How much of Pakistani culture is Indian?

[ajtr]

Sati was a rare practice done only on childless widows. In ancient India Sati was not widespread.

Was there anything like sati or johar or equivalent custom before muslim invaders started arriving in subcontinent?

That's the third option.

nope there are only two options as 0 or 1 as in binary system.

 

[INDIC]

But the Bull is more Zoroastrian.

So did you guys come from us, or did we come from you?

I don't know doc, but I read that pre-Zoroastrian polytheist Iran had many common gods with Hinduism.

 

[AnnoyingOrange]

Was there anything like sati or johar or equivalent custom before muslim invaders started arriving in subcontinent?

No... The Sati Pratha.... was started in states like Rajasthan at the time of Muslim invaders started to attack their States at that time. It existed primarily in Rajput families and Villages and Kingdoms.... to avoid their women from falling into hands of Muslim invaders and ill-treated.... as soon as news of their army losing to Muslim invaders would reach to their Palaces their would be huge fires burnt in open spaces and women would willingly walk into them to save their self from invaders.

 

[INDIC]

Was there anything like sati or johar or equivalent custom before muslim invaders started arriving in subcontinent?

Ancient India was more liberal, by the medieval time Hinduism become more conservative and introvert.

 

[kumarkumar1867]

Was there anything like sati or johar or equivalent custom before muslim invaders started arriving in subcontinent?

Yes Sati did.
Moghul Emperors especially Aurangazeb was strong opponent of this practice.

But Johar started when invaders started arriving in subcontinent

 

[kumarkumar1867]

No... The Sati Pratha.... was started in states like Rajasthan at the time of Muslim invaders started to attack their States at that time. It existed primarily in Rajput families and Villages and Kingdoms.... to avoid their women from falling into hands of Muslim invaders and ill-treated.... as soon as news of their army losing to Muslim invaders would reach to their Palaces their would be huge fires burnt in open spaces and women would willingly walk into them to save their self from invaders.

You are talking about JOHAR.
Sati Pratha was very different from this.

 

[ajtr]

Yes Sati did.
Moghul Emperors especially Aurangazeb was strong opponent of this practice.

But Johar started when invaders started arriving in subcontinent

Actually Aurangazeb was the greatest social reformer who took birth on the indian soil.

 

[INDIC]

No... The Sati Pratha.... was started in states like Rajasthan at the time of Muslim invaders started to attack their States at that time. It existed primarily in Rajput families and Villages and Kingdoms.... to avoid their women from falling into hands of Muslim invaders and ill-treated.... as soon as news of their army losing to Muslim invaders would reach to their Palaces their would be huge fires burnt in open spaces and women would willingly walk into them to save their self from invaders.

Sati was practiced only by High caste Hindus in North India and it was absent in South. It got more widespread in medieval time.

 

[SQ8]

Islam is alien to Indian lands, people, and culture.

That's all I said.

You like 500 million more of you have accepted and internalized it.

It still does not make it indigenous.

Never will.

Why does that make me a bigot?

I come from different racial stock to the rest of you guys.

I recognize my faith is alien to this land.

Yet I am comfortable with both, and it does not in any way make me feel a molecule less Indian than 1.2 billion more Indians.

Please take your bigotry comment back.

I do not take your faith as Alien to this land..
How are Parsis Alien to this land after having been here for ages..
In that manner.. even the Buddist faith.. or Hinduism is Alien..
All encompass elements taken from lands there were outside along with within.
Your definition of Alien would hold true if everything originated wholly and solely from within a section without even a hint of outside influence.

But if you wish to take origin as the concept of Alien.. then yes.. My faith is Alien.
But then so is my blood.. so are a hundred different things in India Alien.. which are not Alien anymore.

And my bigotry comment was directed at this sentence of yours stated in a different form directing Islam as the exception to this rule

Yet I am comfortable with both, and it does not in any way make me feel a molecule less Indian than 1.2 billion more Indians.

Do you pray as the Hindu Indian? or as the Muslim Indian.. ? Or do you dress as the Village Indian ?
You may not feel a molecule less.. but you do have molecules that are different from them.. and you have molecules that are common to them. Failing to acknowledge either.. is suppressing who you are as a person.
Your molecules are the result of a successful reaction between Alien molecules and local molecules.. something worked.
The same happened with Islam.. it did work.. people did convert.. now there were benign chemical reactions(Preachers,Sufi Saints)..and exothermic ones..destructive ones(Invaders).. but in the end.. a product was formed.. which has the characteristics of both the host and Alien entity...but it thrives in this environment called the subcontinent... it is natural to it.

Now.. if someone tries to forcibly remove a molecule.. or add a molecule to you... it may lead to bad consequences..You will resist..maybe even go nuclear.

I cannot be asked to remove the identity that my being a Muslim gives me and differentiates me from the rest of this worlds other inhabitants that practice other religions.. I will resist any attempts to be told to discard it in order to "blend in" more than I already do.

I am what I am.. a molecule of this subcontinent.. and I have a lot in common with you.. a lot of atoms.
but at the same time.. I am also different from you...because of other elements that went into my creation.. and I cannot be asked to ditch that identity either.
So the question now is.. just as you have adjusted to be packed in with the other 1.2 billion Molecules.. some heaving and shoving to find their best fit.. some that broke away for they could not fit as such ..others added and removed elements and did adjust ..
and created the macro molecules of India and Pakistan.. each with its own stable and unstable characteristics..
Should you consider anything alien.. or original?

After all.. there are over a hundred elements in the periodic table, each with differing characteristics.. not all react.. not all react to form stable compounds..
But the reaction is still ongoing....
to blame it on a single element.. when hundreds have come and gone before it even existed in the sub-continent.. and have had worse effects.. is unfair.

And when life did begin in the sea.. should the salamander start telling the elephant they are alien to the land because they were here first? Or does the Shark have greater right in telling the whale to get lost because its an outsider?

And I almost lost myself there..

 

[AnnoyingOrange]

You are talking about JOHAR.
Sati Pratha was very different from this.

Oh yes...thanks for correcting me there.....got that mixed up...History lesson Class 8 ...1989...long time buddy....long time.

 

[vsdoc]

I don't know doc, but I read that pre-Zoroastrian polytheist Iran had many common gods with Hinduism.

Actually we were one and we became katti is some major f-up and parted ways.

So much so that your devas were our daevas (devils), and your asuras were our ahuras (lesser Gods).

 

[kumarkumar1867]

Actually Aurangazeb was the greatest social reformer who took birth on the indian soil.

Yes may be if we talk about Sati thing but he was also a greatest religious bigot & radical who took birth on Indian soil.

You should read about prosecution of Raje Sambhaji & ninth Sikh Guru, Guru Tegh Bahadur which ultimatley caused the end of mughal empire.

 

[Bang Galore]

Regardless, we need to be thankful to the British for banning Sati and to men like General Sir Charles Napier whose words to Hindu priests complaining about the ban on Sati became a legend

-"Be it so. This burning of widows is your custom; prepare the funeral pile. But my nation has also a custom. When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs."

 

[vsdoc]

Oscar bro, aap to senti ho gaye.

I am not a anti-Muslim bigot.

You and others can keep labeling me that, I (and my Muslim friends) know better.

I am a sanki bawa who has pretty strong views on loyalty, gratitude, brotherhood, tolerance, independence, and pride.

As well as on fairplay, right and wrong, and paying one's dues before resting easy.

My rants are better read in that backlight.

But if it suits you to label me a bigot, so be it.

 

[Black Widow]

How much of Pakistani culture is Indian?


What is Pakistani Culture??? If you are talking bout IVC culture, Its Hindu and Indian culture.

If you are talking bout Islamic culture then I must tell you "except Muhammad and Koran, nothing is Islamic", everything is copied from one or other religion.