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Gaza-Israel Conflict | October 2023

Outside of the few, that pay attention regardless, many people in Pakistan and other Muslims counties, I suspect, don’t want to watch news from this conflict (as Dr. Pirzada attests from rating from past conflict) besides the reminder of their humiliation, is their powerless to do anything about it.

Without actual genuine democracy, what good is an informed or even a highly educated public.

Kargil war saw an effective use of Indian Airforce against Pakistani infantry dug in static positions. PAF didnt show up for offensive Ops and it was difficult to provide air defense cover for troops on peaks inside Indian occupied Kashmir.

Hamas has no Air Force and their AD is ineffective unless deployed properly like Yugoslav Army in 1998-99.
 
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"The assault is expected to be Israel’s biggest ground operation since it invaded Lebanon in 2006. It would also be the first in which Israel has attempted to capture land and at least briefly hold onto it since its invasion of Gaza in 2008, according to the three senior officers."

To make it easier for its soldiers to operate, the Israeli military’s rules of engagement have been loosened to allow soldiers to make fewer checks before shooting at suspected enemies, the three Israeli officers said, without giving further details.

Because of the widespread damage to Gaza City caused by recent Israeli airstrikes, commandos have been given additional training in recent days to help them fight in ruined urban environments, according to a fourth officer, Col. Golan Vach.

The invasion was initially planned for the weekend, but was delayed by a few days at least in part because of cloudy conditions that would have made it harder for Israeli pilots and drone operators to provide ground forces with air cover, the officers said.

Source:

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So you see, despite the IDF Hasbara, that they were being magnanimous and allowing time for "civilians to evacuate" they were stalling for better fighting conditions for their own soldiers!
 
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The Jew JDL radical terrorist comes here like he's spokesman for the Pentagon. He makes it feel like Israel is the 51st state of the US. Lol.
Brother as you see I don't get " emotional" with them. Just factual and they have no a habit to argue with me , I live them no option but f off. Those are very low level Jews, the most stupid ones. Just common cheap trash, mostly they work as shop keepers
 
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Irrelevant.

The fact remains that hamas had the courage to do this knowing the retaliation that would come. knowing they were completely militarily outmatched & had to go into enemy territory. Meanwhile, army has given up on kashmir (& palestine too) b/c it would rather make dhas & oppress its own ppl.

Shameful.
This has been discussed to death unless you like digging up old threads.

 
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Israel Plans Gaza Invasion to Avenge Hamas Atrocities​


The Israeli military is preparing to invade the Gaza Strip in the coming days with tens of thousands of soldiers ordered to capture Gaza City and destroy the enclave’s current leadership, according to three senior Israeli military officers who outlined unclassified details about the plan.

The military has announced that its ultimate goal is to wipe out the top political and military hierarchy of Hamas, the Palestinian group that controls Gaza and led last week’s terrorist attacks in Israel that killed 1,300 people.

The assault is expected to be Israel’s biggest ground operation since it invaded Lebanon in 2006. It would also be the first in which Israel has attempted to capture land and at least briefly hold onto it since its invasion of Gaza in 2008, according to the three senior officers.

The operation risks locking Israel into months of bloody urban combat, both above ground and in a warren of tunnels — a fraught offensive that Israel has long avoided because it involves fighting in a narrow and tightly packed sliver of land populated by more than 2 million people. Israeli officials have warned that Hamas could kill Israeli hostages, use Palestinian noncombatants as human shields, and have strewn the territory with booby traps aimed at slowing the Israeli advance.

It remains uncertain what Israel will do with Gaza City, Hamas’s stronghold and the enclave’s largest urban center, if it captures it, or what exactly Israeli officials mean when they describe the destruction of Hamas’s leadership. Hamas, considered a terrorist group by the United States and the European Union, is a large social movement as well as a militia that is deeply embedded within Gazan society.

It is also unclear whether Hezbollah, the larger, Iran-backed Lebanese militia that is allied with Hamas and possesses a vast array of precision-guided missiles and ground forces, might respond to an invasion of Gaza by opening up a second front with Israel along the Lebanese border.

The military has not yet formally announced that it will invade Gaza, though it has confirmed that reconnaissance teams briefly entered the strip on Friday and that Israeli troops were increasing their “readiness” for a ground war.

Tens of thousands of Hamas gunmen are thought to have entrenched themselves inside hundreds of miles of underground tunnels and bunkers beneath Gaza City and the surrounding parts of northern Gaza. Israeli military leaders expect that Hamas will attempt to impede their progress by blowing up some of those tunnels as Israelis advance above them, and by exploding roadside bombs and booby-trapping buildings.

Hamas also plans to ambush Israeli forces from behind by emerging suddenly from hidden tunnel openings dotted across northern Gaza, according to a Hamas officer who was not authorized to speak to the news media.

To make it easier to operate, the Israeli military’s rules of engagement have been loosened to allow soldiers to make fewer checks before shooting at suspected enemies, the three Israeli officers said, without giving further details.

Because of the widespread damage to Gaza City caused by recent Israeli airstrikes, commandos have been given additional training in recent days to help them fight in ruined urban environments, according to a fourth officer, Col. Golan Vach.

The invasion was initially planned for the weekend, but was delayed by a few days at least in part because of cloudy conditions that would have made it harder for Israeli pilots and drone operators to provide ground forces with air cover, the officers said.

In addition to infantry, the Israeli strike force will include tanks, sappers and commandos, the officers added. The ground troops will be given cover by war planes, helicopter gunships, aerial drones and artillery fired from land and sea.

Their goal will be “the rout of Hamas and the elimination of its leaders after the slaughter they perpetrated,” Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari, the chief spokesman for the Israel Defense Forces, said on Saturday.

“This organization will not rule Gaza military and politically,” Admiral Hagari added.

A second military spokesman said that the army was particularly focused on killing Yahya Sinwar, the top Hamas official whose offices, like those of the Hamas government, are in Gaza City. Israel holds Mr. Sinwar responsible for the atrocities against Israelis last Saturday.

Hamas terrorists and their allies massacred civilians in their homes; shot and killed hundreds of others in the street and at a dance music festival; and kidnapped at least 150 other people.

Israel’s president, Isaac Herzog, said the attack was the deadliest single day for Jews since the Holocaust.

“That man is in our sights,” said Lt. Col. Richard Hecht, another military spokesman, referring to Mr. Sinwar.

“He’s a dead man walking, and we will get to that man,” Colonel Hecht added.

Many Palestinians say they fear the invasion will mean a humanitarian crisis and potentially exile.

The Israeli military has said it is seeking to prevent civilian deaths as far as possible. It has warned Palestinians in Gaza City to head to the south of the territory, which is not expected to be the focus of the opening phase of the invasion; hundreds of thousands have heeded that call, but others — encouraged by Hamas — have remained in their homes.

The complexity of the invasion is heightened by the fact that Hamas is thought to be holding many of the Israeli hostages with them in their underground bunkers and tunnels.

Israeli military analysts say they fear that Hamas will use the hostages as human shields, creating a moral and operational dilemma for Israel.

“The only way to get to the hostages is through a ground operation,” said Miri Eisen, a former senior military officer and the director of the International Institute for Counter-Terrorism at Reichman University in Israel.

But if such an operation goes ahead, Ms. Eisen said, “The terrorists are going to take those booby-trapped babies and Holocaust survivors and explode them to show us as being cruel.”

Both Israel and Hamas are adept at psychological warfare and may be engaging in it with both threats and leaks for advantage, especially as the hostage situation remains unresolved.

Mr. Netanyahu’s government has not yet decided whether to retake southern Gaza in addition to Gaza City, according to one of the senior military officers.

But if southern Gaza stays outside of Israeli control, some Hamas leaders could still remain at large.

Some military and political leaders want Israeli soldiers to undertake 18 months of door-to-door arrest operations, said Nimrod Novik, a former senior Israeli diplomat and security adviser to the Israeli government.

“Others, I think, are far more sober and not talking about demolishing Hamas — but rather depriving Hamas of their ability to threaten us,” Mr. Novik added.


That might involve removing its rocket launchers, tunnels and other military hardware, but essentially allowing it to continue as a social movement, Mr. Novik added.

The question of who would run Gaza after Hamas is also fraught, analysts said.
Israel could reassert direct control over the territory, as it did from 1967 until 2005, but that would entail governing a large, hostile population.

One plan now discussed widely by diplomats, officials and analysts involves allowing the Palestinian Authority, which administers parts of the West Bank, to retake control of Gaza, after it was forced out by Hamas in 2007.

But that would risk making the authority look like Israel’s puppet, said Ibrahim Dalalsha, a Palestinian analyst based in Ramallah, West Bank.

“They’d be coming in on an Israeli tank, in the aftermath of Hamas being eradicated,” Mr. Dalalsha said.

 
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"The assault is expected to be Israel’s biggest ground operation since it invaded Lebanon in 2006. It would also be the first in which Israel has attempted to capture land and at least briefly hold onto it since its invasion of Gaza in 2008, according to the three senior officers."

To make it easier for its soldiers to operate, the Israeli military’s rules of engagement have been loosened to allow soldiers to make fewer checks before shooting at suspected enemies, the three Israeli officers said, without giving further details.

Because of the widespread damage to Gaza City caused by recent Israeli airstrikes, commandos have been given additional training in recent days to help them fight in ruined urban environments, according to a fourth officer, Col. Golan Vach.

The invasion was initially planned for the weekend, but was delayed by a few days at least in part because of cloudy conditions that would have made it harder for Israeli pilots and drone operators to provide ground forces with air cover, the officers said.

Source:

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So you see, despite the IDF Hasbara, that they were being magnanimous and allowing time for "civilians to evacuate" they were stalling for better fighting conditions for their own soldiers!
They couldnt care less for the civilians, they will attack when they are fully confident they will achieve what they want to, which is looking like mass genocide.
 
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"The assault is expected to be Israel’s biggest ground operation since it invaded Lebanon in 2006. It would also be the first in which Israel has attempted to capture land and at least briefly hold onto it since its invasion of Gaza in 2008, according to the three senior officers."

To make it easier for its soldiers to operate, the Israeli military’s rules of engagement have been loosened to allow soldiers to make fewer checks before shooting at suspected enemies, the three Israeli officers said, without giving further details.

Because of the widespread damage to Gaza City caused by recent Israeli airstrikes, commandos have been given additional training in recent days to help them fight in ruined urban environments, according to a fourth officer, Col. Golan Vach.

The invasion was initially planned for the weekend, but was delayed by a few days at least in part because of cloudy conditions that would have made it harder for Israeli pilots and drone operators to provide ground forces with air cover, the officers said.

Source:

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So you see, despite the IDF Hasbara, that they were being magnanimous and allowing time for "civilians to evacuate" they were stalling for better fighting conditions for their own soldiers!

They will be sending their forces into an unnecessary deaths that place is an effin labyinth and Hamas, PIJ and volunteers in there have nothing to lose really it will be a meatgrinder to the bitter end. Gaza itself is an enclave if they lose or not it means nothing for them but they wanna throw down. Why do you think they opened the front so many of them can retain something else it was a commericial pressure on the leadership to create plenty of Shaheeds.

Israel will lose alot of manpower, hardware and resources this will drag for years if possible not to forget if it becomes a front many international voluenteers will come there as it will become a commericial place for these who seek shaheed status
 
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They couldnt care less for the civilians, they will attack when they are fully confident they will achieve what they want to, which is looking like mass genocide.
That is exactly why I have quoted those comments.

They will be sending their forces into an unnecessary deaths that place is an effin labyinth and the Hamas, PIJ and volunteers in there have nothing to lose really it will be a meatgrinder to the bitter end or they will disengage
IAF will flatten Gaza... Have you not seen the images I have been sharing in this thread in the past hours. Strike after Strike after Strike...
 
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"The assault is expected to be Israel’s biggest ground operation since it invaded Lebanon in 2006. It would also be the first in which Israel has attempted to capture land and at least briefly hold onto it since its invasion of Gaza in 2008, according to the three senior officers."

To make it easier for its soldiers to operate, the Israeli military’s rules of engagement have been loosened to allow soldiers to make fewer checks before shooting at suspected enemies, the three Israeli officers said, without giving further details.

Because of the widespread damage to Gaza City caused by recent Israeli airstrikes, commandos have been given additional training in recent days to help them fight in ruined urban environments, according to a fourth officer, Col. Golan Vach.

The invasion was initially planned for the weekend, but was delayed by a few days at least in part because of cloudy conditions that would have made it harder for Israeli pilots and drone operators to provide ground forces with air cover, the officers said.

Source:

---

So you see, despite the IDF Hasbara, that they were being magnanimous and allowing time for "civilians to evacuate" they were stalling for better fighting conditions for their own soldiers!
Rescuing Israeli hostages or capturing Hamas fighters for exchange ?


A drone can easily target any leader of any organization. Its easier to send in 20 drone strikes for precision attack on 20 leaders.
 
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Rescuing Israeli hostages or capturing Hamas fighters for exchange ?
I think the initial incursion they attempted on the 12th was a recce to locate hostages. Bibi is under a lot of pressure, if you watch I24 news (Israeli) the families of the hostages want action, they want their loved ones back, this will be Israeli Army's make or break moment.

Ultimately they are going to go hard to make an example out of Hamas. I don't think they will be taking any prisoners.

To Quote the Israeli General "To make it easier for its soldiers to operate, the Israeli military’s rules of engagement have been loosened to allow soldiers to make fewer checks before shooting at suspected enemies".
 
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Israel will lose alot of manpower, hardware and resources this will drag for years if possible not to forget if it becomes a front many international voluenteers will come there as it will become a commericial place for these who seek shaheed status
Losing man power is the last thing Israel wants as that is their achilles heel - human resource.
 
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That is exactly why I have quoted those comments.


IAF will flatten Gaza... Have you not seen the images I have been sharing in this thread in the past hours. Strike after Strike after Strike...

It won't matter much really they did the same in 2008 but the thing is the Gazans will fight and if this turns into a prolonged war it is not good for Israel's economy turism has decline plus dried up and all their citiies being hit will become normal. Ppl leaving Israel in thousands and I don't mean only tourists but all Israelis wiht double citizenship leaving.. If they engage Hamas conventionally it is gonna take years if they want realistically results and living to lose their entire army and keep recruiting it's civilians at the end
 
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I think the initial incursion they attempted on the 12th was a recce to locate hostages. Bibi is under a lot of pressure, if you watch I24 news (Israeli) the families of the hostages want action, they want their loved ones back, this will be Israeli Army's make or break moment.

Ultimately they are going to go hard to make an example out of Hamas. I don't think they will be taking any prisoners.

To Quote the Israeli General "To make it easier for its soldiers to operate, the Israeli military’s rules of engagement have been loosened to allow soldiers to make fewer checks before shooting at suspected enemies".
Winning through attrition of infliction causalities on enemy ? In Vietnam war, USA lost 58,000 troops and killed 500,000+ Vietnamese, still didn't win the war. If this offensive is to pacify public then killing Palestinians could be the sole aim.

what about hostage rescue by IDF ?
 
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If they engage Hamas conventionally it is gonna take years
There is NO conventional war between Israel and Hamas. Conventional war is set pieces, on a map. This is going to be a COIN level stuff. Israel will be trying it's hardest to avoid a protracted conflict, use everything at its disposal to overwhelm the enemy and then hold territory for Seek and Destroy missions.

As all this happens, whilst this is still support for Israel's action, it is starting to wane.
 
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