F-60 / J-31 stealth fighter aircraft for Pakistan Air Force?

[SBD-3]

 

[Mani2020]

well do you honestly think CAC would be taking all this pain just to secure an order of what say max 100?....the insignia on test bed is that of PLAAF not PAF or AVIC.

There can be various reasons like J-10b being serving as a test bed for CAC and PLAAF for J-20 or other future aircrafts. Also there has been a history when CAC modified aircrafts for PAF according to PAF needs but those aircrafts never got inducted in PLAAF. Also why PLAAF will be in a hurry when they are already getting J-10As on the other hand PAF apart from 18 F-16 b52s havent inducted a high tech fighter since quite long . So we by every aspect are in a more dire need then China itself

It can be like what Russia did with su-30, specifically modified the basic su-30 as mki, mkm ,mk2 etc for india, china ,malaysia etc but none of such aircraft found its way in Russian airforce which still is using the basic variant . Apart from india all other orders were for less than 100 numbers , in some cases even less than 50. So such examples always exist .There are many other which we can count

 

[Mani2020]

Another important reason is.........................................


We simply love Pakistan's paintwork.

Send some J-20's i bet you we can do paint job even better on this beast

 

[Zarvan]

finances I think

we already got JF-17 and J-10 going for a third one might not leave much resources to spare.
and also think what role will it play?

JF-17 being the backbone replacing mirages , A5s and F7PGs jack of all trade, air strike, CAP etc.
J-10 together with F-16 .. yet again... Multirole .. intercept, SEAD, escort, CAP and strike roles beyond JF-17s limits.

that pretty much fills everything/.. what is J-61/ F60 going to be? air superiority? replacement of JF-17 and J-10s?
first one is just starting induction, second one is still on paper in terms of what PAF wants.

F-60 or J21 might be something in the far far future. if I am not mistaken JF-17 and J-10s wont mature in our life time.

do correct me if its absurd what I say

Sir stealth planes are whole different thing if India gets Steatlh plane we will definitely need to a stealth plane to counter that only thing to be decided could weather we should buy the J-20 or develop a new stealth plane with the help of China which will be best for PAF and also great for China

 

[SBD-3]

There can be various reasons like J-10b being serving as a test bed for CAC and PLAAF for J-20 or other future aircrafts. Also there has been a history when CAC modified aircrafts for PAF according to PAF needs but those aircrafts never got inducted in PLAAF. Also why PLAAF will be in a hurry when they are already getting J-10As on the other hand PAF apart from 18 F-16 b52s havent inducted a high tech fighter since quite long . So we by every aspect are in a more dire need then China itself

It can be like what Russia did with su-30, specifically modified the basic su-30 as mki, mkm ,mk2 etc for india, china ,malaysia etc but none of such aircraft found its way in Russian airforce which still is using the basic variant . Apart from india all other orders were for less than 100 numbers , in some cases even less than 50. So such examples always exist .There are many other which we can count

Agreed with the first part (though variants based on PG modifications -J-7G and EGs are still inservice with PLAAF). but i couldn't understand the second part, if you say so that the design is PAF specific then it should not have any thing related to PLAAF requirements.
Secondly the case of Russia has been very special. The Russian industry has servived the most part of 90s and 00s based on export market. Not to say Su-30 even the SU-35s and Su-34s only saw their induction very recently when Russian Airforce had enough funds to induct them. When Sukhoi was manufacturing SU-30s for India and China, Russians were keeping their fleet alive by purchasing upgrades.

 

[Tehmasib]

 

[killerx]

poor photo shop man like the jet

 

[mil-avia]

F-60 / J-21 aircraft with Pakistan Air Force roundel and national flag :

1286 × 909 pixels

This very large image above was posted earlier by Hu Songshan in another thread, I partly rotated it to 90 degrees. Related link.

 

[ziaulislam]

Exactly what i said in my previous post on this thread, with every passing day the J-10 is deal is becoming more fragile to me

Lol now even wikipedia has removed Pakistan as a customer of J-10 from the page , they too got sick of the delays ...

Jokes apart but seriously previously the excuse was we are waiting for the MRCA deal to get signed but now it has been for some time now still nothing official about the procurement even the rumors have started to disappear too

well techincally there hasnt been any delay..the date was fixed at 2015..delay will only happen if that date passes..

 

[Mani2020]

Agreed with the first part (though variants based on PG modifications -J-7G and EGs are still inservice with PLAAF). but i couldn't understand the second part, if you say so that the design is PAF specific then it should not have any thing related to PLAAF requirements.
Secondly the case of Russia has been very special. The Russian industry has servived the most part of 90s and 00s based on export market. Not to say Su-30 even the SU-35s and Su-34s only saw their induction very recently when Russian Airforce had enough funds to induct them. When Sukhoi was manufacturing SU-30s for India and China, Russians were keeping their fleet alive by purchasing upgrades.

Then what about UAE F-16s E/F which were specifically designed for UAEAF and never got their place in USAF . US was never short of finances but the case was US priorities were different based on F-22, F-15 latest versions etc similarly who knows Chinese priorities would be jumping from J-10A to J-20 which by every aspect is a better aircraft compared to J-10b

F-16 Barak, Sufa and Netz were specifically designed for ISAF which includes all the major avionics and radar of israeli origin and specifically designed for them though this might be a slightly different thing but still....

Also Pakistan is the major importer of Chinese defence equipment plus the relationship is of a great strategic importance and with Chinese industry flourishing and high on finances this is not a big deal for them

 

[Yeti]

There can be various reasons like J-10b being serving as a test bed for CAC and PLAAF for J-20 or other future aircrafts. Also there has been a history when CAC modified aircrafts for PAF according to PAF needs but those aircrafts never got inducted in PLAAF. Also why PLAAF will be in a hurry when they are already getting J-10As on the other hand PAF apart from 18 F-16 b52s havent inducted a high tech fighter since quite long . So we by every aspect are in a more dire need then China itself

It can be like what Russia did with su-30, specifically modified the basic su-30 as mki, mkm ,mk2 etc for india, china ,malaysia etc but none of such aircraft found its way in Russian airforce which still is using the basic variant . Apart from india all other orders were for less than 100 numbers , in some cases even less than 50. So such examples always exist .There are many other which we can count

Agree with your post but Russia has now ordered a modified version of the SU-30 for its airforce which is similar to MKI they call it the SU-30 SM.

 

[Mani2020]

Agree with your post but Russia has now ordered a modified version of the SU-30 for its airforce which is similar to MKI they call it the SU-30 SM.

But they got it quite a late compared to delivering the aircrafts to India , China and ,malaysia etc If you remember the su-30 mki was introduced in IAF in 2002 and russia ordered the aircraft almost a decade later

Also Su-30sm is not that much similar to mki in that the TVS of su-30sm are based on mki's TVS but there are no canards neither the avionics are of french and isareli origin like in the case of mki..so the difference will always be there ...similarly the mkm is different from mki and same can be said for mk2... so these are versions with differences customized according to the priorities of respective air forces

 

[Yeti]

But they got it quite a late compared to delivering the aircrafts to India , China and ,malaysia etc If you remember the su-30 mki was introduced in IAF in 2002 and russia ordered the aircraft almost a decade later

Also Su-30sm is not that much similar to mki in that the TVS of su-30sm are based on mki's TVS but there are no canards neither the avionics are of french and isareli origin like in the case of mki..so the difference will always be there ...similarly the mkm is different from mki and same can be said for mk2... so these are versions with differences customized according to the priorities of respective air forces

Sukhoi Su-30SM: An Indian Gift to Russia

The model ordered by the Russian military is a “localized” version of the “Indian” Su-30MKI. Earlier, Komsomolsk-on-Amur delivered to the Air Force four “localized” Su-30MK2’s.



Your thinking of the SU-35 which has no candards this is SU-30 SM

The two-seat Sukhoi Su-30SM is based on the Su-30MKI variant supplied to India, and features thrust-vectoring engines and canard foreplanes.

 

[Mani2020]

Sukhoi Su-30SM: An Indian Gift to Russia

The model ordered by the Russian military is a “localized” version of the “Indian” Su-30MKI. Earlier, Komsomolsk-on-Amur delivered to the Air Force four “localized” Su-30MK2’s.



Your thinking of the SU-35 which has no candards this is SU-30 SM

The two-seat Sukhoi Su-30SM is based on the Su-30MKI variant supplied to India, and features thrust-vectoring engines and canard foreplanes.

but still the difference in avionics will be there as you cant expect russia to develop identical systems to french and israelis present in mki and vice versa ...the difference will always be there ...anywayz i think we shouldnot further discuss it here otherwise the thread will be derailed

 

[SBD-3]

Then what about UAE F-16s E/F which were specifically designed for UAEAF and never got their place in USAF . US was never short of finances but the case was US priorities were different based on F-22, F-15 latest versions etc similarly who knows Chinese priorities would be jumping from J-10A to J-20 which by every aspect is a better aircraft compared to J-10b

F-16 Barak, Sufa and Netz were specifically designed for ISAF which includes all the major avionics and radar of israeli origin and specifically designed for them though this might be a slightly different thing but still....

Also Pakistan is the major importer of Chinese defence equipment plus the relationship is of a great strategic importance and with Chinese industry flourishing and high on finances this is not a big deal for them

Bhai you're confusing things up.
1-USAF did not funded the development of Block 60, niether did LMCO out of love of UAEAF. The costs of development were born by UAE.
2-IAF programs were not distinct development like block 60 but rather platform funding coming from US and avionics coming from Israel.
3-Yes Pakistan has been a major importer, yes we had enjoyed the luxury of financing from China. But even the initial contribution to JFT program was made in hard cash (subsequent procurment was made on credit). And more importantly, why would Chinese be not interested in a platform which offers a significant increase over its current inventory for the time being. If somebody speaks about J-20, it is well know even from Chinese sources that China will not induct it in large number. If J-10B offers significantly over J-10A and J-11B in service with Chinese airforce why would they not consider its induction (conservatively speaking, say as a stop gap).
All my point was that J-10B development will take significantly longer time due to issues of inducting nascent technologies in a platform. And PLAAF will like it as much as anyother airforce around with an interest (e.g. PAF).