Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions [Thread 2]

[halloweene]

How is this religious term related to RAFALE

originally it means the mass is said. Became vernacular to said things are completed.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

originally it means the mass is said. Became vernacular to said things are completed.

SO Dear Sir

Please be kind enough to share with us some more details
when can we expect some good news

 

[Hindustani78]

 

[halloweene]

SO Dear Sir

Please be kind enough to share with us some more details
when can we expect some good news

Dassault comm dpt is on OFF, so i do not have any comment, but you can see smiles, smileys etc. I know someone who was hired by DA and she is scheduled to go to india in April, planning didn't change. That sort of things.

 

[Abingdonboy]

No Rafale sale announcement before Modi’s visit to France: Francois Hollande

PARIS (R-euters) - French President Francois Hollande said there will be no news on the sale of Rafale fighter jets to India before the arrival of Prime Minister Narendra Modi on Thursday for a state visit to France.
"There will be no announcement on the Rafale sales before the visit of Prime Minister Modi in France and I do not want the Indian premier's visit to be put in the context of a contract," Hollande told reporters in Paris.
"We are working on it," Hollande added, when asked about the proposed sale of 126 Rafale jets to India.


http://townhall.com/news/politics-el...lande-n1981769

 

[Hindustani78]

A Rafale fighter jet flies over the factory of French aircraft manufacturer Dassault Aviation in Merignac near Bordeaux during a visit by the French President March 4, 2015.
Reuters/Regis Duvignau

 

[halloweene]

@stephen, please do not call me sir, we are very shy here with our names/titles. Yves will be good enough

 

[migflug]

Suspense over Rafale deal continues as Narendra Modi is set to visit France
Published April 8, 2015 | By admin
SOURCE : PTI

Suspense continued on Tuesday over whether the issue of Rafale fighter deal, which has been stuck over cost, will figure in talks that Prime Minister Narendra Modi will have with French President Francois Hollande during his visit beginning on Thursday.

French Ambassador Francois Richier, while addressing a press conference here on Modi’s visit, was evasive to questions over the multi-billion dollar deal, which has been held up for long. However, sources said, “negotiations are on” for the deal under which French company Dassault Aviation will supply 126 Rafale fighter planes.

Richier said French companies, including those in the field of defence, are keen to participate in the ‘Make in India’ programme and the fate of Rafale deal will be a key element in this. Rafale was selected by India from among five bidders in 2012 since it was the lowest bidder.

Indian government officials say that while the deal was initially for about Rs 42,000 crore, French are seeking a higher price now. This, the Indian officials say, has put the price at a “little more than double the cost”.

India is insisting that Dassault Aviation cannot renege on the Request for Proposal (RFP) clauses, which it had initially agreed to.

Even at political level, India has categorically told the French side that it must stick to the RFP, in which Dassault was the lowest bidder and hence was selected for the contract. “The ball is in France’s court,” an Indian official had said sometime back.

The French Rafale and European Eurofighter Typhoon were the only two left in the race for 126 fighter plane deal after years of tests on technical and other aspects. Another point of contention is the guarantee clause under which Rafale has to stand guarantee for the planes that would be manufactured by state-owned HAL.

As per the RFP issued in 2007, the first 18 jets are to be imported and the rest 108 manufactured under licence by Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL). According to the sources, Dassault was reluctant to stand guarantee for the 108 fighters to be built by HAL as far as liquidity damages and timelines for production were concerned.

The Indian Defence Ministry is of the view that the guarantee clause was part of the Air Staff Qualitative Requirements (ASQR) under the RFP. Dassault had agreed to the ASQR and hence was selected for the deal, the sources maintained. “How can the ASQR be relaxed? This is not allowed under the Defence Procurement Procedure, 2013,” the sources said.

However, French authorities insist otherwise. Talking about the price and guarantee clause, the sources said all this takes place within the Indian Defence procurement procedure. “At the conclusion of the competition, the Rafale was selected and its competitors eliminated on the basis of technical/operational assessment and on the basis of price,” they said.

During his talks in France, Modi is expected to refer to his government’s ambitious plan of creating 100 ‘smart cities’ across India and invite French participation. The French Ambassador said his country will see how it can contribute to this endeavour. He said France has expertise in building new cities while preserving the heritage.

Modi will be visiting one of the ‘smart cities’ of France during his visit. The two sides are also expected to discuss cooperation in the field of technology, including space. A new programme of cooperation in the field of space is likely to be signed during the visit. Under it, India will launch French satellites while Indian satellites can be launched from France.

French companies are also keen to enter the Small and Medium Enterprises (SME) market of India as part of “rebalancing” the trade. During his visit, Modi will meet the business leaders of France besides the political leadership. He will also visit the Airbus manufacturing base.

He will also visit a memorial set up for Indian soldiers who died while fighting with France in World War-I against Germany. 9,000 of them had died in that war and Modi will pay homage to them.

 

[drunken-monke]

India draws bottom line, warns Rafale​

India will not ink the mega $20 billion MMRCA (medium multi-role combat aircraft) project to acquire 126 fighters till France agrees to stick to its original pricing, which led its Rafale fighter to defeat the Eurofighter Typhoon in commercial evaluation over three years ago.

This is India’s “bottom line” on which the outcome of long-drawn final negotiations with French aviation major Dassault now hinges, even as Prime Minister Narendra Modi is all set to leave for France on Thursday as part of his three-nation tour.

“Dassault has to adhere to its earlier commitments. No Indian government can finalize such a major project if the L-1 (lowest bidder) pricing is changed… it can be a deal-breaker despite political pressure from France,” said a top source.

As first reported by TOI, the defence ministry is upset with Dassault’s attempt to “change the price line” because it will substantially jack up the production cost of the 108 Rafales to be made by Hindustan Aeronautics (HAL) in India after the first 18 are imported.

As per Dassault’s costing, there is now a “big jump in the man-hours needed” for each jet to be produced by HAL after transfer of technology. In effect, each jet will now cost much more than what was originally projected.

“Hypothetically, if the cost of each jet goes up by around Rs 30-40 crore, we will then be looking at a hike of Rs 3,240-Rs 4,320 crore for the 108 jets to be made here. Dassault should relent, become fully compliant to the RFP (request for proposal) and stand 100% by its original offer. It can live with a slightly lesser profit margin,” said the source.

There is, however, progress on the other major stumbling block. A mechanism is being evolved to ensure there are no penalties or liquidity damages imposed on Dassault if HAL fails to deliver as per specified timelines, sources said.

The voluminous MMRCA contract was almost 90% done, with technology transfer, offsets and other issues as well as the inter-governmental agreement all ready, when pricing and guarantee issues stalled negotiations almost a year ago.

With continuing delay in finalization of the MMRCA project and IAF down to just 34 fighter squadrons (14 of them made of old MiG-21s and MiG-27s), India is also trying to fast-track the stealth fifth-generation fighter aircraft project with Russia, as reported by TOI earlier.

India has told Russia it wants deliveries of the FGFA to begin 36 months after the main contract is inked, instead of the 94 months envisaged earlier. For this, India is ready to switch from the original co-development and co-production plan to direct acquisition of an initial lot followed by co-production. India will spend around $25 billion on the FGFA project if eventually 127 such fighters as planned.

India draws bottom line, warns Rafale - IBC World News

 

[migflug]

Mohan Guruswamy
Apr 08, 2015

From 2000 onwards the total FDI in India was close to $900 billion. France’s contribution was below $15 billion or about 2% during this period. Clearly the economic relationship could do better.
.
Prime Minister Narendra Modi will visit Paris later this week, reciprocating French President Francois Hollande’s visit to India in February 2014. Despite the frequent high-level interactions there has been little traction on substantive issues.

There are several long-pending deals such as six new nuclear power plants by Areva and Nuclear Power Corporation of India (NPCIL), a government-owned entity, and the order for the Dassault Aviations Rafale fighter, that have long-term implications for India and France. In both these deals pricing has become a major bone of contention and it seems unlikely that these agreements will be formalised any time soon, apart from a reiteration of determination to iron out differences.

In the case of the nuclear power project envisaged for Jaitapur on the west coast state of Maharashtra, Areva has sought a tariff of `9.18 per unit. This has been challenged by prominent sections of civil society as being too expensive. Besides, the ruling Bharatiya Janata Party’s ally in Maharashtra, the Shiv Sena, is opposed to the project because of local objections on environmental grounds. The area around Jaitapur is politically significant to the Shiv Sena and overruling it may have political consequences for the BJP.

The Rafale fighter deal is stalled not only due to the high costs involved, but also due to disagreement on how the local component of fighters to be produced in India will be aggregated. Dassault has taken the position that it cannot guarantee the quality of the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) built 108 Rafale fighters after the first 18 are imported. But many experts here say that this is merely a fig leaf to cover Dassault’s financial inadequacy. According to them, Dassault wants another local partner, like the private-sector giant Reliance Industries Limited (RIL), to complete the deal. RIL, with its $10 billion cash hoard, has already set up a defence sector business unit, Reliance Aerospace Technologies Pvt Ltd (RATPL), in anticipation of this.

Defence minister Manohar Parrikar has, however, made his position clear. The terms of the Indian Air Force tender require the French company to guarantee the 108 fighters that HAL would build in India.

Mr Parrikar said, “I have told Dassault to send a person to work out the differences. You have to be clear that, irrespective of anything, the tender’s terms have to be met. They cannot be diluted.”

Then there is the question of money. The initial estimation of $12 billion has now escalated to over $22 billion. The defence minister has publicly questioned the high cost of the Rafale by rhetorically asking as to how he can justify the purchase of a fighter that costs twice as much as the Russian Sukhoi Su-30MKI fighter being produced in India.

To add to Dassault’s discomfiture, Mr Parrikar has also disclosed that the highly rated Su-30MKI costs Rs 358 crore each compared to the `700 crore price tag for the Rafale. This means two Su-30s could be secured for the price of a single Rafale. Many knowledgeable people in the military tend to believe that the Su-30 is a more capable aircraft and certainly represents better value for money. The IAF has an order of 272 of these fighter planes and they are now manufactured by HAL and the Russians have already offered an upgrade to make Su-30 even more potent.

There are others in the influential bureaucracy who are not entirely enamoured of French partnerships given the manner in which the project to manufacture six Scorpene-class submarines has meandered along with huge implicit price escalations.

The Scorpene deal is with the DCNS, a French-law public limited company in which the French state holds a 64 per cent stake, private weapons maker Thales 35 per cent and the personnel a 1 per cent stake. It is the heir to Direction des Constructions et Armes Navales (DCAN).

In 2005, the Indian Navy ordered six Scorpene submarines, all to be built at the ministry of defence- owned Mazagon dock and elsewhere, with the last two to be fitted with an Indian air-independent propulsion (AIP) module.

The first India-made Scorpene has just been floated, 12 (?) years behind schedule. There is also a follow-on requirement of six submarines, for which DCNS plans to offer a larger version of the submarine to the Indian Navy.

India has just floated a requirement for six new submarines to replenish its depleting fleet, but other companies too will be in the fray.

India and France entered a strategic partnership in 1998 to ensure bilateral cooperation through regular high-level exchanges at the head of state level, and growing commercial exchanges, including in strategic areas such as defence, nuclear energy and space.

The number of “strategic partnerships” India has with other countries causes some hiccups, but even so the relationship with France is a highly valued one — France ranks just below Russia and the US as India’s third most preferred partner, higher than Britain and Japan.

A high-ranking official recently summed this up as France being preferred even though “it has time and again proved to be more mercenary than we like.”

On the economic front France is still not much of a partner with bilateral trade of about eight billion euros. This is less than India’s trade with all of France’s neighbours such as Germany, Belgium, the United Kingdom, Netherlands and Italy. From 2000 onwards, the total foreign direct investment in India amounted to close to $900 billion.

France’s contribution has been below $15 billion or about 2 per cent during this period. Clearly the economic relationship with France could do with much improvement and the political relationship, based more on arms transfers, is something neither country should be comfortable with.

Sadly, there are few expectations of a Modi-Hollande breakthrough on this score. But, as the French would say, c’est la vie (this is life).

The writer held senior positions in government and industry, and is a policy analyst studying economic and security issues. He also specialises in the Chinese economy.

India Prime Minister to Discuss Rafale Fighter Jet Deal During France Visit
Published April 8, 2015 | By admin
SOURCE : Sputnik

Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi is set to discuss a long-disputed deal to buy Rafale fighter jets during his visit to France scheduled for April 10-11, France’s Ambassador to India Francois Richier told Sputnik Tuesday.

“Only thing I can say on Rafale is that the deal is on. Rafale deal will be on the agenda of talks during Indian Prime Minister Modi’s visit to France,” Richier said.

The diplomat declined to give any further details.

Earlier, Indian media reported that New Delhi might pull out of the $20-billion deal with the French Dassault Aviation Company on an acquisition of 126 Rafale fighters.

In 2012 the Dassault Aviation won a bid to supply 126 Rafale fighter jets to India but the purchase was delayed over high costs and the company’s refusal to guarantee the performance of Rafales produced in India.

Russian and British fighter jets have been tipped as a possible replacement for the Rafale jets if the deal should be scrapped.

 

[Hindustani78]

With Rafale deal stuck, Germany says Eurofighter option ready | Zee News
Last Updated: Wednesday, April 8, 2015 - 15:20

New Delhi: Days ahead of Prime Minister Narendra Modi's visit there, Germany on Wednesday said European military consortium EADS was still ready to provide India Eurofighter Typhoon aircraft, asserting that the jets are "good" both in terms of quality and price.


India has been in negotiations for last three years with France's Dassault Aviation for procurement of 126 Rafale jets, which is being considered world's biggest military aircraft deal.

German Ambassador Michael Steiner said the European Aeronautic Defence and Space (EADS) was ready with its proposal to offer Eurofighter to India.

"The consortium stands ready with their proposal. The governments of the four nations are supporting this proposal because they are convinced it is a good one both in terms of quality of the product and price," he told reporters.

At the same time, he said the consortium will continue to respect the Indian procurement procedures and it was for India to decide what kind of aircraft it wants to procure.

Prime Minister Modi and German Chancellor Angela Merkel will jointly inaugurate the Hannover Messe fair on April 12. India is the partner country for the famous fair this year.

Rafale was selected by India from among five bidders in 2012 since it was the lowest bidder. The Rafale and European Eurofighter Typhoon were the only two defence majors left in the race for 126 plane-deal after years of tests on technical and other aspects.

Modi is also visiting France but it is not clear whether the Rafale deal would figure during his talks with French President Francois Hollande.

The deal with Dassault Aviation has been stuck for the last three years on cost and guarantee clause. Indian government officials say that while the deal was initially for about Rs 42,000 crore, French are seeking a higher price now.

Under the guarantee clause Rafale has to provide guarantee for the planes that would be manufactured by state-owned HAL.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

US Filling Saudi Munition Holes | China, South Korea Talk Arms Control THAAD’s Shadow | Airbus Seeks Indian Partner

US Filling Saudi Munition Holes | China, South Korea Talk Arms Control in THAAD’s Shadow | Airbus Seeks Indian Partner
Apr 07, 2015 00:28 UTC by Defense Industry Daily staff
America

• Rockwell Collins was awarded a $495 million contract Tuesday for software and system integration on the Army’s helicopters, with a portion of these services earmarked for foreign sales. The company was also awarded a $8.1 million modification for the Common Avionics Architecture System to equip CH-47F helos.
• In further good news for Rockwell Collins, the company will supply 44 Communication Navigation Surveillance/Air Traffic Management systems for the KC-10 tanker fleet, following a similar contract in August.
• The US is ramping up arms transfer to the Saudis, media reported Tuesday, with munitions high on the list of requirements. The assistance is being allocated through a Joint Planning Cell with the Saudis.

Europe

• The European Defence Agency announced new funding for dual-use technologies , releasing a Request for Projects notice Tuesday.
• Turkey is looking to speed up its development of a conceptual trainer aircraft, to be designed and built domestically. The new trainer will be specifically designed to train pilots to use new fighters procured through the indigenous TF-X program , with a RFI for this program released last month.

Asia

• Pakistan wants to buy fifteen AH-1Z Viper attack helicopters, gun systems, 1000 Hellfire II missiles and other equipment through apossible FMS . The cost? $952 million. The State Department has green-lit the deal, with the potential sale going to Congress.
• India will not sign its stalled multi-billion Rafale contract with Dassault until the French company agrees to what the Indian government says was the original pricing structure for the deal. The drawn-out MMRCA programhas seen multiple disputes between the Indian Defense Ministry and Dassault, with the Indians threatening to walk away from the deal in January. Although this may be simply bluster, the Russian vultures are circling, ready to supply the SU-30 fighter if the Rafale deal falls through.
• China and South Korea are to hold arms control talks this week , an interesting development given the recent tension over US plans to base THAAD interceptors in South Korea to complement the existing jointly-operated Aegis/Patriot systems.
• According to Japanese media , Indonesia is contemplating buying the US-2 amphibious plane, the same design India is currently in talks with Japan over.
• Airbus is reportedly in talks with six Indian defense contractors in an effort to find a domestic company to reply to a $2 billion naval helicopter RFI, with Indian procurement regulation allowing only an Indian company to respond.

 

[Green Angel]

Sukhoi's are better than Rafale ..........

 

[Abingdonboy]

PM Narendra Modi says progress possible in Rafale fighter jet talks

PARIS: India and France should be able to make progress in talks over the purchase of Rafale fighter jets, Prime Minister Narendra Modi said in an interview with French newspaper Le Figaro.
"The question of the Rafales is still in discussion and we should be able to make progress on mutually acceptable bases," Modi told the newspaper ahead his arrival on Thursday in France for a state visit.
Talks on the proposed purchase of 126 Rafale planes have been under way for more than three years, trying to resolve differences over pricing and local assembly.

From:
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...campaign=cppst

 

[PARIKRAMA]

NO BREAKTHROUGH YET ON RAFALE DEAL - INDIAN FOREIGN MINISTRY

India remains undecided on whether to go ahead with its planned purchase of France’s Rafale fighter jets, Foreign Secretary Subrahmanyam Jaishankar told reporters on Wednesday.

“As far as I understand it, discussions between the French company, our defense ministry and HAL Company continue… The sides are discussing the technical aspects of the matter. We are differentiating between state visits and a detailed discussion of defense contracts,” the diplomat said.
No Breakthrough Yet on Rafale Deal - Indian Foreign Ministry / Sputnik International