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HAL Tejas | Updates, News & Discussions-[Thread 2]

Can you produce your Tejas without any foreign help, (From Israel/France/USA) please tell us???
Israel France and USA are part of India so its indeginous
Please, enough of the BS. If just money could buy military power than Saudi Arabia, Brazil, Germany and Canada would be on par with say UK, which they are certainly not. It takes more than money. India still had much bigger economy than Pak on Feb 27th.

As you say Tejas is "on paper" ahead of Block 1 and Block 2. Guess what, AZM "on paper" is better then anything in IAF at the moment. It's of little relevance....
Tejas on paper is a star fighter out of star wars flown by the BORG out to assimilate us all
 
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Please, enough of the BS. If just money could buy military power than Saudi Arabia, Brazil, Germany and Canada would be on par with say UK, which they are certainly not. It takes more than money. India still had much bigger economy than Pak on Feb 27th.

As you say Tejas is "on paper" ahead of Block 1 and Block 2. Guess what, AZM "on paper" is better then anything in IAF at the moment. It's of little relevance....


Azm
do.you have evidence this project exists
I mean funding
labs wind tunnels technology
you have yet to.build s helicopter
and you throw this up.from thin air
do you have resources to.build a modern plane
AZM for me is s chinease fc31 for pak.to be designed and built in China to pak.specs on 20.years time . today it's pure thought desire
tejas,has infrastructure money people project etc
 
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Even awecs will have it tough to go beyond 400-450km due to

50m still very exepensive for fighter which received several waivers
Also every fighter has those cost built in
You dont get fighter without an engine
HAL is taking a too big cut here

IAF should have skipped mk1a and only went for mk2 (as they originally planned)
Or liscene produce gripen NG

No it's not. $50 million for a fighter with one of the most reliable engines, AESA radar, EW suite, fully composite airframe, HMDS, full digital FBW, carefree handling, etc. is not much. Waivers are immaterial when it is being built to the customer's spec. F-35 has over 700 "issues" that have not yet been resolved. But only an idiot would say it's not a good fighter.

You do get a fighter without an engine, when the engine is manufactured by another supplier. It happens with all major aviation OEMs. That's how contracts are negotiated. HAL doesn't build the GE F-404-IN-20 engine. GE does. HAL will have to source it from them at rates they negotiate with GE for.

HAL also has nearly 550 suppliers, both private and public sector, who are part of the Tejas supply chain. It has to negotiate with ALL of them for the prices they are willing to supply the parts at. HAL may or may not add a small percentage on top of that. But given that BOTH, HAL and IAF are basically directly under the Govt. of India, it doesn't matter too much. Anyway, we know this- HAL was asked to cap it's profit lower, after the initial round of negotiations where the IAF felt the prices were too high.

The Ministry of Defence is the go-between for IAF and HAL. So they're FULLY aware of what the HAL profit margins are and won't allow it to be high.

Tejas Mk2 requires development time..Mk1A was supposed to be lower hanging fruit. Basically AESA, podded EW Suite, maintenance improvements, new MC, new SMFDs, some other avionics and that was pretty much it. New weapons would be integrated with the Mk1 anyway with software updates. Since the Mk1 was already in production, this was considered the best way to quickly produce and deliver 4 squadrons of the same airframe/engine combination. It would use the same assembly lines already in place for the Mk1. But unfortunately, even despite being a domestic program, it's RFP and contract negotiations dragged on longer than expected.

Anyway, all that is water under the bridge. It's now confirmed, the IAF is eagerly looking forward to it and very importantly, it brings in a LOT of money into the domestic aerospace industry and supply chain. It's the big kick start required so that the Tejas Mk2, TEDBF and AMCA have a large pool of private suppliers from within India who will be involved.

Buying an imported design and license manufacturing it, like the Gripen E, is only going to help build assembly skills, which India already possesses. What we need are genuine Tier 1 and 2 suppliers who will scale up and build India's aerospace industry. Plus, a LOT of the money goes to Saab or whichever foreign OEM there is. This is the much needed stimulus for the aerospace sector.
Azm
do.you have evidence this project exists
I mean funding
labs wind tunnels technology
you have yet to.build s helicopter
and you throw this up.from thin air
do you have resources to.build a modern plane
AZM for me is s chinease fc31 for pak.to be designed and built in China to pak.specs on 20.years time . today it's pure thought desire
tejas,has infrastructure money people project etc

They haven't designed an indigenous fighter ever. AZM cannot change that. The gulf between Pakistan's aerospace industry and those of nations designing and producing 5th gen fighters is simply too big. 2-3 decades big. Plus, the economy is in the doldrums so it's not like they can afford a billion $ development program, which is what ANY 5th gen fighter development program costs.
 
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The Father of the Tejas programme: Padma Shree, Dr. Kota Harinarayana on the recent development
The KH XYZ on each Tejas LSP/TD/LCA-N TD stands for his name.
Great soul.
 
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Azm
do.you have evidence this project exists
I mean funding
labs wind tunnels technology
you have yet to.build s helicopter
and you throw this up.from thin air
do you have resources to.build a modern plane
AZM for me is s chinease fc31 for pak.to be designed and built in China to pak.specs on 20.years time . today it's pure thought desire
tejas,has infrastructure money people project etc

Talking about Tejas MK1A and it's abilities when it has not flown is the same as PAF talking about AZMs abilities. Difference is we do not celebrate every tiny development as a world beating acheivement, much of PAF's work is done quietly. Unlike HAL.IAF
 
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Talking about Tejas MK1A and it's abilities when it has not flown is the same as PAF talking about AZMs abilities. Difference is we do not celebrate every tiny development as a world beating acheivement, much of PAF's work is done quietly. Unlike HAL.IAF


tejas is Massive project in man power infrastructure and investments in dollars

probably bigger than your entire forex reserve when I count the cost of tejas mark 1 and 1a,and 2

I won't even talk a bout Amca

sit back and enjoy aero India in February you will be shocked at how much India is growing in aerospace
 
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Which parts of the jf17 does Pakistan make?

India claims to make 50 percent of the Tejas. What's the Pakistani percentage?
 
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tejas is Massive project in man power infrastructure and investments in dollars

probably bigger than your entire forex reserve when I count the cost of tejas mark 1 and 1a,and 2

I won't even talk a bout Amca

sit back and enjoy aero India in February you will be shocked at how much India is growing in aerospace

So much talk, so little actual flying
 
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"Yasser76, post: 12911181, member: 183830"]
Read the below, lay off the whiskey and go to bed



deep down you know very well.the best way to military superiority long term.is via financial power is GDP and forex and or weapons indengious capability.

we smash pakistan financially you can't touch us by 10 to 1 gdp or 5 to 1 defense budget .

our indengious capability is much larger more wide ranging then yours. be it destroyers subs helicopters awacs mbrl artillery we do it all. yes production can e slow but we have only started,getting serious last decade or so..

we will keep throwing money at it because we,can do.

tejas is on paper ahead of your block 1 and 2 chinease fighter.
better flybewire and airframe
better engines,
hmd wider range of weapons integration ie Indian israeli and French and Russian.
it's massive upgrade on legacy bison
we Indians are delighted and even.more so because Rafale and mki and mirage20000 will be working along side it..
No
Overweight, underpowered with very low angle of attack to name a few...just using composite vs al-titanium frame or four axis vs 2 axis FBW doesnt make it superior just more COSTLY which it has won hands down(4 times more expnsive then block1 17 million tag)
Mk1 is no match for jf17 b1/2

At 60+m a piece it is anything but a good replacement for mig21


True tejas should have been mk2
 
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No
Overweight, underpowered with very low angle of attack to name a few...just using composite vs al-titanium frame or four axis vs 2 axis FBW doesnt make it superior just more COSTLY which it has won hands down(4 times more expnsive then block1 17 million tag)
Mk1 is no match for jf17 b1/2

At 60+m a piece it is anything but a good replacement for mig21


True tejas should have been mk2


explain how thunder is superior
older yes
older tech yes,.. ie like no.hmd or inferior flight control
superior I can't see it sorry
 
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explain how thunder is superior
older yes
older tech yes,.. ie like no.hmd or inferior flight control
superior I can't see it sorry
For example...
Superior in angle of attack
Thrust to weight ratio
Superior in operational capacity and weapon integration

HMD usefulness is within visual range combat..thunder doesnt need it as these are days of BVR never the less it will be available soon much before tejas is inducted..

Thunder is unstable in 1 acess..it doesnt need FBW in all acess..but the block 3 has it.

By time tejas comes into play the oldest thundrs will be 20 yrs old.

Comparing tejas to jf17b1/2 is moot point since jf17b3 is already IN PRODUCTION WHILE TEJAS MK1A hasnt been signed yet
 
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For example...
Superior in angle of attack
Thrust to weight ratio
Superior in operational capacity and weapon integration

HMD usefulness is within visual range combat..thunder doesnt need it as these are days of BVR never the less it will be available soon much before tejas is inducted..

Thunder is unstable in 1 acess..it doesnt need FBW in all acess..but the block 3 has it.

By time tejas comes into play the oldest thundrs will be 20 yrs old.

Comparing tejas to jf17b1/2 is moot point since jf17b3 is already IN PRODUCTION WHILE TEJAS MK1A hasnt been signed yet


Wrong both AOA atre 26 /28 degrees
Both have same TWR ie 0.95
Superior integration = No Tejas will cary Israeli Indian Russian or European weapons ie
BVR derby ER or Astra
WVR r73 asraam or Python 5
Spi
Thunders only use chinease weapons period

Your claims of superority are not factually corr
what you say about thunders smokey labout high maintenance engines fromm
For example...
Superior in angle of attack
Thrust to weight ratio
Superior in operational capacity and weapon integration

HMD usefulness is within visual range combat..thunder doesnt need it as these are days of BVR never the less it will be available soon much before tejas is inducted..

Thunder is unstable in 1 acess..it doesnt need FBW in all acess..but the block 3 has it.

By time tejas comes into play the oldest thundrs will be 20 yrs old.

Comparing tejas to jf17b1/2 is moot point since jf17b3 is already IN PRODUCTION WHILE TEJAS MK1A hasnt been signed yet


Wrong both AOA atre 26 /28 degrees
Both have same TWR ie 0.95
Superior integration = No Tejas will cary Israeli Indian Russian or European weapons ie
BVR derby ER or Astra
WVR r73 asraam or Python 5
Spi
Thunders only use chinease weapons period

Your claims of superority are not factually correct
what you say about thunders smokey high maintenance engines from russia or the fatigue cracks that are appearimg in your older airframes because you did not use composites . Which you pla to now use in blovck 3 as you can see deficency already in block 1 & 2.

Rumours of availablity at 60% is worrying surely .

BUT you guys went speed and low cost AND you will pay the price
 
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Wrong both AOA atre 26 /28 degrees
Both have same TWR ie 0.95
Superior integration = No Tejas will cary Israeli Indian Russian or European weapons ie
BVR derby ER or Astra
WVR r73 asraam or Python 5
Spi
Thunders only use chinease weapons period

Your claims of superority are not factually corr
what you say about thunders smokey labout high maintenance engines fromm



Wrong both AOA atre 26 /28 degrees
Both have same TWR ie 0.95
Superior integration = No Tejas will cary Israeli Indian Russian or European weapons ie
BVR derby ER or Astra
WVR r73 asraam or Python 5
Spi
Thunders only use chinease weapons period

Your claims of superority are not factually correct
what you say about thunders smokey high maintenance engines from russia or the fatigue cracks that are appearimg in your older airframes because you did not use composites . Which you pla to now use in blovck 3 as you can see deficency already in block 1 & 2.

Rumours of availablity at 60% is worrying surely .

BUT you guys went speed and low cost AND you will pay the price
Rd33 is most reliable engine in russian inventory
Just look at your migs
Every idiot knows that al titanium is less prone to stress fatigue especially in new aircraft

Yes AESA will probably be the only plus on mk1a
Pl15 outranges and outguns everything that LCA can carry
 
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Rd33 is most reliable engine in russian inventory
Just look at your migs
Every idiot knows that al titanium is less prone to stress fatigue especially in new aircraft

Yes AESA will probably be the only plus on mk1a
Pl15 outranges and outguns everything that LCA can carry

I don't buy this your thunder looks a generation behind Rafale type fighters
China won't touch it that tells everything
 
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No
Overweight, underpowered with very low angle of attack to name a few...just using composite vs al-titanium frame or four axis vs 2 axis FBW doesnt make it superior just more COSTLY which it has won hands down(4 times more expnsive then block1 17 million tag)
Mk1 is no match for jf17 b1/2

At 60+m a piece it is anything but a good replacement for mig21


True tejas should have been mk2

Ok. What's the max angle of attack of the JF-17? And Gripen? I'll tell you. It's 26 deg. Same as the max AoA for Tejas.

What's the empty weight of the JF-17 and Gripen? 6500 kgs approximately for both. Same as the Tejas.

What's the engine max thrust for the JF-17, Gripen and Tejas? All in the ~85 kN ballpark.

So please, before writing stuff, do some research.

JF-17 doesn't use titanium except in the hottest sections. Titanium is so damn expensive that if it was used liberally on the JF-17, it would cost double for the airframe. Don't go around saying things that expose your level of knowledge.
 
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