F-60 / J-31 stealth fighter aircraft for Pakistan Air Force?

[Kompromat]

@Taimi , it really depends on what SAC offers to us. Both F-6 And A-5 were from SAC [Nanchang] i guess and they all worked out well for us.

 

[sancho]

I believe PAf will stick with whatever Chengdu is going to produce, don't think they will go with a SAC design, Both JF-17 & J-10 are from Chengdu, an J-20 is also from Chengdu, with the level of confidence and relationship we have made with Chengdu, don't think PAF will go somewhere else.

And i still believe PAF will opt for a single engine stealth platform, twin engine seems not the case.

The question is what are the alternatives? F35, or a co-development with Turkey right? The earlier comes with high restrictions and operational limitations, the other with the risk that Turkey is not as far as China in the aero field and needs foreign support as well. But a co-development with Turkey would open the chance to western techs and weapons and reduce the dependance on China too.
I doubt that PAF would go for a single engine fighter, because as the F35 shows, you need a highly powerful engine to carry the weight, fuel and payload and it still offers the least flight performance of all stealth fighters that are under development. The main operational costs will come from maintaining the stealth frame anyway and not from the engines or fuel consumption. Even 40 x of these fighters will add high operational costs to PAF.

 

[TaimiKhan]

its not same chines gov owned ? then why should we stick in one and leave other? if F-60 is best for us and low cost then J-20 why not go with it ?

I did not said we should go with J-20, you never know you may see a single engine stealth design from the J-20 manufacturer or may be a twin engine design similar to this new concept.

It all depends what PAF wants and what the international users want.

 

[DrSomnath999]

but the pics states about j21 ,but why is everyone talking about j20????

 

[KRAIT]

but the pics states about j21 ,but why is everyone talking about j20????

Coz there isn't anything left/present to talk about. Speculations, to be confirmed, no real "leaked" video of uncovered plane.

 

[Mani2020]

Why we are bragging about something that is not on the cards atleast not for sometime , we are finding it hard to finance our own project , still many a thunders are to be inducted while the J-10 program is still lingering around and getting more fragile for me with every passing day ...so why the heck we are jumping onto D before getting onto B and C??

 

[KRAIT]

Why we are bragging about something that is not on the cards atleast not for sometime , we are finding it hard to finance our own project , still many a thunders are to be inducted while the J-10 program is still lingering around and getting more fragile for me with every passing day ...so why the heck we are jumping onto D before getting onto B and C??

One of the practical/realistic posts. You are right, not only your own side, people of our side brag about AURA, AMCA,FGFA which is yet to materialize or inducted. Lets talk about ACs likely to be inducted soon, J-10B,JF blk II on your side, Super Sukhoi,LCA, Rafale on ours...

China hasn't shown anything about it, yet everyone is assuming it is going to be inducted in next 5 years in their AF.

 

[TaimiKhan]

The question is what are the alternatives? F35, or a co-development with Turkey right? The earlier comes with high restrictions and operational limitations, the other with the risk that Turkey is not as far as China in the aero field and needs foreign support as well. But a co-development with Turkey would open the chance to western techs and weapons and reduce the dependance on China too.
I doubt that PAF would go for a single engine fighter, because as the F35 shows, you need a highly powerful engine to carry the weight, fuel and payload and it still offers the least flight performance of all stealth fighters that are under development. The main operational costs will come from maintaining the stealth frame anyway and not from the engines or fuel consumption. Even 40 x of these fighters will add high operational costs to PAF.

No no no, you got me wrong, what i meant was PAf going with a design from another Chinese aircraft manufacturer, the one based at Chengdu, the ones who manufactured JF-17 & J-10s, J-7s etc etc.

This current design seems to be from SAC, while J-20 is from Chengdu design institute or 611 as called.

But who knows PAF might go with a SAC like design it it meets their criteria.

 

[Mani2020]

No no no, you got me wrong, what i meant was PAf going with a design from another Chinese aircraft manufacturer, the one based at Chengdu, the ones who manufactured JF-17 & J-10s, J-7s etc etc.

This current design seems to be from SAC, while J-20 is from Chengdu design institute or 611 as called.

But who knows PAF might go with a SAC like design it it meets their criteria.

Taimi as far as my memory serves me SAC historically has modified or imitated the russian aircrafts apart from the J-8 aircraft... If you go back to the last two decades and see what SAC has come up with , you will find out that the most aircrafts they came up with are twin engine heavy fighter/bombers the last examples are j-11 and J-15 , Their specialty rests with such kind of fighters while on the other hand Chengdu has come up with light single engine multirole fighters with the exception of j-20. Chengdu is also has somewhat superiority over SAC specially when what SAC has produced is merely and imitation while Chengdu has come up with indigenous designs like J-10 , That all factors will influence the PAF decision

Even if SAC comes up with something like F-35 i.e single engine stealth still PAF going for SAC chances are less specially in the midst of heavy co-operation b/w PAF and Chengdu also with what we heard about the MOU signed b/w both for the development of a stealth light multirole fighter

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

I believe PAf will stick with whatever Chengdu is going to produce, don't think they will go with a SAC design, Both JF-17 & J-10 are from Chengdu, an J-20 is also from Chengdu, with the level of confidence and relationship we have made with Chengdu, don't think PAF will go somewhere else.

And i still believe PAF will opt for a single engine stealth platform, twin engine seems not the case.

Isn't it better for us just to confirm J-10B or J-10 sale first
Why rushing towards gen fighter ?

 

[TaimiKhan]

Isn't it better for us just to confirm J-10B or J-10 sale first
Why rushing towards gen fighter ?

Who said anything about rushing ??? There is no official source as of yet nor there will be for coming years.

Its the Chinese members who are proposing that this new design might be for export and a possible sale to pakistan since its for export.

Its a long long plan, somewhere close to 2020 or may be late then that. Till the 2020 time frame J-10Bs and JF-17s would be fully inducted hopefully, as we still have a few years before the induction of J-10B starts.

 

[SuperFieryDragon]

not a long then will have more pleasantly surprised

 

[mylovepakistan]

hottest thread of the day...LOL!!

 

[Donatello]

Yes.. for flow models.

the Thunderstrike, Fatigue test facilities exist at chengdu which the joint team of JF-17 has access to.

ANd yes.. I referred to a 5th gen fighter too.
The design ability for such an aircraft exists too.. to a large extent.
You must understand.. that there are not just local graduates sitting at the PAC.
Graduates from the UK(cranfield etc) , US(Embry Riddle) and all across the globe sit there..
These people have the qualification and the education in distinct important fields to contribute and teach to local students.
So the knowledge base exists..
for eg.. A very detailed study on RAM coatings has been carried out by Pakistan back in the late 90's.. and tested in a modified operational aircraft against multiple radars ,and was found to have worked out pretty well.
So the knowledge base exists.. what these skills demand are funds to procure even more equipment and material.. which does not exist. So the next best thing..i.e to "borrow" Chinese facilities for such tasks is carried out.

Agreed. For this role, we must applaud the Chinese who always lend us their help.

 

[IceCold]

One of the practical/realistic posts. You are right, not only your own side, people of our side brag about AURA, AMCA,FGFA which is yet to materialize or inducted. Lets talk about ACs likely to be inducted soon, J-10B,JF blk II on your side, Super Sukhoi,LCA, Rafale on ours...

China hasn't shown anything about it, yet everyone is assuming it is going to be inducted in next 5 years in their AF.

We are not jumping on anything, we are merely discussing the possibility of doing so after all this is a forum and we all come here to discuss not just the present but also the future.