'Death sentence to Italian marines will be an act of war'

[MarkusS]

If convicted they will be allowed to go back to Italy to serve their jail term inside an Italian jail. It is highly unlikely that they will get the death sentence.

As far as threats of war, economic sanction etc are concerned, they will be completely counter-productive because any sign of softening by the Government of India under such circumstances will be taken as a sign of weakness. It is extremely unlikely that any such threat will work even if they are eminent. As a proud nation that is the last thing we care about.

Italy must also tread judiciously, if pushed for an early trial under international pressure the government in the poll bound India will push for the harshest punishment (death sentence) due to domestic political compulsions. Please do not forget that trial was delayed partly because Italy refused to cooperate during the investigation process. Less media attention this issue gets the better. That is how diplomacy works, issues are settled behind closed doors.

Our government tries to solve that issue behind closed doors now. If thats not working, than public opinion will grow so strong that they must start to but sanctions on india. If even one indian sailor is saved form our marines without our two soldiers free, public here will explode and demand heads. Thats the simple fact. Public here will not support any effort to safe indian sailors. And it is 100% understandable. Sure it will be shit feeling for our soldiers to leave hostages behind at the hands of pirates, but thats the only logical consequence for that entire thing.

As i see india tries to put some steam out of the boiler and ruled out any possibility for death penalty

Italian marines won't face death penalty in India - The Economic Times

We bring the entire weight of the EU and NATO into this game now.

We say that if this issue is not solved as fast as possible and our marines back home, that we will stop any anti pirate operation. NATO and UNO can not afford Italy to leave Atalanta and the entire EU is standing with us. German ambassador also starts to put pressure on india to end this farce:

"Italy's Lower House Speaker Laura Boldrini chimed in Wednesday, saying in a letter to her European Parliament counterpart that India's case against the marines threatens the rule of international law. "While not wishing in any way to express myself on the merits of the court case, I believe that Italy - and, with it, Europe and the international community - must demand respect for international law and a rapid resolution of the case," Boldrini wrote to EP Speaker Martin Schulz. She also reminded Schulz of comments by other EU officials, including warnings just one day earlier that India's attempts to prosecute the Italian marines may hurt efforts to fight piracy in future. "The case is likely to have a negative impact on the EU's efforts and those around the world in the fight against piracy," EU High Representative for Foreign Affairs Catherine Ashton said in a letter Tuesday to European Parliament Deputy Speakers Gianni Pittella and Roberta Angelilli. Italian President Giorgio Napolitano also weighed in on the issue Wednesday. "I am doing everything I can to promote an approach that is in the common interest of Europe as a whole. And this is because the two marines were not in India on an fishing trip, but on an international mission," Napolitano said in Strasbourg, where he spoke before the European Parliament Tuesday. Ashton and German Ambassador to New Delhi Michael Steiner both expressed support for Rome in the case that has caused nearly two years of tensions between India and Italy."

Its said an important decission is made an 10th february. I hope our marines finally come back home and India and EU can finally settle this tragedy.

 

[amitkriit]

@MarkusS I have got reasons to believe that there is more into this "death penalty" issue than whatever information is available in the public domain. I think I have got some ideas, but will wait for the right moment to share.

The surprise was in India seeking the "death penalty" because the federal agency which is investigating the case (NIA) doesn't have the legal power to seek death penalty. That is why the NIA had asked for Supreme Court's permission and all the bickering started from there on. I believe the escalation was intentional and there was a purpose.

The marines have lost their appeal in the SC for trial in Italy, so they are staying here until the trial is over. Diplomatic pressure will not work on the Indian Judiciary. I hope that they will respect the law of the land. If they are innocent, they will be free.

Please remember that the EU was backing Italy when India asked Italy to return back the Marines. So I do not see anything new in these threats regarding economic sanctions. In fact we have lived and prospered under economic sanctions.

EU is not a major trading partner of India.

 

[MarkusS]

@MarkusS I have got reasons to believe that there is more into this "death penalty" issue than whatever information is available in the public domain. I think I have got some ideas, but will wait for the right moment to share.

The surprise was in India seeking the "death penalty" because the federal agency which is investigating the case (NIA) doesn't have the legal power to seek death penalty. That is why the NIA had asked for Supreme Court's permission and all the bickering started from there on. I believe the escalation was intentional and there was a purpose.

The marines have lost their appeal in the SC for trial in Italy, so they are staying here until the trial is over. Diplomatic pressure will not work on the Indian Judiciary. I hope that they will respect the law of the land. If they are innocent, they will be free.

Please remember that the EU was backing Italy when India asked Italy to return back the Marines. So I do not see anything new in these threats regarding economic sanctions. In fact we have lived and prospered under economic sanctions.

EU is not a major trading partner of India.

EU will not accept indias childish games any longer, thats the good things to know. And yes, EU is indias largest trading partner, we are 20% of your trade.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India–European_Union_relations

Italy set india an ultimatum, we wont wait any longer and follow this pathetic show. And since we threaten to leave NATO missions, we also push USA into the ring.

This bullshit goes for almost two years now. Our foreign ministry made clear that we demand a solution within the next days, if not we will take the respective steps, give out diplomatic status and bring them home. This corrupted court deserves no respect at all. And since we see indias position crumble in the last days under international pressure, i'm sure we will have a solution soon. Propably monday we know more.

Respect goes both ways and what we see in india is a court system based on Kindergarten principles. Its two years now and this bogus court couldn't bring up anything. We gave it two years time to prove their case, they proved nothing.

We gave india the chance to save face and find a solution which both sides can agree with. India was unable to do so, so we will deal with it. Our law demands that we must protect our service men with all power.

Meanwhile we arrested a couple of indians last week and charge them for murder. We can play this game too as you see.

You say we should respect your laws. We did that. We showed more respect than any other nation would show. We send them back to you and we did so under great distress and greatest anger. We had ministers stepping back for this. We showed the greatest respective possible. But this is over, respect is not a gift, it must be earned. And the show india played deserves no respect.

 

[sarthak]

EU will not accept indias childish games any longer, thats the good things to know. And yes, EU is indias largest trading partner, we are 20% of your trade.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India–European_Union_relations

Italy set india an ultimatum, we wont wait any longer and follow this pathetic show. And since we threaten to leave NATO missions, we also push USA into the ring.

This bullshit goes for almost two years now. Our foreign ministry made clear that we demand a solution within the next days, if not we will take the respective steps, give out diplomatic status and bring them home. This corrupted court deserves no respect at all. And since we see indias position crumble in the last days under international pressure, i'm sure we will have a solution soon. Propably monday we know more.

Respect goes both ways and what we see in india is a court system based on Kindergarten principles. Its two years now and this bogus court couldn't bring up anything. We gave it two years time to prove their case, they proved nothing.

We gave india the chance to save face and find a solution which both sides can agree with. India was unable to do so, so we will deal with it. Our law demands that we must protect our service men with all power.

Meanwhile we arrested a couple of indians last week and charge them for murder. We can play this game too as you see.

You say we should respect your laws. We did that. We showed more respect than any other nation would show. We send them back to you and we did so under great distress and greatest anger. We had ministers stepping back for this. We showed the greatest respective possible. But this is over, respect is not a gift, it must be earned. And the show india played deserves no respect.

LOL, stfu fag. Your tiny country can't do squat. EU doesn't really give a shit about your country, get over it. What ultimatum can your country set? What can you even do? Bomb us with pastas and spagetti? We are a nuclear power a 1000 times your size. Your country is like a fly that can be squated for us. That's why ,take on someone your own size. The only reason they have avoided death penalty isn't because of the pressure that your tiny country or EU put on us, but because death penalty in India is only given for planned murders , that too , multiple planned murders. So really , take your ultimatum up your *** and **** off.

 

[MarkusS]

LOL, stfu fag. Your tiny country can't do squat. EU doesn't really give a shit about your country, get over it. What ultimatum can your country set? What can you even do? Bomb us with pastas and spagetti? We are a nuclear power a 1000 times your size. Your country is like a fly that can be squated for us. That's why ,take on someone your own size. The only reason they have avoided death penalty isn't because of the pressure that your tiny country or EU put on us, but because death penalty in India is only given for planned murders , that too , multiple planned murders. So really , take your ultimatum up your *** and **** off.

Your response shows i'm right.
Martin Schulz, leader of the EU parliament as well as Cathrin Ashton, chief foreign relations speaker call it their most important issue right now. The german ambassador starts a direct intervention. Italy is G8 nation. Our GDP and economy is bigger than india. Your fake nationalism doesn't change that. The issue is solved now. The ultimatum is there and we will bring them home if india does not match it. Its that simple.

btw, you call me fag? I have a girlfriend. You have a problem with homosexual people? In 21st century we should not use homosexuality as an insult. Your nationalism and love for phallus symbols ( nukes...rockets...) shows something about your mindset. Most super nationalists are homosexuals. But as i said, i have nothing against that. What you guys do in your bed is not my business.

 

[sarthak]

Your response shows i'm right.
Martin Schulz, leader of the EU parliament as well as Cathrin Ashton, chief foreign relations speaker call it their most important issue right now. The german ambassador starts a direct intervention. Italy is G8 nation. Our GDP and economy is bigger than india. Your fake nationalism doesn't change that. The issue is solved now. The ultimatum is there and we will bring them home if india does not match it. Its that simple.

btw, you call me fag? I have a girlfriend. You have a problem with homosexual people? In 21st century we should not use homosexuality as an insult. Your nationalism and love for phallus symbols ( nukes...rockets...) shows something about your mindset. Most super nationalists are homosexuals. But as i said, i have nothing against that. What you guys do in your bed is not my business.

You do look like a fag in your stupid little profile pic and nothing can change that you ****in dork. The EU leaders are just making statements to pacify you sheeple. EU countries and India have billions of dollars worth of defence deals and trade and they won't risk that for your 2 retarded sailors( or murderers). There's nothing you or your tiny country can do to bring them back. They will spend at least 5-10 years in prison here. If your country tries anything stupid , we'll just erase it off the world map. The population of my city is probably larger than the population of your entire country, we'll f***in destroy you.

 

[amitkriit]

Your response shows i'm right.
Martin Schulz, leader of the EU parliament as well as Cathrin Ashton, chief foreign relations speaker call it their most important issue right now. The german ambassador starts a direct intervention. Italy is G8 nation. Our GDP and economy is bigger than india. Your fake nationalism doesn't change that. The issue is solved now. The ultimatum is there and we will bring them home if india does not match it. Its that simple.

btw, you call me fag? I have a girlfriend. You have a problem with homosexual people? In 21st century we should not use homosexuality as an insult. Your nationalism and love for phallus symbols ( nukes...rockets...) shows something about your mindset. Most super nationalists are homosexuals. But as i said, i have nothing against that. What you guys do in your bed is not my business.

Let the EU make it the most important issue of this century. They are going back home any time soon. How are you going to get them released? Through midnight raid?

 

[Vinod2070]

Our GDP and economy is bigger than india. Your fake nationalism doesn't change that.

Not for long. A matter of a couple of years at best.

The issue is solved now. The ultimatum is there and we will bring them home if india does not match it. Its that simple.

The only solution is for them to get due punishment if they committed the crime and go back if the act is determined to be not a crime.

There is no role for you individually or for your country (or even EU) in this matter. I am sure you don't want Italian Mafia committing crime within Italy to go unpunished either.

This pathetic colonial type attitude doesn't work now. You are late by decades...

 

[MarkusS]

Let the EU make it the most important issue of this century. They are going back home any time soon. How are you going to get them released? Through midnight raid?

We give them passport and diplomatic immunity and fly them home. You should read the news. Our ultimatum made it clear. The case is closed.

 

[livingdead]

We give them passport and diplomatic immunity and fly them home. You should read the news. Our ultimatum made it clear. The case is closed.

I am sorry, Indian courts will not like that. Nor would Indian public and an election bound govt will find it quite difficult to do something stupid.
And italian dude should not be this retard to issue a statement that is still in court. (with little probability of death sentence being given). This only makes Govt of India's job more difficult.
must be a political statement I guess.

 

[MarkusS]

Not for long. A matter of a couple of years at best.



The only solution is for them to get due punishment if they committed the crime and go back if the act is determined to be not a crime.

There is no role for you individually or for your country (or even EU) in this matter. I am sure you don't want Italian Mafia committing crime within Italy to go unpunished either.

This pathetic colonial type attitude doesn't work now. You are late by decades...

You are one billion people, but our GDP is bigger than yours...we are just 70 million people. Your GDP is 1.8 trillion $ ours is 2 trillion. That means our GDP is more than 10 times higher. In basic words, each italian generates as much as almost 12 indians. The profit generated from each italian 1200 % that of an indian. If you take your current growth rate of 4.9 % per year...you need in the most positive outcome 245 years to catch up and reach our productivity level and level of living standard.

That said, it is an illussion to believe this is a justice system decission, its a purely diplomatic one.

We bring evrything against india, including the catholic church. Even our holy father adressed indias wrong doing in the case. The EU calls it their top priority. The EU already stopped talks about a free trade agreement with india.

Italian Prime Minister Enrico Letta’s government is making smart moves to save the marines, Latorre Massimiliano and Salvatore Girone, by mobilising the European Union, popular opinion and even the Catholic Church on the death penalty issue.

The EU has threatened to suspend free trade talks with India if it slaps the death penalty on the marines while India seems confused, indecisive and somewhat intimidated.

External affairs minister Salman Khurshid recently complicated things by saying former home secretary RK Singh – back in the headlines after retirement for accusing home minister Sushil Kumar Shinde of serious transgressions – who actually mishandled the case.

Italy is strategising well to protect its soldiers, India is under pressure - Hindustan Times

Cathrine Ashton said she will now put constant pressure on india and the german ambassador in india Michael Steiner also said in a press conference, that germany supports Italy position 100%.

'Constant pressure' on India marines case says Ashton - GazzettaDelSud

Earlier Tuesday German Ambassador to New Delhi Michael Steiner expressed support for Rome in the case, which has caused tensions between India and Italy. Meeting journalists to outline the presidential visit, Steiner said that a smooth handling of the case is in the interest of Italy, India and the EU. "Italy is part of the EU so we are following the case closely. It is on one hand a bilateral issue, but we think it is in the mutual interest of India, Italy and the EU to solve it smoothly, considering it has been going on for two years (now)," he said. The German envoy stressed that "this issue has also a bearing on the global fight against piracy, to which the EU is strongly committed".

That italy made the EU stop the free trade agreement talks with india is the hardest shot against indian interests yet. It costs india many billion $ and hurts its economy. It is interesting to see, that the indian government is very worried and intimidated from the newest developments.

Next week an italian delegation comes to india to negotiate the issue.

We made our homework and india fails. Public worldwide opinion is also on our side. Our ultimatum stands. The indian side knows the consequences and we will not back one step down.

Indians can learn an important lesson here. Italy does evrything in its might to help its people. We play our steps wise and calm. And we have evry right to do so. India on the other hand acted chaotic and one hand doesn´t know what the other hand does. The last weeks showed that india loses control over the situation. Thats a positive situation for italy, since even the pope intervenes now.

I guarantee you that our marines will celebrate their next eastern here back home. And all of italy will be happy with them. They will be celebrated here as heroes.

It is in the hands of the indian government to stop the hurtfull stop of the "FTA" negotiations as well to stop us imposing sanctions through the EU.

On the other side i guarantee you, that we did not forget the families of the two fisherman who died in this accident. We will give them help. Help that their own government did not give to them. I think it is very important to give compensation to them as fast as possible. That won´t bring their loved ones back but will help them to make a good living.

I am sorry, Indian courts will not like that. Nor would Indian public and an election bound govt will find it quite difficult to do something stupid.
And italian dude should not be this retard to issue a statement that is still in court. (with little probability of death sentence being given). This only makes Govt of India's job more difficult.
must be a political statement I guess.

Its not a political statement, we made it towards india, because we have the full backing of the EU, NATO, individual EU member states and even the catholic church. We stopped the Free Trade negotiations between EU and india. We feel good enough now to bring up the ultimatum.

 

[livingdead]

Its not a political statement, we made it towards india, because we have the full backing of the EU, NATO, individual EU member states and even the catholic church. We stopped the Free Trade negotiations between EU and india. We feel good enough now to bring up the ultimatum.

even the catholic church? thats scary
show me a statement from NATO that suggest they support your stand.
rest are not important really.

 

[MarkusS]

even the catholic church? thats scary
show me a statement from NATO that suggest they support your stand.
rest are not important really.

Italy said we will leave any NATO and UNO mission against piracy if this case is not solved till our ultimatum ends. USA could not fill the gap.

As you see we pull evryone into this conflict now. And the pressure is working as you can see how your government gets nervous.

Italy is ready to escalate it now.

India did very much to bind itself to the west in the last decade and italy is ready to destroy evry progress india made in this regard if our marines are not free until our ultimatum runs up.

On a smaller scale and for combining pressure, we arrested two indians in italy last week and charge them with murder. An iranian women which lived in their house was killed. We have no evidence yet they did this, but who needs evidence? They are locked away now. Their fate is in the hands of the indian government.

The fact, that the EU stopped any talk about a free trade agreement, and want put sanctions against india is great news so far. Being indias greatest trade partner, this will cost india several billion $ and lose many jobs. It is good to see your government attacking each other themself now over all this.

Remember, all this can end evry minute. Its at your own hands.

 

[livingdead]

Italy said we will leave any NATO and UNO mission against piracy if this case is not solved till our ultimatum ends. USA could not fill the gap.

As you see we pull evryone into this conflict now. And the pressure is working as you can see how your government gets nervous.

Italy is ready to escalate it now.

India did very much to bind itself to the west in the last decade and italy is ready to destroy evry progress india made in this regard if our marines are not free until our ultimatum runs up.

On a smaller scale and for combining pressure, we arrested two indians in italy last week and charge them with murder. An iranian women which lived in their house was killed. We have no evidence yet they did this, but who needs evidence? They are locked away now. Their fate is in the hands of the indian government.

The fact, that the EU stopped any talk about a free trade agreement, and want put sanctions against india is great news so far. Being indias greatest trade partner, this will cost india several billion $ and lose many jobs. It is good to see your government attacking each other themself now over all this.

Remember, all this can end evry minute. Its at your own hands.

lolz... govt of India does not work that way.. you are funny.. or too young probably.
you can lock anybody you want, that makes you look stupid, and arrogant, not us.
They will be tried like any normal criminal, and given good defence and facility of an undertrial.

Now stop crying like a kid, I seriously doubt you are above 18 yrs old.

 

[Raphael]

Sonia Gandhi will never allow the Italian marines to be punished - after all, they are her real blood kin.