Former additional secretary of Pak Election Commission, exposes massive rigging in 2013 elections!

[Chak Bamu]

A very effective debunking of Afzal Khan by Justice (R) Kiyani. Whereas Afzal Khan had only allegations, Justice Kiyani had detailed answers.

He gave clarification of many allegations with specific information. Printing of Ballot papers, Magnetic Ink, Culpability of ROs etc... and the position of ECP was well explained. However one should wait for the working of Judicial commission. But that depends upon the acceptance of relevance which PTI followers will not do willingly.

About Afzal Khan, Justice Kiyani explained that Afzal Khan asked for a promotion which was not his right. He also explained that Afzal Khan was a source of 'inside stories' about working of ECP and was caught in the act.

Afzal Khan's allegations might have carried *some* credibility if he had said all this while an employee of ECP. The fact that he waited to retire and then decided to act as a whistle blower does not inspire confidence. Also, his links with PTI are undeniable. He was in contact with SMQ. Seems like he was the trump card of PTI and came out at last.

People who are lapping up his stories and allegations without any critical examination should be cautioned. Partisanship is one thing, but gossip-based damage to Institutions setup under Constitution of Pakistan is treason.

What if Afzal Khan turns out to be a corrupt official himself? Who would undo the damage then? There are stories, and to some extent Justice Kiyani hinted at them.

Justice Kiyani is a party now hence whatever he says should be taken with a pinch of salt.

Sir, I am more concerned with your tendency to accept any story that emerges in order to support PTI's narrative. You should at least use *some* critical reasoning.

I would take Afzal Khan's stories with more than a pinch of salt, particularly since he himself admitted that he does not have any proof of his allegations. On the other hand Justice Kiyani gave specific information and alluded to record on most points.

Ideally one should wait for Judicial commission report. But I am afraid that you have already concluded (based on an earlier post from you) that officials of every concerned institution (Judiciary & ECP) are compromised. If a report actually debunked Afzal Khan's version PTI partisans, just like their leader would conveniently ignore it.

'Ends justify the means' - This is PTI's philosophy, it seems and at least one TV channel fully agrees with it.

 

[Albatross]

@Chak Bamu as you claim to be neutral I would like to ask you one question why you think justice kiyani's daughter was appointed in pm's office right after election among the initial appointments as if to honour some promise?
And why was that promise made in first place?

 

[syedali73]

@Chak Bamu Bhai, is hamam mein sab nangey hein.

 

[Albatross]

افضل خان نے دھاندلی کا بھانڈا پھوڑا تو اب پٹواری کہہ رہے ہیں کہ ۔۔۔
تمام آفیسرسچ ریٹائر ہونے کے بعد ہی کیوں بولتے ہیں سب ۔۔۔
او یار ان کو کوئی پلیز بتاؤ ، کہ نادرا آفیسر طارق ملک نے دسمبر 2013 میں ڈیوٹی کے دوران سچ بولا تھا ، اور اس کو معطل کردیا گیا ، ڈایئریکٹ پی ایم ہاؤس سے ۔۔ پھر اس بیچارے کو اس کے بچوں کو مارنے کی دھمکیاں دی گیں تو وہ ملک چھوڑ کر چلا گیا ۔۔۔۔
آخر کب تک اس خون لیگ ، بدمعاش شریف کی بدمعاشیوں کو ، درست کہتے رہو گے ، خدا کا خوف کھاؤ ، ایک عدالت اوپر بھی ہے

 

[Verve]

A very effective debunking of Afzal Khan by Justice (R) Kiyani. Whereas Afzal Khan had only allegations, Justice Kiyani had detailed answers.

He gave clarification of many allegations with specific information. Printing of Ballot papers, Magnetic Ink, Culpability of ROs etc... and the position of ECP was well explained. However one should wait for the working of Judicial commission. But that depends upon the acceptance of relevance which PTI followers will not do willingly.

About Afzal Khan, Justice Kiyani explained that Afzal Khan asked for a promotion which was not his right. He also explained that Afzal Khan was a source of 'inside stories' about working of ECP and was caught in the act.

Afzal Khan's allegations might have carried *some* credibility if he had said all this while an employee of ECP. The fact that he waited to retire and then decided to act as a whistle blower does not inspire confidence. Also, his links with PTI are undeniable. He was in contact with SMQ. Seems like he was the trump card of PTI and came out at last.

People who are lapping up his stories and allegations without any critical examination should be cautioned. Partisanship is one thing, but gossip-based damage to Institutions setup under Constitution of Pakistan is treason.

What if Afzal Khan turns out to be a corrupt official himself? Who would undo the damage then? There are stories, and to some extent Justice Kiyani hinted at them.


Sir, I am more concerned with your tendency to accept any story that emerges in order to support PTI's narrative. You should at least use *some* critical reasoning.

I would take Afzal Khan's stories with more than a pinch of salt, particularly since he himself admitted that he does not have any proof of his allegations. On the other hand Justice Kiyani gave specific information and alluded to record on most points.

Ideally one should wait for Judicial commission report. But I am afraid that you have already concluded (based on an earlier post from you) that officials of every concerned institution (Judiciary & ECP) are compromised. If a report actually debunked Afzal Khan's version PTI partisans, just like their leader would conveniently ignore it.

'Ends justify the means' - This is PTI's philosophy, it seems and at least one TV channel fully agrees with it.

Are you of the opinion that ALL Judges are honest and have not been part of any corruption in any way whatsoever?

Whatever Afzal Khan's motives for his whistleblowing and the timing thereof, it has raised serious questions over Judiciary. As I said before, Judiciary is institutionally corrupt and biased and has been the case for as long as I can remember.

 

[Albatross]

@Chak Bamu Bhai, is hamam mein sab nangey hein.

aur jinka zameer jagta b hai usko k b baqi nange such nail nolne dete ..

 

[Verve]

Audit General's report has come out where it is revealed that additional papers used for ballots were ordered as an emergency! Election commission hasn't even bothered to reply to it in all this duration. There's a lot of condemning information in there.

Que Auditor General character assassination Nooras

 

[Albatross]

Moeed pirzada latest victim of our ganga's democracy..

@Chak Bamu What PM Nawaz Should do to prove his popularity? - He should use all the deputy commissioners & DPO's and all his MNA of Punjab, tax payers money and Maulana Fazal ur Rehman to collect a mammoth crowd at the Fatima Jinnah Park (F-9) and then make them stand and dance and listen to him, and sing with him in happiness with a sense of belief in future, his leadership facing rain, and sun and humidity and fear of terrorists and police for 9 days; Can our ...beloved Mian Sahib do that? Can he command interest of thousands of people, young and old, men and women alike for 9 days?
If you can not then please see the writing on the wall, you are facing a Revolution of Hope and Hearts; hurry with a political compromise, we all know that you don't want to leave power but make some serious concessions to cinch a deal, before this mood starts to spread across the country...9 days of rain, sun, attacks by thugs, fear of police and incessant propaganda by your paid stooges are enough to prove that there is a mood change across the country....hurry up before this starts to lead to violence between different groups and parties...
otherwise please remember!
All the king's horses and all the king's men
Couldn't put Humpty together again

 

[Chak Bamu]

@Chak Bamu as you claim to be neutral I would like to ask you one question why you think justice kiyani's daughter was appointed in pm's office right after election among the initial appointments as if to honour some promise?
And why was that promise made in first place?

First of all, I do not claim to be neutral. I am decidedly in the camp of Constitutionalism, even if it entails making compromises / sacrifices. That is because in a state Constitution is the highest principle.

Second, I do not know about Kiyani's daughter. I do know about Afzal Khan's allegations and their debunking.

@Chak Bamu Bhai, is hamam mein sab nangey hein.

If that is indeed the case, then we must prioritize. Is asking to support Constitution too much, then?

Are you of the opinion that ALL Judges are honest and have not been part of any corruption in any way whatsoever?

Whatever Afzal Khan's motives for his whistleblowing and the timing thereof, it has raised serious questions over Judiciary. As I said before, Judiciary is institutionally corrupt and biased and has been the case for as long as I can remember.

No. However extending that logic to absurd lengths is akin to anarchy. That should sound alarm bells. If it does not, then partisanship is over-whelming. Unfortunate.

Audit General's report has come out where it is revealed that additional papers used for ballots were ordered as an emergency! Election commission hasn't even bothered to reply to it in all this duration. There's a lot of condemning information in there.

Que Auditor General character assassination Nooras

Let us wait then for Judicial commission report. If that is not too much to ask.

 

[Verve]

Now SC orders PTI and PAT to clear Constitutional Avenue because Judges and SC employees can't get to SC. lolz ...

 

[Chak Bamu]

Moeed pirzada latest victim of our ganga's democracy..

@Chak Bamu What PM Nawaz Should do to prove his popularity? - He should use all the deputy commissioners & DPO's and all his MNA of Punjab, tax payers money and Maulana Fazal ur Rehman to collect a mammoth crowd at the Fatima Jinnah Park (F-9) and then make them stand and dance and listen to him, and sing with him in happiness with a sense of belief in future, his leadership facing rain, and sun and humidity and fear of terrorists and police for 9 days; Can our ...beloved Mian Sahib do that? Can he command interest of thousands of people, young and old, men and women alike for 9 days?
If you can not then please see the writing on the wall, you are facing a Revolution of Hope and Hearts; hurry with a political compromise, we all know that you don't want to leave power but make some serious concessions to cinch a deal, before this mood starts to spread across the country...9 days of rain, sun, attacks by thugs, fear of police and incessant propaganda by your paid stooges are enough to prove that there is a mood change across the country....hurry up before this starts to lead to violence between different groups and parties...
otherwise please remember!
All the king's horses and all the king's men
Couldn't put Humpty together again

20K people on a street do not a revolution make. Check your assumptions first.

Now SC orders PTI and PAT to clear Constitutional Avenue because Judges and SC employees can't get to SC. lolz ...

Very appropriate.

افضل خان نے دھاندلی کا بھانڈا پھوڑا تو اب پٹواری کہہ رہے ہیں کہ ۔۔۔
تمام آفیسرسچ ریٹائر ہونے کے بعد ہی کیوں بولتے ہیں سب ۔۔۔
او یار ان کو کوئی پلیز بتاؤ ، کہ نادرا آفیسر طارق ملک نے دسمبر 2013 میں ڈیوٹی کے دوران سچ بولا تھا ، اور اس کو معطل کردیا گیا ، ڈایئریکٹ پی ایم ہاؤس سے ۔۔ پھر اس بیچارے کو اس کے بچوں کو مارنے کی دھمکیاں دی گیں تو وہ ملک چھوڑ کر چلا گیا ۔۔۔۔
آخر کب تک اس خون لیگ ، بدمعاش شریف کی بدمعاشیوں کو ، درست کہتے رہو گے ، خدا کا خوف کھاؤ ، ایک عدالت اوپر بھی ہے

Exactly, Ek Adalat ooper bhi hai. Deen kai naam par jhoot bolnay walon ko sochna chahiyai. Aur kanjar khana kholnay walon to bhi jawab-dahi ka dar kyun naheen hai.

When you bring religious morality, you'd better make sure you are consistent.

But he also said that authority to make decisions was in the hands of the judges. Rigging happened at halka levels. He couldn't possibly be at every halka monitoring it all. RO's were directly appointed by that b***** Iftikhar. His assurance, as you quoted, is based on the system in place, such as pictures of voters on ballot lists. If people at ground level start stamping, how could he possibly stop that!?

One has to take his whole interview in consideration. I have worked at senior management levels in big multinationals, and although one can sense corruption happening (unusual figures in financials, unusual commission payments & contracts etc), and forensic investigations of the full structure is required to dig out the real culprits. Administrators, on most parts, are oblivious and clueless until shit hits the fan.

This logic should work both ways. It can not be one-sided.

 

[Verve]

First of all, I do not claim to be neutral. I am decidedly in the camp of Constitutionalism, even if it entails making compromises / sacrifices. That is because in a state Constitution is the highest principle.

Second, I do not know about Kiyani's daughter. I do know about Afzal Khan's allegations and their debunking.



If that is indeed the case, then we must prioritize. Is asking to support Constitution too much, then?



No. However extending that logic to absurd lengths is akin to anarchy. That should sound alarm bells. If it does not, then partisanship is over-whelming. Unfortunate.



Let us wait then for Judicial commission report. If that is not too much to ask.

WHAT IF supreme court itself is compromised? Or is that something we shouldn't even consider?

Constitution is not word of God. Iceland re-wrote their whole constitution not so many years ago, and their Judiciary was against the proposal for new constitution but public didn't give a damn about Judiciary stance and judgements on it. New constitution was written outside the parameters of the old constiution! There was no anarchy there!! I suggest you read up on that as it was all triggered by one common voter (not a politician etc)!.

 

[Chak Bamu]

WHAT IF supreme court itself is compromised? Or is that something we shouldn't even consider?

Constitution is not word of God. Iceland re-wrote their whole constitution not so many years ago, and their Judiciary was against the proposal for new constitution but public didn't give a damn about Judiciary stance and judgements on it. New constitution was written outside the parameters of the old constiution! There was no anarchy there!! I suggest you read up on that as it was all triggered by one common voter (not a politician etc)!.

If Supreme Court is compromised (and it is certainly NOT) then feel free to preach anarchy and Jungle law.

Do you NOT see how the script is being played?

Do you want to spend your life under a re-juvinated Deep state like Egypt & Thailand?

Why did we Pakistanis gave so many sacrifices to break this Deep State? So that like of you can casually give it up because IK is spewing nonsense?

 

[Asian.Century]

IK has made PMs resignation a ego issue. The PM should not resign till the proof of rigging is substantiated in the Supreme court.

Also Afzal Khan gave no proof but levelled allegations against everyone in the parliament except PTI.

Ex-ECP Afzal Khan is a member of PTI and hence biased. His secret is out all over twitter, readers can check his past tweets and pics at dharnas to decide for themselves. Hahahaha Afzal bhai pakrey gaye, atleast foot steps tu sahii cover kertay...before disclosing anything, must have cleared his past history.

 

[Verve]

If Supreme Court is compromised (and it is certainly NOT) then feel free to preach anarchy and Jungle law.

Do you NOT see how the script is being played?

Do you want to spend your life under a re-juvinated Deep state like Egypt & Thailand?

Why did we Pakistanis gave so many sacrifices to break this Deep State? So that like of you can casually give it up because IK is spewing nonsense?

14 people dead and additional 90 shot by Punjab police and SC is sitting oblivious. This is the same court whose CJ was taking suo motto on everything including business deals.

I see the script with corruption of one institution after another being exposed gradually. Anarchy is unlikely as once the mobile networks and tv channels are switched off, PA can control any rogue elements on the streets.

Deep States exist everywhere! UK, USA, you name it they exist. It would be foolish to think otherwise.