Erdogan: S-400 is a done deal. We will start co-production now and may work with S-500

[UzaySan]

Bavar 373 for

Is this a copy or indegionus? If its a copy dd you guys made any improvment?

 

[bsruzm]

To think the entire F-35 program will collapse just because of Turkey would be foolish. We would be happy to replace you in manufacturing parts for the F-35. The US, NATO and their allies are not in a hurry. Even without 5th generation aircraft, their airforces are far stronger than anything you could throw at them.

Also the F-35 was never meant to be a profitable program.

BSG.

 

[Sine Nomine]

Bavar 373 for

I really was other day thinking,perhaps Pakistan should take a look into this system.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Don't know about the others, but for the PAF it's a great piece of news!!! The antidotes for S-400 will be ready by the time they're delivered to India...

 

[azyr]

To think the entire F-35 program will collapse just because of Turkey would be foolish. We would be happy to replace you in manufacturing parts for the F-35. The US, NATO and their allies are not in a hurry. Even without 5th generation aircraft, their airforces are far stronger than anything you could throw at them.

Also the F-35 was never meant to be a profitable program.

You need to comprehend why the program collapses when a key player exits it. It's about the time needed to replace Turkey in all aspects (manufacturing and servicing) and how the program as a whole will be affected in that timeframe.

Sure, Israel would be able to replace Turkey in both those aspects - but when?

 

[Beny Karachun]

You need to comprehend why the program collapses when a key player exits it. It's about the time needed to replace Turkey in all aspects (manufacturing and servicing) and how the program as a whole will be affected in that timeframe.

Sure, Israel would be able to replace Turkey in both those aspects - but when?

You're not such a key player. And again, as I said, no one is in a hurry. The amount of 5th generation fighters the West has is way more than the East. Air superiority is insured. If Turkey pulls out, it doesn't stop the production cycle, it just lowers its rate.

 

[Mithridates]

Is this a copy or indegionus? If its a copy dd you guys made any improvment?

this is homegrown. it's a long story but the short version is its the result of previous upgrades.

 

[skyshadow]

Is this a copy or indegionus? If its a copy dd you guys made any improvment?

This is Bavar 373 air defence system and its made by Iran, it is not a copy of any Western products. The system has been in making for almost 12 years, and its Its capabilities are roughly 1.5 times strong than the S300 pmu 2 system.

The Bavar 373 – which translates as “faith” – is designed to intercept cruise missiles, drones, combat aircraft and ballistic missiles.

Bavar-373 missile defense system uses two or three types of missiles to confront aerial targets in different layers.

The Iranian commander said the Bavar-373 surface-to-air missile system is more advanced than the Russian S-300 missile defense system.

Bavar-373 is capable of hitting targets at a high altitude. The new system uses a phased array radar like Russian 96L6 radar for tracking aerodynamic targets and ballistic missiles in medium to long ranges, mounted on the ZAFAR heavy truck.

I really was other day thinking,perhaps Pakistan should take a look into this system.

i would like that. i did not see any form for this system in pk section i would like to see what is pk members analysis of this air defence system. if there is one then please tag me.

 

[damm1t]

The Iranian commander said the Bavar-373 surface-to-air missile system is more advanced than the Russian S-300 missile defense system.

Hmm, if its better so why Iran bought S-300 from Russia for billion dolar. Its a huge amount of money.

 

[WinterNights]

Hmm, if its better so why Iran bought S-300 from Russia for billion dolar. Its a huge amount of money.

Because Iran started developing this system after Russia refused to deliver the S-300. Russia only finally delivered S-300 last year and the one Iran got is apparently even more advanced than PMU2 and will boost Iran air defence till Bavar is fully operation. Bavar should become operation this year.

 

[skyshadow]

Hmm, if its better so why Iran bought S-300 from Russia for billion dolar. Its a huge amount of money.

well we gave Russia the money in 2007, but they did not give us the system, so we complained about them at the International Court, when Russia realized that the court's decision will be in favor of Iran, they decided to give us the system. And at the time of the delivery of the S300 system in 2016 Bavar 373 system was not yet ready, and Russia did not want to give us the money back, so we selected S300 pmu 2 system and they delivered them us and they knew Bavar 373 will be more advance. In the end, the Russians did not give us back money, so we had to get the system.

 

[MMM-E]

This is Bavar 373 air defence system and its made by Iran, it is not a copy of any Western products

China copied Soviet missile technology , Iran copied Soviet missile technology via China , Ukraine and N.Korea

 

[Bengal71]

I just like the way Erdogan talks like the boss he is. I wish this man has another 20 years of life left and stays in power. Classic Ottoman, like a boss.

P

Turkey should work with Russia

-- Nuclear Power Plant
-- S400 Air Defense System with Turkish Radar software and IFF System
-- maybe also S500 in near future


-- and Turkey is global partner of F35 program since 1999 and Turkey invested $1,25 billion for F35 program
but the US is threatening Turkey to block the sale of F-35

President ERDOGAN said that Turkey will resort to international arbitration if the US blocks the sale of F-35 to Turkey
so the US will pay billiions of dollars penalty to Turkey

then SU-57 Fighter Jet with Turkish design cockpit , electronics , source codes , software , IFF System , SPEWS-II self protection Electronic Warfare Suite and air to air missiles - cruise missile and smart Bombs

Greece,Egypt,Israel,Iran and Saudi Arabia are potential threats to Turkey in the region
I prefer Turkish control S400 + SU-57 instead of American control F35 against Greek F-16s , Egyptian Rafales , MIG-29M2s and Israeli F-15s-F-35s

I was discussing with you the other day, even if Turkey gets the F-35 it should not go for it. Get Su-57 and work on your own 5th gen without an US or European engine.

 

[raptor22]

China copied Soviet missile technology , Iran copied Soviet missile technology via China , Ukraine and N.Korea

Well show us Bavar equivalent in China , Ukraine and N.Korea or even in Russian AD products ... on missile technology we first had Libya & N Korea but things has got changed & now its Iran providing NK with technology:

"...North Korea’s Unha-series may now incorporate some Iranian technologies. North Korea’s Unha-2 launch in 2009 failed when the rocket’s third stage did not separate properly. North Korea’s first successful Unha-series launch, in December 2012, used a larger third stage that appeared to be similar to a rocket stage previously seen only in Iran..."
​

 

[azyr]

You're not such a key player. And again, as I said, no one is in a hurry. The amount of 5th generation fighters the West has is way more than the East. Air superiority is insured. If Turkey pulls out, it doesn't stop the production cycle, it just lowers its rate.

That wasn't the point I was trying to make though. If Turkey exits ;

• The F35 will still fly
• It will still be used by the nations that already have them
• It will still sell some more

I'm not refuting any of this. What I am saying though is that NATO is weaker because the F35 isn't used by everyone. You lose Turkey and you don't have maintenance or refitting capabilities in that region. Your plane is now also more expensive to buy and maintain.

Some countries that were already on the fence with the F35 will undoubtedly decide against buying it when this happens.

So yes, the program will have much less airfields and maintenance centers and weapon systems to chose from as a result of this. The whole point of the program was to have a plane that could take off from the US and circle the globe starting from Europe all the way to the far east (I know they can reach China from the other side, not my point though).

If you don't have enough assets and logistics in place to maintain this then all you have left is a capable jet fighter that is 5th gen. Sure, that's great - but that's not why all this money was spent was it? It could've been done much cheaper.

TLDR : The F35 is in the balance right now with many nations in NATO that outright refuse to buy it because of expenses. When Turkey is out of the program that number will increase even more and therefore the F35 will not be the F-16 of the new age. It will just be a 5th gen fighter that some nations use. And that was not the plan. Hence why I said that if Turkey exits then the plan will fail.