DRDO to unveil catapult gun system built on Arjun MBT Mk-I chassis | GSQR trials in May

[DESERT FIGHTER]

yes,Rifled Gun generally faces a lot more wear and tear than Smoothbore.but recent developments enabled us to reduce this gap to significant amount,if not completely.they don't have lower range,in fact,they've more accuracy.also,Rifled gun can fire missiles...Arjun-1 can fire Lahat.actually,Arjun can fire all existing type of missiles.you're still living in 60's where this kind of problems surfaced.its all about what you want from your gun.Rheinmettal's Smoothbore can't fire missiles(or atleast couldn't).in the past,there was time when Rifled Gun couldn't fire APFSDS rounds.but now,it can fire it without any hindarence.in fact,its smoothbore which can't fire HESH rounds.its the HEAT rounds,which couldn't be fired from Rifled guns in the past.but specially designed HEAT rounds can be fired now,which Arjun will use.



you've no clue about what you're talking about..right???New Rifled Gun has life over 400 rounds(holy fk,where did you find this 'few dozens' data??)wear and tear problem has been solved to much extent,thats why new guns can fire APFSDS as well as HEAT rounds.seriously,you should study more.and who told you "HESH" is obsolete???HESH is multipurpose round which can be used against tank,soldiers as well as buildings.the declining of use is not for its effectiveness,but love for Smoothbore guns,where this round can't be used.but still,a lot of tanks as well as arty pieces use this ammo.seriously,some times I wonder whether you just post for trolling,or you just don't know.

Thts a lot of bullshit..let me explain how:


I never said said a rifled gun can't fire sabots or stabilised rounds.. I said modern rounds Dnt need a rifled gun ... Infact a rifled gun only screws the effectiveness of finned rounds and also itself... By not only decreasing its life but also the performance of the round.. You don't want a stablised finned sabot etc spinning ?lmao.. While it's the opposite n smoothbores... !!! Which have longer ranger,more muzzle velocity and accuracy thanks to modern ammo.. Tht Dnt need a rifled gun with its cons to be stablised.. Hence no problem with accuracy as ur pal was parroting..

2nd) no the basic mk1 can't ... Even the improved Arjun mk2 is facing smokey chamber issues while firing a missile./. And yes no structural change is there... If it was so hunky dory it wouldn't be a problem


An improved version of the same tank facing a problem resolved in the basic version sounds logical ????..And yes I did provide the sources...


Heck it's gun is obsolete... Again I provided the link with data..


3) HESH is obsolete it was obsolete even in the 80s.. Unless you want to destroy apartment/buildings... Coz it sucks even against fortified positions... Heck do take a look at the ones in indian army service.. Even those aren't even worth crap.. Compared to other HESH crap rounds tht nobody uses today!!!!!!!!!

again why do Abrams,lecrecs,Leo's,AKs,t90s,t84s etc use the smoothbore if it's inferior to a rifled gun???


P.S: even the rounds in service with indian army are ... Read the links I posted..

 

[Dazzler]

Rifled gun is very much obsolete tech by todays standards, wonder why Indians went with them? Brits abandoned them back in 90s and went with smoothbores.

Rifled gun can be a nightmare in field conditions with its huge wear and tear that brings a small barrel life, the increased accuracy is questionable at best. Modern smoothbores are sophisticated and accurate.

Rifled guns produce less chamber pressure for shell penetrators which restrict their penetration values.

HESH is an obsolete shell, just like rifled gun, it is unable to penetrate a vehicle equipped with adequate composite armour (boron, titanium etc) and is next to useless against ERA.

 

[Blast##]

Can Arjun fire canister round like smoothbore barrel gun ??

 

[SURYA-1]

Thts a lot of bullshit..let me explain how:


I never said said a rifled gun can't fire sabots or stabilised rounds.. I said modern rounds Dnt need a rifled gun ... Infact a rifled gun only screws the effectiveness of finned rounds and also itself... By not only decreasing its life but also the performance of the round.. You don't want a stablised finned sabot etc spinning ?lmao.. While it's the opposite n smoothbores... !!! Which have longer ranger,more muzzle velocity and accuracy thanks to modern ammo.. Tht Dnt need a rifled gun with its cons to be stablised.. Hence no problem with accuracy as ur pal was parroting..

2nd) no the basic mk1 can't ... Even the improved Arjun mk2 is facing smokey chamber issues while firing a missile./. And yes no structural change is there... If it was so hunky dory it wouldn't be a problem


An improved version of the same tank facing a problem resolved in the basic version sounds logical ????..And yes I did provide the sources...


Heck it's gun is obsolete... Again I provided the link with data..


3) HESH is obsolete it was obsolete even in the 80s.. Unless you want to destroy apartment/buildings... Coz it sucks even against fortified positions... Heck do take a look at the ones in indian army service.. Even those aren't even worth crap.. Compared to other HESH crap rounds tht nobody uses today!!!!!!!!!

again why do Abrams,lecrecs,Leo's,AKs,t90s,t84s etc use the smoothbore if it's inferior to a rifled gun???


P.S: even the rounds in service with indian army are ... Read the links I posted..

You are pathetic jingoistic troll


What link earlier did you provide ??Link of forum discussion. tsk tsk


Are only APFSDS rounds only used as ammo for tank ?? What about normal and HESH rounds ??


Why do one country's army uses one type and another country uses another is based on their doctrine and requirement.

Did someone tell you that India manufactures both type of guns and uses both as per requirement.

 

[Dazzler]

You are pathetic jingoistic troll


What link earlier did you provide ??Link of forum discussion. tsk tsk


Are only APFSDS rounds only used as ammo for tank ?? What about normal and HESH rounds ??


Why do one country's army uses one type and another country uses another is based on their doctrine and retirement.

APFSDS is most effective against an mbt, secondly, a HEAT round with a high penetration value such invar of relfex or Kombat. Try using a HESH against an mbt covered with composite armour and ERA and see what happens.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

You are pathetic jingoistic troll


What link earlier did you provide ??Link of forum discussion. tsk tsk


Are only APFSDS rounds only used as ammo for tank ?? What about normal and HESH rounds ??


Why do one country's army uses one type and another country uses another is based on their doctrine and retirement.

Did someone tell you that India manufactures both type of guns and uses both as per requirement.

Wow what a retarded reply..

Rifled gun is very much obsolete tech by todays standards, wonder why Indians went with them? Brits abandoned them back in 90s and went with smoothbores.

Rifled gun can be a nightmare in field conditions with its huge wear and tear that brings a small barrel life, the increased accuracy is questionable at best. Modern smoothbores are sophisticated and accurate.

Rifled guns produce less chamber pressure for shell penetrators which restrict their penetration values.

HESH is an obsolete shell, just like rifled gun, it is unable to penetrate a vehicle equipped with adequate composite armour (boron, titanium etc) and is next to useless against ERA.

Kindly post about the obsolete gun used by Arjun with data ...

 

[SURYA-1]

APFSDS is most effective against an mbt, secondly, a HEAT round with a high penetration value such invar of relfex or Kombat. Try using a HESH against an mbt covered with composite armour and ERA and see what happens.

APFSDS and HEAT both rounds can be fired from rifled gun. Infact casting rifled gun is more difficult than smoothbore but still they are used due to their advantage over later in accuracy.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Arjun's HESH rounds are keeping in mind the large defensive fortifications[bunds] and bunkers PA has on the punjab-rajasthan border.Infantry in bunkers with ATGMS is more lethal at times than enemy MBts.[see israel-hezbollah war,yom kippur war]Thus the cheap HESH round was picked to quickly and accurately decimate these from range and allow support infantry to advance.Combined arms warfare for the 'experts' who are unaware of the term.

 

[Dazzler]

APFSDS and HEAT both rounds can be fired from rifled gun. Infact casting rifled gun is more difficult than smoothbore but still they are used due to their advantage over later in accuracy.

read post #62

Arjun's HESH rounds are keeping in mind the large defensive fortifications[bunds] and bunkers PA has on the punjab-rajasthan border.Infantry in bunkers with ATGMS is more lethal at times than enemy MBts.[see israel-hezbollah war,yom kippur war]Thus the cheap HESH round was picked to quickly and accurately decimate these from range and allow support infantry to advance.Combined arms warfare for the 'experts' who are unaware of the term.

Congrats on your promotion

clearing fortifications with an mbt in a battlefield is not a good idea because adversary will not wait for Ajuns to clear the fortifications and fire as it sees. Also, HESH can also be fired by other mbts in the region. Your point on infantry and ATGM is mute, both sides will have infantry teams with ATGMs.

 

[Killswitch]

yet another DRDO product which doesnt even come close to meeting army requirements. Why couldnt they mount the 155/45 bofors on the tank? (besides the barrels bursting)

 

[SURYA-1]

read post #62




Congrats on your promotion

clearing fortifications with an mbt in a battlefield is not a good idea because adversary will not wait for Ajuns to clear the fortifications and fire as it sees. Also, HESH can also be fired by other mbts in the region. Your point on infantry and ATGM is mute, both sides will have infantry teams with ATGMs.

Ran out of jingoistic rants ??

 

[Dazzler]

Ran out of jingoistic rants ??

counter the argument first

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

read post #62




Congrats on your promotion

clearing fortifications with an mbt in a battlefield is not a good idea because adversary will not wait for Ajuns to clear the fortifications and fire as it sees. Also, HESH can also be fired by other mbts in the region. Your point on infantry and ATGM is mute, both sides will have infantry teams with ATGMs.

Thanks .

Exactly,and while ours can take out the bunkers from long range with cheap rounds.Urs with AP rounds alone can't and have to wait for air support or precision artillery or make costly infantry assaults to clear the ATGM squads

 

[jhungary]

its the role man...a 120mm MBT is Tank,whose role is to fill up "Heavy Direct Fire"...SPG generally provides "Indirect Fire" as well as limited "Direct Fire" capability.only difference from towed gun is,it can be maneuvered under its own power.also,it has substantial amount of protection against other arty pieces which they don't.so,both are used for different purposes.

Actually, this is not how you classify direct and indirect fire.....

Direct fire mean the gunner saw the target and directly fire at the target, while indirect fire mean the gunner DO NOT HAVE the sight of the target and have to rely on a spotter...

Both tank and SPG can do direct and indirect fire.....

 

[kingdurgaking]

No wonder poor Europeans n Americans went for smoothbores instead of awesome rifled guns.. Damn u smart!

Also enlighten us how a rifled gun is more accurate than a modern smoothbore.. Not to forget life,use of different rounds,missiles or even range?combat proven!?


MK 1's was designed as per IA's requirements. Maintaince is not a big problem as they can be replaced when required since guns are home built.

Yes no wonder indian army went for t-90s with good numbers over 118+ Arjun's.. Or 124 mk2 under development MBTS's...

Hint: The gun of mk1 is obsolete not coz it's just rifled..





Damn you are so smart.. Poor me.. N even your jingoistic defence journalists..

A rifled gun provides accuracy more than smooth barreled gun .. It needs more maintenance than smooth barrel.. The simple logic is once a round is fired in smooth barrel it will state rotating the round within the gun which means it will be able to pierce through the friction of air easily because it is rotating just like a driller does.. Simple physics.. thats why better range and more accuracy... There are documentary in you tube on this..