History of Afghans (Articles and Pictures)

[ghoul]

You are late to the party, i got revealed on my very first day.

Ok Afghani boy.

 

[ghoul]

And two inaccuracies in your historical accounts. One, Ghauris weren't Pashtuns. They were Tajik/Persian like their enemies, the Khwarezmians of central Asia, and used Persian as the language in their courts and accounts. Secondly, Ibrahim Lodhi was later beheaded by Babur.

Lastly, I don't know if Rohtas should really be included in the Afghan/Pashtun history section. I mean Rohtas is actually a Gakhar village today, and has been a Gakhar possession for the past many centuries.

 

[Samandri]

And two inaccuracies in your historical accounts. One, Ghauris weren't Pashtuns. They were Tajik/Persian like their enemies, the Khwarezmians of central Asia, and used Persian as the language in their courts and accounts. Secondly, Ibrahim Lodhi was later beheaded by Babur.

Lastly, I don't know if Rohtas should really be included in the Afghan/Pashtun history section. I mean Rohtas is actually a Gakhar village today, and has been a Gakhar possession for the past many centuries.

1- Ghurids were pashtuns, persian was court langauge of all turko-afghan dynasties.
2- Ibrahim lodhi's body was found among bodies of dead. Babur was told that ibrahim died fighting, impressed by it, babur buried him with respect.
3- Its thread about history of Afghans not any particular geographical region. Pictures are of sher shah museum in Rohtas fort built by an Afghan king.

 

[ghoul]

1- Ghurids were pashtuns, persian was court langauge of all turko-afghan dynasties.
2- Ibrahim lodhi's body was found among bodies of dead. Babur was told that ibrahim died fighting, impressed by it, babur buried him with respect.
3- Its thread about history of Afghans not any particular geographical region. Pictures are of sher shah museum in Rohtas fort built by an Afghan king.

Modern day Ghaur is a Tajik majority region and Ghauris were based in Northern Afghanistan rather than southern. There is no evidence of Ghauris being Pashtuns and the term "Afghan" was never used for them. On the other hand, there is plenty of evidence of them being Tajik.

 

[Kabira]

1- Ghurids were pashtuns, persian was court langauge of all turko-afghan dynasties.

One question, Ghurids were psudo pashtuns like Sudhans of Azad Kashmir for exemple? Many Azad Kashmiri sudhans now days generally mix with pashtuns despite being of indic origin, (indic mean indo-aryan west of sutlej while east of sutlej is dravidian land). Many sudhans on internet completly believe to be real pashtuns. Azad Kashmiris are generarly confused people about their identity anyway. I say after 100 years major part of Sudhans will start looking like pashtuns because of heavy mixing.

 

[Samandri]

Not a historical map but useful one to know about location of pashtun majority regions of balochistan.

 

[ghoul]

Actually its word Tajik that has never been used for ghurids. The best source for us is Alberuni who mentioned them as "Afghans", the same word he also uses for Afghan tribes of sulieman ranges. Moreover the ruling clan of ghor was suri, which is a pashtun tribe. Also contemperory historians that langauge of ghor was different from that of khorasan (farsi). Mahmood ghaznavi, whose court langauge was farsi, needed translator to communicate with tribal leaders of ghor. Persian historian Ferishta also mention them as afghans.
Ghorids are mentioned as tribal people, persians/tajiks were neither tribal nor budhists/hindus.
Ghor region has also pashtun districts in south, tajiks in the west but majority of population is aimak and hazara (both are legacies of mongol invasion). Remember that mongol invasion of ghor, bamiyan etc pushed pashtuns eastward.


Actually its word Tajik that has never been used for ghurids. The best source for us is Alberuni who mentioned them as "Afghans", the same word he also uses for Afghan tribes of sulieman ranges. Moreover the ruling clan of ghor was suri, which is a pashtun tribe. Also contemperory historians that langauge of ghor was different from that of khorasan (farsi). Mahmood ghaznavi, whose court langauge was farsi, needed translator to communicate with tribal leaders of ghor. Persian historian Ferishta also mention them as afghans.
Ghorids are mentioned as tribal people, persians/tajiks were neither tribal nor budhists/hindus.
Ghor region has also pashtun districts in south, tajiks in the west but majority of population is aimak and hazara (both are legacies of mongol invasion). Remember that mongol invasion of ghor, bamiyan etc pushed pashtuns eastward.

I haven't done much research into the origin of Ghauris, but their being Pashtuns is highly improbable. First of all, their historical sites are all located in the North, particularly in Herat, which has always been a Persian region. The Pashtun minorities in the north are most probably migrants and settlers. Secondly, they patronized Persian language, which they shouldn't have considering them being Pashtuns. Lastly, if their language was said to be different doesn't automatically mean it was Pashto. Mountainous regions give rise to different dialects, that's why pahari and Hindko differ from Punjabi. Heck, the Ghaurids might even have spoken greek for all we know, considering the world was a much different place back then. As for them being Hindu mostly. Well, it is suggested that the Turks simply labelled them Hindu because of the polytheistic nature of whatever religion they were following. Their exact religion might not have been hinduism to be precise. It might have been something like nuristani religion or zoroastrianism. The presence of Hindu Shahis in eastern Afghanistan might have confused Turks further.

Besides that, most Arab sources describe the pashtuns(or whoever was living in the pashtun regions 1200 years ago) as atheist or religion less. The first Arab source describe the people west of Peshawar as atheistic and much given to polyandry and female infanticide. Another source described the tribes of Waziristan as religion less, whose chiefs the arabs kidnapped and converted to Islam. The first arab source I mentioned was completely plagiarized by Ferishta(a very biased person) some 700 years later, who copied and pasted the same words to describe the Gakhars even when they were muslim. The reason being the fact that Gakhars had harassed Ferishta's cousin. Ferishta is a highly unreliable source. He described the 30,000 naked soldiers in Hindu Shahi army against Mahmud as Gakhars, when they were in reality Khokhars. He confused the two races. Basically he didn't know what he was talking about.

As for Al-Beruni, where exactly did he call Ghauris Afghan? And he might have gotten confused too. Like he described the first Hindu Shahi dyansty(Kabul-shahi) as hindu Turks, while the Chinese sources described the same dynasty as hindu kshatriya(Rajput). So who do we really trust?

One question, Ghurids were psudo pashtuns like Sudhans of Azad Kashmir for exemple? Many Azad Kashmiri sudhans now days generally mix with pashtuns despite being of indic origin, (indic mean indo-aryan west of sutlej while east of sutlej is dravidian land). Many sudhans on internet completly believe to be real pashtuns. Azad Kashmiris are generarly confused people about their identity anyway. I say after 100 years major part of Sudhans will start looking like pashtuns because of heavy mixing.

Do Sudhans use the surname Sadhozai?

 

[Kabira]

Do Sudhans use the surname Sadhozai?

According to some internet Sudhans users, they came from Afghanistan around 200-250 years ago. But have completely lost their looks, customs, language, culture etc While Niazis who moved to Punjab 500 years still retain somewhat their culture, and of course looks. There are around 1 lakh sikhs and hindu Sudhans across the border in IoK. Sudhans are believed to be brahmin origin, possible moyhal which is warrior clan.

 

[Samandri]

 

[Samandri]

Some of the pictures of pre-1935 Quetta city. Quetta city's buildings were mostly destroyed in 1935 earth qauke.

 

[ghoul]

According to some internet Sudhans users, they came from Afghanistan around 200-250 years ago. But have completely lost their looks, customs, language, culture etc While Niazis who moved to Punjab 500 years still retain somewhat their culture, and of course looks. There are around 1 lakh sikhs and hindu Sudhans across the border in IoK. Sudhans are believed to be brahmin origin, possible moyhal which is warrior clan.

Yeah there were Hindu sudhans living in pre-partition Rawalpindi district. I doubt any pashtun clan that moved in 200 years ago had a hindhu population. Lol. Brahmin converts shy away from their heritage for some odd reason, even though they were the highest caste in Hinduism.

@ghoul the moment you said that their historical sites are in herat, i stopped reading rest of your post....you dont even have basic idea about ghor and ghurids.

A lot of their sites are in Herat district(not the city) and Herat-Ghaur border districts. Their archaeological sites lie in the northern section of Ghaur for the most part. Basically, where Tajiks live today. Also they were called "Al-sansab" by the Arabs, which might have derived from the term Sassanid. And their chief family wasn't Suri. That "suri" origin is bullcrap pseudo-history made up by some flop "historian" lol.

@save_ghenda tajiks themeselves think that they are persianized east iranian people. For example here in the link i am giving, they are pondering what could be the origin of word "ghor". One is incorrectly saying that persian word for mountain is ghar (its koh, ghar is pashto word). Another is saying that ghar must be word of east iranian langauges.
Ghor- name ethmytology
Pata khazana solves the puzzle, ghorids were pashtuns and ghar (pronounced ghor in some dialects) is pashto word.

In the above link of tajikam, a tajik is admitting that their ancestors sogdians and bactarians were close to pashtuns and ghar might be sogdian words. Pashtuns themeselves claim that portion of their people have lineages from bactarians. Historians themeselves think, that now extinct bactarian might be the closest langauge to pashto and can be called proto-pashto.
It seems to me that not all bactarians or sogdians got persianized. Ghorids either retained their ancient langauge, as they didnt convert to islam and didnt mixed with iranians, or they got pashtunized due to linguistic and cultural proximities with Afghans who lived south of ghor. By the time of amir kror suri, they were pashto speakers.

Now I haven't seen a lot of Tajiks in real life. Do they look different from Pashtuns? The Panjsheri fighters from old pictures looked different to me.

 

[Kabira]

@save_ghenda tajiks themeselves think that they are persianized east iranian people. For example here in the link i am giving, they are pondering what could be the origin of word "ghor". One is incorrectly saying that persian word for mountain is ghar (its koh, ghar is pashto word). Another is saying that ghar must be word of east iranian langauges.
Ghor- name ethmytology
Pata khazana solves the puzzle, ghorids were pashtuns and ghar (pronounced ghor in some dialects) is pashto word.

In the above link of tajikam, a tajik is admitting that their ancestors sogdians and bactarians were close to pashtuns and ghar might be sogdian words. Pashtuns themeselves claim that portion of their people have lineages from bactarians. Historians themeselves think, that now extinct bactarian might be the closest langauge to pashto and can be called proto-pashto.
It seems to me that not all bactarians or sogdians got persianized. Ghorids either retained their ancient langauge, as they didnt convert to islam and didnt mixed with iranians, or they got pashtunized due to linguistic and cultural proximities with Afghans who lived south of ghor. By the time of amir kror suri, they were pashto speakers.

Tajiks have nothing to do with Iranis and are actually quite close to Afghan pashtuns genetically. They are indigenous to Afghanistan before any arab invaded. I don't know why you believe in hundred years old stories/books and reject latest genetic studies. But you are same one who said Hindko were not indigenous to KPK but came with Ranjeet Singh so lol

Yeah there were Hindu sudhans living in pre-partition Rawalpindi district. I doubt any pashtun clan that moved in 200 years ago had a hindhu population. Lol. Brahmin converts shy away from their heritage for some odd reason, even though they were the highest caste in Hinduism.



A lot of their sites are in Herat district(not the city) and Herat-Ghaur border districts. Their archaeological sites lie in the northern section of Ghaur for the most part. Basically, where Tajiks live today. Also they were called "Al-sansab" by the Arabs, which might have derived from the term Sassanid. And their chief family wasn't Suri. That "suri" origin is bullcrap pseudo-history made up by some flop "historian" lol.



Now I haven't seen a lot of Tajiks in real life. Do they look different from Pashtuns? The Panjsheri fighters from old pictures looked different to me.

They look different because of recent Mongol admixture which Tajiks got lot more then Pashtuns especially Pakistani ones. But genetically they cluster with Afghan pashtuns, and not anywhere near Iranis.

If you look at harappadna Tajiks have very high % NE euro component, more then pashtuns and way more then Iranis despite recent mongloid admixture.

 

[KingMamba]

One question, Ghurids were psudo pashtuns like Sudhans of Azad Kashmir for exemple? Many Azad Kashmiri sudhans now days generally mix with pashtuns despite being of indic origin, (indic mean indo-aryan west of sutlej while east of sutlej is dravidian land). Many sudhans on internet completly believe to be real pashtuns. Azad Kashmiris are generarly confused people about their identity anyway. I say after 100 years major part of Sudhans will start looking like pashtuns because of heavy mixing.

 

[Samandri]

Tomb of hoshang shah in Malwa, an example of Afghan art and architecture

 

[Samandri]

Orissa came under muslim rule for the first time when Afghan ruler of Bengal, Sulieman karrani conquered it in 1568 by defeating its Raja Mukundadeva and appointed khan jahan lodhi as its governor. Afghan rule on Orissa continued till 1592.
Islam in Orissa