Ghar Wapsi unconstitutional, Conversion constitutional right:Christians

[SamantK]

Who said conversion is a problem.. My POV is always that encourage money for conversion scheme and we will see significant reduction in poverty here..

Its naïve to think that conversions will reduce poverty. These orgs will pump money to convert, not for reducing poverty and we do not need any foreign influence in reducing the poverty by changing the people of this country.

 

[SrNair]

It's true. Right to propogate is a part of the constitution.



Ghar Wapsi is not your 'right'. Yoou are using money and threats for it.

In my state 35 people converted to Hinduism from Christianity.Noone pressured them or influence them.Today they themselves said they were cheated by Christian missionaries.So they were trying for reconversion for a few years till now.
But our secular UDF govts police and Christian groups are threatening them.
So who is the real threat in here?


Evangelists angel uses stupid inspirational tactics with cheap tricks for cheating poor people.Is that right?
As long as there is freedom of religion in Article 25 we will carry out our 'ghar Wapsi' and it is our constitutional right.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

In my state 35 people converted to Hinduism from Christianity.Noone pressured them or influence them.Today they themselves said they were cheated by Christian missionaries.So they were trying for reconversion for a few years till now.
But our secular UDF govts police and Christian groups are threatening them.
So who is the real threat in here?


Evangelists angel uses stupid inspirational tactics with cheap tricks for cheating poor people.Is that right?
As long as there is freedom of religion in Article 25 we will carry out our 'ghar Wapsi' and it is our constitutional right.

John Dayal is a sob. His website is atrocious as well. Every conscious Indian should read it (preferably while being intoxicated).

Who said conversion is a problem.. My POV is always that encourage money for conversion scheme and we will see significant reduction in poverty here..

The converted in Odisha to Chattisgarh, Jharkhand to Kashmir, Nagaland to Tamil Nadu have NOT come out of poverty even after converting to Christianity. They remain under-fed, malnourished and starving. Their children continue to die to lack of treatment. In the remotest parts of Odisha where the State ends, and the Maoist reign begins - the Evangelicals set up shop. None of their situations have changed over decades.

Sometimes it is funny to just read all the posts in a single go.....Good time pass....BTW, i get the sarcastic sense in your post.


OT:- Tell me, how converting to Christianity is going to change the normal day to day life of a tribal?

You can go and see for yourself. Go to the tribal belts. The people have transformed from starving Hindus to starving Christians. That's about it. Don't take my word. Go in person and see.

 

[Darmashkian]

Mostly people left because Hindus were too strict with their laws, The dos and don'ts is what turned away good amount of people. It would be better if Hindu right wing work to remove such prejudices from Hinduism itself but unfortunately it's a battle of ego, we will have to bear with it for a while.

Ranjeet ji, the VHP & other Hindu organisations are indeed working to tackle such evils.Though our media doesn't highlight it.

In many villages in South India, they have convinced the BCs & OBCs to allow SCs to enter our mandirs.

 

[unbiasedopinion]

You can go and see for yourself. Go to the tribal belts. The people have transformed from starving Hindus to starving Christians.

So nothing changes. He was struggling for food earlier too and struggling for food after conversion too. So it is just a number game played by those who claim themselves Messengers of God.

 

[drunken-monke]

BAHRAICH/AGRA/BHADOHI: Fresh instances of religious conversions have been alleged, with a number of Hindus now claiming to have been converted to Christianity in various parts of UP.

In Bahraich's Navinagar Mohraniya village, 70 Hindus were allegedly converted to Christianity, leading to tension in the area, with the district administration deploying provincial armed constabulary to maintain peace. Cops, however, dismissed this prima facie as rumour, but said the charges were being investigated.

In Agra, a woman in Etmadpur, who had complained to the police on Sunday against some members of a Christian 'satsang' converting her to Christianity, has now gone underground. A group of VHP men alleged that she was forced to leave the village after her admission that she was forcibly converted to Christianity.

While Ramvati Devi of Gadi Sampat village alleged she was converted, cops said she may have left the village for work. Her children refused to divulge their parents' location after both of them were seen leaving the village by some people on Monday morning.

On Sunday, around a dozen women from Hindu families at Gadi Sampat village in Etmadpur, 25 km from Agra, had claimed that they had converted to Christianity. Although the police claimed no conversion had taken place in that village, VHP reached the police station with Ramvati, who gave a 'tehrir' (complaint) to lodge an FIR against two persons, both Hindus.

In her complaint, Ramvati Devi (46), wife of Bani Singh from Gadi Sampat village, claimed to have opted for Christianity around a fortnight ago. She said she was lured by a fellow villager who used to go to the 'satsang' organized by Christians every Sunday at Tundla. She claimed the "satsang" organizers had promised a government job for her husband and free education to her children in missionary schools.

"Initially, the police refused to lodge an FIR. Later, when we took Ramvati with us, they said they will lodge an FIR after the probe. Now, Ramvati has been forced to leave the village. We will not let this go easily," said VHP's Parmendra Jain. He added that VHP has a list of more than 20 villages where Christians are running their "conversion business".

"In villages of Parihar, Garapur, Sakalpur-Dera, Rehan-Khurd, Agarpur, Kheria etc, Christians are frequently visiting and meeting Hindu families and luring them to get converted to Christianity," said Sunil Parashar, Prant Gau Raksha Pramukh.

Christian conversions fuel tension in UP - The Times of India

 

[mujhaidind]

There is no greater shame than abandoning your country.

There is moe shame in abandoning your religion for money. These missionaries also used same tactics on your ancestors who sol their faith for economic benefits.

I differ from your opinion here.

I have nothing against Christians of India. My only problem in against foreign Missionaries. Yes obviously there are some Indians also involved who get lot of money from these Missionaries. But that don't represent all Christians of India.

But yes the Missionaries are spreading the evil/extremist form of Christianity. Its the same thing as done by Saudi/Qatar in name of Islam in South Asia. The Missionaries are not only doing immoral business of converting people by giving money/free medical treatments/school admissions but also promoting hatred for Hindus/Hindu Gods. These missionaries cannot shame Jesus/Christianity more then this.

I ask anyone who is a Indian Christian who can state or tell me if this is what Christianity teaches? If not, then these Missionaries are bringin only shame to Christianity and same time engaging in anti national activities in India.

My friend, even Indian Christians donate to this noble cause of harvesting heathen souls. This isn't restricted to some particular sects. Every sect indulges in it. Even the pope during his visits to India never forgets to tell his catholic followers to convert more.

How will they shame Christianity? How do you think those missionaries got people converted during British rule. Same tactics were used.

 

[Nihil]

Here's what mentioned in the link as John Dayal said


Dr. John Dayal




If people are converting due to poverty the government should take steps to check it. If conversion is taking place due to caste factor then steps should be taken to annihilate caste as an institution and if somebody is being converted with physical force then law of land should be brought and a case of fraud under Section 420 should be registered, said Dr. John Dayal, eminent human rights activist and Christian leader.


“But if they are converting out of free will from any religion then they must be allowed to do so. Conversion is a constitutional right. I support conversion. Religion and nationality are the only two things that a person can change. Many NRIs (Indians) have thrown Indian passports and embraced foreign nationalities. Even Indian gurus are travelling all over the world, spreading message of their spiritualism and Hare Rama and Krishna sect has been converting tens and thousands of western people into Hinduism,” Dr Dayal said.



What he said was forceful conversion is unconstitutional.. I just copied what he said..read it and tell me if u find anything wrong..

The Indian media is also notorious in twisting words.

 

[mujhaidind]

Missionary has this evil design world wide. How ever their flimsy ideology is not in a position to convert or retain people into the Christianity fold. Even Europe and US is dropping Christianity. Let them spend the money, they are unlikely survive for a long time.

They will survive. Vatican is the most riches entity/organization in the world. They will keep pumping money and converting people. Only religions like Islam and Judaism know how to counter this. Hinduism and Hindus is/are weak.

I know one Hindu guy who converted to Christianity to please his girlfriend as she wasn't willing to marry him.

 

[SamantK]

They will survive. Vatican is the most riches entity/organization in the world. They will keep pumping money and converting people. Only religions like Islam and Judaism know how to counter this. Hinduism and Hindus is/are weak.

I know one Hindu guy who converted to Christianity to please his girlfriend as she wasn't willing to marry him.

I know two Muslim girls, one married to Kerala hindu and one to a telugu, both follow Hinduism now.

Muslims are weak

 

[Guynextdoor2]

In my state 35 people converted to Hinduism from Christianity.Noone pressured them or influence them.Today they themselves said they were cheated by Christian missionaries.So they were trying for reconversion for a few years till now.
But our secular UDF govts police and Christian groups are threatening them.
So who is the real threat in here?


Evangelists angel uses stupid inspirational tactics with cheap tricks for cheating poor people.Is that right?
As long as there is freedom of religion in Article 25 we will carry out our 'ghar Wapsi' and it is our constitutional right.

I have no problems with voluntary choices, 'Ghar Wapsi' is not voluntary. This is Praveen togadia and gang carrying out their own agenda.

Bro this is exactly what VHP is trying to do by Ghar Wapsi. To bring back those innocent Hindus who were target of these fraud Missionaries earlier.

But as you see, these Missionaries have lots of funds at their disposal, and they have lot of connections. You see how much storm they have raked up in media against this genuine effort by VHP to counter these anti national Missionaries.

They don't love you, they don't love Hindus, they don't love Tribals, They don't love Indians. They just want to spread hate. These Missionary do not represent Jesus, and if they work in India they will bring you, me and all Indians down.

I hope you also help VHP to throw these foreign funded spies out of India. and I hope the public opinion will change and even Christians like you would oppose these Missionaries. I just want these Missionary shops closed and stop their business of spreading hate for Hindus.

I like Catholics, and other Christians who promote peace and happiness for all Indians (Hindus, Muslims everyone). Ghar Wapis is only targeted at foreign funded shops working in India.

All Indians need to oppose these agencies as these agencies are here to destroy you, me and all Indians future.



Yes I agree with you. I support ban on these Missionaries/ anti Conversion law.

Ghar wapsi will be stopped I guess once a ban is placed on these Missionaries/anti conversion law comes in place. Till then, the VHP has to continue to protect those poor Hindus who became Targets of these Missionaries. Missionaries have not stopped their activities, so I hope you agree that they cannot be allowed to be the only player in the field.

For your concern I would say:

1) VHP only targets Hindus. (former hindus converted by Missionaries). So those who are Christians by default would not be targeted. So I don't think they need to use force. They might use money, counselling, and other benefits. Which is right because they are not trying to convery Christians, but only former Hindus.

2) VHP never advocate force. I would never support any VIOLENT action against Christians by VHP/RSS. I would not even support them converting Christains to Hindus. I only support conversion of former Hindus back to Hindus (that too peacefully).

3) So far no forceful conversions have taken place. Infact less then using sword and doing mass killings, no one can force people to convert religion forcefully in today's world. Yes financial aids for conversion do work.

Yeah VHP is trying to do somthig constitional. Put this in the stupid and funny section.

 

[HariPrasad]

Only religions like Islam and Judaism know how to counter this. Hinduism and Hindus is/are weak.

yes, Religion like Islam know very well how to counter that as well as other religion and other sects of Islam itself. We that all over the world.

 

[drunken-monke]

I have no problems with voluntary choices, 'Ghar Wapsi' is not voluntary. This is Praveen togadia and gang carrying out their own agenda.

Yeah VHP is trying to do somthig constitional. Put this in the stupid and funny section.

Then what is this??
Christian conversions fuel tension in UP - The Times of India

Almost all missionaries are doing it.. In my home state Maharashtra, in gadhchiroli district, Adiwasis have been converted by offering them money, education, food and much more.. Many have returned back to Hindu religion once they got the real picture of these missionaries..

 

[timetravel]

The time of Missionaries is over. Indians have finally woken up.

Missionaries pack your bags and get lost.

 

[indiatester]

seiko these are hardcore Hindus. they are more interested to blame Christians just because they don't respond like muslims.. One side these RSS etc are openly stating that they will bring 100% Hinduism into this country.. in other words they want to convert Christian by any means. ... it's waste of time to argue with them... that mujaihind is purely creating fight between Christian members and others. . no matter what you argue. . they will not show you proof about missionaries forceful conversion of Hindus nor they will accept that harassment on minority. ..


i told these members. .. my self received threats from innocent people. .. that is small issue for them... Hindus can threaten you with knife... warn you that they will not hesitate to kill your family... you know we are minorities with less or no voice..... no one can argue on behalf of us.. otherwise they will stamp you as sickulars...

Dude... don't get into that victim-hood mentality. If someone threatens you, its not because they are hardcore Hindu's, but it is because they are criminals. They deserve to be in jail and it is not a small issue.

Regarding proofs of forceful conversion, in most cases it is because of allurement and not because they have found Jesus. I don't have quoted sources as I did not collect them, but I did talk to people who did convert.
If conversion in those camps is alright, you must look at why reconversion via ghar-vapasi is wrong. Both are similar in their modus operandi.