History of Vietnam or What do you want to know about Vietnam?

[elis]

He don't look like Vietnamese, bro.

Hoa Lu is hometown of our Emperor Dinh Tien Hoang, who is founder of Dinh Dynasty of Vietnam. There was first capital of us.

His name is François Trinh-Duc, a captain of the french rugby team

Another race mixed vietnamese that doesn't look like an asian

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

His name is François Trinh-Duc, a captain of the french rugby team

Another race mixed vietnamese that doesn't look like an asian

Yeah, i've seen many Viet/White mix person, many of them can pass as a South European or Middle Easterner.

 

[elis]

Yeah, i've seen many Viet/White mix person, many of them can pass as a South European or Middle Easterner.

Actually it depends, some looks indeed like south european, some still have slanty eyes
But they are usually white skinned, some have quite clear hair, some dark hair

 

[Rechoice]

Relax, first we should not pay too much attention to a world (in this case "Han") and exaggerate the meaning. Chinese say "Han" is a cultural umbrella. It does not refer to ethnics, races, countries or political view. As we know three key elements of Han cultures and custom are Ancestor worship, Confucism and Taoism. We can discuss the topic to death.

For example, who am I?

For the Germans, I am a German because I live in the country, work for German company, have a German passport and am familiar with their cultures and custom. For most of the people I am seen as German. I accept this without problem. Besides, I am seen as Viet because my parents are Vietnamese, and I was born in Vietnam. I accept this, too. So I am free to decide which group I belong to: I take both views. For others it may be different.

Second, We are ethnic Kinh, the ethnic minorities are generally seen as moi (barbarians). I understand that is not a nice view. You mentioned Gia Long and Ho Chi Minh. Below again I post the link of the article in wiki telling about Emperor Gia Long. Ho Chi Minh did not say anything about Han.


Sinocentrism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

However, Vietnam was also heavily Sinicized, using Classical Chinese as its official literary language and adopting most aspects of Chinese culture, including the administrative system, architecture, philosophy, religion, literature of China, and even a general cultural outlook. Vietnam persistently identified itself in relation to China, regarding itself as the kingdom of the south as against China in the north, as seen in this line from a poem (in Classical Chinese) by General Lý Thường Kiệt (李常傑) (1019–1105): Nam Quốc sơn hà Nam Đế cư. (南國山河南帝居), which means "Over mountains and rivers of the South reigns the Emperor of the South"

In adopting Chinese customs, the Vietnamese court also adopted Sinocentric world view as it became increasingly Confucianist during the expanding Le and Nguyen dynasties. In 1805, the Emperor Gia Long referred to Vietnam as trung quốc, the "middle kingdom".[9] In 1811, Gia Long proposed a law Hán di hữu hạn (漢夷有限), which means "making clear the border between the Vietnamese and barbarians", referring to the Vietnamese as Han people.[10] Cambodia was regularly called Cao Man Quốc (高蠻國), the country of "upper barbarians". In 1815, Gia Long claimed 13 countries as Vietnamese vassals, including Luang Prabang, Vientane, Burma, Tran Ninh Plateau in eastern Laos, and two countries called "Thủy Xá Quốc" and "Hỏa Xá Quốc", which were actually Malayo-Polynesian Jarai tribes living between Vietnam and Thailand. Mirroring the Chinese model, the Vietnamese court attempted to regulate the presentation of tribute to the Vietnamese court, participation in New Year and emperor's birthday ceremonies, as well as the travel routes and size of tributary missions.[11]

You said: "Chinese say "Han" is a cultural umbrella. It does not refer to ethnics, ..."

No, Han ethnic group is a biggest ethnic group is recognized in China and in the world

The Han Chinese are an ethnic group native to East Asia. They constitute approximately 92% of the population of China, 98% of the population of Taiwan, 74% of the population of Singapore, 24.5% of the population of Malaysia, and about 20% of the entire global human population, making them the largest ethnic group in the world.

Han Chinese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Your parents are Vietnamese and your appearance looks 100 % Vietnamese (or bloodline). if you decide to claim that you belong to a Germanic ethnic group native (white man) in BRD. People could laugh or smile on you, even though it is may be permitted in German. White man German people can think that it's not correct and should look down at you.

Same story here and in other History forum, Northern Han China don't think Southern people are true Han.

Northerner claims Cantonese are not Han Chinese - AsianFanatics Forum

 

[Snomannen]

You said: "Chinese say "Han" is a cultural umbrella. It does not refer to ethnics, ..."

No, Han ethnic group is a biggest ethnic group is recognized in China and in the world



Han Chinese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Your parents are Vietnamese and your appearance looks 100 % Vietnamese (or bloodline). if you decide to claim that you belong to a Germanic ethnic group native (white man) in BRD. People could laugh or smile on you, even though it is may be permitted in German. White man German people can think that it's not correct and should look down at you.

Same story here and in other History forum, Northern Han China don't think Southern people are true Han.

Northerner claims Cantonese are not Han Chinese - AsianFanatics Forum

As I have said, the concept of ethnic in China and other East Asian nations DIDN'T follow the definition from the western/ modern. Of course Han has a meaning referring to the largest ethnic group in the world since we adopted the western concept of nations/ ethnicity after the Empire was gone.
Do you even know that, when Mainland China was still ruled by the Republic (KMT), there were only 5 ethnics were recognized and some of the minorities such as Zhuang and Hmong nowadays were considered as Han.
Think about it, why didn't 鮮卑 Xianbei and 契丹 Khitan are considered as "minitories" in the PRC, why the princess of Jing (女 真 Jurchen) was being called "Han Princess 漢公主", why the Vietnamese King would have said something like "漢(Han)夷有限" but not "京(Kinh)夷有限". Why some stupid people keep saying Northern Han are "True Han" while they are the descendant of Hun, Jurchen, Xianbei and many others ancient ethnics which are no longer existed.

There was a saying in ancient China: 華入夷為夷 夷入華为華, which simply translated as : You are who your heart belongs to.


And why did you post that stupid link again.

Congragulations dumbass. You found a post on an english language online FORUM, by someone providing no sources and claiming to be southern Chinese. Cool story, I can create an account on that forum, pretend to be Vietnamese, and post threads about how Vietnamese are all descendants of Chimpanzees mating with baboons.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

You said: "Chinese say "Han" is a cultural umbrella. It does not refer to ethnics, ..."

No, Han ethnic group is a biggest ethnic group is recognized in China and in the world



Han Chinese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Your parents are Vietnamese and your appearance looks 100 % Vietnamese (or bloodline). if you decide to claim that you belong to a Germanic ethnic group native (white man) in BRD. People could laugh or smile on you, even though it is may be permitted in German. White man German people can think that it's not correct and should look down at you.

Same story here and in other History forum, Northern Han China don't think Southern people are true Han.

Northerner claims Cantonese are not Han Chinese - AsianFanatics Forum

Bad example, both North Han and South Han are Sino-Tibetan Mongoloid people, while Germans belong to another race. This is apple to orange.

North Han and South Han is like North German to South German. And i also heard that some North German nationalists claimed that South Germans are the germanicized Celts, not pure Germanic people like the North Germans. This comparison should be similar to North Han and South Han.

 

[yue10]

Again, we are talking of who are Han people and what are Han´s cultures and custom.
As KirovAirship says, (and correct me if I´m wrong) Han people share a common cultures and custom, you can say a single cultural umbrella. Besides Ancester worship, Confucism and Taoism, Buddhism is another character of the Han. The Han people are heterogeneous, they belong to different ethnics and speak different Chinese dialects with mandarin as preferred languague. But first and foremost Han is not about DNA, nations, languages, ethnics or races. It is not about citizenship, either. At least no directly related. Well, China is the home of the Han, and most of the Han have a common DNA trait. No doubt about it.
How about the Jing people in China? why this ethnic minority, which immigrated from Vietnam hundreds of years ago is seen as minority and not Han? I can´t tell you, but I assume it is a matter of politics. Perhaps KirovAirship can tell us why? In this point, we see Han concept is a bit cloudy.
The concept of Han is reminds me to that of Western countries, called "Christian traditions". It is somewhat similar. As you know the European Union (EU) is an economic and political union of 28 independent states, and all of them share Christian traditions. Germany is a part of it. France, too.
What are Christian traditions of these western countries? well, they are a set of similar traditions, religions (most Christians), cultures and custom which are developed and evolved with the times. For instance the French, the Germans and the Greeks think they belong to a family.
Here is a graph showing different christian traditions, but one common root:
Since decades (50 years), Turkey is trying to become a member of this family, they fail. Why? Because the Turks are Muslims. They have different cultures and custom. Others don´t want them.

the evil European are teaching you wrong concept of ethnic my Annam friend, there is both blood component and cultural component, if use your idea the dude Phillip Rosler is the German ethnic but it doesn’t work like that bloodline matter but only where you are born as same race as your fellow ethnic, look here the girl born and raised in China but is she Han?
in future new ethnic minority of Guangzhou

it could not also just be based on cultural alone since I read the Shanghai ren man is like a puzzy or the Yangdi and New Culture did not understand the concept of Confucianism so use your idea they are not Han, also today the Chinese is loving the Western culture like some Wenzhou ren worship in secret meeting for the Jidu, many also have Western name like their movie star and singer so they could not be Han, we could easily see what the Western style economic and consumerism will bring to them in the future, make me laugh when see them speaking about their hatred of whites but worship the Western culture so much

OK, I stop call you as "bro", I will call you "kid".
Read again my comment above, I said "he doesn't look like Vietnamese" I didn't said that "he is not Vietnamese". Its' different.
when I have been to in Europa, my class mate is Jew, he told me "If your mother is Jew, you are Jew. If your father is Jew, you should be not Jew". So that Obama is Jew.
for the case of François Trinh-Duc, we have to make a DNA testing, the result should tell us who is he, is he Vietnamese or not. Do you understand, kid ?
For the Capital City of Vietnam, it was changed time to time. There was Phong Chau, Melinh, Co Loa, Hoa Lu, Thang long, Hue, Saigon ... It's depended on own willing of our Kings, where is good position for defense counter our enemies.

just stop tried to weaselling your way out ok, your first reaction said he did not look as Viet then already it meant you did not consider him to be true Viet, what for need to test his DNA? his surname is Viet name, already that is enough to know paternally he is descended from Viet but more from Google his grandfather Viet, his father mix Viet, so according to your 'preserved original paternal blood lineage, he true Viet or not?
for Jews there is also the Reform school my Annam friend, look here the Tiger Mother

this Annam claim Phong Chau and Me Linh is a joke

 

[Snomannen]

the evil European are teaching you wrong concept of ethnic my Annam friend, there is both blood component and cultural component, if use your idea the dude Phillip Rosler is the German ethnic but it doesn’t work like that bloodline matter but only where you are born as same race as your fellow ethnic, look here the girl born and raised in China but is she Han?
in future new ethnic minority of Guangzhou

it could not also just be based on cultural alone since I read the Shanghai ren man is like a puzzy or the Yangdi and New Culture did not understand the concept of Confucianism so use your idea they are not Han, also today the Chinese is loving the Western culture like some Wenzhou ren worship in secret meeting for the Jidu, many also have Western name like their movie star and singer so they could not be Han, we could easily see what the Western style economic and consumerism will bring to them in the future, make me laugh when see them speaking about their hatred of whites but worship the Western culture so much

Do you know that Jewish people has been living in China for more than hundreds year.
Jewish people never give up their tradition and religion easily, even though their lives were harsh under the pressure from other ethnics during the past. But Jewish people in China is an exception, they were all localized and have already become part of Han.
I don't see why this African Chinese can't be a Han just because of her bloodline. Defining an ethnicity according to bloodline is what really the western/ modern defination of the concept about ethnics.
Indeed western culture is assimilating everyone nowadays, but using computer and speaking English don't make you an American. It is all the matter of your own sense of identity.

 

[BeyondHeretic]

Why do the Vietnamese people want to learn german en masse? do they see themselves as the potential next Nazi Germany ?

 

[EastSea]

just stop tried to weaselling your way out ok, your first reaction said he did not look as Viet then already it meant you did not consider him to be true Viet, what for need to test his DNA? his surname is Viet name, already that is enough to know paternally he is descended from Viet but more from Google his grandfather Viet, his father mix Viet, so according to your 'preserved original paternal blood lineage, he true Viet or not?
for Jews there is also the Reform school my Annam friend, look here the Tiger Mother

this Annam claim Phong Chau and Me Linh is a joke

You are low IQ kid.

I said that:

"when I have been to in Europa, my class mate is Jew, he told me "If your mother is Jew, you are Jew. If your father is Jew, you should be not Jew". So that Obama is Jew.
for the case of François Trinh-Duc, we have to make a DNA testing, the result should tell us who is he, is he Vietnamese or not. Do you understand, kid ? ".

I can tell you directly my idea: Surname does not say nothing when we talking about Bloodline, he could be the product of his mother secret relation or love adventure when the man is far away from family on business.

That why, Jew people are smart.

Phong Châu (kinh đô) – Wikipedia tiếng Việt

 

[Viet]

Why do the Vietnamese people want to learn german en masse? do they see themselves as the potential next Nazi Germany ?

en masse? where do you get this info? Nazi? are you mad? I guess the number of Vietnamese learning German is equal (or lower) to those learning French.

Vietnamese-German University
Home

 

[Viet]

the evil European are teaching you wrong concept of ethnic my Annam friend, there is both blood component and cultural component, if use your idea the dude Phillip Rosler is the German ethnic but it doesn’t work like that bloodline matter but only where you are born as same race as your fellow ethnic, look here the girl born and raised in China but is she Han?
in future new ethnic minority of Guangzhou

it could not also just be based on cultural alone since I read the Shanghai ren man is like a puzzy or the Yangdi and New Culture did not understand the concept of Confucianism so use your idea they are not Han, also today the Chinese is loving the Western culture like some Wenzhou ren worship in secret meeting for the Jidu, many also have Western name like their movie star and singer so they could not be Han, we could easily see what the Western style economic and consumerism will bring to them in the future, make me laugh when see them speaking about their hatred of whites but worship the Western culture so much

just stop tried to weaselling your way out ok, your first reaction said he did not look as Viet then already it meant you did not consider him to be true Viet, what for need to test his DNA? his surname is Viet name, already that is enough to know paternally he is descended from Viet but more from Google his grandfather Viet, his father mix Viet, so according to your 'preserved original paternal blood lineage, he true Viet or not?
for Jews there is also the Reform school my Annam friend, look here the Tiger Mother

this Annam claim Phong Chau and Me Linh is a joke

Philipp Rösler is ethnic Vietnamese as his parents are Vietnamese. Actually if either mother or father is Vietnamese, their offspring is Vietnamese. So see the basic law of Vietnam, too.

Also, he is German citizen, due to the fact he has a German passport (naturalized).

 

[EastSea]

Why do the Vietnamese people want to learn german en masse? do they see themselves as the potential next Nazi Germany ?

It's nothing related to Nazism. Its simply, German people are smart, work hard, keep cool and discipline and also to save a money. We can learn from them at all.

 

[yue10]

Do you know that Jewish people has been living in China for more than hundreds year.
Jewish people never give up their tradition and religion easily, even though their lives were harsh under the pressure from other ethnics during the past. But Jewish people in China is an exception, they were all localized and have already become part of Han.
I don't see why this African Chinese can't be a Han just because of her bloodline. Defining an ethnicity according to bloodline is what really the western/ modern defination of the concept about ethnics.
Indeed western culture is assimilating everyone nowadays, but using computer and speaking English don't make you an American. It is all the matter of your own sense of identity.

holy shizz your mentality and modern people mentality is down fall of society, it is a shame the social engineer bury the name of Hitler now brainwashed everybody, either that or Chinese is scared of getting balkanised tried to make people think anyone could be considered as Han, it is not according to bloodline but race, as long as the person indistinguishable from other Asian then they could be Han if they believe so from upbringing, if she is Han why you need to say African Chinese, in the future if her children is mix so much they become as Mongoloid then her children and ancestor could be Han but not her
following what the Jew people said it is either they are Jewish or non-Jewish, how could a Jew be Han

You are low IQ kid.

I said that:

"when I have been to in Europa, my class mate is Jew, he told me "If your mother is Jew, you are Jew. If your father is Jew, you should be not Jew". So that Obama is Jew.
for the case of François Trinh-Duc, we have to make a DNA testing, the result should tell us who is he, is he Vietnamese or not. Do you understand, kid ? ".

I can tell you directly my idea: Surname does not say nothing when we talking about Bloodline, he could be the product of his mother secret relation or love adventure when the man is far away from family on business.

That why, Jew people are smart.

Phong Châu (kinh đô) – Wikipedia tiếng Việt

hahaha look this Annam now speaking some nonsense about secret relation, did I said I was high IQ?

In 1983, the Reform movement adopted the principal of patrilineal descent. This is a bit of a misnomer. Reform Judaism considers a child of an interfaith couple to be Jewish if one parent is Jewish and the child is raised as a Jew and receives a Jewish education and celebrates appropriate life cycle events, such as receiving a Hebrew name and becoming bar or bat mitzvah. This also assumes that the child is being raised exclusively as a Jew and not practicing another religion.

MS. CHUA: It was complicated. My children speak Chinese but they’re raised Jewish.

Trinh-Duc was noted as one of the first ever rugby players of Vietnamese origin to play for the French national side.[6][7] His paternal grandfather, Trịnh Đức Nhiên, was born in Vietnam,[8] migrated to France during the First Indochina War, and settled near Agen in Lot-et-Garonne. Nhien later married an Italian woman, and Trinh-Duc's father, Philippe was born

Philipp Rösler is ethnic Vietnamese as his parents are Vietnamese. Actually if either mother or father is Vietnamese, their offspring is Vietnamese. So see the basic law of Vietnam, too.

Also, he is German citizen, due to the fact he has a German passport (naturalized).

my Annam friend according to you ethnic is only by culture so why the dude Rosler is considered as Viet, he himself did not even like your race
the offspring is not true Viet otherwise no need to call them as lai and be discriminated against, will you accept mix black or white as leader of VN

 

[Wholegrain]

You said: "Chinese say "Han" is a cultural umbrella. It does not refer to ethnics, ..."

No, Han ethnic group is a biggest ethnic group is recognized in China and in the world



Han Chinese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Your parents are Vietnamese and your appearance looks 100 % Vietnamese (or bloodline). if you decide to claim that you belong to a Germanic ethnic group native (white man) in BRD. People could laugh or smile on you, even though it is may be permitted in German. White man German people can think that it's not correct and should look down at you.

Same story here and in other History forum, Northern Han China don't think Southern people are true Han.

Northerner claims Cantonese are not Han Chinese - AsianFanatics Forum

Idiot, on internet forums, northern Vietnamese say southern Vietnamese are unpure Kinh, and have mixed with Cham, Montagnard, and Chinese.

Asia Finest Discussion Forum > Northern Viet, Central Viet, and Southern Viet

And then Southern Vietnamese ***** and claim northern Vietnamese are mixed with Chibese.

Asia Finest Discussion Forum > Vietnamese with Northern mongoloid features

MO4R

Asia Finest Discussion Forum > Northern and Southern Vietnamese

Asia Finest Discussion Forum > Difference between Northern and Southern Viet Girls?

Northern and southern Vietnam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Linguistic differences between Northern and Southern Vietnamese