Developed cancer drug for 'western patients' who could afford, not 'for Indians': Bayer's CEO

[surya kiran]

our marines work in our embassy and attend party and nightclubs. so what are you trying to say?

bzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.............the conversation just got a little intelligent. bzzzz offff

 

[amitkriit]

our marines work in our embassy and attend party and nightclubs. so what are you trying to say?



No, we do whats best for our people. Our people come first. We test it on yours, so it is safe for ours. You said yourself, own family comes first.

A. If your Marines are living a happy life in India then why are you complaining about it? Are you being jealous of your country men?
B. Are you a Nazi? May be a Mussolini fan?

 

[MarkusS]

A. If your Marines are living a happy life in India then why are you complaining about it? Are you being jealous of your country men?
B. Are you a Nazi? May be a Mussolini fan?

Mussolini has many fans in italy. He even has a duce monument in rome still standing. I stand for my people first. If we can profit from your people we should do it and we do it. Its just natural. family comes first.

 

[gambit]

We do not want their investments over dead bodies of our people.

That is an absurd argument. You are basically saying that the ONLY way to develop any drug is at the expense of people.

You really want the Indian government to tell our people that it cannot let them have access to life saving drugs because that might deter foreigners from investing into our country?

Cannot? What else can the GoI tell the people when foreigners decides not to invest? Or that these companies leave? Force investments and/or force them to stay?

Let us see...

'We, the Government of India, will compel you to give licensing rights to Indian companies and at a compensation rate at our discretion, and if you object and refuse to enter the Indian market, you are an immoral and evil company.'

Yeah...Like THAT is going to be incentive enough.

 

[kbd-raaf]

That is an absurd argument. You are basically saying that the ONLY way to develop any drug is at the expense of people.


Cannot? What else can the GoI tell the people when foreigners decides not to invest? Or that these companies leave? Force investments and/or force them to stay?

Let us see...

'We, the Government of India, will compel you to give licensing rights to Indian companies and at a compensation rate at our discretion, and if you object and refuse to enter the Indian market, you are an immoral and evil company.'

Yeah...Like THAT is going to be incentive enough.

Compulsory licensing is WTO approved.

 

[gambit]

Look don't blame a government. This is part of WTO. They were agreed upon in the 90s. Nothing new here. Typically, its the developed countries which harp about WTO, now we are.

They dont want to invest, let them not. Like I mentioned, there are enough Indian pharma companies which have scaled up and are now investing in R&D.

You cannot avoid the fact that compulsory licensing upon Bayer is the first for India.

GlaxoSmithKline licenses production of generic AIDS drugs in South Africa

The pharmaceutical company GlaxoSmithKline has granted a voluntary licence to a company in South Africa to manufacture and distribute low cost generic versions of three of its AIDS drugs, on the basis of an agreement announced last week.

This is VOLUNTARY, not compelled. So the issue is not about helping the host country in times of need. If GSK can do it, so can Bayer. And Natco Pharma is not doing this for charity.

Compulsory licensing is WTO approved.

That does not mean it is the right thing to exercise.

 

[amitkriit]

That is an absurd argument. You are basically saying that the ONLY way to develop any drug is at the expense of people.


Cannot? What else can the GoI tell the people when foreigners decides not to invest? Or that these companies leave? Force investments and/or force them to stay?

Let us see...

'We, the Government of India, will compel you to give licensing rights to Indian companies and at a compensation rate at our discretion, and if you object and refuse to enter the Indian market, you are an immoral and evil company.'

Yeah...Like THAT is going to be incentive enough.

Two questions:
A. Is the GOI committing a mistake by ensuring availability of life saving medicine at affordable price for Indian citizens at the cost of profitability of a foreign entity?
B. Is the GOI in violation of any international laws and/or treaties of which India is a signatory.

 

[gambit]

Two questions:
A. Is the GOI committing a mistake by ensuring availability of life saving medicine at affordable price for Indian citizens at the cost of profitability of a foreign entity?
B. Is the GOI in violation of any international laws and/or treaties of which India is a signatory.

Nice dodge, but it will not work. Explain how is Bayer profiting by costing Indian lives.

 

[kbd-raaf]

You cannot avoid the fact that compulsory licensing upon Bayer is the first for India.

GlaxoSmithKline licenses production of generic AIDS drugs in South Africa

This is VOLUNTARY, not compelled. So the issue is not about helping the host country in times of need. If GSK can do it, so can Bayer. And Natco Pharma is not doing this for charity.


That does not mean it is the right thing to exercise.

Without insurance, can you afford $96,000 treatments? If not, how do you expect 99% of Indians to be able to.

These guys were never the target market for Bayer anyway.

 

[gambit]

Without insurance, can you afford $96,000 treatments? If not, how do you expect 99% of Indians to be able to.

These guys were never the target market for Bayer anyway.

That is why Dekker made that comment. Granted, it was crude and even offensive, but it was the truth. Nexavar is about fighting a complex form of cancer that required billions and years to produce a drug. You cannot expect Bayer to sell it at cost, let alone give it away for free, as seemingly you guys are arguing here, and the only countries that can afford to pay for it are the Western countries. If the GoI is going to force Bayer to accept royalty payments that is solely upon its discretion, do not complain WHEN foreign companies hesitate to invest in any partnership with India.

 

[kbd-raaf]

Nice dodge, but it will not work. Explain how is Bayer profiting by costing Indian lives.

He didn't say that Bayer profiting would cost Indian lives.

There are three groups of people this will affect

a) People who could never afford the original drug
b) People who could afford the original drug but will not buy the generics
c) Bayer's shareholders

The availability of the Natco drugs for a) is not affecting Bayers bottom line.

Most people who could afford the original drug (people with Western Insurance companies) will not come to India to get the generic version of the drug. (Westerners are only paying ~$100 after insurance and Indians will pay ~$170 for the generics)

So all in all @gambit explain to me, how is this affecting Bayer shareholders too much. Don't you think the benefits (potentially saving many lives) is worth the cost (a tiny reduction in potential profit, if at all)?

That is why Dekker made that comment. Granted, it was crude and even offensive, but it was the truth. Nexavar is about fighting a complex form of cancer that required billions and years to produce a drug. You cannot expect Bayer to sell it at cost, let alone give it away for free, as seemingly you guys are arguing here, and the only countries that can afford to pay for it are the Western countries. If the GoI is going to force Bayer to accept royalty payments that is solely upon its discretion, do not complain WHEN foreign companies hesitate to invest in any partnership with India.

We'll see about that, a lot of govt.s have also started enforcing compulsory licensing in their nations. Bayer and co. would have to not enter those markets too.

That is why Dekker made that comment. Granted, it was crude and even offensive, but it was the truth. Nexavar is about fighting a complex form of cancer that required billions and years to produce a drug. You cannot expect Bayer to sell it at cost, let alone give it away for free, as seemingly you guys are arguing here, and the only countries that can afford to pay for it are the Western countries. If the GoI is going to force Bayer to accept royalty payments that is solely upon its discretion, do not complain WHEN foreign companies hesitate to invest in any partnership with India.

Oh the pharmas will complain a lot, but they'll enter the Indian market again, even if only 1% of Indians can afford their treatments that's still 12 million people, a number which will only continue to grow.

 

[Butchcassidy]

Why doesnt indian government buy these drugs at international prices and then give them at subsidised rates?
Just asking

 

[kbd-raaf]

Why doesnt indian government buy these drugs at international prices and then give them at subsidised rates?
Just asking

Why should it? It has broken no laws.

 

[Butchcassidy]

Why should it? It has broken no laws.

The government subsidizes petrol why not drugs?

 

[kbd-raaf]

The government subsidizes petrol why not drugs?

Because it's not possible to make a generic version of petrol.