HISTORY OF MALABAR :DISCUSSIONS.

[kalanirnay]

Kalari system is almost extinct.Two types Vadakkan mura (Northern style)
and thekkan mura (southern style) were prevailed in kerala in early times.
Thekkan style is extincted.Only vadakkan style is still existed in some parts.

Maybe you would like to expand on the history of kalari ?

@kalanirnay

I've heard about tharakan's only. Will be interesting if you ppl know about Villarvattom kings.

By all accounts the myth of a christian Villarvattom king is a figment of imagination and the fable was created by Syrian Christians just to show their importance to win the favour of the Portuguese.

Scholarly research has not found any official or authentic record about any "Valaripattopm kingdom".

 

[abjktu]

The rigid caste structure in kerala is well know to everybody. It is one of the most calcified in India. what is there to be confused ?

Just because I speak the truth, it does not make me a casteist ......... just an incorrigible honest guy. You on the other hand are trying too hard to make it sound like caste in kerla was a joke. Not even the mallu's here would believe you.

Yes..Caste system is a reality and rigid in Kerala..But we only have very limited/vague history of it...More so for the last some 800-1000 years..beyond that??
Let me ask you one question..
Why these Nair,Namboodiri(Probably NI ancestry),Knanaya Christians(Syrian Jewish),Muslims(Arabi+ Nair+local converts) and has been living in Kerala within the so called rigid caste structure(without intermix) looks very exactly??...why don't you peoples looks like a typical NI or a jew or an Arabi??

 

[kalanirnay]

Yes..Caste system is a reality and rigid in Kerala..But we only have very limited/vague history of it...More so for the last some 800-1000 years..beyond that??
Let me ask you one question..
Why these Nair,Namboodiri(Probably NI ancestry),Knanaya Christians(Syrian Jewish),Muslims(Arabi+ Nair+local converts) and has been living in Kerala within the so called rigid caste structure(without intermix) looks very exactly??...why don't you peoples looks like a typical NI or a jew or an Arabi??

Genetic studies on Indians have shown that caste has dictated breeding for the last 2000 years. Any mixing happened before that. That study was posted in pdf many moons back by me.

Studies have also shown that if you live with a partner for 30+ years, both of you start looking like each other.

I am not sure what you mean by "typical" Jew or Arab or Nair look. There is NO "typical" look. We all look different and we all look the same.

I myself have been mistaken for a Tamil Iyengar, a punjabi and a UP bhaiya. What does that tell you ? My maternal aunt has "cat" eyes. What does that tell you ?

I have a nephew and an cousin who looks so fair that they looks like Europeans, he's even got brown hair ! I have been asked if my nephew lives in the US !! I have an aunt and a cousin who is so dark that even africans look fairer than her

It is foolish to go by looks.

 

[abjktu]

Genetic studies on Indians have shown that caste has dictated breeding for the last 2000 years. Any mixing happened before that. That study was posted in pdf many moons back by me.

Studies have also shown that if you live with a partner for 30+ years, both of you start looking like each other.

I am not sure what you mean by "typical" Jew or Arab or Nair look. There is NO "typical" look. We all look different and we all look the same.

I myself have been mistaken for a Tamil Iyengar, a punjabi and a UP bhaiya. What does that tell you ? My maternal aunt has "cat" eyes. What does that tell you ?

I have a nephew and an cousin who looks so fair that they looks like Europeans, he's even got brown hair ! I have been asked if my nephew lives in the US !! I have an aunt and a cousin who is so dark that even africans look fairer than her

It is foolish to go by looks.

Looks are important...
A Malayali could easily identify his fellow ones even from a distance(irr of theirs caste ,religious ,skin tone,height or whatever difference) just by their looks/facial appearance..same for all other groups...haven't you felt that.??..
grey eyes,Brown hairs are secondary only...

 

[kalanirnay]

Looks are important...
A Malayali could easily identify his fellow ones even from a distance(irr of theirs caste ,religious ,skin tone,height or whatever difference) just by their looks/facial appearance..same for all other groups...haven't you felt that.??..
grey eyes,Brown hairs are secondary only...

Yes there are certain looks that feels more malayalee, but even the opposite is true. Most times its got to do with personality, dress sense, attitude etc.

That being said, my wife does look 'typical' mallu

 

[SrNair]

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Looks are important...
A Malayali could easily identify his fellow ones even from a distance(irr of theirs caste ,religious ,skin tone,height or whatever difference) just by their looks/facial appearance..same for all other groups...haven't you felt that.??..
grey eyes,Brown hairs are secondary only...

That was right .I could identify keralites y more than 80% probability when I was in chennai.

 

[kalanirnay]

Continuing on this discussions on Nairs there is evidence to indicate the Nair's were also native to the land of kerala and not outsiders. One of the most intriguing features of Nairs are their devotion to snakes or Nagas.

This could indicate to their tribal origin or could equally mean a pragmatic approach to nature. After all they were living in a land which was full of snakes. It made sense to respect them.

But it is indicative of a society and culture that chooses to live with nature and not change nature to suite its needs.

Another fascinating feature was the ancient practice of elongating the earlobes by making a hole in it and streaking it. Almost all ancient pictures and representation of Nairs show this elongated ear lobes.

This act of self mutilation is a tribal custom.

Similar practice among the tamil vellalar women.

Only Nair men and women used to put large gold earrings in that hole. Now you know where the mallu love for gold comes from. Nair fascination for gold was a never ending love affair.

This practice of using gold seems to have come much later and probability had much to do with the gold trade that happened with the rest of the world, from arabs to greeks to romans.

Below is a picture from 1680 of possibly a Nair man and his wife. Observe the elongated ear lobes and martial build.

 

[SrNair]

Maybe you would like to expand on the history of kalari ?



By all accounts the myth of a christian Villarvattom king is a figment of imagination and the fable was created by Syrian Christians just to show their importance to win the favour of the Portuguese.

Scholarly research has not found any official or authentic record about any "Valaripattopm kingdom".

No I dont meant it.I am just saying.

Continuing on this discussions on Nairs there is evidence to indicate the Nair's were also native to the land of kerala and not outsiders. One of the most intriguing features of Nairs are their devotion to snakes or Nagas.

This could indicate to their tribal origin or could equally mean a pragmatic approach to nature. After all they were living in a land which was full of snakes. It made sense to respect them.

But it is indicative of a society and culture that chooses to live with nature and not change nature to suite its needs.

Another fascinating feature was the ancient practice of elongating the earlobes by making a hole in it and streaking it. Almost all ancient pictures and representation of Nairs show this elongated ear lobes.

This act of self mutilation is a tribal custom.

Similar practice among the tamil vellalar women.

Only Nair men and women used to put large gold earrings in that hole. Now you know where the mallu love for gold comes from. Nair fascination for gold was a never ending love affair.

This practice of using gold seems to have come much later and probability had much to do with the gold trade that happened with the rest of the world, from arabs to greeks to romans.

Below is a picture from 1680 of possibly a Nair man and his wife. Observe the elongated ear lobes and martial build.

Well I have a good doubt about that.
Those who worked as slaves or farmers would also get a build up body.
But present Nair have striking difference comparing that people.
May be modern life or inter mixing.Am I right?

 

[kalanirnay]

No I dont meant it.I am just saying.

Well I have a good doubt about that.
Those who worked as slaves or farmers would also get a build up body.
But present Nair have striking difference comparing that people.
May be modern life or inter mixing.Am I right?

A amount of muscle build up on that man cannot be from being a slave. Its the build of a VERY WELL FED man and women. Remember, we are talking about food availability and distribution 600 years back.

If he was a farmer or slave he would not be allowed to bear arms. Especially dangerous one's like bow and arrow. The shape of that Bow too show fine craft man ship. Its no ordinary reed bow. That arrow looks like Iron Tipped. Both would have been rare and Very Expensive in those days.

The women seems to be holding a Lotus and she is looking at that man as an equal.

Everything indicates nobility.

 

[abjktu]

Continuing on this discussions on Nairs there is evidence to indicate the Nair's were also native to the land of kerala and not outsiders. One of the most intriguing features of Nairs are their devotion to snakes or Nagas.

This could indicate to their tribal origin or could equally mean a pragmatic approach to nature. After all they were living in a land which was full of snakes. It made sense to respect them.

But it is indicative of a society and culture that chooses to live with nature and not change nature to suite its needs.

Another fascinating feature was the ancient practice of elongating the earlobes by making a hole in it and streaking it. Almost all ancient pictures and representation of Nairs show this elongated ear lobes.

This act of self mutilation is a tribal custom.

Similar practice among the tamil vellalar women.

Only Nair men and women used to put large gold earrings in that hole. Now you know where the mallu love for gold comes from. Nair fascination for gold was a never ending love affair.

This practice of using gold seems to have come much later and probability had much to do with the gold trade that happened with the rest of the world, from arabs to greeks to romans.

Below is a picture from 1680 of possibly a Nair man and his wife. Observe the elongated ear lobes and martial build.

Syrian Christian ladies of Kerala also used to wear Large gold earrings..Its called 'kunukku" in Malayalam..

 

[kalanirnay]

Syrian Christian ladies of Kerala also used to wear Large gold earrings..Its called 'kunukku" in Malayalam..

Specially for you ...... kerala christian lady. Sect not know.

The lady below is syrian christian.

If you observe closely, the earring styles are different.


Also a kerala muslim lady dressed in an old style.

 

[rockstarIN]

Continuing on this discussions on Nairs there is evidence to indicate the Nair's were also native to the land of kerala and not outsiders. One of the most intriguing features of Nairs are their devotion to snakes or Nagas.

This could indicate to their tribal origin or could equally mean a pragmatic approach to nature. After all they were living in a land which was full of snakes. It made sense to respect them.

But it is indicative of a society and culture that chooses to live with nature and not change nature to suite its needs.

Another fascinating feature was the ancient practice of elongating the earlobes by making a hole in it and streaking it. Almost all ancient pictures and representation of Nairs show this elongated ear lobes.

This act of self mutilation is a tribal custom.

Similar practice among the tamil vellalar women.

Only Nair men and women used to put large gold earrings in that hole. Now you know where the mallu love for gold comes from. Nair fascination for gold was a never ending love affair.

This practice of using gold seems to have come much later and probability had much to do with the gold trade that happened with the rest of the world, from arabs to greeks to romans.

Below is a picture from 1680 of possibly a Nair man and his wife. Observe the elongated ear lobes and martial build.

man the old photos does not tell you the exact picture. I doubt this picture really a nair. Nair had always 'munkuduma'. Also where there cameras in 1680?

The old photos of Kerala be it 1890s..or early 20th century was taken by Christian pathiris who came for convert people, which was quite biased against the native religions. Do not go by that. U can see such photographs in matrhubhumi.com.

 

[SrNair]

A amount of muscle build up on that man cannot be from being a slave. Its the build of a VERY WELL FED man and women. Remember, we are talking about food availability and distribution 600 years back.

If he was a farmer or slave he would not be allowed to bear arms. Especially dangerous one's like bow and arrow. The shape of that Bow too show fine craft man ship. Its no ordinary reed bow. That arrow looks like Iron Tipped. Both would have been rare and Very Expensive in those days.

The women seems to be holding a Lotus and she is looking at that man as an equal.

Everything indicates nobility.

Origin of peoples in kerala is still remained in mystery.
In ancient time it was a part of Tamil kingdom .But now there is some striking ddissimarility between Tamils and Keralites except a few cases.Trade with foreign nations was genuine and have proof.But these immigration from NI or Ceylon etc are still remain as just tory not validated.
If they can invade Kerala why they cant Tamil Nadu.Except Brahmins Ayer etc I dont see much change in there.
But I think we all have some links with tribal people in kerala.Since they were the first natives in kerala

 

[kalanirnay]

man the old photos does not tell you the exact picture. I doubt this picture really a nair. Nair had always 'munkuduma'. Also where there cameras in 1680?

The old photos of Kerala be it 1890s..or early 20th century was taken by Christian pathiris who came for convert people, which was quite biased against the native religions. Do not go by that. U can see such photographs in matrhubhumi.com.

The old picture are not photos but drawings and paintings.

When in the field the Nair warriors did not wear a Mundu. They went into battle wearing only a 'konam'. That is what the image shows.

There could be bias. That drawing was by the dutch trader and diplomat Johan Nieuhof and his job was to report back accurate descriptions to his mentors.

Below is his drawings of the kochi port in 1682.

Origin of peoples in kerala is still remained in mystery.
In ancient time it was a part of Tamil kingdom .But now there is some striking ddissimarility between Tamils and Keralites except a few cases.Trade with foreign nations was genuine and have proof.But these immigration from NI or Ceylon etc are still remain as just tory not validated.
If they can invade Kerala why they cant Tamil Nadu.Except Brahmins Ayer etc I dont see much change in there.
But I think we all have some links with tribal people in kerala.Since they were the first natives in kerala

There is nothing that says Tamil Ayers were not tribals earlier too. We all were at some point.

But it is also possible that the tribals adopted the practices of the Nairs and not the other way around.

 

[abjktu]

Specially for you ...... kerala christian lady. Sect not know.

If you observe closely, the earring styles are different.


Also a kerala muslim lady dressed in an old style.

so what???..its quite natural..every castes have their own unique style...just look that Tamil vellalar women..her earring style are also bit different from Nair style..