Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions [Thread 2]

[T90TankGuy]

Let me know when its signed.

 

[-xXx-]

Its just finalised and not final-est finalized.

Parrikar may still ask for one Meteor free for each Rafale.

 

[Incog_nito]

Will this deal be increased from 36 to 100/110 of them; finally?

 

[kaykay]

Its just finalised and not final-est finalized.

Parrikar may still ask for one Meteor free for each Rafale.

haha I won't be surprised.

 

[[Bregs]]

This deal will be now rechecked for any discrepancy left so now as usual chill for couple of weeks more

 

[kaykay]

This deal will be now rechecked for any discrepancy left so now as usual chill for couple of weeks more

Yeah bro. Since commercial negotiations are finally over( thanks God for that as every time we were close to do that, they had some new issue) and final draft has been finalised I believe finally we are close to signing the deal as hardly anything is left now. Should be done in next 15 days.

 

[4GTejasBVR]

Before this Saturday we will come to know

 

[Trying to be honest]

It feels like the deal is being intentionally delayed and could be timed close to French presidential election to give the incumbent French president a much needed boost close to the polls.

 

[Picdelamirand-oil]

It feels like the deal is being intentionally delayed and could be timed close to French presidential election to give the incumbent French president a much needed boost close to the polls.

Majority of French people don't care about this deal, don't even know that there is negociation between India and France for buying Rafale. Each month Airbus sale are more important that this deal without any advertising.

 

[zebra7]

https://www.facebook.com/TejasMrca/

Courtesy Tejas India's mrca :

Okay, so let's clear some misconceptions regarding the Rafale deal

1. Offsets: Total 50% of the deal and ("surprise") ToT

Thirty percent offsets will be embarked for future military aviation research and development (R&D) programs and the remaining 20 percent will be with Indian [defense] industries making components for Rafale.

Safran and Thales will join Dassault in providing state-of-the-art technologies in stealth, radar, thrust vectoring for missiles, and materials for electronics and micro-electronics,

2. Advanced weaponry

IAF wants and includes Mica air-to-air missile, Scalp cruise missile and Meteor beyond-visual-range missile and precision-guided munitions.

3. More payload

An IAF source said India-specific Rafale aircraft will be able to carry 10 tons of weaponry. The current capacity is 9.5 tons so this could mean improved M-88 engines.

4. Faster delivery

The first Rafale is expected to be delivered within 20 months of signing the G2G agreement. This is only possible if the jets currently under assembly and marked for Armee De L'air are re-routed for India.

5. Deployment

Out of the 36 aircraft,18 will be deployed at Ambala air base bordering Pakistan and another 18 will be deployed at an air base in the eastern Indian state of Arunachal Pradesh, bordering China.

6. More Rafales?

There is a long-term requirement of about 10 squadrons of Rafale aircraft under MMRCA

There are many who think that the $8.8 Billion is far too expensive for 36 Rafale jets. Let's take a look shall we?

~ The fly away cost for a single Rafale airframe is $85 Million (according to official french documents)
So for 36 Rafales = 36 x 85 = $3.06 Billion

~ IAF is getting two types of air to air missiles as well as two types of air to ground missiles. So the weapons package per Rafale costs around $25 million (average) = 36 x 25 = $900 Million

~ Setting up of two bases and maintenance depots costs $1.2 Billion

~ The deal said that it would cover 10 years of maintenance and spares. The total LCC is calculated for 40 years and it comes to around 2.5 times the price of airframes (average).
Hence, for 10 years = 2.5 x 3.06 / 4 = $1.92 Billion ($53.4 Million per Rafale)

~ So far, the total adds upto $7.08 Billion.
The remaining 8.8 - 7.08 = $1.72 Billion is for ToT and covers the 50% offsets (that means, 8.8 / 2 = $4.4 Billion will be re-invested back in India)

Quoting $245 Million/ Rafale is just plain stupid. What people don't understand is that if India goes for remaining 90 Rafales for MMRCA, we'll have to pay only for the airframes, weapon and maintenance, since the two bases being set-up can handle three squadrons each without major expenditure.

That is 90 * ( 85 + 25 + 53.4 ) = $14.7 Billion excluding another $500 Million for upgradation of the bases. (again with 50% offsets)

So the total cost for 126 Rafales will be $24 Billion (pretty close to the $20 Billion quoted in the original MMRCA deal adjusting for inflation and ToT)

(Note - The figures are estimates and only provided to give you an idea as to the real cost break-up structure. The cost for 90 remaining jets will increase due to the 'Make in India' initiative for setting up assembly line. But the re-investment will compensate most of the additional cost)

 

[migflug]

https://www.facebook.com/TejasMrca/

Courtesy Tejas India's mrca :

Okay, so let's clear some misconceptions regarding the Rafale deal

1. Offsets: Total 50% of the deal and ("surprise") ToT

Thirty percent offsets will be embarked for future military aviation research and development (R&D) programs and the remaining 20 percent will be with Indian [defense] industries making components for Rafale.

Safran and Thales will join Dassault in providing state-of-the-art technologies in stealth, radar, thrust vectoring for missiles, and materials for electronics and micro-electronics,

2. Advanced weaponry

IAF wants and includes Mica air-to-air missile, Scalp cruise missile and Meteor beyond-visual-range missile and precision-guided munitions.

3. More payload

An IAF source said India-specific Rafale aircraft will be able to carry 10 tons of weaponry. The current capacity is 9.5 tons so this could mean improved M-88 engines.

4. Faster delivery

The first Rafale is expected to be delivered within 20 months of signing the G2G agreement. This is only possible if the jets currently under assembly and marked for Armee De L'air are re-routed for India.

5. Deployment

Out of the 36 aircraft,18 will be deployed at Ambala air base bordering Pakistan and another 18 will be deployed at an air base in the eastern Indian state of Arunachal Pradesh, bordering China.

6. More Rafales?

There is a long-term requirement of about 10 squadrons of Rafale aircraft under MMRCA

There are many who think that the $8.8 Billion is far too expensive for 36 Rafale jets. Let's take a look shall we?

~ The fly away cost for a single Rafale airframe is $85 Million (according to official french documents)
So for 36 Rafales = 36 x 85 = $3.06 Billion

~ IAF is getting two types of air to air missiles as well as two types of air to ground missiles. So the weapons package per Rafale costs around $25 million (average) = 36 x 25 = $900 Million

~ Setting up of two bases and maintenance depots costs $1.2 Billion

~ The deal said that it would cover 10 years of maintenance and spares. The total LCC is calculated for 40 years and it comes to around 2.5 times the price of airframes (average).
Hence, for 10 years = 2.5 x 3.06 / 4 = $1.92 Billion ($53.4 Million per Rafale)

~ So far, the total adds upto $7.08 Billion.
The remaining 8.8 - 7.08 = $1.72 Billion is for ToT and covers the 50% offsets (that means, 8.8 / 2 = $4.4 Billion will be re-invested back in India)

Quoting $245 Million/ Rafale is just plain stupid. What people don't understand is that if India goes for remaining 90 Rafales for MMRCA, we'll have to pay only for the airframes, weapon and maintenance, since the two bases being set-up can handle three squadrons each without major expenditure.

That is 90 * ( 85 + 25 + 53.4 ) = $14.7 Billion excluding another $500 Million for upgradation of the bases. (again with 50% offsets)

So the total cost for 126 Rafales will be $24 Billion (pretty close to the $20 Billion quoted in the original MMRCA deal adjusting for inflation and ToT)

(Note - The figures are estimates and only provided to give you an idea as to the real cost break-up structure. The cost for 90 remaining jets will increase due to the 'Make in India' initiative for setting up assembly line. But the re-investment will compensate most of the additional cost)

This page always brings same calculation every few months

 

[jaiind]

NEW DELHI: The much anticipated contract for 36 Rafale fighter jets is likely to be sealed soon as both the countries have finalised the details for the deal which will cost about Euro 7.87 billion.

Government sources said the cost, offsets and service details have been finalised and the work is being done on the Inter Governmental Agreement for the deal.

A "working team" from France is already in town with their own translators and are going through the contract, running into several thousand pages, with their Indian counterparts.

The sources said that once the IGA is firmed up, the document will go back to the Cabinet Committee on Security for a final clearance.

They said that India has been able to save over Euro 590 million through tough price negotiations which began in January this year.

Though the deal could have been firmed up earlier, issues like pricing and offsets took time as India wanted a better contract.

Following intervention by Prime Minister Modi late last year, France agreed for a 50 per cent offset clause.

This means creating business worth at least three billion Euros for Indian companies, both big and small, and generating thousands of jobs in India through offsets.

A high-level delegation from France could come down for the formal signing of the contract, French sources said.

The delivery for the fighter aircraft is expected to begin in 2019, with an annual inflation capped at 3.5 per cent.

The weapon systems, part of the deal, will also include the new-age, beyond visual range missile 'Meteor', and Israeli helmet mounted display.

Last month, a report submitted by the team negotiating the Rafale deal with France was cleared by the Defence Ministry. The file was then sent to the Prime Minister's Office for review and clearance.

The work on the IGA started after that, sources said.

During his visit to France in April last year, Prime Minister Narendra Modi had announced that India would purchase 36 Rafale jets in a government-to-government contract.

Soon after the announcement, the Defence Ministry scrapped a separate process that was on to purchase 126 Rafale fighter planes, built by French defence giant Dassault Aviation.

http://www.newindianexpress.com/nat...sed-sources-say/2016/09/14/article3620840.ece

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

I thing I can assure every one of is , the first airframe will be delivered only within 36 months from the date , " The first Tranche of Payment " is cleared from India.

No 20 months delivery time.

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

Please stick to the Rafale sticky thread for everything related to Rafale.

@WAJsal @waz @Oscar @PARIKRAMA
Please get the needful done.

 

[4GTejasBVR]

I thing I can assure every one of is , the first airframe will be delivered only within 36 months from the date , " The first Tranche of Payment " is cleared from India.

No 20 months delivery time.

Actually it should be 18 months not 20