European Roma descended from India

[Audio]

It is. And here you are.

You sure that's not the window open and you are smelling newly built plumbing?

 

[Joe Shearer]

Not that i want to defend razpak, but why don't you go a bit around and see for yourself the problems your cousins are making. But ofcourse...you won't want to see. All you can muster is some poorly thought out remarks to which any European would laugh at.

Your pathetic in your defense of scum and criminals.

Oh, I've been around. Worked for one of the largest European companies, and worked with their British, French and German counterparts - the work was a little too complicated for Central Europeans, so I never had the privilege of meeting new Europeans of your sort. Thank God for that. Headed a European company not too far from where you crawled out from under your rock. The streets were filled with young girls sold by their own people into prostitution. Eastern Europe was, and apparently still is the armpit of Europe. And you are a most appropriate representative, with your borrowed English phrases and your sneering bigotry and courage in the face of the unarmed, and of women and children. Not far from pogrom country, are we? Typical.

 

[Roybot]

While France Deports Roma Gypsies, Spain Integrates Them - TIME

Antonio Moreno lives on what is reputedly Madrid's most dangerous street, where dealers openly offer any type of drug around the clock. He owns a four-bedroom house with a pool; he works out of his own photo and video studio — and he's a Gypsy, one of the 40,000 inhabitants of an illegal settlement on the outskirts of the Spanish capital. If they lived in just about any other European country, Moreno and his neighbors would be the source of tension and controversy: on Tuesday, the European Union called France's continued deportation of its Gypsies a "disgrace" and threatened disciplinary action against the country. Suddenly, all across Europe, a community that is used to living on the fringes is now in the spotlight — and in some cases, suffering heightened prejudice as a result. But Moreno isn't worried. Because when it comes to dealing with Gypsies — also known as Roma — Spain is different.

"[The deportations] will never happen here," says Moreno. "We are integrated. I'm first Spanish, then Gypsy, and I'm proud to be both." While many European countries see their Roma communities as problems to be tackled, Spain has embraced its Gypsies, giving them rights, celebrating their history and making them feel at home. "Of course there is racism, but it's better here than anywhere else I've seen," Moreno says, referring to his trips to Italy, France, Germany and the Czech Republic. "Spain has helped Gypsies a lot."

(See pictures of France cracking down on migrants.)
Indeed, 35 years after the death of dictator Francisco Franco, the lives of the Roma have improved dramatically. "We weren't even human before. We were animals," says Moreno of the time when authorities prevented Gypsies from working, studying or even gathering in groups bigger than four. Today the European Commission, E.U. member countries and the Roma themselves all agree that Spain has become the model for integrating Gypsies, with some citing it as a case of good practices. Now the governments of Bulgaria, Slovakia, Hungary, the Czech Republic and even Romania — where many Roma come from — are looking to Spain for ideas to apply themselves.

Of the 10-12 million Roma living in Europe, Spain has the second biggest community, estimated at 970,000, or about 2% of the total population. And the country spends almost €36 million annually bringing them into the fold. In Spain, only 5% of gypsies live in makeshift camps, and about half of Roma are homeowners. Just about all Gypsies in Spain have access to health care, and while no recent figures exist, at least 75% are believed to have some sort of steady income.

(See "Who Are Gypsies, and Why Is France Deporting Them?")
Spain is also investing in an area that many experts believe is the key to keeping Roma out of poverty: education. Almost all Gypsy children start elementary school (although only about 30% compete it), and more than 85% of the country's Gypsies are literate. "Spain's use of European social funds is a good example for other member states," said E.U. Commission Vice President and Justice Commissioner Viviane Reding in an e-mail to TIME. "The Spanish government has shown that it is working on integrating the Roma population, and we've seen some positive results."

Spain's two-pronged integration approach has been instrumental in those results, pairing access to mainstream social services with targeted inclusion programs. For example, Roma can have access to public housing and financial aid on the condition that they send their children to schools and health care facilities. Then there's the Gypsy Secretariat Foundation Acceder program, which experts say is one of the best integration initiatives in Europe. The program takes young, unemployed Gypsies and teaches them technical skills and helps them earn the equivalent of a high school degree. At the end, they are placed in jobs through a series of agreements with private companies. The program has been such a success that Romania's National Agency for Roma is trying to implement its own version.

(See pictures of immigration in Europe.)
But can the rest of Europe replicate Spain's success? Much of the country's good work in integrating Roma is thanks to its specific history with the community. In order to guarantee stability in a country split along nationalist lines, the constitution written after Franco's death was inclusive of all ethnic groups and cultures, thus shielding Roma from institutional exclusion. And because Gypsies were the single most impoverished population in the 1980s, they attracted the most development efforts.

Despite centuries of victimization, Gypsies have melded into Spanish mainstream culture — flamenco dancing and traditional Spanish dress are both borrowed from the community. "Spanish Gypsies also resisted integration efforts less than in other countries because they have been sedentary for centuries," says José Manuel Fresno, an adviser to the E.U. commission on Roma issues and head of the Spanish government's anti-racism commission.

(See "Spain's Immigrants Suffer in Economic Downturn.")
Even if other E.U. countries followed in Spain's footsteps and learned to love their Roma, that would solve only half the problem. The best way to stop countries such as France and Italy from deporting Gypsies is to ensure that Gypsies are happy enough at home that they don't need to migrate to France or Italy in the first place. "Spain has done much more than other member states [to integrate Roma], but now we have to make sure that success transfers to new member states," says Ivan Ivanov, executive director of the Brussels-based European Roma Information Office. "Then Roma migrations might stop." Deportations are futile, he says: "The Gypsies will just come back in a few months. Policies need to be adopted now, or in five years the very same countries will complain of migrations from other countries."

Antonio Moreno would agree. A Spanish Gypsy as far back as he can trace his roots, he can't imagine his family living anywhere else. And while he appreciates that his children get financial aid and that the state pays for his grandchildren to attend school, he believes that Gypsies have a responsibility to integrate. "Most Gypsies are good people and want to coexist with others," Moreno says. "There are some who exclude themselves, but not us. We're staying in Spain because this is our home."



Read more: While France Deports Roma Gypsies, Spain Integrates Them - TIME

@Audio, so this bs that Gypsies don't want to change, integrate and they like living in ***** and squalor and commit petty crimes seems just like that, a pile of racist bull crap.

 

[Joe Shearer]

You sure that's not the window open and you are smelling newly built plumbing?

Considering that it's you, it is newly built plumbing. Not very well built either. But then you lot never could do anything properly, could you? Not even become good Europeans.

I found this
There is no doubt that racism fans the flames of anti-Rom sentiment. Having South Asian physical features, Roma are darker than most Balkan peoples and thus readily identifiable. Xenophobic nationalist organizations target Roma as a threat to national and racial "purity." Centuries of stereotyping also play a significant role in anti-Rom sentiment which gives rise to individual and group violence. One of the most common stereotypes is that Roma are criminals. In fact, the word tsigan in many European languages means thief or cheater, similar to the English verb "to gyp" (from Gypsy), meaning to cheat. The media reinforce these stereotypes by reporting the ethnicity of Rom criminal suspects while withholding the ethnicity of others. In fact, according to the Project on Ethnic Relations 1992 Report on Roma in Central and Eastern Europe, the rate of conviction for theft is no higher among Roma than the national averages, and the rates for murder and rape are far lower. The few reliable studies of "Gypsy criminality" strongly question the stereotype; a 1982 Hungarian study concluded that while crime by Roma is twice that national average, less than 1.5 percent of Roma commit criminal offenses. A 1991 Hungarian survey claims that the rate of criminal behavior in poor Rom neighborhoods is not higher than the rate in poor non-Rom neighborhoods, suggesting that the most important factor to consider is poverty, not ethnicity. - See more at: Persecution and Politicization: Roma (Gypsies) of Eastern Europe | Cultural Survival

These Balkan mongrels are the scummiest.

 

[Audio]

Enlighten us then. Is there any statistical proof that Gypsies are over represented in crimes? Anecdotal evidence don't count, neither does the rant on stormfront.

I will not cater to your whims and your bias. You have a YouTube video with a cop from Germany explaining the numbers from one building alone in this thread.
And if you really think i come up with this stuff on stormfront and that "innocent" people are being exiled only because they have darker complexion....

Considering that it's you, it is newly built plumbing. Not very well built either. But then you lot never could do anything properly, could you? Not even become good Europeans.



These Balkan mongrels are the scummiest.

lol, no, no, i think it's your neighbours. As for good Europeans, there's your cousins we can aspire to.

 

[Audio]

While France Deports Roma Gypsies, Spain Integrates Them - TIME


@Audio, so this bs that Gypsies don't want to change, integrate and they like living in ***** and squalor and commit petty crimes seems just like that, a pile of racist bull crap.

It is similar here in Slovenia too, but when you go to Germany, Switzerland, Italy, there's a whole another story. there is no official statistics for Roma crime, since labeling it like that is deemed not politically correct. Similarly to immigrant crime isn't differentiated from native one.

91' hungarian study don't really count that much because that was just when communism ended, and in communism, everyone had jobs. Even if it was unprofitable. This was the silver lining that communist parties used to praise themselves over capitalism.

The Gypsy crime family population in the United States is directly responsible for an estimated $15 billion dollars in varying forms of thievery annually. Gypsy hunter, Detective Donna Fitzgerald of the North Palm Beach, Florida Police Department says, "Most Gypsy crimes are directed at people who are the most vulnerable. People in times of emotional pain are often easy prey. Our elderly are their largest targets because they still trust people. The victims are our biggest concern."

http://www.policemag.com/channel/gangs/articles/2001/06/gypsies-kings-of-con.aspx

PARIS, France - Hundreds of armed police have been placed around Paris' major tourist monuments because of an influx of criminal gangs from eastern Europe.

It follows a huge increase in the number of aggressive beggars and pickpockets flooding into the French capital from Romania and Bulgaria – countries whose citizens will soon have unrestricted access to the UK.

http://www.eturbonews.com/34329/gypsy-criminal-gangs-eastern-europe-overrun-paris-tourist-attrac

Roma make up 2-3% of population in the Czech Republic. According to Říčan (1998), Roma make up more than 60% of Czech prisoners and about 20-30% earn their livelihood in illegal ways, such as prostitution, trafficking and other property crimes.[42] Roma are thus more than 20 times overrepresented in Czech prisons than their population share would suggest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antiziganism


Sorry @Random Boy, i really didn't mean to go on a tirade against the Roma, but you and your uncles saying it's all because of skin color and how gypsies are poor victims of hateful Yuropeans is bullshit.

 

[INDIC]

While France Deports Roma Gypsies, Spain Integrates Them - TIME


@Audio, so this bs that Gypsies don't want to change, integrate and they like living in ***** and squalor and commit petty crimes seems just like that, a pile of racist bull crap.

Few years back, two Romas were found dead on some beach of Italy and nobody called the police or hospital perhaps for two days. I didn't expect such thing from West Europe.

 

[INDIC]

lol, you're just making stuff up now. There was another indian, his nickname was doc-something, in the early days of me being here he was implying i am from those parts and kept posting a picture of some woman, with insinuations if i remember her. He then asked straight up if i wasn't on some other forums under a different nickname.

Now, run along and find me that post where im say i'm Kazakh and stop being a liar.



Ja sam pola Slovenac, pola Svajcarac. Tvoj ujak iz Indije prica gluposti.

I know vsdoc. You are not from Kazakhstan but Denialstan

 

[Audio]

These Balkan mongrels are the scummiest.

Ironically, the former commie governments did everything they could to integrate them so they can keep up the facade. Please learn stuff before you speak.

I know vsdoc. You are not from Kazakhstan but Denialstan

Ok, we can just leave it at you being a liar. No problem. Have fun.

 

[Audio]

Few years back, two Romas were found dead on some beach of Italy and nobody called the police or hospital perhaps for two days. I didn't expect such thing from West Europe.

More lies. Please educate yourself.

At about 1pm, the four girls decided to go into the water even though none of them, it seems, knew how to swim. They soon got into difficulties because of strong currents in the area and were hit by an unusually big wave.

Two of the girls were rescued by life-savers from a nearby private beach. But rescuers were unable to reach the two oldest until they were already dead.

Their corpses were dragged ashore and laid out on the sand under beach towels.

"But the knot of curious onlookers that formed around the girls' bodies dissolved as [swiftly] as it had formed," the newspaper Corriere della Sera reported. "Few left the beach or abandoned their sunbathing. When the police from the mortuary arrived an hour later with coffins, the two girls were carried away on the shoulders [of the officers] between bathers stretched out in the sun."

Gypsy girls' corpses on beach in Italy fail to put off sunbathers | World news | The Guardian

 

[Random Boy]

It is similar here in Slovenia too, but when you go to Germany, Switzerland, Italy, there's a whole another story. there is no official statistics for Roma crime, since labeling it like that is deemed not politically correct. Similarly to immigrant crime isn't differentiated from native one.

If it is not politcally correct why is European Media so Anti-Roma in newspapers and in movies and serials even the roma are never represented as average "normal" humans always exotic even if sometimes romanticised.

91' hungarian study don't really count that much because that was just when communism ended, and in communism, everyone had jobs. Even if it was unprofitable. This was the silver lining that communist parties used to praise themselves over capitalism.

There should be a study on roma crime.

Gypsies: Kings of Con - Article - POLICE Magazine



Armed police guard Paris tourist attractions from Romanian, Bulgarian thugs Gypsy criminal gangs ...

Well if 20-30% live by illegal ways it means that the rest 70-80% doesnt, right? Roma are overrepresented in crime, but how many Roma are criminal? And illegaly ways could be selling cheaper cigarettes, cheap chinese products etc. or playing Music without license or selling stuff without license. Which is technically a crime, but just very petty. It is something else then thievery, robbery, murder, rape etc.

Antiziganism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Sorry @Random Boy, i really didn't mean to go on a tirade against the Roma, but you and your uncles saying it's all because of skin color and how gypsies are poor victims of hateful Yuropeans is bullshit.

It is not only because of Skin Colour. But Skin Colour is a part of it. You fail to recognise that Roma can be and are victims of discrimination and partially of hate crimes. Did you watched my Video of Hungary targeting Roma to kill them. Or the Article about the Italian Mob putting Roma Settlement on Fire because of false Rape accussation. I remember I have been a normal Boy in Serbia and my Dad worked and my mum worked partly but partly was Housewife and I had Problems with my Neighbours who called me deragatory words. I was just a child but learned very early what it means to be of roma ancestry and how you get discriminated. I lived in a House not in a Trailer.

 

[Roybot]

I will not cater to your whims and your bias. You have a YouTube video with a cop from Germany explaining the numbers from one building alone in this thread.
And if you really think i come up with this stuff on stormfront and that "innocent" people are being exiled only because they have darker complexion....

Seriously? A youtube video about one building ? Not the sharpest tool in the shed are you? Should we go and pull out stats from other cesspools and ghettos of European cities and towns?

Am not saying that Gypsies don't commit crime, am sure they have some crims amongst them, like every other group does. But there is obvious bias in the way your governments are dealing with them. Deporting them all, just because a few commit petty crimes, just because they don't have a political clout. Would you guys have the balls to do the same to other groups? If am not wrong Muslims migrants are over represented in prison statistics, would you government have the balls to deport Muslim migrants cause of that?

You are picking on the weak one, and feel no shame in doing so.

 

[Audio]

Seriously? A youtube video about one building ? Not the sharpest tool in the shed are you? Should we go and pull out stats from other cesspools and ghettos of European cities and towns?

Am not saying that Gypsies don't commit crime, am sure they have some crims amongst them, like every other group does. But there is obvious bias in the way your governments are dealing with them. Deporting them all, just because a few commit petty crimes, just because they don't have a political clout. Would you guys have the balls to do the same to other groups? If am not wrong Muslims migrants are over represented in prison statistics, would you government have the balls to deport Muslim migrants cause of that?

Sure sure, if you cannot take an example from that one video you can take representation in Czech prisons which i also quoted. What excuse will you think of in that case?

Like i wrote above, the stats don't reflect it because it is not deemed politically correct to take account of ethnicity, but you somehow conveniently glossed over that.

It is not only crime, it is begging, scams, bad hygienic conditions in their slums, etc....though why am i even writing this. Obviously blood is not water and you'll be sticking out for them no matter what.

You are picking on the weak one, and feel no shame in doing so.

Dozens of Roma (Gypsies) have arrived back in Romania after being repatriated by France under a controversial policy backed by President Nicolas Sarkozy.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11020429

Note where it says back to Romania, as they arrived as illegals (all of them who were deported, what percentage does crime is irelevant in this case) all can be deported. Sharpest tool and all that.

As for Muslims, same thing, those that are foreign can be deported.

will be expelled from the country in the coming days as part of ongoing efforts to deport foreign-born preachers who "refer to the need to fight against France".

http://www.france24.com/en/20130130-france-deport-radical-imams-islam-valls

Any other concerns you have that i can address?

 

[Random Boy]

also your first article says

We have all heard or know about organized crime. But did you know there is an organized crime family specializing in fraud that has successfully operated throughout the world for almost 2,000 years?

then it goes on explaining that romanies are the gypsies and it means egyptian etc. and they are all criminal. sounds like Hollywood. roma departure out of india was just 1.400 years ago and they are in europe since 800 years. how can they steal since 2000 years? also i doubt the Story with the crucifixation. i never was taught the Story nor anyone else in my Family. but i heard that it was a common blood Label in medieval times by the europeans, they thought Romas are doomed because they stole the nails to Jesus christs crucifixation similar as to jews are doomed to wander because they rejected him.

 

[Audio]

It is not only because of Skin Colour. But Skin Colour is a part of it. You fail to recognise that Roma can be and are victims of discrimination and partially of hate crimes. Did you watched my Video of Hungary targeting Roma to kill them. Or the Article about the Italian Mob putting Roma Settlement on Fire because of false Rape accussation. I remember I have been a normal Boy in Serbia and my Dad worked and my mum worked partly but partly was Housewife and I had Problems with my Neighbours who called me deragatory words. I was just a child but learned very early what it means to be of roma ancestry and how you get discriminated. I lived in a House not in a Trailer.

Look, Serbia and Europe don't really go together. Same with Hungary with their despotic Orban in power. As for Italy, well, no comment there, except maybe you should remember they are the land of the mafia and are easily stirred and revenge played a not so small role in their lives up to not so long ago. Especially in the south.