How come Iran/Persia never became an Arab/Arabized Nation?

[Pakistanisage]

Yes, but Ferdowsi is the one who came first. His whole mission was to save the Persian language, which he accomplished with the Shahnameh. The rest of the poets you mentioned built on the foundations that Ferdowsi laid.

I agree with you Shahin.

But the ones that followed were GIANTS in Persian Poetry in their own right.

 

[Serpentine]

It depends on your definition of Arabize. The arabs did not even enter their cities for anything but taxes after they had captured Persia and kept to their garrisons they built for themselves. The Ummayads when they took over wanted the money the taxes were providing so they did not encourage any conversions but eventually Persians started converting anyway.

There were many uprisings in Khorasan,Tabarestan, Atropatene (Azerbaijan),Pars and many other places of Persia against Arab rule,they were all put down by brute force. Umayids did try to enforce Arabic on the non-Arab lands they conquered,especially Iraq,Syria and Iran.

According to Bernard Lewis:

"Arab Muslims conquests have been variously seen in Iran: by some as a blessing, the advent of the true faith, the end of the age of ignorance and heathenism; by others as a humiliating national defeat, the conquest and subjugation of the country by foreign invaders. Both perceptions are of course valid, depending on one's angle of vision… Iran was indeed Islamized, but it was not Arabized. Persians remained Persians. And after an interval of silence, Iran reemerged as a separate, different and distinctive element within Islam, eventually adding a new element even to Islam itself. Culturally, politically, and most remarkable of all even religiously, the Iranian contribution to this new Islamic civilization is of immense importance. The work of Iranians can be seen in every field of cultural endeavor, including Arabic poetry, to which poets of Iranian origin composing their poems in Arabic made a very significant contribution. In a sense, Iranian Islam is a second advent of Islam itself, a new Islam sometimes referred to as Islam-i Ajam. It was this Persian Islam, rather than the original Arab Islam, that was brought to new areas and new peoples: to the Turks, first in Central Asia and then in the Middle East in the country which came to be called Turkey, and of course to India. The Ottoman Turks brought a form of Iranian civilization to the walls of Vienna."

It may not be all right, but it can shed some light on whole matter.

Iranians accepted Islam by their heart, not by force, the same way they didn't accept Arab culture (not that it's a bad culture,but it was totally different) which rulers tried to enforce.

 

[somebozo]

If that was the case why is it that when they removed the Ummayads, they remained Muslim? When they removed the Abbasids, they remained Muslim? When they removed the Samanids, they remained Muslim? When they removed the Ghaznavids, they remained Muslim?? When the Mongols destroyed the Khwarazmian dynasty and allowed Persians to choose their own religion why then did they once again choose Islam?? Would they have not finally rid themselves of its yoke if Islam was the problem??

Instead what happened? Persians remained proud Muslims and not only retained Islam but spread it to the Indian subcontinent, to the Turks, to China even. Islam is not an Arab religion, if it was it would have collapsed from within long ago. You may take your leave bozo.



You can google it for starters, google islamization of Iran. Next google conversion of Iran to shia islam. You will then see what happens when force really is applied on a losing nation back in those days.

By systematic genocide, enslavement and humiliation religion came to become main stay of Persian society because not everyone was able to emigrate out of Persia. However you should note that while Persia Islamized, they kept the rebellion up by adhering to different sect of Islam than the mainstream Arabs.

By the end of Ummayad empire, Persians were stripped of their pride, identity and heritage systematically!

 

[MilSpec]

Proud communities always have strong affinity to their culture.

Now we are opening a big can of worms!

 

[KingMamba]

By systematic genocide, enslavement and humiliation religion came to become main stay of Persian society because not everyone was able to emigrate out of Persia. However you should note that while Persia Islamized, they kept the rebellion up by adhering to different sect of Islam than the mainstream Arabs.

By the end of Ummayad empire, Persians were stripped of their pride, identity and heritage systematically!

Persians only became Shia hundreds of years later under the safavids, Persia was the seat of Sunni Islam ever since the Abbasids and the Arabs were also Sunni. Persian soldiers were instrumental in the overthrow of the Ummayads, they did not like the rulers but were proud Muslims. The Abbasids was a Persianized Arab caliphate and the capital was moved the Baghdad for that very reason. Most of the Abbasids soldiers were Persians. They never lost their pride, identity, or heritage.
@Era_923

 

[KS]

An example would be destruction of IVC by invading Aryans.

*Sigh*

I hope you were not serious.

 

[Aegis DDG]

They still celebrate Nowrez...

 

[KingMamba]

There were many uprisings in Khorasan,Tabarestan, Atropatene (Azerbaijan),Pars and many other places of Persia against Arab rule,they were all put down by brute force. Umayids did try to enforce Arabic on the non-Arab lands they conquered,especially Iraq,Syria and Iran.

According to Bernard Lewis:



It may not be all right, but it can shed some light on whole matter.

Iranians accepted Islam by their heart, not by force, the same way they didn't accept Arab culture (not that it's a bad culture,but it was totally different) which rulers tried to enforce.

If you read in the same place you got that quote, for the most part Arabs remained in their garrisons. The Ummayads learned really quickly that it was better for them to allow Persians to do whatever they wanted in exchange for taxes. Syria and Iraq already had many Arab tribes and that is one of the reasons those areas were invaded according to some historians. Yes there were revolts, there were bound to be as was the case in all conquered areas but you guys have moved on have you not??

 

[somebozo]

Persians only became Shia hundreds of years later under the safavids, Persia was the seat of Sunni Islam ever since the Abbasids and the Arabs were also Sunni. Persian soldiers were instrumental in the overthrow of the Ummayads, they did not like the rulers but were proud Muslims. The Abbasids was a Persianized Arab caliphate and the capital was moved the Baghdad for that very reason. Most of the Abbasids soldiers were Persians. They never lost their pride, identity, or heritage.
@Era_923

The Sunni strain in Iran was much more tolerant that the Arab version - in today's words think that Arabs are Salafis and Iranians were Sufis. Hence the skirmishes between Ummayads and Persia continued.

 

[Kambojaric]

The people in Mesopotamia and whole the western area until Morocco were arabized after the Muslims conquered Middle East and North Africa.


But the Persians still speak Farsi and Arabs in Persia/Iran number only 1-2 million out of 70 million Parsi, Azeris, Lurs etc ? Despite being practically the first Major power the Caliphate'ul Rashidun had defeated.

"Persia" in its strictist sense refers to a region within Iran but the Persian culture was far widespread, up to Khorasan and Badakshan. These were regions that had been conquered by the Caliphates but Damascus/Baghdad had a very loose hold over them. Subsequently with rise of the Samanids and Persianized Turkic dynasties like the Ghaznavids and Ghorids, Persian culture was maintained in the East and patronage was given to Persian language poets and scholars like Firdowsi for example. Mesopotamia and Egypt whilst having equally ancient civilizations were entirely taken over by the Arabs and as such their original culture/language was not maintained in any area outside or inside of the Caliphate. Rather the masses slowly slowly adopted the religion and culture of the Arab ruling elite until the entire populace were Arabized. Of course this "Arabization" was also assisted by the fact that as Semetic peoples they shared a lot more with the Arabs than the Persians did.

 

[MilSpec]

So what caused Zoroastrians to convert to Islam ??

 

[KingMamba]

The Sunni strain in Iran was much more tolerant that the Arab version - in today's words think that Arabs are Salafis and Iranians were Sufis. Hence the skirmishes between Ummayads and Persia continued.

Since your original premise was incorrect now you bring this up. Of course this is incorrect as usual. There is no way you can prove that Sunni Persians of the time were any different than the Sunni Arabs of the time.

"Persia" in its strictist sense refers to a region within Iran but the Persian culture was far widespread, up to Khorasan and Badakshan. These were regions that had been conquered by the Caliphates but Damascus/Baghdad had a very loose hold over them. Subsequently with rise of the Samanids and Persianized Turkic dynasties like the Ghaznavids and Ghorids, Persian culture was maintained in the East and patronage was given to Persian language poets and scholars like Firdowsi for example. Mesopotamia and Egypt whilst having equally ancient civilizations were entirely taken over by the Arabs and as such their original culture/language was not maintained in any area outside or inside of the Caliphate. Rather the masses slowly slowly adopted the religion and culture of the Arab ruling elite until the entire populace were Arabized. Of course this "Arabization" was also assisted by the fact that as Semetic peoples they shared a lot more with the Arabs than the Persians did.

In the case of Egypt that is not fully true. The copts number in the millions and have still maintained all of their beliefes along with their language. The Berbers are still a majority in Morocco and Berber is one of the official languages of Morocco. The problem is people here are trying to equate Islam with Arab culture for their own agenda aka atheists like bozo.

 

[Aegis DDG]

So what caused Zoroastrians to convert to Islam ??

According an book I read at central libary, Zoroastrian temples where destroyed while Christian Alters and Jewish temples where allowed to be used

 

[Uhuhu]

because iranian culture was much stronger than them,
people were proud and couldn't accept it and as ERA mentioned, many up raising happened but in theorder to khalife, they killed many iranian.
2- there were some people who were important in this issue. warriors and leaders like yaqub Layth( Rādmān pūr-i Māhak), afshin,maziar,babak,abu moslem and ... and Poets like ferdowsi and many others...

It depends on your definition of Arabize. The arabs did not even enter their cities for anything but taxes after they had captured Persia and kept to their garrisons they built for themselves. The Ummayads when they took over wanted the money the taxes were providing so they did not encourage any conversions but eventually Persians started converting anyway.

arabs came to name of islam, but they did many crimes, they killed many iranians and
repressed iranian upraisings.they burned all books and ravaged iran. that's why even today sometimes you can see some haters between arabs and iranians. it started since that time. iranian finally could throw out arabs but kept islam.

Obviously, you have never visited QOM.

what's your mean? people in qom are arab? qom is a religious city but people are iranian and they do same things as same as other iranian. they speak persian and celebrate nowruz and ...

 

[FULL_METAL]

Persia has a very strong culture, heritage and language and Arabs have actually plagiarized a lot from Romans, Semites and Persians. There is no way a strong civilization could be become dominated by an inferior one. Hence why Persia never became Arabized while countries like Roman-Arabia and Egypt lost their language due to massive exodus, genocide and suppression - a large part of their culture still survived.