does israel have the right to exist?

[Mujahid Memon]

• Israel should not have been created
• now it is being there for 60+ yrs, they have the right to further exist
• Altough they've the RIGHT TO EXIST, BUT NOT IN THIS WAY

 

[Burger Boy]

No use arguying with me, the time was the late 40s, and the place was the UN.
They did not convince the UN.

Maybe they did not prepare any reasonable counter proposal. Wasn't borne at the time.

II believe it was incorrect for the UN to be involved in the first place. What gives the nations of the world the right to partition a land that wasn't theirs.


If the UN was to be involved at all, It would've been better if the British had allowed a referendum in the Mandate of Palestine to determine which land should go to which state as was done in Norway in 1905, East Timor in 1999, and Sudan in 2011.

 

[Ahiska]

Yes it has a right to exist and it was good that it was created.

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

Because Muslim believe its the same religion and have the same right over the site. New structure was built and old structure remained except ofcourse erosion took place.

mosque was build over it.

You mean minority muslim ruling a majority population? where?

no i means jews will rule irrespective to muslims population. like in other muslims country other religion people don't have voting rights . In Israel also muslims would not be given right to change govt.

 

[he-man]

@RazPaK

Saaleya main bahar ki geya tu shudayee hi ho geya??
jaabliyaan chaadi jaana besharma......................pump te petrol kaun bharu??

ek pakistan nai ga,,,goreyaan ne keh ke lai laini aa teri je kam na kita othe

 

[jerry_tan]

Our country supported Israel right to exist!

 

[hussain0216]

mosque was build over it.


no i means jews will rule irrespective to muslims population. like in other muslims country other religion people don't have voting rights . In Israel also muslims would not be given right to change govt.

Yeah you mean an apartheid state

 

[Burger Boy]

I'm a little confused with the difference between the wording of the poll and the title of the thread

I answered no to the question because of the way it was worded.

"Should Israel have been created"

If I was alive in 1947 I would've voted against Israel creation because as I said the partition plan was unfair to the Arab.

However we are not living in the same times anymore.....and the actions of the Arabs made the situation worse.

For example, the Arabs threw more fuel on the fire by when Arab countries, mostly in North Africa, expelled their Jewish population. These Jews would immigrate to Israel. By some accounts, these Jews and their descendants make up the largest ethnic group in Israel.

However as for Israel's "right to exist," it has existed for 67 years and Israel has the right to exist by way of its military prowess...and will continue to exist until it is military defeated (unlikely) ....or is democratically dissolved.


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I also do agree with @gambit and @FaujHistorian that we can not only dwell on the past but should deal with the best course of action based on the current situation.

I may lose some friends for this but I'll say it anyway

Though I have sympathized with the Palestinians, I actually think its better if Muslim countries, including Pakistan, recognize Israel.

There is no chance of Pakistan ever going to war with Israel as Pakistan does not have the naval power to project forces overseas as it is situated so far away from Israel....not to mention that any war against Israel would cause Pakistan to distance itself from politically from the US and even from China.

Most of Israel's Arab neighbors have made peace with Israel, so its unlikely that they will go to war with Israel again, so Pakistani pilots cannot be sent to fight for Arab armies against Israel as they had done in the past.

Some people think that recognizing Israel will cause a betrayal of the Palestinian cause; however, I disagree.

Recognizing Israel will mean that political pressure can be placed on Israel to stop its occupation and cease settlements.

In addition, by recognizing Israel, countries could act as a mediator between the Palestinians and the Israelis.

 

[livingdead]

I'm a little confused with the difference between the wording of the poll and the title of the thread

I answered no to the question because of the way it was worded.

"Should Israel have been created"

If I was alive in 1947 I would've voted against Israel creation because as I said the partition plan was unfair to the Arab.

However we are not living in the same times anymore.....and the actions of the Arabs made the situation worse.

For example, the Arabs threw more fuel on the fire by when Arab countries, mostly in North Africa, expelled their Jewish population. These Jews would immigrate to Israel. By some accounts, these Jews and their descendants make up the largest ethnic group in Israel.

However as for Israel's "right to exist," it has existed for 67 years and Israel has the right to exist by way of its military prowess...and will continue to exist until it is military defeated (unlikely) ....or is democratically dissolved.

I also do agree with @gambit and @FaujHistorian that we can not only dwell on the past but should deal with the best course of action based on the current situation.

I may lose some friends for this but I'll say it anyway

Though I have sympathized with the Palestinians, I actually think its better if Muslim countries, including Pakistan, recognize Israel.

There is no chance of Pakistan ever going to war with Israel as Pakistan does not have the naval power to project forces overseas as it is situated so far away from Israel....not to mention that any war against Israel would cause Pakistan to distance itself from politically from the US and even from China.

Most of Israel's Arab neighbors have made peace with Israel, so its unlikely that they will go to war with Israel again, so Pakistani pilots cannot be sent to fight for Arab armies against Israel as they had done in the past.

Some people think that recognizing Israel will cause a betrayal of the Palestinian cause; however, I disagree.

Recognizing Israel will mean that political pressure can be placed on Israel to stop its occupation and cease settlements.

In addition, by recognizing Israel, countries could act as a mediator between the Palestinians and the Israelis.

how can you support existance of pakistan as a country and not israel?
Both were formed roughly around same time, by same colonial power. Both jews and muslims of subcontinent had similar argument, they will not survive and prosper as community(with be subjugated by others) without having a country of their own.
In case of jews, the threat was very real.
In 47 if you would have voted for pakistan then it would have been hypocrisy to oppose a jewish homeland.

 

[Burger Boy]

how can you support existance of pakistan as a country and not israel?
Both were formed roughly around same time, by same colonial power. Both jews and muslims of subcontinent had similar argument, they will not survive and prosper as community(with be subjugated by others) without having a country of their own.
In case of jews, the threat was very real.
In 47 if you would have voted for pakistan then it would have been hypocrisy to oppose a jewish homeland.

Well this'll be entirely hypothetical as its in the past now.......but anyway........I'll answer this as if I was alive in 1947......

+90% of the people of Pakistan are natives of the land in which they live. Most of the rest are muhajirs from India which immigrated in a population exchange or Afghans who immigrated from Afghanistan.

Contrast this to the population of Israel which was founded after the immigration of European Jews to Palestine in the early 20th century.

Jewish & Non-Jewish Population of Israel/Palestine (1517-Present) | Jewish Virtual Library



In short, almost all of the people of Pakistan are native to the land.......whereas almost all Israelis are/were immigrants/descendants of the immigrants from elsewhere.

 

[UKBengali]

how can you support existance of pakistan as a country and not israel?
Both were formed roughly around same time, by same colonial power. Both jews and muslims of subcontinent had similar argument, they will not survive and prosper as community(with be subjugated by others) without having a country of their own.
In case of jews, the threat was very real.
In 47 if you would have voted for pakistan then it would have been hypocrisy to oppose a jewish homeland.

Are you being serious here or trolling?

Pakistanis are nearly all indigenous to the land that makes up current day Pakistan.

Majority of Jews are imports from outside Palestine, and displaced the native population

 

[livingdead]

Are you being serious here or trolling?

Pakistanis are nearly all indigenous to the land that makes up current day Pakistan.

Majority of Jews are imports from outside Palestine, and displaced the native population

they did not displace natives by conquering the land. Are you saying you support a jewish homeland but not at that specific site?

Well this'll be entirely hypothetical as its in the past now.......but anyway........I'll answer this as if I was alive in 1947......

+90% of the people of Pakistan are natives of the land in which they live. Most of the rest are muhajirs from India which immigrated in a population exchange or Afghans who immigrated from Afghanistan.

Contrast this to the population of Israel which was founded after the immigration of European Jews to Palestine in the early 20th century.

Jewish & Non-Jewish Population of Israel/Palestine (1517-Present) | Jewish Virtual Library



In short, almost all of the people of Pakistan are native to the land.......whereas almost all Israelis are/were immigrants/descendants of the immigrants from elsewhere.

are you impying you support a jewish homeland but not at that site?

 

[UKBengali]

they did not displace natives by conquering the land. Are you saying you support a jewish homeland but not at that specific site?

For the crime of trying to exterminate Jews, Germany and Austria should have lost
some of their territory to allow a Jewish state to be formed.

 

[livingdead]

For the crime of trying to exterminate Jews, Germany and Austria should have lost
some of their territory to allow a Jewish state to be formed.

there by ensuring that jews live in fear of being invaded again and killed en masse? I would argue they should have chosen a site furthest from europe.

 

[hussain0216]

For the crime of trying to exterminate Jews, Germany and Austria should have lost
some of their territory to allow a Jewish state to be formed.

Exactly, the Germans kill 6 million so they should give up land to form israel

no but the jews and their indian lackeys what palestinians to suffer