How much of Pakistani culture is Indian?

[SQ8]

Not to mention that the "Om" chant (like many ancient Avestan chants) has very strong vibrations.

You cannot simply replace it with a version of your belief system and expect it to work.

Man Oscar seriously ...... am sure you were not serious on that one?

Then again, you probably were.

Why cant you?
Have you ever seen a Zikr? that too has very strong vibrations.. and you really cant figure out what frequency is that makes us resonate.. To each their own..
It works for me.. and helps me in my day.. which means Im probably doing something right.

When you leave that perception of Alien entity(based on your personal exp.. and not on historical references.. or the personal exp of many others given the right content).. you will find that there is a lot you have to discover about Islam.
You dont have to convert for that.. just as I dont have to renounce Islam to be able to practice Yoga after Fajr Prayers.

 

[AnnoyingOrange]

Unfortunately.. that is another problem..
India was as India was defined by Nehru.. and he was around to see it through the foundation years.
The same cannot be said for Pakistan.. Jinnah died..his otherwise scheming but still half-principled deputy assassinated.. the original Muslim League leadership put on the sidelines.. Pakistan never became the Pakistan of M.A Jinnah from the day he died.

Fine.. no problem.. whats been done as been done..
NOW WHAT?..
It is foolish to assume that the Pakistan of Jinnah can ever be dug out or redeemed again.. Its dead.. its gone.. for now until miracles come forth.
Now is the Pakistan we must define today.. and define in identity..
if we wish to take on the identity of Maududi and his inspired religious bigotry then we SHOULD.. if its by popular vote.. then dont feel guilty about it.
If we wish to create a somewhat rightwing feudal democracy then accept it.. instead of trying to justify Islam in it... Islam does not hold any love for feudalism.
If we wish a Military state with an extreme rightwing Shariah compliant dictator and are willing to take the burdens that come with it.
Then so be it.. its by popular demand.. and people should not feel apologetic for who they are.
Those that oppose it .. should learn to adapt to the majority.. or in the words of our erstwhile PM.. "They should leave, who is stopping them".

Dilly dallying over whether we are some Islamic IVC leftover Aryan blooded Afghan Arabs is really not going to take this country anywhere.

Now that's the way to go...if you dig out history, the only thing you will find is corpses and remains ... not good enough to make a future....start today..and make a future for yourself ...today.

 

[Bang Galore]

I have a blood pressure problem and it has got worse.

It will only get even worse if you insist on crossing swords with people for whom "History" is an article of faith. As a faith, it has no use for facts. Their" belief" is unshakeable & no amount of throwing facts in their face will change that.

 

[Srinivas]

Unfortunately.. that is another problem..
India was as India was defined by Nehru.. and he was around to see it through the foundation years.
The same cannot be said for Pakistan.. Jinnah died..his otherwise scheming but still half-principled deputy assassinated.. the original Muslim League leadership put on the sidelines.. Pakistan never became the Pakistan of M.A Jinnah from the day he died.

Fine.. no problem.. whats been done as been done..
NOW WHAT?..
It is foolish to assume that the Pakistan of Jinnah can ever be dug out or redeemed again.. Its dead.. its gone.. for now until miracles come forth.
Now is the Pakistan we must define today.. and define in identity..
if we wish to take on the identity of Maududi and his inspired religious bigotry then we SHOULD.. if its by popular vote.. then dont feel guilty about it.
If we wish to create a somewhat rightwing feudal democracy then accept it.. instead of trying to justify Islam in it... Islam does not hold any love for feudalism.
If we wish a Military state with an extreme rightwing Shariah compliant dictator and are willing to take the burdens that come with it.
Then so be it.. its by popular demand.. and people should not feel apologetic for who they are.
Those that oppose it .. should learn to adapt to the majority.. or in the words of our erstwhile PM.. "They should leave, who is stopping them".

Dilly dallying over whether we are some Islamic IVC leftover Aryan blooded Afghan Arabs is really not going to take this country anywhere.

Pakistan went into the hands of bureaucrats and soldiers after Jinnah's death. Those guys did maximum damage in the bilateral relationship with India.

 

[vsdoc]

Why cant you?
Have you ever seen a Zikr? that too has very strong vibrations.. and you really cant figure out what frequency is that makes us resonate.. To each their own..
It works for me.. and helps me in my day.. which means Im probably doing something right.

When you leave that perception of Alien entity(based on your personal exp.. and not on historical references.. or the personal exp of many others given the right content).. you will find that there is a lot you have to discover about Islam.
You dont have to convert for that.. just as I dont have to renounce Islam to be able to practice Yoga after Fajr Prayers.

Islam is alien to Indian lands, people, and culture.

That's all I said.

You like 500 million more of you have accepted and internalized it.

It still does not make it indigenous.

Never will.

Why does that make me a bigot?

I come from different racial stock to the rest of you guys.

I recognize my faith is alien to this land.

Yet I am comfortable with both, and it does not in any way make me feel a molecule less Indian than 1.2 billion more Indians.

Please take your bigotry comment back.

 

[SQ8]

Pakistan went into the hands of bureaucrats and soldiers after Jinnah's death. Those guys did maximum damage in the bilateral relationship with India.

Not even soldiers.. cowards.. the actual soldiers died and bled on the front.
Ayub Khan chickened out in Burma and refused to lead a charge of his fellow Indians against the Japanese.
And then this man was expected to provide leadership in a strategic coup-de-tat against India in Kashmir??

 

[Jackdaws]

Not even soldiers.. cowards.. the actual soldiers died and bled on the front.
Ayub Khan chickened out in Burma and refused to lead a charge of his fellow Indians against the Japanese.
And then this man was expected to provide leadership in a strategic coup-de-tat against India in Kashmir??

If I remember correctly, it was either Ayub or Yahya who bought a motorbike from Maneckshaw and did not pay him.

 

[vsdoc]

If I remember correctly, it was either Ayub or Yahya who bought a motorbike from Maneckshaw and did not pay him.

That's way enough reason for any Parsi to go to war.

 

[Bang Galore]

Unfortunately.. that is another problem..

Forget other earlier problems. Pakistan's current problem stems from the fact that there are too few "Oscars" & too many of the...err.."others"

 

[INDIC]

yes and those IVC DRAVIDIAN PEOPLE were not hindu and the land was not called hindustan .........

Truth is Hinduism evolved from the religion of IVC. Either it is swastika, or meditation in Hinduism, the Pashupati etc.

 

[kumarkumar1867]

Forget other earlier problems. Pakistan's current problem stems from the fact that there are too few "Oscars" & too many of the...err.."others"

I second that

 

[vsdoc]

Truth is Hinduism evolved from the religion of IVC. Either it is swastika, or meditation in Hinduism, the Pashupati etc.

But the Bull is more Zoroastrian.

So did you guys come from us, or did we come from you?

 

[INDIC]

Didn't do so.. for a very long time.. infact brought in a lot of converts who were tired of their daughters being burnt right after their old husbands died.

Sati was a rare practice done only on childless widows. In ancient India Sati was not widespread.

 

[ajtr]

But the Bull is more Zoroastrian.

So did you guys come from us, or did we come from you?

How can either of you come from each other with huge IVC muslim pakistan between you both.

 

[vsdoc]

How can either of you come from each other with huge IVC muslim pakistan between you both.

That's the third option.

Pakistan bein midway between Asia Minor and the Gangetic plains in the tug o war between AIT and OOI.