Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions [Thread 2]

[PARIKRAMA]

So there will be "Rafale produced in India" added to the 36 in fly away conditions already to be signed in the Rafale approval moment.

Yes that is part of the agreement as it has been said before.. but DPP2016 strategic partnership have to be approved and revealed.. bcz under that this line will come up.

Suppliers are actually told about a increase in numbers for procurement from 2018-19 onwards. So this is a clear indication about the same. Fortunately this increase does not correspond to 33 jets but more..

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

So there will be "Rafale produced in India" added to the 36 in fly away conditions already to be signed in the Rafale approval moment.

Its about the 36. If its 36, 150 more at least will follow . The first 36 is what matters....

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Something interesting for all of you. I am sure @Ankit Kumar 002 might have posted this before

But there was a much deeper point raised in Lok Sabha Discussion on 12.08.2016 on IAF topic. That actually clears out many doubts. I am quoting only the portions relevant to this thread topic and removing other portions (bcz at the top of the pic you can understand the reason)

​

Dr Subhas Ramrao Bhambre is MoS Defence.

Thats in the Lok Sabha, in parliament. There is no mention of other contenders not even the point that its under discussion. Unless DM MP does not share things with MoS Bhambre, its a clear pointer of where other so called offers stand at really..

And like the words here a lot - procurement and planned induction. ..40 fighter squadrons will be added...

 

[GuardianRED]

Source says

1. In G20 there was a short meeting between PM NaMo and Prez Hollande on the sidelines where both leaders pull aside each other, sat and talked...
2. A verbal invitation has been given by PM NaMo for Rafale approval which he says will be intimated soon post necessary procedures (read CCS approval)
3. Also discussed is Scorpene data theft issue and how India feel's France should help some new tech upgrades for the same.
4. Prez Hollande said he has got to hear via Jean-Yves Le Drian and via Ambassador Alexandre Ziegler about the apprehensions of scorpene data theft as well as about the relationship progress in all other defence matters including Rafales.
5. Prez Hollande assured that France will do everything to strengthen and solidify the defence relationship and will ensure India does not feel any apprehensions as well as any doubt on French weapon systems or fear of future security breaches.
6. Prez Hollande said that he will work out a suitable date for the meet to formally sign as and when India formally sends the invitation out and said to have assured that he will be there for India France friendship moment.
7. Prez Hollande also said Rafales produced in India will be given full support from French government side and in case of any issue or roadblock, he has assured PM NaMo to look into the same personally.
8. Both PM NaMo and Prez Hollande agreed that DM MP + NSA Doval from Indian side and DM Le Drian + Amb Ziegler from French side should discuss more for all strategic project cooperation in order to expedite the things.

@Abingdonboy @MilSpec @Vergennes @Picdelamirand-oil @BON PLAN @anant_s @Ankit Kumar 002 @Taygibay @surya kiran @GuardianRED @R!CK @Aero @Stephen Cohen https://defence.pk/members/bregs.148509/ @hellfire @randomradio @others

Do we have a Tentitive Timeline to when the Approval will be made? + Is there True to the Morrocan request for aircrafts?

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

Something interesting for all of you. I am sure @Ankit Kumar 002 might have posted this before

View attachment 331700

But there was a much deeper point raised in Lok Sabha Discussion on 12.08.2016 on IAF topic. That actually clears out many doubts. I am quoting only the portions relevant to this thread topic and removing other portions (bcz at the top of the pic you can understand the reason)

View attachment 331702
​

Dr Subhas Ramrao Bhambre is MoS Defence.

Thats in the Lok Sabha, in parliament. There is no mention of other contenders not even the point that its under discussion. Unless DM MP does not share things with MoS Bhambre, its a clear pointer of where other so called offers stand at really..

And like the words here a lot - procurement and planned induction. ..40 fighter squadrons will be added...

Anything in the world except single engines.... and they should deliver it quick.

The Mig27s flying make me really sick. Mig21s are fine , actually more than fine....but 27s need to be replaced quick.

Do we have a Tentitive Timeline to when the Approval will be made? + Is there True to the Morrocan request for aircrafts?

Dassault is looking into 4-5 major new markets except India , shouldn't be a surprise if its Morocco. Canada and Malaysia along with UAE.

No official tentative dates as of yet.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Do we have a Tentitive Timeline to when the Approval will be made? + Is there True to the Morrocan request for aircrafts?

Approval will happen soon and signing within next 40 days or even less.

On Morocco, Courtesy @CNL-PN-AA

Several high level discussions occured between France and Morocco since february concerning the Rafale ( and other military equipments ). Same with Malaysia, Canada, UAE, Finland, Belgium and 3 other potential customers.
For the Rafale production capacity at Mérignac, I give a clue by saying that in 2018 SAFRAN will produce 85 M88s.

https://defence.pk/threads/dassault...ussions-thread-2.351407/page-310#post-8650741

look at safran engine numbers.. its much beyond the capacity of production and he confirmed it subsequently.

Anything in the world except single engines.... and they should deliver it quick.

The Mig27s flying make me really sick. Mig21s are fine , actually more than fine....but 27s need to be replaced quick.

Dassault is looking into 4-5 major new markets except India , shouldn't be a surprise if its Morocco. Canada and Malaysia along with UAE.

No official tentative dates as of yet.

Both 21s and 27s need replacement urgent.. need to boost LCA production rate and also Rafales MII part so that quicker induction can be done.

I will be happy if MII rate of production is more than 1 squadron per year for Rafales.. Bcz only then it makes sense and it will be very good if its closer to ~1.5-2 squadrons a year...

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

Approval will happen soon and signing within next 40 days or even less.

On Morocco, Courtesy @CNL-PN-AA

Several high level discussions occured between France and Morocco since february concerning the Rafale ( and other military equipments ). Same with Malaysia, Canada, UAE, Finland, Belgium and 3 other potential customers.
For the Rafale production capacity at Mérignac, I give a clue by saying that in 2018 SAFRAN will produce 85 M88s.

https://defence.pk/threads/dassault...ussions-thread-2.351407/page-310#post-8650741

look at safran engine numbers.. its much beyond the capacity of production and he confirmed it subsequently.



Both 21s and 27s need replacement urgent.. need to boost LCA production rate and also Rafales MII part so that quicker induction can be done.

I will be happy if MII rate of production is more than 1 squadron per year for Rafales.. Bcz only then it makes sense and it will be very good if its closer to ~1.5-2 squadrons a year...

Isn't Belgium getting F35s?last time heard USA "almost "added Belgium as its F35 customer...

 

[Aero]

Something interesting for all of you. I am sure @Ankit Kumar 002 might have posted this before

View attachment 331700

But there was a much deeper point raised in Lok Sabha Discussion on 12.08.2016 on IAF topic. That actually clears out many doubts. I am quoting only the portions relevant to this thread topic and removing other portions (bcz at the top of the pic you can understand the reason)

View attachment 331702
​

Dr Subhas Ramrao Bhambre is MoS Defence.

Thats in the Lok Sabha, in parliament. There is no mention of other contenders not even the point that its under discussion. Unless DM MP does not share things with MoS Bhambre, its a clear pointer of where other so called offers stand at really..

And like the words here a lot - procurement and planned induction. ..40 fighter squadrons will be added...

40 new Fighter Squadrons means going past 42 Squadrons of Fighters as only Mig-27/21 needs replacement now (Mig-29 may be later) & Su-30s and Tejas will stay for quite a while with IAF.

P.S: They should see all aspects as you mentioned in your previous posts and instead Rushing for Make in India F-16/F-18, we should clearly examine all available options to us as ToT from US will be restricted to certain level.

look at safran engine numbers.. its much beyond the capacity of production and he confirmed it subsequently.

Dassault will probably speed up production rate.
I wonder what they will do with that odd 85th M88. (Just saying)

 

[GuardianRED]

Dassault is looking into 4-5 major new markets except India , shouldn't be a surprise if its Morocco. Canada and Malaysia along with UAE.

No official tentative dates as of yet.

Approval will happen soon and signing within next 40 days or even less.

On Morocco, Courtesy @CNL-PN-AA

Several high level discussions occured between France and Morocco since february concerning the Rafale ( and other military equipments ). Same with Malaysia, Canada, UAE, Finland, Belgium and 3 other potential customers.
For the Rafale production capacity at Mérignac, I give a clue by saying that in 2018 SAFRAN will produce 85 M88s.

https://defence.pk/threads/dassault...ussions-thread-2.351407/page-310#post-8650741

look at safran engine numbers.. its much beyond the capacity of production and he confirmed it subsequently.



Both 21s and 27s need replacement urgent.. need to boost LCA production rate and also Rafales MII part so that quicker induction can be done.

I will be happy if MII rate of production is more than 1 squadron per year for Rafales.. Bcz only then it makes sense and it will be very good if its closer to ~1.5-2 squadrons a year...

For the UAEAF the negotiation with Dassault has always being a sticky one. One of the clauses they have, is to take back (or have them sold) all the Mirage 2000-9s in addition to procure the Rafale. Any idea this issue has been solved?

 

[Aero]

Isn't Belgium getting F35s?last time heard USA "almost "added Belgium as its F35 customer...

F-35 for belgium is not yet confirmed as there is some opposition.
http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/politiek/1.2545430

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

For the UAEAF the negotiation with Dassault has always being a sticky one. One of the clauses they have, is to take back (or have them sold) all the Mirage 2000-9s in addition to procure the Rafale. Any idea this issue has been solved?

They tried to sell off a few to Egypt too , but it hasn't happened yet.
How I wish .......

Coming back , yes UAE deal is stuck right now....

 

[Taygibay]

Coming back , yes UAE deal is stuck right now....

No, no! Delayed until 2018.
The UAE don't really need a buy soon for one & this allows
them to circumvent the Fr elections for two and lastly means
that the F3 R standard* will be completed so they don't have
to pay for any upgrade they want that it already contains.

And like the words here a lot - procurement and planned induction. ..40 fighter squadrons will be added...

Try to add all those is more like it :
All MKIs + all Rafales + all Tejas = 40 sqdns.
Which would be really nice if it happened.

Great day all, Tay.

* Due in 2018.

 

[GuardianRED]

No, no! Delayed until 2018.
The UAE don't really need a buy soon for one, this allows
them to circumvent the Fr elections for two and lastly means
that the F3 R standard will be completed so they don't have
to pay for any upgrade they want that it already contains.



Try to add all those is more like it :
All MKIs + all Rafales + all Tejas = 40 sqdns.
Which would be really nice if it happened.

Great day all, Tay.

What abt the Mirage 2000-9s?

 

[BON PLAN]

Isn't Belgium getting F35s?last time heard USA "almost "added Belgium as its F35 customer...

Nothing is made in Belgium. The hard piece is the nuclear free bomb integration....

What abt the Mirage 2000-9s?

Sold to Morocco? Egypt? Irak? India? ....

 

[Taygibay]

What abt the Mirage 2000-9s?

I think they have more chances of being redistributed amongst small and / or
"poor" Arab AFs. Iraq has been discussed a few months back for example
although their Shia side is probably a blocking point.

And India has no good reason to want these unless the Rafale deal fails.

This will remain a sticking point too. You need a good enough AF for such
highly capable fighters but one with room for them too which is pretty rare.

Maybe they could be pooled in a GCC/Arab League unit?

We'll see; best of days to you, Tay.