to the SUPER SUKHOI SU30MKI which is only 12-24 months away ...
http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian...grade-80-su-30mkis-super-sukhoi-standard.html

 

[batmannow]

SO IT SEEMS WE HAVE THE ANSWERS FROM BATMANNOW & HIS FRIEND wanglaokan....

J16 a brand new Flanker with reduced RCS and superior weapons & radars will be the answer to IAF SU30MKI

LETS JUST hope that the IAF and indeed the RUSSIANS do not start some ambitious programme to upgrade their existinf fleet of 157 SU30MKI delivvered already with a AESA radar. reduced RCS programme through ram coating & new EW suites and a new rangle of RAMJET BVR missles like NOVATOR...

oh hang on " somebody just showed me this

Armed with 5G jet features, Super Sukhoi on the way... | Russia & India Report

oh my GOD the damn indians & russians have started to induct fifth gen features to those already delivered 157 su30mki

AND WE ARE STIL TALKING ABOUT J16 as been the correct answer to MKI

Sorry to be sarcastic

in warefare NOTHING STANDS STILL

su30mki is the backbone of the IAF already

THEY WILL ADD T50/FGFA technology to this jet at which point there will be little to choose between the

SUPER SUKHOI SU30MKI & SU35B OR THE F15 SILENT EAGLE & F18 SUPERHORNETS

Armed with 5G jet features, Super Sukhoi on the way... | Russia & India Report

a serious question HAVE THE PAF found the real answer to this current threat of SU30MKI & will they get the answer to the SUPER SUKHOI SU30MKI which is only 12-24 months away ...
http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian...grade-80-su-30mkis-super-sukhoi-standard.html

Armed with 5G jet features, Super Sukhoi on the way...
September 12, 2011 Sergei Ptichkin

SUPER SUKHOI SU30MKI which is only 12-24 months away ...

that was September 12, 2011, & this is december 16th 2012? so where it is?lol
is it also from some one said or you can show us delivery notice?
ADD T50/FGFA technology to this jet
why thn to spend huge funds on T50/FGFA?
any way we got the answer, J-16 now even you put a rapptor,s A..S into it, still it wiould be called a SU-30MKIiiiiiiiiiiiii , its up to you how many of iiis you can put in it?lol

 

[Storm Force]

BATMANN

The message is clear for everyone.

THE SU30MKI will celebrate a FULL DECADE of service next year.. in 2013.

The programme has been a MASSIVE SUCCESS with 157 jets in service as we speak and growing year in year out.

AS YOU CAN SEE they have already started the MLU pgramme to reduce RCS add AESA radars and new EW SUITES and new ramjet missles. THIS WILL COST OVER $2 BILLION over the next 5 years on all 270 jets.

TO DATE PAF is stil looking at suitable answers to the original SU30MKI FROM 2003 AND THE INDIANS ARE ENTERING into the SUPER SU30MKI ...

i ask again is the JF17 & small fleet of F16s enough ????????/

 

[Contrarian]

If people with this mentality exist in the Indian army's top leadership. Then good luck to the South Asia. You are SADLY mistaken if you think that Pakistan is bowing down to your pressure or is accepting you as a big brother. If you talk to them being someone from the US government, the ONLY enemy they think they have...is India. So, let me assure you, try not to run with your crazy logic. I am sure you'll destroy Pakistan but be ready to go back to pre 1950's India too. I don't understand why you guys are so stupid* at times. Is this all a joke for you guys filled with fantasy Indian supremacy?? There are HUNDREDS of NUKES involved in this. There is no 'Winner' here. The whole talk about disparity between conventional arms, etc, doesn't apply here. I don't think anyone thinks there will be a next 'conventional' war. It'll just be a mother of all wars and it'll kill hundreds of millions of people. So get off the supremacy horse and look around you and your geography. Try to work things out with peace. Not with this attitude of yours reflected in your post above. That'll hurt many innocent poor people who don't deserve another war!!!

Maybe you didn't get my post. I never talked about war. I said there should not be a treaty of peace based on equality between India and Pakistan as they are unequal on every respect.

India has demanded trade and visa liberalization with Pakistan for decades. Pakistan in turn demanded Kashmir to be solved before any of these things ie trade or visa.
India demanded joint authentication of agpl in siachen as a precondition for Indian withdrawal. Pakistan rejected it for years saying it cannot agree to signing an agpl.

Guess what - Pakistan is going ahead with trade, already signed visa treaty with us, agreed to sign agpl in track 2 in siachen.
All this while agreeing that Kashmir should be kept on the backburner. Exactly what India wanted for decades and exactly what Pakistan army did not want for decades. I see India getting what it wants from Pakistan without compromising. This is what I mean peace treaty not based on idea of equality but a hard acknowledgement of the difference today between India and Pakistan.

And the reason for this is India's economy providing global diplomatic weight and stronger military capability acting as coercive agents.