Genocide Watch: Indian Muslims

[jamahir]

But during partition a lot of people from both sides were killed isn't it? A number of Hindus also came from Azad Kashmir who sre non Kashmiris and they were not made domicile of Kashmir until 370 abrogation. Not sure if they have got their domicile yet but I think its on the anvil.

Well, because Hindus were killed in Punjab and other places as were Muslims being killed by Hindus and Sikhs should it mean that Kashmiri Muslims who had no role to play in the killings elsewhere, they be genocided ?

Secondly, what was the business of the Hindu raja Hari Singh to continue after independence ? Why was his monarchist rule continuing ? You know how the famous landmark in Srinagar, Kashmir called Lal Chowk got its name ? Much before 1947 the Muslim and Sikh Communists of the Kashmir region were agitating against the anti-democratic monarchist Hari Singh and these Communists were inspired to adapt the Red Square area in Communist Moscow to that landmark in Srinagar. One of those Communists was BPL Bedi, the father of the famous actor Kabir Bedi.

Now, if the Communists of Kashmir were the ones to govern the region in India the refugee Hindus from Pakistan-administered Kashmir would have been given equal rights to live and no later violence would have occurred. When RSS terrorists were gathering in Kashmir in 1947 Vallabhbhai Patel, who's very dear to the current Hindutvadis, did nothing to act against the RSS. Patel is as much guilty of the Muslim genocide as the RSS and the raja. Would Patel, the deputy prime minister then, have allowed the Communists to govern Jammu and Kashmir ? The Modi government celebrated Vallabhbhai Patel by building the world's tallest statue in Patel's image because he served to become the Hindutavadis' gun-arm against two of their main enemies - Muslims and Communists.

 

[Jugger]

With the current political situation in Pakistan, i am more worried about a civil war there than anything else.
Stop worrying about Palestine, Somalia, Iraq and douse the fire burning inside your house first.

 

[Bossman]

The NAZIs also justified the final solution similar to the way Indians are justifying atrocities against a minority by the majority.

 

[waz]

Yes very typical of the sanghis on this forum to defend it or say "what about Muslim crimes". But if you look at every single riot in India Muslims have come off FAR worse with nearly three times as many deaths.
What a joke.

 

[Faqirze]

Very soon, the very sight of a Hindu will be called as Genocide against Muslims.

Hindu extremists and their goons run the country, the vast majority of the Indian population is Hindu and wont change much anytime soon, But Hindus khatre mein hai! how do you explain this? its no different to when Muslims in Afghanistan or Pakistan claim Islam is in danger despite being a vast majority in their country whilst actively committing a genocide against their minorities and living in a literal Islamic republic.

Four out of five Indians will still be Hindu even when Muslim population peaks

Current growth trends if they persist show that India's population will peak in 2060s

www.livemint.com

 

[Bossman]

Very soon, the very sight of a Hindu will be called as Genocide against Muslims.

Very soon what happened in Rwanda will happen in India. Indians like you have convinced themselves that genocide is justified.

 

[jamahir]

Let me do my research on this topic before I can make my conclusion.

So you do not believe me ?

The communists project is an abject failure world over. Humans are not communist by nature. Ants are , bees are. Not humans.

You have a misunderstanding of Communism. You think Communism is about mind control and citizens blindly obeying the leader ? No, that is Capitalism, that is USA, that is India. The USA government spent 700 billion dollars as its military budget just for 2020-21 for its imperialist military when that government should have spent that financial, human and material resources on the welfare of its citizens. There are so many homeless people in USA - did Nature dictate in the night sky for them to have no homes ? Then so many others become indebted for years if they avail of healthcare and education. Not much is free in USA yet instead of the USA government spending of welfare of its citizens it has spent decades pushing its criminal military and intelligence agency to invade or sabotage countries where there is free housing, free healthcare etc. What stupidity ! You spoke of Gaddafi in another thread. When Gaddafi and his comrades gained governance power in 1969 he promised to the Libyans that his own parents would live in a tent until no Libyan was left without a house. In 2011 when the Libyan Jamahiriya was invaded by the 30+ militaries of NATO+GCC and thousands of their non-state helpers - Al Qaeda and "Muslim" Brotherhood - there was no homeless person in Libya. Can that be said of USA and India ? In the 1970s Gaddafi initiated the world's biggest water delivery project, the Great Manmade Rive ( GMMR ). Water was considered a free human right in the Libyan Jamahiriya. In USA and India water is taxed as if these countries still were monarchies or feudalities. I quote Gaddafi himself from my thread from 2016 :

"In the name of Allah, the beneficent, the merciful..

For 40 years, or was it longer, I can’t remember, I did all I could to give people houses, hospitals, schools, and when they were hungry, I gave them food. I even made Benghazi into farmland from the desert.

I stood up to attacks from that cowboy Reagan. When he killed my adopted orphaned daughter, he was trying to kill me; instead he killed that poor innocent child.

Then I helped my brothers and sisters from Africa with money for the African Union, did all I could to help people understand the concept of real democracy, where people’s committees ran our country.

But that was never enough, as some told me. Even people who had 10-room homes, new suits and furniture, were never satisfied. As selfish as they were they wanted more, and they told Americans and other visitors, they needed ‘democracy’, and ‘freedom’, never realising it was a cut-throat system, where the biggest dog eats the rest.

They were enchanted with those words, never realising that in America, there was no free medicine, no free hospitals, no free housing, no free education and no free food, except when people had to beg or go to long lines to get soup.

No, no matter what I did, it was never enough for some. But for others, they knew I was the son of Gamal Abdel Nasser, the only true Arab and muslim leader we’ve had since Salah ad-Din. When Nasser claimed the Suez Canal for his people, as I claimed Libya for my people, it was in his footsteps I tried to follow, to keep my people free from colonial domination - from thieves who would steal from us …

Now, I am under attack by the biggest force in military history. My little African son Obama wants to kill me, to take away the freedom of our country: to take away our free housing, our free medicine, our free education, our free food, and replace it with American-style thievery, called ‘capitalism’.

But all of us in the Third World know what that means. It means corporations run the countries, run the world, and the people suffer.

So there is no alternative for me; I must make my stand, and if Allah wishes, I shall die by following his path - the path that has made our country rich with farmland, with food and health, and even allowed us to help our African and Arab brothers and sisters to work here with us, in the Libyan Jamahiriya.

I do not wish to die, but if it comes to that, to save this land, my people, all the thousands who are all my children, then so be it.

Let this testament be my voice to the world: that I stood up to crusader attacks of Nato, stood up to cruelty, stood up to betrayal, stood up the West and its colonialist ambitions. And that I stood with my African brothers, my true Arab and muslim brothers, as a beacon of light.

When others were building castles, I lived in a modest house, and in a tent. I never forgot my youth in Sirte. I did not spend our national treasury foolishly, and like Salah ad-Din, our great muslim leader, who rescued Jerusalem for Islam, I took little for myself …

In the West, some have called me ‘mad’ or ‘crazy’. They know the truth but continue to lie. They know that our land is independent and free, not in the colonial grip; that my vision, my path, is and has been clear and for my people, and that I will fight to my last breath to keep us free. May Allah almighty help us to remain faithful and free."

Translated by Professor Sam Hamod.
5 April 2011

Modi cannot come close to Gaddafi in national, regional and transnational achievements in a light year. The socio-economic system of Libyan Jamahiriya was Socialist and the political was Communist - true democracy via direct democracy, realizing Communism's desire of the "Withering away of the State". I have already linked you to my explanation post. Is USA democratic ? Is India democratic ? And below is Google result for "Communism" as written in simple words :

Communism is a philosophical, social, political and economic ideology and movement whose ultimate goal is the establishment of a communist society, namely a socioeconomic order structured upon the ideas of common ownership of the means of production and the absence of social classes, money and the state. Wikipedia

What is your objection to such humane and wonderful set of thoughts ? Do you now think Communism is from ants and bees or is it from evolved people ? Particularly for you and me it is time for Indian culture to evolve, having lived in regressiveness, anti-humanity, irrationality, chaos and disharmony for 3000 years for which period India has been the most Capitalist society in human history. Indians must adopt Communism or forever be condemned as an uncouth and irrational people.

BTW my member name Jamahir is my understanding of a person who forwards the Jamahiriya political and socio-economic system devised in Libya by Gaddafi. Please read the basis of the Jamahiriya idea in the Green Book here.

Show me one country where communism succeeded.

Other than Libya as described above and in Cuba, even in much sanctioned North Korea basic human needs like housing is free for the citizens ( though I dislike the party-based and dynasty-based governance of NK because these are not Communist ideals ). Contrast that with India where there are billionaires like Mukesh Ambani firstly of all and they earn from the public but not only they don't give back to them but this fellow, Ambani, in particular builds an ugly, two-billion-dollar 27-storey "house" which has six storeys just for his 168 cars and has a private temple while not far that from "house" are people living in congested slums. When Ambani and his family do multiple prayers to their privately gods and goddesses in their private temple do they ever feel guilty that they are being Capitalist and unjust to the people surrounding them and enabling injustice in India ? The offerings they make to their gods will buy food for the malnutritioned people in the slums around that ugly skyscraper because basic food is to be purchased in India for money. Nita Ambani can take off in a private plane to Sri Lanka just to buy a new crockery set but that money and the money for the plane trip could have been used to build comfortable homes for two or three families from those slums. As Ratan Tata said about Ambani's ugly 27-storey "house", this is a stuff of revolutions, but unfortunately many of the Indian masses are not the rebellion types because they have been conditioned by Indian culture for 3000 years to accept servitude and injustice without complaint especially since Modi became PM in 2014 and transmit that servitude and injustice through their traditional Indian family structure.

Lastly, you ask where Communism succeeded but you don't remember USSR which was a world power from fields like agriculture to space and which helped India though India was more inclined towards the Capitalist West because of the Capitalist make up of Indian society.

They are all valid questions. Why should anyone due. Why should partition have taken place. Once it did why did all Muslims not migrate. Why did India not call herself Hindu nation. Hari Singh held onto power because that was the deal with the exitting British. If you talk about rss in Jammu, you also need to talk about Muslim tribesmen in Azad Kashmir and GB. Patel is a great statesman and unifier of modern India. Although I am for secular india, if india declares herself Hindu nation it will be hard challenge that. Because that was the terms of partition. A pakistan for Muslim and hindustan for Hindus. These are all old wounds that are best kept under wraps and not picked unnecessarily.

First we must correct the notions about history. Many Hindutvadis complain that Jinnah was the cause of the Partition but in fact it is the Hindutvadis who are the root cause of the Partition through their devising of the Two Nation Theory which the Muslim League picked up and later did Jinnah himself. I quote this article from 2020 about what Shashi Tharoor of the Congress party said :

Speaking at the session 'Shashi on Shashi' with Micheal Dwyer on Day 2 of the Jaipur Literature Festival (JLF), Mr Tharoor claimed that the Hindutva movement started by Vinayak Damodar Savarkar categorically rejected the Constitution.

He said that for Savarkar, a Hindu was one for whom India was his fatherland and holy land. Muslims and Christians were not considered in this.

"Savarkar, Madhav Sadashiv Golwalkar and Deen Dyal Upadhay rejected the constitution and in fact agreed with the Muslims that religion should determine nationhood. In the historical sense, the first advocate of the two-nation theory was actually Savarkar, who as the head of the Hindu Mahasabha called upon India to recognise Hindus and Muslims as part of two separate nations three years before the Pakistan Muslim League passed the Pakistan Resolution in Lahore in 1940," he said.

Mr Tharoor further said that according to them, the Constitution was full of imported ideas written in the wrong language - English.

"Another flaw they pointed out was that it assumes that the nation of India is a territory and it's (constitution) written for all the people on the territory. Nation is not a territory but its people and the people of India are only Hindus," he said.

Patel, that anti-Muslim and anti-Communist Hindutvadi is a great statesman ? I quote from this thread of mine whose OP is a great article by writer Jawed Naqvi :

It is a Hindutva canard that Sardar Patel muscled 560 plus princely states into joining India. Pressure mounted on the monarchs when Nehru declared in his 1946 presidential address at the AISPC that those princely states that refuse to merge with India and join the Constituent Assembly would be considered hostile states.

Patel was keen to let Kashmiri Muslims be genocided by Hari Singh, who was a monarch, but Patel was very keen the next year to launch a "police action" against the nizam of Hyderabad only because the nizam was a Muslim. Why the different behaviors with the two monarchs ? However, I don't support the nizam for multiple reasons. I further ask you to read this thread from two months ago :

Sardar Patel’s communalism—a documented record

A cabal of self-confessed Hindu nationalists, as distinct from Indian nationalists, consistently lauds Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel because it finds in him a soulmate. He is not praised by himself; significantly, he is always pitted against Nehru. "The communalism of a majority is apt to be taken...

defence.pk

Like I said earlier, these all are why the Modi government holds Patel so dear.

 

[Faqirze]

Very soon what happened in Rwanda will happen in India. Indians like you have convinced themselves that genocide is justified.

Rwanda?? you don't know what you are talking about. There will be no outright genocide as the Hindu elites don't will it, its more in their interest to sit back and allow the Hindu-Muslim enmity and communalism to go on for eternity as it helps them gain sympathy and votes and distract the people from actual issues.

 

[Abu Shaleh Rumi]

However during that time there was movement of non-Muslims who were driven out by the Afghan tribesmen

Thats because, they started killing muslims...

 

[jamahir]

Hindu extremists and their goons run the country, the vast majority of the Indian population is Hindu and wont change much anytime soon, But Hindus khatre mein hai! how do you explain this? its no different to when Muslims in Afghanistan or Pakistan claim Islam is in danger despite being a vast majority in their country whilst actively committing a genocide against their minorities and living in a literal Islamic republic.

Four out of five Indians will still be Hindu even when Muslim population peaks

Current growth trends if they persist show that India's population will peak in 2060s

www.livemint.com

What you describe is a sad business but true. And a good article you linked, I have bookmarked your post for it.

 

[Faqirze]

What you describe is a sad business but true. And a good article you linked, I have bookmarked your post for it.

Thanks, glad I was able to help! funny how they had no response to that and ran away like usual.

 

[Bossman]

Rwanda?? you don't know what you are talking about. There will be no outright genocide as the Hindu elites don't will it, its more in their interest to sit back and allow the Hindu-Muslim enmity and communalism to go on for eternity as it helps them gain sympathy and votes and distract the people from actual issues.

I know what I am talking about. Rwanda has already happened on a smaller scale in India. Now the sort mass anti Muslim hysteria that is being created will lead to genocide 10 and 100 times bigger. The gunpowder is ready and waiting for a spark. You Indians can deny all you can.

 

[Markandeya]

I know what I am talking about. Rwanda has already happened on a smaller scale in India. Now the sort mass anti Muslim hysteria that is being created will lead to genocide 10 and 100 times bigger. The gunpowder is ready and waiting for a spark. You Indians can deny all you can.

Not ..not if Muslins of India learn to live like Hindus living in Pakistan..

 

[Baba_Yaga]

Not ..not if Muslins of India learn to live like Hindus living in Pakistan..

Well that is the problem, when you think of muslims, you automatically think Pakistan. There are Hindus in other muslim countries that are treated just fine- Indonesia, Malaysia, Turkey, GCC, Central Asian muslim countries etc, sure not all of these are secular, but they are still very peaceful. We should aim for true secularism - no free handouts, uniform civil code, no loudspeakers in all places of worship, but the same time, no lynching, no mob violence etc etc.

Did the Imported Government of Shahbaz Sharif make a Statement about Hindutva extremists in India yet????

If even 10th of this was happening in Pakistan against Hindus the Indian government would have been screaming Islamic terror Pakistan!!!

Well firstly, since you don't even have a 10th of the minorities that India has and you have already wiped them out, obviously you have no one left to attack, so how will you have even a 10th of the cases. Secondly, minorities in Pakistan are nowhere near as violent as muslims in India, they mostly live in designated ghettos and are totally segregated from muslims as happens in a true apartheid state. Thirdly, these incidents happen in Pakistan all the time but it is so normal it doesnt even reach the media. Only time we see it is when it becomes an international issue like what happened to that poor Sri Lankan guy. Had that happened to a Pakistani, we would never get to see it.

 

[Clutch]

Well firstly, since you don't even have a 10th of the minorities that India has and you have already wiped them out

Show me the wiping out of minorities evidence???

Pakistan all the time but it is so normal it doesnt even reach the media

But it reaches you?

Had that happened to a Pakistani, we would never get to see it.

Every incident that happens reaches mainstream media.... It's in India that there is no coverage...


Are you practicing the Hindu Moo par Ram Ram Baghaal May Chooree mantra again?