G-4 nations put joint bid for Security Council expansion

[Chinese-Dragon]

dont wory there wont be any voting for the group, the voting will be for the individual countries.
so the joint bid is just for pushing the reforms, and not the common voting.

That's not how it works.

They are not going to reform the UN four times for each separate member. There will be one reform bill, and it seems that all four G4 countries are going to put their name on that bill.

And anyway:

The plenary, which began with the G-4 statement, faced instant opposition from China. China, which has opposed the G-4 bid, and is the guardian angel for the opposers, United for Consensus (earlier known as the Coffee Club). The Chinese delegate called the resolution "divisive" while opposing it.

It only takes one P5 member to abstain, in order to shut down any reform resolution.

 

[Nakki Nair]

There is in one poster here, @gotterdung a german who always supports china .

now wonder, germany wants a permanent seat while China vehemently opposes G4, so who gotterrdamen would support his own nation or china.

@topic: I think UN is useless organization which could not prevent iraq, afghanistan libya or nigeria violence.
India should spend diplomatic energies in bilateral and multilateral organisations than on UN

exactly. Diplomatic positioning is the way to go. We can also be a parter of groups like ASEAN, SCO etc

 

[Martian2]

1. To be considered one of the most powerful countries on Earth and a member of the United Nations Security Council with a permanent veto, you need a hydrogen bomb to scare the bejesus out of lesser countries.

1967: THE FIRST CHINESE HYDROGEN BOMB exploded with 3.3 megatons of destructive power

"On June 17 1967, China revealed its true military power.

At 00:19, a Chinese H-6 bomber dropped the first Chinese hydrogen bomb. It exploded with a force of 3.3 megatons. It marked the date when China entered the thermonuclear era."

YouTube - THE FIRST CHINESE HYDROGEN BOMB

2. You need to have a fleet of nuclear ballistic missile submarines to carry around your doomsday thermonuclear weapons to intimidate others.

Type 094 Jin-class SSBN with 12 JL-2 thermonuclear SLBMs with 3 MIRVs per SLBM. You can kiss 36 cities goodbye.

3. You have to demonstrate your technological excellence to justify your seat as a P-5. Building your own turbofan engine for a jet fighter meets the criterion.

J-10B Vigorous Dragon with domestic WS-10A turbofan engine. Go ahead and build as many J-10Bs with domestic turbofan engines as you like and rain bombs down on those that annoy you.

All P-5 members meet the three important criteria listed above. All proposed G-4 members fail to satisfy the three specified conditions. Therefore, the applications of all G-4 members should be rejected for failure to demonstrate adequate military power.

 

[Kazhugu]

at the time of becoming a permanent member china did not have nuclear bomb, no copied fighter, no SSBN....

all it had was millions of cannon fodder soldiers to send out in human waves and exhaust the bullets of the opposition....

so stop this snake oil selling..chinese..

we do not need the p-5 seat so badly...but cannot tolerate this lame chest beating from chinese....

 

[indianspetsnaz]

1. To be considered one of the most powerful countries on Earth and a member of the United Nations Security Council with a permanent veto, you need a hydrogen bomb to scare the bejesus out of lesser countries.

1967: THE FIRST CHINESE HYDROGEN BOMB exploded with 3.3 megatons of destructive power

"On June 17 1967, China revealed its true military power.

At 00:19, a Chinese H-6 bomber dropped the first Chinese hydrogen bomb. It exploded with a force of 3.3 megatons. It marked the date when China entered the thermonuclear era."

YouTube - THE FIRST CHINESE HYDROGEN BOMB

2. You need to have a fleet of nuclear ballistic missile submarines to carry around your doomsday thermonuclear weapons to intimidate others.

Type 094 Jin-class SSBN with 12 JL-2 thermonuclear SLBMs with 3 MIRVs per SLBM. You can kiss 36 cities goodbye.

3. You have to demonstrate your technological excellence to justify your seat as a P-5. Building your own turbofan engine for a jet fighter meets the criterion.

J-10B Vigorous Dragon with domestic WS-10A turbofan engine. Go ahead and build as many J-10Bs with domestic turbofan engines as you like and rain bombs down on those that annoy you.

All P-5 members meet the three important criteria listed above. All proposed G-4 members fail to satisfy the three specified conditions. Therefore, the application of all G-4 members should be rejected for failure to demonstrate adequate military power.

in some way i agree with you but India is close to being self sufficient in most of these things however as for the nuclear test we could conduct a nuclear test anytime but its up to the political jarheads to do it noone from Congress will try to screw up the nuclear deal and try to get sanctioned economically whereas BJP would conduct tests and attain self sufficiency through indigenous nuclear energy production or even from thorium based reactors as since there is a lot of Thorium in Kerala and Goa. and with its free market principles and support of capitalization (with it comes along urbanization) the sanctions will have little to no effect as sanctions did not do much after 98 tests because of the economic growth,

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Here is a list of the currently recognized "Great Powers" in the world.

Great power - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They are: The USA, Russia, China, Britain and France. Does that sound familiar?

It corresponds almost exactly to the current P5.

 

[indianspetsnaz]

Perhaps India should enter a single bid to become apart of the security council and there would be no opposition as many nations even China support India's bid for a SC seat only the entire p5 supports India bid so why don't we file for reform of the security council already?

---------- Post added at 09:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:41 PM ----------

besides most people (won't say who) are against India's rise to the top well like it or not we will be on top this century it is our century and we will be the worlds biggest superpower even according to economists

'India will be the biggest superpower'

 

[Rocky25]

Here is a list of the currently recognized "Great Powers" in the world.

Great power - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They are: The USA, Russia, China, Britain and France. Does that sound familiar?

It corresponds almost exactly to the current P5.

You are going in vicious circles... This Wikipedia article is old and it is telling the Veto power countries are powerful because they are in security council.

 

[kingkobra]

i think we should choose stronger ties with japan over UN seat...japan has helped us in many ways....

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

You are going in vicious circles... This Wikipedia article is old and it is telling the Veto power countries are powerful because they are in security council.

LOL, having a veto doesn't make you a great power.

Japan and Germany are also regarded as "Great economic powers".

 

[Rocky25]

LOL, having a veto doesn't make you a great power.

Japan and Germany are also regarded as "Great economic powers".

So why not grant them the veto status in SC?

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

So why not grant them the veto status in SC?

The seven great powers are listed as these: USA, Russia, China, Britain, France, Germany and Japan.

Only five of them have permanent seats in the Security Council. The other two (Germany and Japan) have "pacifist constitutions", and were barred from the Security council as a result of the outcome of WW2.

Having a pacifist constitution is nice, but not much use on a Security Council.

 

[Martian2]

So why not grant them the veto status in SC?

I will say this one last time. Those countries are weak and not deserving of P-5 membership.

at the time of becoming a permanent member china did not have nuclear bomb, no [awesome] fighter, no SSBN....

To Kazhugu, take a look at the calendar. Is it 1945 or 2012?

You can't expect to apply in 2012 for U.N. Security Council membership with a permanent veto and pledge to meet 1945 criteria. Everyone will just laugh.

You should be aware that technology continues to advance. The criteria to be recognized as a Great Power is fluid and the bar is constantly being raised. In the near future, applicants for P-5 membership may be required to demonstrate AESA-radar-equipped destroyer capability to control the battlespace. Otherwise, many people would consider you militarily weak and not worthy.

If you want a seat at the big table, you have to possess the same military power as the big boys. Otherwise, you're just a pretender.

Clash of the Titans

Only China has been able to match the American Arleigh Burke with their Type 052C Lanzhou-class destroyer with AESA radar. This makes the Pentagon very unhappy. The distinctive convex structures are the phased array radars.

U.S. Arleigh Burke is the world's first naval AESA destroyer. The distinctive hexagonal plates are the phased array radars.

 

[Holmes]

So people are saying that we should be busy to make the H-Bomb in order to get a set on un?

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

The seven great powers are listed as these: USA, Russia, China, Britain, France, Germany and Japan.

Only five of them have permanent seats in the Security Council. The other two (Germany and Japan) have "pacifist constitutions", and were barred from the Security council as a result of the outcome of WW2.

Having a pacifist constitution is nice, but not much use on a Security Council.

Well i think you should know history better and politics and now Future also.

A) when UN was set up , US , UK, Russia and French asked India to Join the UN P5 body, but India refused and said China should be in UN council because they are most polulous nation ( this was blunder done by our new born PM because he don't know about world politics and influenced by Communalism ")

B) All P4 was Nuclear weapon other then China which was poor country that time.

C) China blasted Nuclear Weapon , in 1964 and awarded seat in 1971 to UN.

That time only 5 County posses the nuclear weapons and captured the power in UN. Now the time has change and other countries emerges with Nuclear Weapons apart from that they become major economic power which are so powerful that G8 are forced with acknowledge them. Their Myth was broken that they control the world economy.

The economy now change hands and moved to Asian hands and south american hands . But P5 powers don't want to loose their king seat which they enjoyed form long.

Brazil , India and which is not becoming the most booming economy and are regional power and on the verge of breaking the doors in technologial area of P5. Now P5 either need to reform or it will collaasp within next 25 years if P5 keep on holding power.

Japan and Germany was economic power but today they are only technological power, that barrier will also shattered with 25 years. India and Brazile are now on fast track in technical technology also.

Its matter of time.