Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions [Thread 2]

[MirageBlue]

Looks like the "Rafale" pilot is confused about what kind of plane he is flying juding by his Su30MKI patch .... ......

Obviously an ex-Su-30MKI pilot. Common enough to see pilots with experience on another type wearing a patch from their previous squadrons.

 

[Foinikas]

You know what the problem is? Every page and article about the Rafale is either made or spammed by Indians now.
You go on google and type "Rafale" or anything related to it and most of the infographics,articles and photos are from Indian sources. I even found an article saying "It will take 10 hours from France to India for the Rafales to arrive". You go on youtube and they invade almost every video about the Rafale with comments.
"We have it too". I checked Dassault's group on Instagram and there were Indians spamming photos "We are waiting for it" or "thank you we want this we love France from India" etc.
I tried to find good infographics about it...and they put their own with titles like "WHY IT WILL GIVE THE IAF THE EDGE".
They even invaded Greek videos on youtube stirring up trouble between Greeks and Turks.
"Greek Indian alliance we fight Turkey/Pak" wtf?
"Love to Greece from India we are world's oldest civilizations"
"Haha Turkey/Pak now will be destroyed"
and every stupidity you can find...

 

[BON PLAN]

What about SPECTRA? Can you fly safely in the forbidden airspace?

RAFALE unchained – taistelutestattu Rafale Suomelle? - Siivet

Siivet-lehti käsittelee kattavasti Suomen HX-hävittäjähankintaan liittyviä kysymyksiä ja perehtyy vaihtoehtoina oleviin koneisiin. Siivet-lehden numerossa 2016/4 uppouduimme ranskalaiseen Dassault Rafale -monitoimihävittäjään, joka on yksi hävittäjähankinnan...

siivet.fi

Former Rafale pilot Joseph Barraco answers:
We have proof of that. We have faced the most difficult defences, such as the Russian S-300. The latest MACE (Multidomain Airborne Cyber and Electronic warfare) exercise included the Rafale, Typhoon, Hornet, Growler and Gripen.

The Finnish Exercise Manager said at the press briefing that the Rafale was the best of the exercise. It is not just SPECTRA, but many capabilities. The SPECTRA is part of the Survivability Capability, as are the two engines and the AGCAS. The problem is that we cannot talk about SPECTRA. It is difficult to explain the power of the system. But it has a status that everybody knows.

I have worked with Growlers, which are pretty much the same but different. We did the same mission, but in a different way. We deal with the whole spectrum of targeting. SPECTRA is part of sensor fusion and is designed for passive targeting. It is part of the stealth aircraft detection system. It does targeting, jamming, protection and information sharing.

One of the characteristics of the system is its adaptability. If you are stealthy, you always use the same tactics, because it only protects you in one way. Stealth is a geometric feature. It's not 360 degrees, so it's predictable. If the radars are operating on a different frequency or in a different direction, they will detect you. The Rafale can operate with great flexibility and use different systems and tactics," says Barraco.

******

Flying & fighting in the Dassault Rafale: Interview with a Rafale combat veteran

Flying & fighting in the Dassault Rafale: Interview with a Rafale combat veteran

From the perilous deck of an aircraft carrier, Pierre-Henri ‘Até’ Chuet took the Dassault Rafale M into combat in Iraq. We spoke to him to find out more about the Rafale, a remarkable …

hushkit.net

 

[mig25]

What about SPECTRA? Can you fly safely in the forbidden airspace?

RAFALE unchained – taistelutestattu Rafale Suomelle? - Siivet

Siivet-lehti käsittelee kattavasti Suomen HX-hävittäjähankintaan liittyviä kysymyksiä ja perehtyy vaihtoehtoina oleviin koneisiin. Siivet-lehden numerossa 2016/4 uppouduimme ranskalaiseen Dassault Rafale -monitoimihävittäjään, joka on yksi hävittäjähankinnan...

siivet.fi

Former Rafale pilot Joseph Barraco answers:
We have proof of that. We have faced the most difficult defences, such as the Russian S-300. The latest MACE (Multidomain Airborne Cyber and Electronic warfare) exercise included the Rafale, Typhoon, Hornet, Growler and Gripen.

The Finnish Exercise Manager said at the press briefing that the Rafale was the best of the exercise. It is not just SPECTRA, but many capabilities. The SPECTRA is part of the Survivability Capability, as are the two engines and the AGCAS. The problem is that we cannot talk about SPECTRA. It is difficult to explain the power of the system. But it has a status that everybody knows.

I have worked with Growlers, which are pretty much the same but different. We did the same mission, but in a different way. We deal with the whole spectrum of targeting. SPECTRA is part of sensor fusion and is designed for passive targeting. It is part of the stealth aircraft detection system. It does targeting, jamming, protection and information sharing.

One of the characteristics of the system is its adaptability. If you are stealthy, you always use the same tactics, because it only protects you in one way. Stealth is a geometric feature. It's not 360 degrees, so it's predictable. If the radars are operating on a different frequency or in a different direction, they will detect you. The Rafale can operate with great flexibility and use different systems and tactics," says Barraco.

******

Flying & fighting in the Dassault Rafale: Interview with a Rafale combat veteran

Flying & fighting in the Dassault Rafale: Interview with a Rafale combat veteran

From the perilous deck of an aircraft carrier, Pierre-Henri ‘Até’ Chuet took the Dassault Rafale M into combat in Iraq. We spoke to him to find out more about the Rafale, a remarkable …

hushkit.net

PAF already has a plan and is ready to surprise India according to several posters here. The PL-15 mounted on JF-17s is a known Rafale killer on PDF.

No point discussing things here. It's sad that the inflated egos that go around here will not let you have any meaningful discussions.

Expect no replies to your post here!

 

[BON PLAN]

PAF already has a plan and is ready to surprise India according to several posters here. The PL-15 mounted on JF-17s is a known Rafale killer on PDF.

No point discussing things here. It's sad that the inflated egos that go around here will not let you have any meaningful discussions.

Expect no replies to your post here!

PL15 Rafale killer : maybe on PDF.... what is important is on a battle field.
PL15 is better than PL10 for sure, but what else?
Inflated ego? where? when?
I need no special answer. I give some information. In this case it came from a former pilot of Rafale M, with experience in Lybian air battle.

 

[dbc]

former pilot of Rafale

..a former Rafale pilot now employed by Dassault. I'd take his words with a huge dollop of salt.
He says Rafale defeated "difficult" S300's, Israeli's do that before breakfast each day and twice on a Sunday with their ageing F-16's

 

[SQ8]

..a former Rafale pilot now employed by Dassault. I'd take his words with a huge dollop of salt.
He says Rafale defeated "difficult" S300's, Israeli's do that before breakfast each day and twice on a Sunday with their ageing F-16's

They are supposed to be salesperson’s as well along with an aspect of national pride. Which is why that “kill” against the F-22 was touted more than any repeat press even though soft deck rule violations were done in that engagement.

That doesn’t mean the Rafale isn’t a beast of an aircraft but that it isn’t the next best thing to sliced bread.

 

[Foinikas]

PAF already has a plan and is ready to surprise India according to several posters here. The PL-15 mounted on JF-17s is a known Rafale killer on PDF.

Turks are saying the same ever since it was announced that we're getting 18 Rafale F3R.
Suddenly you had guys like MMM-E say they will turn them into heaps of trash with the S-400s,others saying "we're building TFX 5th generation fighter and Mius" and futuristic stuff.

Then again,they were bragging for about 10 years about getting the F-35 and after they got kicked from the program they started going like "we didn't need that bad aircraft,we'll make a better one...haha".

 

[dbc]

They are supposed to be salesperson’s as well along with an aspect of national pride. Which is why that “kill” against the F-22 was touted more than any repeat press even though soft deck rule violations were done in that engagement.

That doesn’t mean the Rafale isn’t a beast of an aircraft but that it isn’t the next best thing to sliced bread.

..for me its tantamount to false marketing. Especially the claim that SPECTRA is better than an aircraft specifically designed to be LO. Against a near peer adversary SPECTRA is going to be a damp squib, plus I don't understand why anyone believes an emitter like SPECTRA will contribute to LO. How stupid does one have to be to argue the physics of that reasoning? Especially considering the claim is being made by a 'former Rafale pilot'...

 

[SQ8]

..for me its tantamount to false marketing. Especially the claim that SPECTRA is better than an aircraft specifically designed to be LO. Against a near peer adversary SPECTRA is going to be a damp squib, plus I don't understand why anyone believes an emitter like SPECTRA will contribute to LO. How stupid does one have to be to argue the physics of that reasoning? Especially considering the claim is being made by a 'former Rafale pilot'...

If one takes the distributed sensors out of the picture (essentially antenna’s around the aircraft) - SPECTRA is NO better than AIDEWS, IDECM or EPAWSS. One can read through the public technical aspects of each and the capabilities are essentially the same(barring antennas and updated threat libraries which are nation specific)

Unfortunately, as with any user and producer of systems - its a matter of national pride and jingoism comes into play rather than true analysis.

Rumors on ATLC with the Desert Falcon vs the Rafale don’t paint such a rosy picture as pushed by the “ Rafale pilots”.

I can make statements all day that “everyone knows” or SPECTRA is all different and revolutionary. But rhino pilots have gone against Rafale Ms and red flags have happened with them. I do not know of one American pilot or British pilot that would trade their latest with the Rafale.

 

[dbc]

If one takes the distributed sensors out of the picture (essentially antenna’s around the aircraft) - SPECTRA is NO better than AIDEWS, IDECM or EPAWSS. One can read through the public technical aspects of each and the capabilities are essentially the same(barring antennas and updated threat libraries which are nation specific)

Unfortunately, as with any user and producer of systems - its a matter of national pride and jingoism comes into play rather than true analysis.

Rumors on ATLC with the Desert Falcon vs the Rafale don’t paint such a rosy picture as pushed by the “ Rafale pilots”.

I can make statements all day that “everyone knows” or SPECTRA is all different and revolutionary. But rhino pilots have gone against Rafale Ms and red flags have happened with them. I do not know of one American pilot or British pilot that would trade their latest with the Rafale.

Rafale carries a lot of payload and is exceptionally good at low altitude ingress. In a way, its combat niche is similar to the much larger B1-B Lancer. Similar sensor suit to detect hostile emitters and skirt around ground threats and deliver the payload - this is where the Rafale truly shines. Is it the best at all missions - no, it is mediocre at most. It's a decent bird but not my first choice for a zombie apocalypse-my first choice for that eventuality is the A10-warthog.

 

[BON PLAN]

..a former Rafale pilot now employed by Dassault. I'd take his words with a huge dollop of salt.

No. He work for himself. He made youtube video of all subject in link with planes.

He says Rafale defeated "difficult" S300's, Israeli's do that before breakfast each day and twice on a Sunday with their ageing F-16's

Strange ! During MACE electronic trainings the dedicated F16CJ were unable to deal with S300 when Rafale was the sole able to do....

 

[BON PLAN]

..for me its tantamount to false marketing. Especially the claim that SPECTRA is better than an aircraft specifically designed to be LO. Against a near peer adversary SPECTRA is going to be a damp squib, plus I don't understand why anyone believes an emitter like SPECTRA will contribute to LO. How stupid does one have to be to argue the physics of that reasoning? Especially considering the claim is being made by a 'former Rafale pilot'...

Spectra is not a simple emitter. It's not without some good reasons that it's R&D phase cost 25% of the whole Rafale project.
It's goal is to reduce the effective range of any opponent radar, and after that to reduce the range in which it can elaborate a fire solution.
Last trial was made few months ago by Egyptian in a training Su35 vs Rafale.

 

[serenity]

You know what the problem is? Every page and article about the Rafale is either made or spammed by Indians now.
You go on google and type "Rafale" or anything related to it and most of the infographics,articles and photos are from Indian sources. I even found an article saying "It will take 10 hours from France to India for the Rafales to arrive". You go on youtube and they invade almost every video about the Rafale with comments.
"We have it too". I checked Dassault's group on Instagram and there were Indians spamming photos "We are waiting for it" or "thank you we want this we love France from India" etc.
I tried to find good infographics about it...and they put their own with titles like "WHY IT WILL GIVE THE IAF THE EDGE".
They even invaded Greek videos on youtube stirring up trouble between Greeks and Turks.
"Greek Indian alliance we fight Turkey/Pak" wtf?
"Love to Greece from India we are world's oldest civilizations"
"Haha Turkey/Pak now will be destroyed"
and every stupidity you can find...

My friend this is not even 1% of extent of Indian craziness and noise making. At least this stuff you mentioned is calm and positive lol. They love causing trouble and stirring complex things and making everyone more riled up. It's because India has many English speaking people also contributing to world's greatest collection of fake news and government propaganda onto the world stage.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-50749764

This is just in influencing Europe's thinking. Their efforts for Asia region is even stronger.

Spectra is not a simple emitter. It's not without some good reasons that it's R&D phase cost 25% of the whole Rafale project.
It's goal is to reduce the effective range of any opponent radar, and after that to reduce the range in which it can elaborate a fire solution.
Last trial was made few months ago by Egyptian in a training Su35 vs Rafale.

SPECTRA performs passive signals collection and then active cancellation right? In general terms.

I would not think this general type of method is unique to just Rafale simply because the more modern American, Chinese, Russian and so on fighters do not give a public name for their equivalents. At least shaping and material stealth is also employed as another level. Using electronic attack both passive and active methods, there must be many types and older F-16 to compare with modern Rafale is a bit unfair. SAMs do not work well against US fighters not only because of avoiding them and performing SEAD and so on.

 

[BON PLAN]

Rafale carries a lot of payload and is exceptionally good at low altitude ingress. In a way, its combat niche is similar to the much larger B1-B Lancer

what a nice joke, really. Are you serious?

SAMs do not work well against US fighters not only because of avoiding them and performing SEAD and so on.

Also because since 30+ years there was no conflict with US jets (and european and russian and;..) against real deep SAM protected airspace.
Syria is not such an exemple. In Syria the sole real SAM integrated system is the russian one to protect Tartous and neither the US neither the Israelis tried to fight against.